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Cleveland Cavaliers & The NBA

LeBron back?

Talk Cavs hoops and other items from the NBA here.

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Want him back?

Yes
12
60%
No
8
40%
 
Total votes : 20

Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:25 pm

You really think somebody is going to offer Deng a max contract?
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:34 pm

motherscratcher wrote:Pros, it's not just about the cold and scraping windshields. It's about the nightlife and things of that nature. You're not going to get a club scene in Cleveland like you have in a place like NY, Miami, or LA. That won't matter everybody, but it will matter to some. And it might matter to LeBron too.

I still think if he has a choice of a better nightlife or a better shot at another ring or three, he'll go for the rings every time. And he can afford to hire someone to run the juice bar from November to May.

You're not incorrect when you say that there's a decent young core here that LeBron might be able to win a Championship with. But you go list guys like Jack, Thompson, and Bennett as part of why it would be so attractive to come here. Why the hell would LeBron care about playing with those guys? He can play with those guys anywhere.

My point, which I failed to make, was that as LeBron gets older he's not going to want to play on a team with three superstars who have to carry all the water for 82 games plus another 25 or so. He might like to play on a team where the second unit (Zeller, Waiters, Jack, Bennett, and whoever we take with our first round pick this year) can routinely outscore the opponent's second unit, thereby allowing LeBron, Andy, Kyrie, TT, and Miles to play only 30 minutes a game until the playoffs.

If we end up signing Deng you can add his name to the list.

If LeBron doesn't return, we can sign Deng and still have enough money to snag a major free agent. Or not sign Deng and get two major free agents. Yeah, I know, they won't sign here, not enough sunshine and night life. Time will tell.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Jan 12, 2014 6:18 pm

Prosecutor wrote:You really think somebody is going to offer Deng a max contract?


This is my point.

If you think he's gonna stay here, the stupid money is coming from Cleveland.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby leadpipe » Mon Jan 13, 2014 1:27 am

And more proof Kyrie is watching his "get out of Cleveland" clock; not even interested enough to stay in front of Jimmer Fredette.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:56 am

leadpipe wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:You really think somebody is going to offer Deng a max contract?


This is my point.

If you think he's gonna stay here, the stupid money is coming from Cleveland.


Well, this is another example of your consistent negative mindset.

If Deng signs with another team next year, it's because no decent free agents ever sign with Cleveland no matter what they're offered - they don't want to chip ice off their windshields.

If Deng signs with the Cavs, well, obviously it's because they stupidly offered him more money than he's worth.

Either way, the Cavs are losers. You've already decided they're going to lose no matter what happens.

Which is pretty much every take you've ever had. Going back several years I honestly can't recall a single positive thing you've ever said about the Cavs or anything they've done or anybody who works for them.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby leadpipe » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:12 pm

Prosecutor wrote:
leadpipe wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:You really think somebody is going to offer Deng a max contract?


This is my point.

If you think he's gonna stay here, the stupid money is coming from Cleveland.


Well, this is another example of your consistent negative mindset.

If Deng signs with another team next year, it's because no decent free agents ever sign with Cleveland no matter what they're offered - they don't want to chip ice off their windshields.

If Deng signs with the Cavs, well, obviously it's because they stupidly offered him more money than he's worth.

Either way, the Cavs are losers. You've already decided they're going to lose no matter what happens.

Which is pretty much every take you've ever had. Going back several years I honestly can't recall a single positive thing you've ever said about the Cavs or anything they've done or anybody who works for them.


Not a negative mindset Pros. Just telling you the way it is.

Concerning Deng. He will either A. Leave B. Stay if they overpay. If other than one nof these two, let us know.

And if you'd like a positive mindset concerning the Cavs, they could start by doing something right every now and then.

Your "positive mindset concerning the Cavs and Browns in recent years has just caused you to be consistently wrong.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:46 pm

I think my mindset is more like, "Let's wait and see, this actually might work out well," as opposed to your philosophy which is, "No matter which way it goes, the Cavs will take it up the ass."

If I said, "Hey, this Baron Davis trade might get us Kyrie Irving", you would have howled with derision.

If I said, "Hey, signing Bynum might end up getting us Luol Deng," you would have roared with laughter.

Sometimes things actually work out for the best, even in Cleveland. Not often, though, I'll admit that.

And even if LeBron stays in Miami, the Cavs are well-positioned to add one or two significant players next year in addition to their first round pick. One of them might be Deng. Bynum's agent said Bynum liked it here.

But then again, Bynum isn't from South Sudan.
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby CharacterIV » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:59 pm

Prosecutor wrote:I think my mindset is more like, "Let's wait and see, this actually might work out well," as opposed to your philosophy which is, "No matter which way it goes, the Caves will take it up the ass."

If I said, "Hey, this Baron Davis trade might get us Kyrie Irving", you would have howled with derision.

If I said, "Hey, signing Bynum might end up getting us Luol Deng," you would have roared with laughter.

Sometimes things actually work out for the best, even in Cleveland. Not often, though, I'll admit that.

And even if LeBron stays in Miami, the Cavs are well-positioned to add one or two significant players next year in addition to their first round pick. One of them might be Deng. Bynum's agent said Bynum liked it here.

But then again, Bynum isn't from South Sudan.


Pros, not to be confrontational, but remember the Clips pick that became Kyrie had like a 1% (or something like that) chance of winning the lotto, and it did. You can't rely on odds like that.

I'd say the odds are similarly small that Deng is successful and stays in Cleveland without being overpaid. I really like Deng, but when you get down to it, most all free agents are overpaid unless they hit FA and then make a leap in development shortly thereafter.

Either Deng has a good second half and someone overpays him, or he has a horrible/injured second half and that lowers the bill. The very unlikely third option is that Deng plays well and becomes so enamored of Mike Brown's system and the situation in Cleveland that he's willing to accept a reasonable offer to stay. Considering he shunned Chicago's 3 years, 30 mil offer, I don't think that's happening (unless he has a crummy second half.)
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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:42 am

CharacterIV wrote:
Pros, not to be confrontational, but remember the Clips pick that became Kyrie had like a 1% (or something like that) chance of winning the lotto, and it did. You can't rely on odds like that.

Exactly. Sometimes things work out better than expected, even for the woebegone Cavaliers. That's why you can't automatically assume the Cavs will end up losers no matter what. Remember, they had to win a coin toss (or was it a ping pong ball?) to get LeBron.

I'd say the odds are similarly small that Deng is successful and stays in Cleveland without being overpaid. I really like Deng, but when you get down to it, most all free agents are overpaid unless they hit FA and then make a leap in development shortly thereafter.

If you assume that all free agents are "overpaid", then you've created a lose/lose situation. If Deng stays, then we overpaid. If he leaves, then we screwed ourselves out of a higher draft pick for a shot at making the playoffs for one season and getting blown out. It's this mentality that says, "The Cavs will get screwed no matter which way it goes" that I'm objecting to. It's not always like that.

Either Deng has a good second half and someone overpays him, or he has a horrible/injured second half and that lowers the bill. The very unlikely third option is that Deng plays well and becomes so enamored of Mike Brown's system and the situation in Cleveland that he's willing to accept a reasonable offer to stay. Considering he shunned Chicago's 3 years, 30 mil offer, I don't think that's happening (unless he has a crummy second half.)

One reason he declined Chicago's offer is he didn't like the way he was treated by the Bulls when he had a life-threatening condition. It's also normal for players to wait for free agency to test the market.

I don't know if signing Deng long term is critical. If we don't, then we have tons of money to sign other quality free agents. I do know that Deng has all the qualities they're looking for as a player and as a person. It reminds me of how they picked up Antawn Jamison for the stretch run a few years back.

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Re: LeBron back?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:43 am

Prosecutor wrote:
CharacterIV wrote:
Pros, not to be confrontational, but remember the Clips pick that became Kyrie had like a 1% (or something like that) chance of winning the lotto, and it did. You can't rely on odds like that.

Exactly. Sometimes things work out better than expected, even for the woebegone Cavaliers. That's why you can't automatically assume the Cavs will end up losers no matter what. Remember, they had to win a coin toss (or was it a ping pong ball?) to get LeBron.

I'd say the odds are similarly small that Deng is successful and stays in Cleveland without being overpaid. I really like Deng, but when you get down to it, most all free agents are overpaid unless they hit FA and then make a leap in development shortly thereafter.

If you assume that all free agents are "overpaid", then you've created a lose/lose situation. If Deng stays, then we overpaid. If he leaves, then we screwed ourselves out of a higher draft pick. It's this mentality that says, "The Cavs will get screwed no matter which way it goes" that I'm objecting to. It's not always like that.

Either Deng has a good second half and someone overpays him, or he has a horrible/injured second half and that lowers the bill. The very unlikely third option is that Deng plays well and becomes so enamored of Mike Brown's system and the situation in Cleveland that he's willing to accept a reasonable offer to stay. Considering he shunned Chicago's 3 years, 30 mil offer, I don't think that's happening (unless he has a crummy second half.)

One reason he declined Chicago's offer is he didn't like the way he was treated by the Bulls when he had a life-threatening condition. It's also normal for players to wait for free agency to test the market.

I don't know if signing Deng long term is critical. If we don't, then we have tons of money to sign other quality free agents. I do know that Deng has all the qualities they're looking for as a player and as a person. It reminds me of how they picked up Antawn Jamison for the stretch run a few years back.

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