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2014 College QB Thread

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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:19 pm

HoodooMan wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:I like Mariota a lot too, but I get the feeling he'll be the 2nd QB off the board, meaning likely not there at 6.


Yep.

Just take a look at the bottom of the NFL standings:

JAX 0-7
TB 0-6
NYG 0-6
MIN 1-4
HOU 2-5
OAK 2-4

You have to figure chances are really good that at least one of Hundley or Mariota

returns to school. How are we going to leapfrog JAX or TB? And unless Freeman blows up in MIN, that's another team that's almost certain to pick a QB ahead of us. Do either of Houston or Oakland pass on Hundley or Mariota?

It was a fun stretch with Hoyer, but it almost certainly cost us a tippy top QB prospect this year.


Giants just might be willing to trade down in exchange for more picks - so that might be a slim possibility.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby pup » Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:24 pm

Doubt TB is taking another QB after selecting Glennon last year...so there is a little bit of extra hope.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby HoodooMan » Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:33 pm

mattvan1 wrote:Giants just might be willing to trade down in exchange for more picks - so that might be a slim possibility.


Yes, but while Eli has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt to not be elite-- big : ) --he can't be this bad the whole year, can he?

I just figure they win themselves out of that position somehow.

And damn, if my team passed on a franchise QB prospect because it already had:

Image

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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:40 pm

Unless the guy has already proven himself, only a nutbag franchise would assume their 3rd round draft pick will be "Franchise" enough to pass on a Top 5 QB in a QB-heavy draft.

Only stupid teams like Cleveland thinks 3rd rounders = hand over the franchise keys.

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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Govbarney » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:44 am

Hikohadon wrote:I like Mariota a lot too, but I get the feeling he'll be the 2nd QB off the board, meaning likely not there at 6.


1st QB off the board, take it to the bank , he is a Jag next year. Hope he likes London.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby FUDU » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:34 am

HoodooMan wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:Giants just might be willing to trade down in exchange for more picks - so that might be a slim possibility.


Yes, but while Eli has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt to not be elite-- big : ) --he can't be this bad the whole year, can he?

I just figure they win themselves out of that position somehow.

And damn, if my team passed on a franchise QB prospect because it already had:

Image

:kablooeyhead


Not to hijack, but if you take those two rings off of Eli's fingers (one with an unconventional Hail Mary, another with the unconventional failure of Tom Brady) he's right dab smack in the meh-ddle of the pack of NFL QBs. He's very dependent of the team around him even for arguably the most dependent position on the field.

There's enough reason for the Gmen to consider drafting a QB this year. Not for their immediate future mind you.

[/hijack]
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby motherscratcher » Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:20 pm

FUDU wrote:
Not to hijack, but if you take those two rings off of Eli's fingers (one with an unconventional Hail Mary, another with the unconventional failure of Tom Brady) he's right dab smack in the meh-ddle of the pack of NFL QBs. He's very dependent of the team around him even for arguably the most dependent position on the field.

There's enough reason for the Gmen to consider drafting a QB this year. Not for their immediate future mind you.

[/hijack]


So, your position is that Eli would be mediocre if not for the two Super Bowl rings on his finger?

I agree with you that the Giants probably should draft a QB. But, even if they think that too, I don't think they will pull the trigger on it.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby FUDU » Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:26 pm

motherscratcher wrote:
FUDU wrote:
Not to hijack, but if you take those two rings off of Eli's fingers (one with an unconventional Hail Mary, another with the unconventional failure of Tom Brady) he's right dab smack in the meh-ddle of the pack of NFL QBs. He's very dependent of the team around him even for arguably the most dependent position on the field.

There's enough reason for the Gmen to consider drafting a QB this year. Not for their immediate future mind you.

[/hijack]


So, your position is that Eli would be mediocre if not for the two Super Bowl rings on his finger?

I agree with you that the Giants probably should draft a QB. But, even if they think that too, I don't think they will pull the trigger on it.


That's how it's broken down, that's how the "world" judges these guys. It's still the chicken egg question. I'm not a big Romo fan, b/c he sucks at finishing games, but if Romo had 1 ring on his finger and Eli had none, Romo would be talked about in more elite breath than Eli could ever imagine. But we don't, b/c one of Eli's passes got stuck in Tyree's face mask. Eli would be looked at as very average by the world if he had no rings on his finger.

Agree, they should consider it, but my guess is they won't.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby TouchEmAllTime » Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:39 pm

FUDU wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:
FUDU wrote:
Not to hijack, but if you take those two rings off of Eli's fingers (one with an unconventional Hail Mary, another with the unconventional failure of Tom Brady) he's right dab smack in the meh-ddle of the pack of NFL QBs. He's very dependent of the team around him even for arguably the most dependent position on the field.

There's enough reason for the Gmen to consider drafting a QB this year. Not for their immediate future mind you.

[/hijack]


So, your position is that Eli would be mediocre if not for the two Super Bowl rings on his finger?

I agree with you that the Giants probably should draft a QB. But, even if they think that too, I don't think they will pull the trigger on it.


That's how it's broken down, that's how the "world" judges these guys. It's still the chicken egg question. I'm not a big Romo fan, b/c he sucks at finishing games, but if Romo had 1 ring on his finger and Eli had none, Romo would be talked about in more elite breath than Eli could ever imagine. But we don't, b/c one of Eli's passes got stuck in Tyree's face mask. Eli would be looked at as very average by the world if he had no rings on his finger.

Agree, they should consider it, but my guess is they won't.


There was some luck involved in those two SB wins, but that throw Eli made to Manningham in the second one along the sidelines was one of the best throws I've ever seen. People always want to bring up the Tyree miracle, but Eli has made some big throws in big moments. That being said, I wouldn't be shocked at all if NY starts looking for their future QB. Just saying, his resume (more so the playoffs one) shouldn't completely be discounted.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:41 pm

Saying that Eli would be considered average if not for winning those SB's is like saying Dan Marino would be considered average if he hadn't completed all those passes.

Did Eli just wake up in the SB BOTH those years? Or did he have to win a bunch of playoff games on the road?

Did he come into the game just in time to throw that pass to Tyree? Or was there like a whole rest of the game he played in well enough that a TD on that drive put them in the lead?

Like Flacco, Eli can be meh during the regular season at times, but when he gets into the playoffs, he's nails, he's a hall of famer. Beating the undefeated Patriots in the SB doesn't come down to one "lucky" play. Winning TWO Super Bowls is not chance.

Even POS gets his props for winning 2 SB's. You win 2, you are in a very elite group, and claiming it's only because of the rest of his team or luck is beneath your intelligence.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby FUDU » Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:51 pm

It most certainly was a team effort. All I am saying is the breath that separates how we talk about Eli, as opposed to a Romo maybe even a Marino, is based on his performance in one game (the Superbowl, two times of course). We seem to conveniently overlook or forget the rest of Eli's career.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby HoodooMan » Fri Oct 25, 2013 2:53 pm

Hikohadon wrote:Saying that Eli would be considered average if not for winning those SB's is like saying Dan Marino would be considered average if he hadn't completed all those passes.


Not really, because you're talking about a team accomplishment on one hand and more of an individual one one the other.

Eli was spectacular in the 2011 SB run. It was more of a mixed bag in 2007. Overall, he has a career rating of 81.8 in an era where that puts you smack dab in the middle of the league, and more often than not below average.

He'll make the HOF, but he shouldn't.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby HoodooMan » Fri Oct 25, 2013 2:57 pm

Where 81.8 ranks you in the NFL since 2004:

2004: 19th
2005: 19th
2006: 16th
2007: 19th
2008: 20th
2009: 19th
2010: 22nd
2011: 17th
2012: 19th
2013: 21st
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Fri Oct 25, 2013 3:45 pm

HoodooMan wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:Saying that Eli would be considered average if not for winning those SB's is like saying Dan Marino would be considered average if he hadn't completed all those passes.


Not really, because you're talking about a team accomplishment on one hand and more of an individual one one the other.

Eli was spectacular in the 2011 SB run. It was more of a mixed bag in 2007. Overall, he has a career rating of 81.8 in an era where that puts you smack dab in the middle of the league, and more often than not below average.

He'll make the HOF, but he shouldn't.


All I'm really saying is that you can't really use the "If this didn't happen" argument because it did happen. If a tidal wave hit my ex-wife when she was 14 I never would've met her. It was only through the sheer dumb luck of her not being in Japan during a typhoon that she was thrust into my life.

I think he's a highly mediocre regular season QB that is very dangerous in the postseason (like Flacco). Playing your best when it counts the most - NUMEROUS times - is all I really need to know about the guy.

Now, if I were New York, I'd seriously consider taking a top QB just because of the rarity of the opportunity and the luxury it affords you not having to wander the Cleveland/Tampa/Miami/Oakland desert of QB blech when it does come time for Eli to move on. That doesn't mean that Eli sucks, though.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby HoodooMan » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:09 pm

Hikohadon wrote:I think he's a highly mediocre regular season QB that is very dangerous in the postseason (like Flacco).


IMO, that's kind of a weird argument. Probably because it's so hyper-W/L-results based, and such arguments generally don't appeal to me. I'm more prone to say that pretty much any starting NFL QB is capable of going on a good 3-4 game run in the right circumstances.

But does this mean that you're no longer going to ever say Only X number of NFL QBs can win you a Super Bowl? Since it apparently doesn't matter how meh a QB is, because he might just be the kind of meh that magically becomes dangerous in the post season?
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:34 pm

HoodooMan wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:I think he's a highly mediocre regular season QB that is very dangerous in the postseason (like Flacco).


IMO, that's kind of a weird argument. Probably because it's so hyper-W/L-results based, and such arguments generally don't appeal to me. I'm more prone to say that pretty much any starting NFL QB is capable of going on a good 3-4 game run in the right circumstances.

But does this mean that you're no longer going to ever say Only X number of NFL QBs can win you a Super Bowl? Since it apparently doesn't matter how meh a QB is, because he might just be the kind of meh that magically becomes dangerous in the post season?


Yes, I have surrendered that position after last year's playoffs. Although I will state the obvious "it's MUCH easier to get to the playoffs/Super Bowl with a great QB, so much so that riding with meh in hopes of a magical run is just making things unnecessarily hard on yourself."

So please don't take that as support for settling for a QB like Hoyer (for instance).

I will soften my stance to "It is unlikely that Matt Schaub/Andy Dalton/Matthew Stafford/etc will win a SB" from the "never".

Alex Smith is a meh regular season QB that played well enough to beat NO 2 years ago (played "elite" in that game) and probably well enough to beat the Giants. Flacco is a meh regular season QB. Eli has had some really good years, I think he's better than those two.

Regardless, the Ravens won last year in large part BECAUSE Flacco played so well. The Giant won 2 rings with Eli in large part BECAUSE he played so well. During those runs at least, those guys were "elite". ;-) ;) :wink:
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Fire Marshall Bill 2.0 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:36 pm

FUDU is just trying to justify his Peyton Panties...

What's Eli's playoffs won lost total vs Peyton's, FoooooDooooo?
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby FUDU » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:27 pm

Huduman does a good job of expounding on my overall pointa especially about a 3-4 gamrs stretch.

Playing at a high level is playing at a high level, Eli doesnt all that often, and frankly has played at a meh level quite often even before this season.

I agree he is bounding over to the hall but probably shouldnt be let in.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Sun Oct 27, 2013 12:59 am

Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Sun Oct 27, 2013 9:51 am

Hikohadon wrote:Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.


SD

Hundleys stock is circling the drain.

Don't look now, but Ohio State has two draft worthy QBs one in the top five and one that's worth a pick before the fifth round.

Miller is very bit the talent of Marrioti, just less refined.

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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Oct 27, 2013 11:26 am

Hikohadon wrote:Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.


Really some red flags with Hundley as far as the next level. He's either primary receiver or those eyes drop...fast.

About the only caveat is that he's stuck with one of the dinosaurs in head coaching. Mora hasn't adjusted one bit from what he learned from his old man. A casual fan can call the UCLA plays before they happen. 2nd and 10 is ALWAYS a running play. As is 2nd and 1. Ah-la Pat Shurmer and that moron Haley in Pittsburgh that is ruining their offense. And make sure you bunch the formation as tight as possible every third and short so your dual threat QB is reduced to zero dimensions. You run into well coached squads like Stanford with that archaic approach....good luck.

So, I'm not sure if they aren't giving the keys a little more to Hundley cause they don't feel he can handle it, or if they are that GD stupid. Mora...Bo Pelini...wake up. Christ.

And Braxton Miller isn't top 5 until he improves accuracy. Greatly. For the love of Vince Young. The NFL is passing ability on an athlete. Not an athlete with questionable passing ability.

And I also have ZERO idea if Mariotta can read anything close to an NFL defense. Maybe he can, not his problem at this point - just that he doesn't really have to do it.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Sun Oct 27, 2013 1:43 pm

leadpipe wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.


Really some red flags with Hundley as far as the next level. He's either primary receiver or those eyes drop...fast.

About the only caveat is that he's stuck with one of the dinosaurs in head coaching. Mora hasn't adjusted one bit from what he learned from his old man. A casual fan can call the UCLA plays before they happen. 2nd and 10 is ALWAYS a running play. As is 2nd and 1. Ah-la Pat Shurmer and that moron Haley in Pittsburgh that is ruining their offense. And make sure you bunch the formation as tight as possible every third and short so your dual threat QB is reduced to zero dimensions. You run into well coached squads like Stanford with that archaic approach....good luck.

So, I'm not sure if they aren't giving the keys a little more to Hundley cause they don't feel he can handle it, or if they are that GD stupid. Mora...Bo Pelini...wake up. Christ.

And Braxton Miller isn't top 5 until he improves accuracy. Greatly. For the love of Vince Young. The NFL is passing ability on an athlete. Not an athlete with questionable passing ability.

And I also have ZERO idea if Mariotta can read anything close to an NFL defense. Maybe he can, not his problem at this point - just that he doesn't really have to do it.



SD:

Millers had an epiphany.

Buys time in the pocket ,by moving within the rush,and now looks downfield to complete the pass instead of run.

Moreover he's studying film like a pro and knows whose supposed to be open due to the defensive scheme rather than the Pre bobble head Weedenesque play where he had to wait to see whose open.

Hasn't yet demonstrated the sophisticated tools to throw receivers open , as that has not been needed, but has the tools to do so at the next level as he makes quick decisions and has the arm strength to throw dimes.

With better coaching in the passing game from a technique and film study aspect the talent is there for an elite level player at the next level, well beyond the athleticism. McNabb brought into the game at this levels hen he came out of Syracuse.

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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Oct 27, 2013 4:37 pm

SoulDawg74 wrote:
leadpipe wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.


Really some red flags with Hundley as far as the next level. He's either primary receiver or those eyes drop...fast.

About the only caveat is that he's stuck with one of the dinosaurs in head coaching. Mora hasn't adjusted one bit from what he learned from his old man. A casual fan can call the UCLA plays before they happen. 2nd and 10 is ALWAYS a running play. As is 2nd and 1. Ah-la Pat Shurmer and that moron Haley in Pittsburgh that is ruining their offense. And make sure you bunch the formation as tight as possible every third and short so your dual threat QB is reduced to zero dimensions. You run into well coached squads like Stanford with that archaic approach....good luck.

So, I'm not sure if they aren't giving the keys a little more to Hundley cause they don't feel he can handle it, or if they are that GD stupid. Mora...Bo Pelini...wake up. Christ.

And Braxton Miller isn't top 5 until he improves accuracy. Greatly. For the love of Vince Young. The NFL is passing ability on an athlete. Not an athlete with questionable passing ability.

And I also have ZERO idea if Mariotta can read anything close to an NFL defense. Maybe he can, not his problem at this point - just that he doesn't really have to do it.



SD:

Millers had an epiphany.

Buys time in the pocket ,by moving within the rush,and now looks downfield to complete the pass instead of run.

Moreover he's studying film like a pro and knows whose supposed to be open due to the defensive scheme rather than the Pre bobble head Weedenesque play where he had to wait to see whose open.

Hasn't yet demonstrated the sophisticated tools to throw receivers open , as that has not been needed, but has the tools to do so at the next level as he makes quick decisions and has the arm strength to throw dimes.

With better coaching in the passing game from a technique and film study aspect the talent is there for an elite level player at the next level, well beyond the athleticism. McNabb brought into the game at this levels hen he came out of Syracuse.

SoulDawg


McNabb threw the ball so much better at Syracuse than Miller does now, it's not funny.

Whatever the future brings, we'll see, but he ain't goin' top 5 till be proves he can throw it better.

Even for an overdrafted position in terms of value, a guy with "project" in areas on him isn't going top 5. If he shakes project issues before he declares - another story. Right now - no way in hell.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:19 am

leadpipe wrote:
SoulDawg74 wrote:
leadpipe wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:Be surprised at this point if Hundley comes out, clearly needs another year in college to hone his not-suck against good teams.


Really some red flags with Hundley as far as the next level. He's either primary receiver or those eyes drop...fast.

About the only caveat is that he's stuck with one of the dinosaurs in head coaching. Mora hasn't adjusted one bit from what he learned from his old man. A casual fan can call the UCLA plays before they happen. 2nd and 10 is ALWAYS a running play. As is 2nd and 1. Ah-la Pat Shurmer and that moron Haley in Pittsburgh that is ruining their offense. And make sure you bunch the formation as tight as possible every third and short so your dual threat QB is reduced to zero dimensions. You run into well coached squads like Stanford with that archaic approach....good luck.

So, I'm not sure if they aren't giving the keys a little more to Hundley cause they don't feel he can handle it, or if they are that GD stupid. Mora...Bo Pelini...wake up. Christ.

And Braxton Miller isn't top 5 until he improves accuracy. Greatly. For the love of Vince Young. The NFL is passing ability on an athlete. Not an athlete with questionable passing ability.

And I also have ZERO idea if Mariotta can read anything close to an NFL defense. Maybe he can, not his problem at this point - just that he doesn't really have to do it.



SD:

Millers had an epiphany.

Buys time in the pocket ,by moving within the rush,and now looks downfield to complete the pass instead of run.

Moreover he's studying film like a pro and knows whose supposed to be open due to the defensive scheme rather than the Pre bobble head Weedenesque play where he had to wait to see whose open.

Hasn't yet demonstrated the sophisticated tools to throw receivers open , as that has not been needed, but has the tools to do so at the next level as he makes quick decisions and has the arm strength to throw dimes.

With better coaching in the passing game from a technique and film study aspect the talent is there for an elite level player at the next level, well beyond the athleticism. McNabb brought into the game at this levels hen he came out of Syracuse.

SoulDawg


McNabb threw the ball so much better at Syracuse than Miller does now, it's not funny.

Whatever the future brings, we'll see, but he ain't goin' top 5 till be proves he can throw it better.

Even for an overdrafted position in terms of value, a guy with "project" in areas on him isn't going top 5. If he shakes project issues before he declares - another story. Right now - no way in hell.



SD:

You have to understand its not in the best interests of these College coaches to prepare QB's for the next level , but exploit what they can out of them while they have them for their own purposes .

IE EJ Manuel had a falling out with that coaching staff , because they weren't preparing him for the next level , but were using him up like he was Adrian Peterson on junk College run option bullshit schemes .

Pryor admitted he had to come to Oakland to learn how to throw .

and as an advocate of his raw talent , I'd be the first to tell , ya he threw like a fucking girl , it was that butt ugly while in College.

Didn't like his fundamnetals one damn bit .

Which brings me back to Miller < I wouldn't have let him handoff from the wildcat n a pro team last year his passing was that suspect .

And the start of this season wasn't too much more he was showing to change that opinion .

However dudring the Northwestern game , a game in which he fumbled and otherwise screwed the pooch , I saw a kid who dug down deep and pulled it out when he didn't have anywhere near his best stuff , making plays with his arm instead of his leg .

He learned something that day which he has been applying to his game , like a math student who finds its easier to do division in hs head faster than with paper pencil or calculator , and he never knew it was there .

He's learned the value of film study and that there is a game within a game well beyond being the best physical specimen on the field , it came from being injured when his own mortality became a reality , as he learned the lesson Youngins take all too long to realize ,.

Your not bullet proof, plus Guiton was having six TD games and could go out dancing that night instead of sitting all night in an ice water bath to take down the swelling from the pounding he was taking awhich Guiton deftly avoided, by simply spinning that pill.

Watch the game , he stepped up into the pocket feeling the rush , but not focussing on it as he kept his eyes downfield completing ropes .

He's subtley made that change from a runner who will chuck and run , to a QB looking to pass first , who can use his legs to buy time , or take off when all else fails .

He can do nothing but get better and better ,as he is now using all the bullets in the chamber , and thats the player I'm advocating , the one I'm projecting will be avaiable as a result of this continued development at years end .

Not the kid you think you know who your refering too.

With Hoyer and Campbell to apprentce behind and Turner too develop his game , we're talking an Aaron Rodgers type course of development with the same athletic type upside
,without blowing two or more of our number one picks chasing the grail.


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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:15 am

2 things

Miller CAN make all the throws but tOSU doesn't ask him to - the route trees are pretty simple - a lot of bubble screens, flat/curl stuff and go routes.

Do we know if he is going to declare? Pretty crowded QB class in 2014. Guys always come out of the woodwork but right now it seems as if the cupboard is bare for 2015. If Miller stays and continues to develop would go much much higher (obviously) and without (at least right now) too much competition.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:34 am

mattvan1 wrote:2 things

Miller CAN make all the throws but tOSU doesn't ask him to - the route trees are pretty simple - a lot of bubble screens, flat/curl stuff and go routes.

Do we know if he is going to declare? Pretty crowded QB class in 2014. Guys always come out of the woodwork but right now it seems as if the cupboard is bare for 2015. If Miller stays and continues to develop would go much much higher (obviously) and without (at least right now) too much competition.


I really think Miller stays another year to try and vault his stock (not to mention make a legit run at the Heisman) rather than come out now and be the 5th/6th QB drafted.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby jb » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:22 am

If Hundley stays in school, and Teddy and Mariotta are gone, anyone thinking we stand pat until we see what's there in round 2 as they are all different versions of JAGS not worthy of a # 1?

The alternative is to rush and reach and make another Weeden mistake.

I know everyone is programmed that we NEED a QB and must take one hell or high water, but I gotta tell yah if the options are a Seastrunk, a top shelf WR, or a playmaking ILB to put a bow on the defense, I simply don't want to reach for a Carr or Boyd.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby jb » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:23 am

mattvan1 wrote:2 things

Miller CAN make all the throws but tOSU doesn't ask him to - the route trees are pretty simple - a lot of bubble screens, flat/curl stuff and go routes.

Do we know if he is going to declare? Pretty crowded QB class in 2014. Guys always come out of the woodwork but right now it seems as if the cupboard is bare for 2015. If Miller stays and continues to develop would go much much higher (obviously) and without (at least right now) too much competition.



Miller would be the dumbest man on earth to come out this year.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:33 am

jb wrote:If Hundley stays in school, and Teddy and Mariotta are gone, anyone thinking we stand pat until we see what's there in round 2 as they are all different versions of JAGS not worthy of a # 1?

The alternative is to rush and reach and make another Weeden mistake.

I know everyone is programmed that we NEED a QB and must take one hell or high water, but I gotta tell yah if the options are a Seastrunk, a top shelf WR, or a playmaking ILB to put a bow on the defense, I simply don't want to reach for a Carr or Boyd.


I'm with you. No packaging of picks. If the guy you want is there when you select then take him. If he's not then take BPA at position of need.

It's very clear to everyone to everyone but Mike Holmgren that Anyone Other than Weeden (IOW, anyone exhibiting even basic competencies at the QB position) can move the organization and the team forward in their march to relevancy.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:34 am

jb wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:2 things

Miller CAN make all the throws but tOSU doesn't ask him to - the route trees are pretty simple - a lot of bubble screens, flat/curl stuff and go routes.

Do we know if he is going to declare? Pretty crowded QB class in 2014. Guys always come out of the woodwork but right now it seems as if the cupboard is bare for 2015. If Miller stays and continues to develop would go much much higher (obviously) and without (at least right now) too much competition.



Miller would be the dumbest man on earth to come out this year.


Agree again. His rate of development under Meyer is quickening and widening. Another year puts him right in the mix of Top 10 guys if that pace continues.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby HoodooMan » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:48 am

jb wrote:If Hundley stays in school, and Teddy and Mariotta are gone, anyone thinking we stand pat until we see what's there in round 2 as they are all different versions of JAGS not worthy of a # 1?


Hope we do, fear we won't.

Also, FTR, Jameis has a bubble butt. And it's weird that he's throwing to red blobs of color out there.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 4:26 pm

HoodooMan wrote:
jb wrote:If Hundley stays in school, and Teddy and Mariotta are gone, anyone thinking we stand pat until we see what's there in round 2 as they are all different versions of JAGS not worthy of a # 1?


Hope we do, fear we won't.

Also, FTR, Jameis has a bubble butt. And it's weird that he's throwing to red blobs of color out there.


You saw that too? (not his butt, but the fact he doesn't wear his contacts while playing and has to squint to see the play call from the sidelines) Weird.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:11 am

Mariota staying.

Mettenberger and Murray with a torn ACL (not that I wanted them anyway, but if they DID draft one of them they'd have to redshirt their rookie year).

Hundley and Miller likely to stay in school.

So, of the supposed top prospects, that leaves:

Teddy Bridgewater (have to be at #1 to get him)
Johnny Douchebag (pass)
AJ McCarron (sigh, so uninteresting)
Tajh Boyd (meh)
Derek Carr (something about the Carr name frightens me)

Everyone else (including that Ggarroppollo dude) are rated as 3rd round or later, so I'm not gonna pretend like we should EXPECT them to be any better than the fodder we have had.

Teams picking ahead of us right now:

Houston - Likely to draft QB
STL (from WAS) - I doubt it
Jacksonville - Hell yes
Atlanta - No
Tampa - At this point, I doubt it
Vikings - Hell yes

So, at 7, the Browns might be looking at either taking the 4th best QB of a rapidly deteriorating QB class (likely Manziel or McCarron or Boyd) or waiting until the 2nd round and taking a Mettenberger or Grrrappollllo.

Or heading into the season with Brian Fucking Hoyer, Jason Fucking Campbell, and Mike-Lombardi-Identified-Developmental-QB.

Is it time to start analyzing the 2015 QB draft class yet?

:gah:
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby motherscratcher » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:13 am

I was thinking about this yesterday when I heard about marriota. What a big pile of meh...including Bridgewater really, compared to some of the QB prospects of years past. Unless we can get up to #1 and take Teddy, I thnk it's Clowney or bust with our first pick. Probably need to get up to #2 for that.

I agree with your assessment of who needs QBs, but I just can't fathom Teddy, Manziel, mcCarron, and Boyd all going in the top 7. Maybe one of them will be available with our second pick?

Jeez...I'm not sure I really want any of them. It's another 2 year minimum wasted if we go in on one of those guys in the first and they turn out to be what we all think they probably are...ugh.

I'd like to know about Carr. My inclination is to stay away, but that's 100% based on big bro. Which is unfair and ridiculous. Maybe David is Ozzie and Derek is Jose...
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:17 pm

motherscratcher wrote:I was thinking about this yesterday when I heard about marriota. What a big pile of meh...including Bridgewater really, compared to some of the QB prospects of years past. Unless we can get up to #1 and take Teddy, I thnk it's Clowney or bust with our first pick. Probably need to get up to #2 for that.

I agree with your assessment of who needs QBs, but I just can't fathom Teddy, Manziel, mcCarron, and Boyd all going in the top 7. Maybe one of them will be available with our second pick?

Jeez...I'm not sure I really want any of them. It's another 2 year minimum wasted if we go in on one of those guys in the first and they turn out to be what we all think they probably are...ugh.

I'd like to know about Carr. My inclination is to stay away, but that's 100% based on big bro. Which is unfair and ridiculous. Maybe David is Ozzie and Derek is Jose...


Given that Manuel went mid-first last April, I can easily see all four going in the first seven.

That said, I dangle both our firsts and all the other spare picks Lombardi picked up to Washington and see if Snyder's ready to write off the RG3 Era in favor of the Johnny Football Era.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby pod2dawg » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:39 pm

For the record I was all in on Mariota. Raw but HUGE upside & I see the next Kapernick possibilty there.

So sitting on a park bench & accepting Hiks analysis I hereby decree...count me in on this race for us coming down to either Carr or Johnny Hotdog.

Don't know enough about Carr yet vs. J. Hotdog which I do believe will do well.

Why?...Why you say?

1. Passing League
2. Hoyer, Campbell, Tanney, somebody Caleb.........oh and Weeden.

I can't sit thru another season of 4-12 with at least throwing another fresh glob of shit against the wall and hoping something sticks at the QB position.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:54 pm

I'd be quite happy with Teddy, but outside of that I guess I have to vote Carr too since he's the only one of that group that I haven't seen enough of to say Meh or For The Love Of God No.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby googleeph2 » Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:21 pm

There was a Fresno State San Jose State game recently- Carr vs. Fales, and it was really entertaining. They both looked great to me. I followed some scouting tweets that night and they sure seemed to be smiling and nodding about Carr. They were talking about how he'll skyrocket toward the top of the draft. He was accurate, moved well in the pocket, knew what he was doing in changing plays at the line. He scrambled for yardage, and the announcers said he had a sports hernia last year and that resulted in him getting no credit for running ability- but that ability is there again. I am fully on board with Carr, and it would be great if they can keep the other pick.

On a side note, the Cleveland Browns have no business entertaining the likes of a QB whose name sounds like "fails"...

David Carr- I don't remember him ever being as good as Derek. Hope the connection devalues him some. Also, interesting that he was in college a looong time ago. I saw him get benched at tOSU in Cooper's last season. Threw several picks. Belisari looked better.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby General » Wed Dec 04, 2013 8:36 pm

I'm going to put myself out there over and over again. AJ McCarron is the answer. I will take on all beatings now and later. I have a gut feeling on him. This is part subjective and based on gaudy Alabama record. Go ahead and let me have it I will not argue. Gut. That is all. :hide:
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:58 pm

General wrote:I'm going to put myself out there over and over again. AJ McCarron is the answer. I will take on all beatings now and later. I have a gut feeling on him. This is part subjective and based on gaudy Alabama record. Go ahead and let me have it I will not argue. Gut. That is all. :hide:



SD:

All he does is win .

On the IQ meter there isn't another better.

I'd use my second number one on him , or trade down my first number one if I could net a #1 for next year, and sign him then , but not with a top five pick if we get that high.

Kinda partial to the SIU kid in the second if we don't draft a QB in the first.

The pickings are getting that slim.


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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:44 pm

As long as you fuckers aren't trumpeting Johnny Douchebag, I'm good. I'll give anyone but that disaster a shot at this point.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby justmebd » Thu Dec 05, 2013 8:22 am

Hikohadon wrote:As long as you fuckers aren't trumpeting Johnny Douchebag, I'm good. I'll give anyone but that disaster a shot at this point.

+1

He's just a dumber version of Colt McCoy, and unlike Hiko I don't have a burning hatred of Colt McCoy, but for the love of God NOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby jb » Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:15 am

AJ McCarron? Really, why not?

With MM back in school it's Teddy & the 7 dwarfs. Ones potentially as good as the other. Get the best one left in rd 2 & use round 1 to improve the team.

Look at the QB rankings for the class of 2012. Ray Charles can see the lesson.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby mattvan1 » Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:23 am

Hikohadon wrote:As long as you fuckers aren't trumpeting Johnny Douchebag, I'm good. I'll give anyone but that disaster a shot at this point.


Truth. His off the field issues make Josh Gordon look like a monk.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby motherscratcher » Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:06 am

If we don't end up in pole position for Teddy (and we won't) I'm all in for this guy: Jimmy Garoppolo from Eastern Illinois

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20131113/jimmy-garoppolo-eastern-illinois/

When it gets closer to combine time I'll start the "Jimmy Garoppolo FTW" thread.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby jb » Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:56 am

I'm calling Mettenberger with the Colts pick now, BTW.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby General » Thu Dec 05, 2013 11:48 am

jb wrote:I'm calling Mettenberger with the Colts pick now, BTW.


Torn ACL, sprained MCL. Surgery held up until MCL heals.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby jb » Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:02 pm

General wrote:
jb wrote:I'm calling Mettenberger with the Colts pick now, BTW.


Torn ACL, sprained MCL. Surgery held up until MCL heals.



Yep. What better way to show you're smarter than everyone, and ensure Hoyer gets a longer look if you are Lombardi?
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby Hikohadon » Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:49 pm

jb wrote:
General wrote:
jb wrote:I'm calling Mettenberger with the Colts pick now, BTW.


Torn ACL, sprained MCL. Surgery held up until MCL heals.



Yep. What better way to show you're smarter than everyone, and ensure Hoyer gets a longer look if you are Lombardi?


It's thoughts like this which led to me choosing my adopt-a-team (the Seahawks) before the season even began this year.

In the past, I'd always waited until the Browns were at least eliminated before jumping on another team's bandwagon, but it seems Cleveland is eliminated before the season even starts these days.
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Re: 2014 College QB Thread

Unread postby rebelwithoutaclue » Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:31 pm

mattvan1 wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:As long as you fuckers aren't trumpeting Johnny Douchebag, I'm good. I'll give anyone but that disaster a shot at this point.


Truth. His off the field issues make Josh Gordon look like a monk.




Hyperbole much? Josh Gordon was kicked out of school; Manziel was suspended for what, a quarter?
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