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FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:29 pm

peeker643 wrote:With or without JC I think the Browns will exploit the seams this season. Between Little, Gordon and Nelson and with Bess/Benjamin/B Jackson and Dion Lewis, they'll be able to do so in one way or another.

IF JC gets/stays healthy they're even more dangerous. But let's be honest: TEs like Moore and to an extent Watson were basically guys too fast for LBs and too big for DBs. They have that w/Little/Gordon and Nelson.

If the O can create some matchup issues and Weeds can recognize them, they'll be fine.

Obviously that's the biggest caveat, but if it happens I like this offense as much as any they've put on the field here since '99.

YMMV.



Good point. From a talent perspective better to have 3 or even 4 WR's out there quite a bit.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby AttackOffense » Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:09 pm

Bottom line: I just think it's easier to defense the Browns because they lack a quality threat at the tight end position. If we could add a greater TE threat, somebody who legitimately scares defenses more, that would help Weeden and the offense, just as a nice threat at TE has helped many other NFL offenses -- from Whitten in Dallas and F. Davis in San Fran to Graham in Cincy and Miller in Pitts. With out it, instead of all 8 cylinders humming smoothly, there's a bit of a sputter and hesitation in the engine.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby AttackOffense » Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:11 pm

jb wrote:
peeker643 wrote:With or without JC I think the Browns will exploit the seams this season. Between Little, Gordon and Nelson and with Bess/Benjamin/B Jackson and Dion Lewis, they'll be able to do so in one way or another.

IF JC gets/stays healthy they're even more dangerous. But let's be honest: TEs like Moore and to an extent Watson were basically guys too fast for LBs and too big for DBs. They have that w/Little/Gordon and Nelson.

If the O can create some matchup issues and Weeds can recognize them, they'll be fine.

Obviously that's the biggest caveat, but if it happens I like this offense as much as any they've put on the field here since '99.

YMMV.



Good point. From a talent perspective better to have 3 or even 4 WR's out there quite a bit.

Very exciting to read that Chud may line up Nelson some to play a TE role. I love anything that's going to confuse defenses. For a change, let's have other teams guessing vs. all this predictable stuff that has pretty mcuh represented the Browns offense in recent years.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby YahooFanChicago » Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:37 am

Govbarney wrote:
YahooFanChicago wrote:This is one ugly thread.

I'm just hoping for a new ownership group since I don't like Jimmay and Banner. How entertaining would it be to see Jimmay and Banner crash and burn and a new owner bring back Heckert. I am not saying Heckert was awesome (I do think he was good) but I would love to see him ignore and then fire the guy who just ignored and fired him last year.


Yes because its so "entertaining" to watch the Browns suck. I would think you would have had enough of that form of entertainment the past decade and a half.


Of course I would much rather have a good team and long-term/stable ownership and front office. This team should be better than prior years but I think 8-8 at best and more likely 6-10 or 7-9. Also, do you think Banner and Mike Lombardi are the front office that can build a consistent contender? I don't so I would rather take the bullet yet again and get on with it.

Very high likelihood that Jimmay is forced to sell. Very likely that Mike Lomardi is just as much of a scrub now as he was last time he was here and that Banner is a pecker head control freak. Most new owners bring in their own President/Exec. who cleans house and brings in the guys he knows and trusts. I think all of those things are >70% likely in this case.

If I'm wrong I will take pleasure in watching us win. If not, I will take whatever enjoyment I can out of watching Lombardi, Banner and Jimmay crash and burn.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby AttackOffense » Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:13 pm

Wouldn't it be great to bring in another new coach who goes back to the 4-3 after Browns being in the 3-4 and before that the 4-3 and before that the 3-4. Maybe they'll rename the team the Cleveland Ping-Pongs.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby YahooFanChicago » Tue Jun 11, 2013 1:03 am

That's a good idea. Maybe the new guys can change the offense back to west coast also? Poorly executed verticle passing to poorly executed west coast to vertical passing and then back to west coast again? I guess we could also go back to alienating and fighting with Jim Brown again. That shouldn't be too difficult.

All kidding aside, I do think this new coaching staff has potential. I don't like our President & GM but I will give them credit in assembling what seems like a good coaching staff though.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Hikohadon » Tue Jun 11, 2013 8:43 am

AttackOffense wrote:Wouldn't it be great to bring in another new coach who goes back to the 4-3 after Browns being in the 3-4 and before that the 4-3 and before that the 3-4. Maybe they'll rename the team the Cleveland Ping-Pongs.


An apropos name, since they're in the NFL version of the lottery every year.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby AttackOffense » Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:04 am

YahooFanChicago wrote:That's a good idea. Maybe the new guys can change the offense back to west coast also? Poorly executed verticle passing to poorly executed west coast to vertical passing and then back to west coast again? I guess we could also go back to alienating and fighting with Jim Brown again. That shouldn't be too difficult.

All kidding aside, I do think this new coaching staff has potential. I don't like our President & GM but I will give them credit in assembling what seems like a good coaching staff though.


In my opinion this is the best coaching staff the Browns have had since Belichick.

But I do wonder about Chud a little: he thinks DB Chris Owens is talented and obviously pushed Lombardi to get him in FA. But nearly everyone else, including the staff and media and fans covering Owens's former team, Atlanta, thought he stank.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby justmebd » Wed Jun 19, 2013 9:38 am

Three more employees plead and turn state's evidence. I think my timeline of Jimmy getting indicted right at the beginning of training camp is holding strong.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Govbarney » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:06 am

I still think his brother is going to pull some strings and get him out of this mess, would be allot easier with a republican in the White House , but regardless this thing is going to drag out for years, and in the end he will get away with it, question is how much will the day to day operations of the Browns suffer.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby justmebd » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:23 am

If the indictments end up being what I think they are (Massive fraud-type stuff), the NFL will make Jimmy sell as this will impact his ability to afford the team.

Once Art Modell could no longer make the bills, the NFL made him sell, it won't be any different with this hick.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby gotribe31 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:37 am

Hiring an FBI agent as their director of security might help.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Govbarney » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:59 am

justmebd wrote:If the indictments end up being what I think they are (Massive fraud-type stuff), the NFL will make Jimmy sell as this will impact his ability to afford the team.

Once Art Modell could no longer make the bills, the NFL made him sell, it won't be any different with this hick.


Is there any proof that the NFL forced Modell to sell, from what I understand his decision to sell was firmly his own because he was concerned about leaving his family with massive amounts of debt, and besides Modell stopped "making bills" in the late 80's . If anything you would have expected the NFL to step in sometime around the Andre Rison fiasco.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby justmebd » Wed Jun 19, 2013 7:46 pm

Govbarney wrote:
justmebd wrote:If the indictments end up being what I think they are (Massive fraud-type stuff), the NFL will make Jimmy sell as this will impact his ability to afford the team.

Once Art Modell could no longer make the bills, the NFL made him sell, it won't be any different with this hick.


Is there any proof that the NFL forced Modell to sell, from what I understand his decision to sell was firmly his own because he was concerned about leaving his family with massive amounts of debt, and besides Modell stopped "making bills" in the late 80's . If anything you would have expected the NFL to step in sometime around the Andre Rison fiasco.

Yes, the proof is out there. I can't point you to a specific place right now, but I know both Pluto and Grossi have talked about it.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:15 pm

Modell has no meaning here.

But Eddie D sure does.

NFL ownership threashold isn't innocent until proven guilty. Precident is the stink of indictment makes you an embarrassment & goota go.

Trey's bigget asset is his previous Stiller ownership stake. he had it while this was going on. As we know that franchise can do no wrong, the Roonet Irish mafia may save him.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby rk » Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:40 pm

jb wrote:Trey's bigget asset is his previous Stiller ownership stake. he had it while this was going on. As we know that franchise can do no wrong, the Roonet Irish mafia may save him.


Assuming his brother isn't part of the reason for the federal interest in making this a criminal matter he would also have to receive some consideration as Jimmy's biggest asset.

So far the only thing I've seen here is 'mail fraud'. Still no reason for the IRS to be involved. But they are.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:50 pm

rk wrote:
jb wrote:Trey's bigget asset is his previous Stiller ownership stake. he had it while this was going on. As we know that franchise can do no wrong, the Roonet Irish mafia may save him.


Assuming his brother isn't part of the reason for the federal interest in making this a criminal matter he would also have to receive some consideration as Jimmy's biggest asset.

So far the only thing I've seen here is 'mail fraud'. Still no reason for the IRS to be involved. But they are.


Not to go all reentsian here, but BOJ (Brother of Jimmy) waers the wrong jersey and is only a gov. How's that help him one iota?
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Govbarney » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:52 am

Well in spite of everything JH3 is still spending money
RT @caplannfl: Browns named former Raiders PR director Zak Gilbert as director of communications
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Spin » Mon Jul 01, 2013 11:36 pm

OH FUCK.

Well we know where Jimmy got the money to buy the Browns now.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutd ... 16498.html

A nice $700,000,000 dividend from Pilot (the same amount he put down on the Browns) from a company four BILLION dollars in debt. That sounds like embezzlement, doesn't it?

Make the move, Roger. Get him the fuck out of here.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby noles1 » Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:58 am

Like many things, you have to be careful in reacting to the headline versus the actuality of the situation.

In this particular case, this is not terribly uncommon to leverage one's company for a period of time. The downgraded rating is serious, no doubt but Pilot was actually really well positioned prior so it is not catastrophic either. It is also tough for Joe Schmo to appreciate the kind of money that moves hands from time to time with these companies. Not to make excuse or condone what is taking place here, just sayin.

However, when you combined this with all the other major mis-steps I think this is a terrible look for Jimmah and his regime. I think between this and the selling of the minor league team & stake in the Steelers, it does continue to put into question his financial viability as an owner. In a way, I am shocked that the NFL did not fully vett this out during their evaluation process. I can understand not knowing the FBI investigation but Rog & Team not having a better handle on Jimmah's finances is very surprising. Really is the good old boy network...

That said, the federal investigation will be more of a challenge for Jimmah then the financial because basically everything he has done since he's gotten the Browns has been with profits in mind. (naming rights, tv show, radio deals, and countless other minor profit-driven decisions) When all said and done, as long as Jimmah can separate from the blame game with the investigation, he'll stick around. Anything less and his ownership is in jeopardy. My two cents...
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Govbarney » Tue Jul 02, 2013 8:13 am

Spin wrote:OH FUCK.

Well we know where Jimmy got the money to buy the Browns now.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutd ... 16498.html

A nice $700,000,000 dividend from Pilot (the same amount he put down on the Browns) from a company four BILLION dollars in debt. That sounds like embezzlement, doesn't it?

Make the move, Roger. Get him the fuck out of here.


Its a common practice among companies who are looking to make large capital investment, and its been known for a long time that's where he got the money, nothing fishy or illegal about it. That being said , not the wisest investment in light of whats happened since.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:43 am

Spin wrote:OH That sounds like embezzlement, doesn't it?




Dude. He owns the company and it is privately held.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:44 am

Govbarney wrote:
Spin wrote:OH FUCK.

Well we know where Jimmy got the money to buy the Browns now.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutd ... 16498.html

A nice $700,000,000 dividend from Pilot (the same amount he put down on the Browns) from a company four BILLION dollars in debt. That sounds like embezzlement, doesn't it?

Make the move, Roger. Get him the fuck out of here.


Its a common practice among companies who are looking to make large capital investment, and its been known for a long time that's where he got the money, nothing fishy or illegal about it. That being said , not the wisest investment in light of whats happened since.



There's that, but in the overall scehem damn near everything is trending toward the old Thomas Crapper device for Trey.

I get that tis Moddy's thing may fluctate but it's yet another data point in the nosedive.

Big thing, of couse, will be the trial if it goes there.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby gotribe31 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:28 pm

Jimmy is in Trouble. Capital T. Everyone under him is rolling. Shit was getting recorded by CHS's. There's an electronic paper trail. And when they get done cutting deals, there's gonna be one guy who doesn't have anyone above him to roll on. Mr. Pres himself, a guy who was admittedly involved in every minute detail of his organization from top to bottom. I don't see how this ends well for JHjr.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/97918 ... al-inquiry

At least 11 former Pilot employees already are cooperating with the FBI and offering evidence against Pilot. Seven of them have entered guilty pleas to fraud charges, and four have obtained immunity from prosecution in return for their cooperation. Late last month, federal prosecutors, in a major signal, arranged to postpone the sentencing of the seven to allow the FBI to continue its probe. The delay shows that the investigation is growing beyond earlier expectations, say lawyers and an investigator involved in the probe who spoke to ESPN.com on condition of anonymity. The court cases are now scheduled for a report to the judge on Feb. 3.



According to the sworn FBI statement filed in federal court in Knoxville, the probe began when an individual known only as Confidential Human Source 1 (CHS1) told the FBI that an employee of Pilot had described to CHS1 a vast scheme in which Pilot officials "had been intentionally defrauding" Pilot customers by withholding amounts due to customers in the form of monthly rebate checks. Instead of sending the promised rebate on the fuel purchased by the customer, Pilot employees reduced the amounts of the rebates to increase company profits and to increase their sales commissions.

Agents quickly located a Pilot employee now known as CHS2, who told them that "the fraud occurred with the knowledge" of all four of the Pilot executives, including Haslam, who attended the meeting in 2009 when Haslam expressed his gratitude to his national sales director for saving the company money during the recession.



At a meeting in February recorded by the former employee known as CHS2, Freeman explained that Western Express unexpectedly caught him cheating on rebates.

"I called Jimmy (Haslam) and told him I got busted at Western Express," Freeman said. "He knew all along that I was cost-plussin' this guy (another Pilot shorthand expression for reducing rebates without the customer's knowledge). He knew it all along and loved it. We were makin' $450,000 a month" on Western.

Freeman then bragged to CHS2 that he persuaded Western to take $1 million back in settlement even though "we did it for five years. We made $6 million on (Western), and it cost us a million bucks."



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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby mattvan1 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:04 pm

CHS1

Really?

I mean what other kind of source is there? Confidential Animal Source? Confidential Machine Source?

And yes, it appears our beloved team needs a new owner. Will that come with another rebuild?
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby gotribe31 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:47 pm

mattvan1 wrote:CHS1

Really?

I mean what other kind of source is there? Confidential Animal Source? Confidential Machine Source?

And yes, it appears our beloved team needs a new owner. Will that come with another rebuild?


Some agencies just call them CI's. FBI always uses CHS. Could be an electronic source I guess.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby peeker643 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:28 pm

gotribe31 wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:CHS1

Really?

I mean what other kind of source is there? Confidential Animal Source? Confidential Machine Source?

And yes, it appears our beloved team needs a new owner. Will that come with another rebuild?


Some agencies just call them CI's. FBI always uses CHS. Could be an electronic source I guess.


Another article in ESPN said the contingency is for team to go to Jimmy's old man.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:55 pm

peeker643 wrote:
gotribe31 wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:CHS1

Really?

I mean what other kind of source is there? Confidential Animal Source? Confidential Machine Source?

And yes, it appears our beloved team needs a new owner. Will that come with another rebuild?


Some agencies just call them CI's. FBI always uses CHS. Could be an electronic source I guess.


Another article in ESPN said the contingency is for team to go to Jimmy's old man.


That would be grand since he's only like 98.

You keep losing owners, next man/woman up. Banner's the de facto owner anyway.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby jb » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:17 am

Ownership 1 - passionate father out leaves team to absentee son.

Ownership 2. - passionate son out leaves team to absentee father.

OIC where Orange is the New Brown ( and yeah I claim 1 st use bitche$ ).

OTOH they still gotta prove it it court or get a deal. Just becasue there's testimony doesn't = conviction. I say this not as a wierdo pollyanna fan but as one jaded in the legal system.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby pod2dawg » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:08 am

Deal. Meet the new (older) Orange.
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Re: FBI Locks Down Flying J Headquarters

Unread postby Hikohadon » Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:18 am

Ron Swanson: Capitalism - God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor.
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