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Cleveland Browns & The NFL

The Search

Talk Browns football and discuss the NFL here.

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Re: The Search

Unread postby bookelly » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:43 am

Hikohadon wrote:
peeker643 wrote:As to Trestman, he was here in late 80's and it was rocky at times but not because of him. He was in a bad situation w/Bernie, etc as Bernie was Manning-like in the specific sense he wanted/demanded control of the offense. The Trestman Browns were actually pretty good offensively. I have no idea why he fell off the NFL map but he was also very young when he was here and maybe he didn't play nice with others.

Not sure he's head coaching material but not sure he's not.


He's been a pretty damn good coach in the CFL. Not sure how much that means, but it is successful head coaching experience.

I actually wouldn't mind that hire at all.


The Canadian pitch is wider with deeper endzones, so isn't it like playing on grass vs. clay in tennis? One game is spread out for the slow guys (clay/CFL), the other is speed and more speed (grass/NFL). Not sure how that would translate.

Tho at least he does have to work with a limited roster...which give him a management skill college coaches don't possess.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:15 am

It's not like he has no experience with NFL football conditions.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:03 am

I guess Kosar likes Trestman, but that 1988/89 Browns offense was not that good, IIRC.
Although the Browns were a mess- Schottenheimer was handing off the offense after trying to handle himself when Infante left, and Modell was actively refusing to invest in the O line.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:11 am

googleeph2 wrote:I guess Kosar likes Trestman, but that 1988/89 Browns offense was not that good, IIRC.
Although the Browns were a mess- Schottenheimer was handing off the offense after trying to handle himself when Infante left, and Modell was actively refusing to invest in the O line.


To be fair, they used about 5 QB's in 88, and Kosar was never the same post Lloyd Burress.

Kosar was more than mentally capable of carrying on post Infante - just not physically. Which is why Kosar's phone rang when Belichik needed to bend someone's mind in learning about NFL offense.

What thel hell do I really know about Trestman, but I would say that a commendation from Kosar ain't the worst bit of news.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:16 am

Agree, and if the guy is a respected offensive mind who has shown he can lead, well I'm sure I can warm up to him.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:18 am

I divide the remaining coaching options into 3 categories.

Guess I'd Be Fine: Mike McCoy, Ken Whisenhunt, David Shaw, Jay Gruden, Marc Trestman, Chris Peterson, Josh McDaniels, Greg Roman, Bruce Arians

Meh (Prob Because We Need Offense More): Lovie Smith, Mike Zimmer, Ray Horton, Jack Of The River, Seattle's DC

Vomit: Jon Gruden, Bill Cowher, Jim Tressel
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Re: The Search

Unread postby FUDU » Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:11 am

I just can't see this FO taking the chance on Trestman. I mean you're the new big shot owner in the NFL and you hire a CFL coach, regardless of your drawl. Man if it doesn't work out you're quite possibly a bigger joke than Randy at future owners meetings.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:29 am

FUDU wrote:I just can't see this FO taking the chance on Trestman. I mean you're the new big shot owner in the NFL and you hire a CFL coach, regardless of your drawl. Man if it doesn't work out you're quite possibly a bigger joke than Randy at future owners meetings.


Dude's a joke already, might as well not give a damn what anyone else thinks and do what he truly believes is the right thing. Start from the top down. It's his team, not Joe Banner's team.

He'd be better off if someone came in and broke the curse that Wormtongue has over him.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:01 pm

How many brain cells does Bernie have left these days? Six? His Twitter feed is pretty much the poster-child for how severe head trauma (and drug use) can ruin someone's ability to function at a level higher than a fourth grader.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Nicastro13 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:04 pm

andrew6586 wrote:The over under on the obscene amount of money the Browns will throw at Saban tomorrow is $7M per year. I'm taking the over.



It better be over he's making 5.3 at Bama, plus 100K for getting to NC game and another 200K for winning, not to mention endorsment, radio/TV bs and whatever "extra" money hes probably getting.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:10 pm

If the Browns find a guy that can lead I'll be fine. That is a cliche' and incorporates a lot of things, but they haven't had a 'leader' since they returned. Get that guy whether we know his name or not.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby neoleo » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:30 pm

googleeph2 wrote:I guess Kosar likes Trestman, but that 1988/89 Browns offense was not that good, IIRC.
Although the Browns were a mess- Schottenheimer was handing off the offense after trying to handle himself when Infante left, and Modell was actively refusing to invest in the O line.


Webster Slaughter had a career year and was a pro bowler in 89, and Bernie actually had one of his better years yardage wise that year too.

I'm very intrigued by Trestan, take a quick look at his resume and look at what some of those passing offenses did under his tutelage as a QB coach/O coordinator.

Career year and franchise record for receiving yards for Webster Slaughter
Led the NFL in points with SF (career year and NFL single season records for Jerry Rice)
Turned Rich Gannon into an MVP and a Super Bowl champion
Made Scott Mitchell not suck
Won a playoff game in AZ with Jake Plummer

Plus he has head coaching experience in the pro's. Even if it's Canada and their crazy rules it's better than experience at Oregon.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:40 pm

How in da fuck is experience being a head coach in a league with totally different rules better experience than being HC at Oregon?

Some people....
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:57 pm

peeker643 wrote:If the Browns find a guy that can lead I'll be fine. That is a cliche' and incorporates a lot of things, but they haven't had a 'leader' since they returned. Get that guy whether we know his name or not.


This is why I would be all in with Cowher (realizing he isn't coming to the Browns).
I know Browns fans consider him to be just a product of the steeler org, who wouldn't translate here.

Back 20 yrs ago, in the Metcalf double punt return game I believe, he went for it on 4th down. It wasn't near the end of the game, and I think it was around midfield. They didn't make it, and the Cleveland crowd went wild. He was on the field, snarling and foaming at the mouth at the offense coming to the sideline. Full scowling/chin mode. You could read his lips very clearly: "Let's go!!! We're playing (eff)ing to win!!!" Love that kind of leader.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby neoleo » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:58 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:How in da fuck is experience being a head coach in a league with totally different rules better experience than being HC at Oregon?

Some people....


NFL experience is the number one factor, which he has and Kelly doesn't, so that's intriguing to me. And the fact that he's been a professional head coach before, even in Canada, is a bonus.

It would be different if Trestman came up in the CFL and had never been to the States.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:04 pm

Oregon is closer to professional football than the CFL.

I'm fine with you liking the NFL experience (although I find that whole argument beyond foolish... SPURRIER FAILED, THUS ALL WILL!!!!). But to claim that the CFL and it's third rate athletes and shitty rules makes it a better direct comp to the NFL than Oregon does is just hilarious.

Most Oregon players get paid more in gear from Nike than CFL players.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby bac5665 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:11 pm

I think the point is that Trestman worked in the NFL at some point, not just the CFL. No one here is claiming that CFL experience alone is better than Oregon experience.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:18 pm

Oregon is closer to professional football than the CFL.

I'm fine with you liking the NFL experience (although I find that whole argument beyond foolish... SPURRIER FAILED, THUS ALL WILL!!!!). But to claim that the CFL and it's third rate athletes and shitty rules makes it a better direct comp to the NFL than Oregon does is just hilarious.

Most Oregon players get paid more in gear from Nike than CFL players.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:19 pm

neoleo wrote:Plus he has head coaching experience in the pro's. Even if it's Canada and their crazy rules it's better than experience at Oregon.


BAC, I'm not sure how this statement isn't stating that being a head coach in the CFL is directly a better resume item than being a coach at Oregon.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby bac5665 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:27 pm

Fine, one person is saying that.

The point is that Testment does have NFL experience, so not only is the Oregon/CFL comparison moot, but shouting about it is just silly.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:28 pm

I was replying directly to that person and I am not shouting beyond my mimiking the idiot Browns fans that have been running around shouting SPURRIER FAILED!!! COLLEGE = BAD!!!!
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Re: The Search

Unread postby neoleo » Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:34 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:I was replying directly to that person and I am not shouting beyond my mimiking the idiot Browns fans that have been running around shouting SPURRIER FAILED!!! COLLEGE = BAD!!!!


Don't know how I get lumped into being an idiot Browns fan in your mind, but ok.

My point all along was Trestman has a good NFL resume AND head coaching experience, which is intriguing to me. I also like that it's at the professional level, dealing with somewhat equal talent and grown men trying to make a living. You want to argue that college experience is better than CFL experience, that's perfectly acceptable, hell you might even be right. If Kelly had the NFL resume of Trestman before going to Oregon as head coach, I probably would have been ok with him as a candidate, so maybe that does makes you right. Congratulations.

My point remains unchanged though regarding Trestman's resume and why I'm intrigued.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby pup » Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:09 pm

The Browns will interview Bengals defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer for their head coaching vacancy Wednesday afternoon.
Despite seven head coaching jobs coming available on Black Monday, it's Zimmer's first interview of the season. Intense and outspoken, he brings a resume that includes 18 years in the NFL and five years at the head of the Bengals' defense. This year, he coaxed a breakout season out of DT Geno Atkins and developed WLB Vontaze Burfict as the unit finished sixth in the league. The Browns could steal an asset from their division rival while simultaneously filling their own vacancy.


Very interesting.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:17 pm

Bengals fans have been cringing in the corner over the possibility of someone noticing Zimmer standing there.

Wondering- has the search widened to defensive coaches now?
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:20 pm

The Browns interviewing Chud and Bruce is the funniest shit ever.

They really should interview Daboll too just to complete the tri-fecta.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:39 pm

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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:41 pm

googleeph2 wrote:http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8827258/bill-cowher-wants-coach-nfl-again-some-point-according-report


Yes, but since he's reportedly not interested in working with Banner, we don't have to worry about him coming here.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:42 pm

So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Larvell Blanks » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:51 pm

googleeph2 wrote:http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8827258/bill-cowher-wants-coach-nfl-again-some-point-according-report


:pb:

Of course once word got out that's all you'll hear about until either a)Browns hire someone b) Cowher clears the air, "I said a return at some point".

Until then we'll be treated to:

Home purchase rumors
Cowhers pledge to Rooney he'd coach everywhere else but Cleveland
He's a Cleveland guy, despite spending only 7 years of his 30 years playing/coaching in the city
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:05 pm

He's the damsel dropping her handkerchief past her petticoat to the floor, to see who the suitors will be that will fight to pick it up for her.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby googleeph2 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:12 pm

At least with them talking with Zimmer, I'd feel more confident that they have a solid understanding of why we suck.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:06 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!


Fuck all 3 of 'em.

And that's got nothing to do with Chip flirting and then playing hard to get. Fuck all 3 of 'em cuz I don't give a shit about any of 'em and didn't want any of 'em in the first place.

Tie all 3 in a bag and drop 'em in the river. :santa:
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:07 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!


Chip Kelly acted unprofessionally.

Cowher and Gruden are duplictious attention whores. Chin doesn't want to coach now, but will jump back in when he's 60? Which actually might work, because Banner will probably be looking for his 3rd HC hire in 2018.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:10 pm

mattvan1 wrote:
e0y2e3 wrote:So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!


Chip Kelly acted unprofessionally.

Cowher and Gruden are duplictious attention whores. Chin doesn't want to coach now, but will jump back in when he's 60? Which actually might work, because Banner will probably be looking for his 3rd HC hire in 2018.


You are very generous, giving his 2nd hire 5 years.

That almost might be seen as a rip-roaring success here.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby General » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:11 pm

When does the move to LA occur?
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:17 pm

Hikohadon wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:
e0y2e3 wrote:So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!


Chip Kelly acted unprofessionally.

Cowher and Gruden are duplictious attention whores. Chin doesn't want to coach now, but will jump back in when he's 60? Which actually might work, because Banner will probably be looking for his 3rd HC hire in 2018.


You are very generous, giving his 2nd hire 5 years.

That almost might be seen as a rip-roaring success here.


3rd hire. I figure it breaks down like this -

2013 Swing for fences, hit a slow roller to the right side, barely beat the throw. Hire coordinator.

2015 Swing for fences, interview Chip Kelly for 72 straight hours. He goes to the Cowboys, end up getting HBP, hire coord on the other side of the ball from the one you hired in 2013.

2018 Swing for fences, hit a bloop single and land Cowher, at the age of 60. Need to ensure Berea complex has wheelchair access.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:38 pm

General wrote:When does the move to LA occur?


Commissioner Bear-Huuger wants the game to go global. I'm thinking Browns to Frankfurt. I hear rhey have a passionate fan base.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:45 pm

mattvan1 wrote:
Hikohadon wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:
e0y2e3 wrote:So for everyone that consider Chip Kelly the worst person ever for spending a weekend interviewing, how do you feel about an attention whore like The Chin or Gruden making sure to get their name mentioned re: coaching vacancies every year while never bothering to interview or even seriously consider taking a job just to make sure their Q rating stays high?

I mean, clearly they are okay because they haven't turned the Brown down yet but that bastard Chip Kelly should be lynched!


Chip Kelly acted unprofessionally.

Cowher and Gruden are duplictious attention whores. Chin doesn't want to coach now, but will jump back in when he's 60? Which actually might work, because Banner will probably be looking for his 3rd HC hire in 2018.


You are very generous, giving his 2nd hire 5 years.

That almost might be seen as a rip-roaring success here.


3rd hire. I figure it breaks down like this -

2013 Swing for fences, hit a slow roller to the right side, barely beat the throw. Hire coordinator.

2015 Swing for fences, interview Chip Kelly for 72 straight hours. He goes to the Cowboys, end up getting HBP, hire coord on the other side of the ball from the one you hired in 2013.

2018 Swing for fences, hit a bloop single and land Cowher, at the age of 60. Need to ensure Berea complex has wheelchair access.


Ah, sorry, I thought you were counting Reid as his first hire. Third hire here... gotcha.

Yep, that's more likely to be (sadly) accurate.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby skatingtripods » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:07 pm

As usual, Mike Polk has something to say. Pause it on the Craigslist posting and read it (around 1:43).

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Re: The Search

Unread postby LakeErieWarriors » Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:29 pm

According to PD: Whisenhunt is getting a 2nd interview for the Browns HC position. Not sure when.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:32 am

Another data point on Banner.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/jason-la-canfora/21544053/nfl-today-arians-whisenhunt-pace-coach-updates-kelly-staying-at-nd


Whisenhunt Talks Break Down Over Control
The Browns were high on former Cardinals coach Ken Whisenhunt as their next head coach, according to sources with knowledge of the situation, before hiring Rob Chudzinski late Thursday night. Whisenhunt was flown from his home in Arizona back to Cleveland on Thursday for a second interview, spending several hours with team president Joe Banner before the Browns moved on to hire Chudzinski, who had been Carolina's offensive coordinator.

According to sources, Banner and Whisenhunt could not reach an agreement on how much say the front office would have in rounding out the coaching staff. Whisenhunt wasn't seeking any personnel control or anything out of the ordinary for a head coach, but Cleveland's front office wanted input on certain staff issues and ultimately were most comfortable with a rookie head coach.

The Browns had significant interest in college coaches Chip Kelly (Oregon) and Bill O'Brien (Penn State), but both stayed in school. They also met with Doug Marrone, who left Syracuse for the Buffalo Bills during Cleveland's courtship of Kelly. Chudzinski's strong relationship with top offensive coordinator Norv Turner also was a key to his hiring, sources said, with the Browns hopeful of landing Turner (Chudzinski worked under Turner in San Diego).

Banner has been a fan of the spread formations and read-option offenses, and Chudzinski had success running those elements for Cam Newton in Carolina. Mike Vick, who Banner helped bring to Philadelphia during his time with the Eagles, is a fit in that scheme as well, and could well land with the Browns as a free agent, as he will not renegotiate his deal to stay with the Eagles and it's highly unlikely the Eagles pay him $15.5 million next season.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:04 am

So where does Mike Holmgren stop and Banner begin?
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:37 am

mattvan1 wrote:According to sources, Banner and Whisenhunt could not reach an agreement on how much say the front office would have in rounding out the coaching staff. Whisenhunt wasn't seeking any personnel control or anything out of the ordinary for a head coach, but Cleveland's front office wanted input on certain staff issues and ultimately were most comfortable with a rookie head coach.

....

Chudzinski's strong relationship with top offensive coordinator Norv Turner also was a key to his hiring, sources said, with the Browns hopeful of landing Turner (Chudzinski worked under Turner in San Diego).


So Banner demands control of the coaching staff, so turns to Chud... who's a package deal with Norv? That's not entirely computing.

Banner has been a fan of the spread formations and read-option offenses, and Chudzinski had success running those elements for Cam Newton in Carolina.


Ohh, there we go. Whis wants to bring in Grimm and run whatever they were running in Arizona. Chud says he can run the new shiny. Banner wants the new shiny. Chud wins.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:38 am

e0y2e3 wrote:So where does Mike Holmgren stop and Banner begin?


good point. While Walrus was stuck in the 1980's and made some really bad decisions, at least knew football. Banner scares the crap outta me.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:49 am

Norv Turner has certainly ran a lot of read option in his days!

And man... WATCH THAT GINGER RUN!
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:56 am

mattvan1 wrote:Another data point on Banner.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/jason-la-canfora/21544053/nfl-today-arians-whisenhunt-pace-coach-updates-kelly-staying-at-nd


Banner has been a fan of the spread formations and read-option offenses, and Chudzinski had success running those elements for Cam Newton in Carolina. Mike Vick, who Banner helped bring to Philadelphia during his time with the Eagles, is a fit in that scheme as well, and could well land with the Browns as a free agent, as he will not renegotiate his deal to stay with the Eagles and it's highly unlikely the Eagles pay him $15.5 million next season.


Ugh. My vasectomy on Friday was more pleasant than reading this.

Now we have ANOTHER president married to a system and makes coaching decisions based upon said system. The only difference is that this president never ran the system himself.

Of course, this makes the pursuit of Nick Saban make so much sense. ::doh::

On the upside, this trainwreck might yet be massively entertaining. If you're gonna fail, might as well go epic.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby swerb » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:57 am

God help us all.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:57 am

and the hits just keep on coming!!

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/14/paton-out-of-browns-g-m-mix-but-reason-isnt-clear/

In the days after the Browns fired G.M. Tom Heckert, word emerged that the Browns requested permission to interview Vikings assistant G.M. George Paton.

But an interview never happened.

There are two different versions in league circles as to what happened. One source says that Paton passed. Another source says that the Vikings declined permission.

The latter suggests that the Browns’ General Manager position won’t entail, at least on paper, final say over the roster. If it did, the Vikings couldn’t have blocked either the interview or the hire.

There’s a chance, we suppose, that both the Vikings declined and Paton wasn’t interested.

Still, there’s now a valid question in Cleveland, especially since new coach Rob Chudzinski doesn’t have personnel experience: Who will have final say when it comes to picking players?


Joe Banner?
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Re: The Search

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 12:07 pm

<-- still doesn't understand why Norv Turner is OC when the stated desire to to run the new age spread and read option.
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Re: The Search

Unread postby Hikohadon » Mon Jan 14, 2013 12:14 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:<-- still doesn't understand why Norv Turner is OC when the stated desire to to run the new age spread and read option.


Because Jimmy Joe has heard of him before?
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