Moderators: peeker643, swerb, pup, paulcousineau
by bookelly » Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:46 pm
by RedDawg53 » Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:27 pm
by Bigfist » Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:46 am
bookelly wrote:Where there's smoke there's fire. Per Hoynse, there is a brewing love affair between the FO and Terry. With Alomar remaining as bench coach. This would be pretty much my ideal situation, but only if Sandy is willing to wait the 3-5 years it will take until the next collapse and gets his shot at the helm.
If the FO plays it's cards right (trading Droobs, Choo, Justin, CPerez, and anyone else with value - and notice how they are asking for season ticket re-up's early this year) we could set ourselves up with a nice wave of talent to accompany Santana, Kipnis, Lindor, Brantley, and Chiz in 3 years. Which must be what they are telling Francona.
by bookelly » Sun Sep 30, 2012 1:21 am
Bigfist wrote:bookelly wrote:Where there's smoke there's fire. Per Hoynse, there is a brewing love affair between the FO and Terry. With Alomar remaining as bench coach. This would be pretty much my ideal situation, but only if Sandy is willing to wait the 3-5 years it will take until the next collapse and gets his shot at the helm.
If the FO plays it's cards right (trading Droobs, Choo, Justin, CPerez, and anyone else with value - and notice how they are asking for season ticket re-up's early this year) we could set ourselves up with a nice wave of talent to accompany Santana, Kipnis, Lindor, Brantley, and Chiz in 3 years. Which must be what they are telling Francona.
I thought the trades of CC, Lee, and Victor were supposed to set us up for the next wave of contention? If it did not happen when those three were traded, why should it happen with lesser talent traded? At least Francona has to be wondering about that.
by jerryroche » Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:40 am
bookelly wrote:I'm sure we can get 6 players for the group of 4 I mentioned above.
by 1Perry » Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:47 am
by motherscratcher » Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:50 am
by peeker643 » Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:12 am
by leadpipe » Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:27 am
peeker643 wrote:::doh::
Somebody give me a reason a guy accustomed to $200m payrolls, big deadline deals and WS titles would have any interest in this gig.
Use your heads.
If he's taking this job it's because his rep has been obliterated in baseball's inner sanctum because of what ended up being the Red Sox situation and he's looking to repair it as a good soldier for two years.
Honestly, too many of you are glossed by shiny shit.
It ain't gonna happen. You shouldn't want it too happen.
And let me know when you guys who made fun of the Sox clubhouse falling apart and Francona's hand in it remember it's the same guy you're drooling over now.
Christ sake. Fans here deserve the embarrassment their teams give them.
by skatingtripods » Sun Sep 30, 2012 1:12 pm
peeker643 wrote:::doh::
Somebody give me a reason a guy accustomed to $200m payrolls, big deadline deals and WS titles would have any interest in this gig.
Use your heads.
If he's taking this job it's because his rep has been obliterated in baseball's inner sanctum because of what ended up being the Red Sox situation and he's looking to repair it as a good soldier for two years.
Honestly, too many of you are glossed by shiny shit.
It ain't gonna happen. You shouldn't want it too happen.
And let me know when you guys who made fun of the Sox clubhouse falling apart and Francona's hand in it remember it's the same guy you're drooling over now.
Christ sake. Fans here deserve the embarrassment their teams give them.
by Bigfist » Sun Sep 30, 2012 1:25 pm
by peeker643 » Sun Sep 30, 2012 5:36 pm
Bigfist wrote:Well, to be honest, except for Terry Pluto, I am not sure too many people really want Francona as the new manager. Actually, most don't really care who it is. But I would think most want a real GM with experience...not Antonetti. But that looks like it is not going to happen.
by Bigfist » Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:02 pm
by peeker643 » Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:51 pm
Bigfist wrote:You know, Peeker, this really is starting to resemble the Indians of our youth. Remember the owner Vernon Stouffer, then Nick Mileti? Guys with no money and hired GMs like Gabe Paul who would tell such whoppers to the fans that no one with half a brain would believe..things like "well, we got four players for one..what is not to like about a trade like that?" Not one time mentioning the quality of the players involved.
I sense we are entering a very dark age in Indians baseball. A stage where decisions are made on a shoe string budget, and lots of double talk from the front office and management, with players who cannot play. Why on earth would a Francona (not that I am all that crazy about him) walk into such a situation like that is beyond me, unless it is a Peeker says..that he needs to redeem himself around the league.
What in the world is Pluto thinking?
by 1Perry » Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:40 pm
Bigfist wrote:You know, Peeker, this really is starting to resemble the Indians of our youth. Remember the owner Vernon Stouffer, then Nick Mileti? Guys with no money and hired GMs like Gabe Paul who would tell such whoppers to the fans that no one with half a brain would believe..things like "well, we got four players for one..what is not to like about a trade like that?" Not one time mentioning the quality of the players involved.
I sense we are entering a very dark age in Indians baseball. A stage where decisions are made on a shoe string budget, and lots of double talk from the front office and management, with players who cannot play. Why on earth would a Francona (not that I am all that crazy about him) walk into such a situation like that is beyond me, unless it is a Peeker says..that he needs to redeem himself around the league.
What in the world is Pluto thinking?
by bookelly » Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:38 pm
leadpipe wrote:peeker643 wrote:::doh::
Somebody give me a reason a guy accustomed to $200m payrolls, big deadline deals and WS titles would have any interest in this gig.
Use your heads.
If he's taking this job it's because his rep has been obliterated in baseball's inner sanctum because of what ended up being the Red Sox situation and he's looking to repair it as a good soldier for two years.
Honestly, too many of you are glossed by shiny shit.
It ain't gonna happen. You shouldn't want it too happen.
And let me know when you guys who made fun of the Sox clubhouse falling apart and Francona's hand in it remember it's the same guy you're drooling over now.
Christ sake. Fans here deserve the embarrassment their teams give them.
Surely you aren't talking about the same fans that laughed at that "fat ass" Miggy Cabrera playing third for Detroit while championing the fact the Tribe had Jack Hanahan at the hot corner to provide the excellent defense needed for our "extreme ground ball staff" - presumably lead by Fausto and Derek Lowe.
And book....shake yourself. What they have to offer Francona, no matter how they spin it, is about the biggest sack of shit in the league. Which leaves you with two results; 1. No way in holy hell he comes or 2. He falls for it, making him about the stupidest GD guy on the planet - at least in regard to baseball talent evaluation.
Again, you are getting young - and considered by most to be not ready or desperate - a vet that will be making his last stop.
by skatingtripods » Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:27 pm
peeker643 wrote:Someone with an allegiance to this region needs to buy that team and have the money to sit at the high buy-in game that these guys play.
by jerryroche » Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:53 pm
by peeker643 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:10 pm
skatingtripods wrote: That being said, as lifelong Clevelanders, they probably have a list of criteria and there aren't going to be many people from around here with the means and desire to buy the team and keep it here. Frankly, Gilbert and Haslam are the only two contenders I see. And I'm not sure either one would be eager to pick up another large investment.
by pup » Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:11 pm
by skatingtripods » Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:13 pm
peeker643 wrote:If a 'foreign' owner would come in and find money-making potential that is alluring and that would bind them to the area I'd be fine with that.
by googleeph2 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 6:10 pm
by Rat_Tail » Mon Oct 01, 2012 6:55 pm
peeker643 wrote:If he's taking this job it's because his rep has been obliterated in baseball's inner sanctum because of what ended up being the Red Sox situation and he's looking to repair it as a good soldier for two years.
by swerb » Mon Oct 01, 2012 7:56 pm
by Gradysmanldy » Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:08 pm
by jerryroche » Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:33 pm
by peeker643 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:14 pm
googleeph2 wrote:Peeker, What will come first- the Tribe moving, or the leveling of the playing field with a salary cap? A cap would at least cause many fans to have some hope. I don't care as much about revenue sharing. Just make it tough to stack a team. And make mistake signings tough to overcome- not just for midwest markets, but for every team.
Back in '94, I wanted them to stay away until they got a cap put in place. I think the purpose of that stoppage was to measure and compare genitalia, and that's it.
by motherscratcher » Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:20 pm
peeker643 wrote:googleeph2 wrote:Peeker, What will come first- the Tribe moving, or the leveling of the playing field with a salary cap? A cap would at least cause many fans to have some hope. I don't care as much about revenue sharing. Just make it tough to stack a team. And make mistake signings tough to overcome- not just for midwest markets, but for every team.
Back in '94, I wanted them to stay away until they got a cap put in place. I think the purpose of that stoppage was to measure and compare genitalia, and that's it.
I think too many teams make far too much money, as does MLB itself, to level the playing field. They'll raze the least profitable franchises before they share the wealth, IMO.
That's part of what a guy like Francona hasn't had to deal with: in Boston you outspend your mistakes. In Cleveland those mistakes play 35 games a year for 4 years as your DH.
by peeker643 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:54 pm
motherscratcher wrote:peeker643 wrote:googleeph2 wrote:Peeker, What will come first- the Tribe moving, or the leveling of the playing field with a salary cap? A cap would at least cause many fans to have some hope. I don't care as much about revenue sharing. Just make it tough to stack a team. And make mistake signings tough to overcome- not just for midwest markets, but for every team.
Back in '94, I wanted them to stay away until they got a cap put in place. I think the purpose of that stoppage was to measure and compare genitalia, and that's it.
I think too many teams make far too much money, as does MLB itself, to level the playing field. They'll raze the least profitable franchises before they share the wealth, IMO.
That's part of what a guy like Francona hasn't had to deal with: in Boston you outspend your mistakes. In Cleveland those mistakes play 35 games a year for 4 years as your DH.
And surely Francona knows that just as much as we do, yet his interest seems genuine. So what does he know that we don't know?
by googleeph2 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:20 pm
by pod2dawg » Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:17 am
peeker643 wrote:motherscratcher wrote:peeker643 wrote:googleeph2 wrote:Peeker, What will come first- the Tribe moving, or the leveling of the playing field with a salary cap? A cap would at least cause many fans to have some hope. I don't care as much about revenue sharing. Just make it tough to stack a team. And make mistake signings tough to overcome- not just for midwest markets, but for every team.
Back in '94, I wanted them to stay away until they got a cap put in place. I think the purpose of that stoppage was to measure and compare genitalia, and that's it.
I think too many teams make far too much money, as does MLB itself, to level the playing field. They'll raze the least profitable franchises before they share the wealth, IMO.
That's part of what a guy like Francona hasn't had to deal with: in Boston you outspend your mistakes. In Cleveland those mistakes play 35 games a year for 4 years as your DH.
And surely Francona knows that just as much as we do, yet his interest seems genuine. So what does he know that we don't know?
That he loves being around the game like all lifers do and this is a job that's open.
by peeker643 » Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:48 am
pod2dawg wrote:He has already proven himself. Getting paid big jack to make out a line-up card and be around the game he loves, why not? Sure its a challenge & he will be working with knit-wits but he probably thinks he would be doing a good deed by infusing a little bit of competency or rational thought into the whole Shap/Ant/Dolan Vortex. It will only be for a few years as you have noted.....he is only human.
by pod2dawg » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:02 am
by 1Perry » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:16 am
by peeker643 » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:49 am
pod2dawg wrote:Good point(s), but those before him had the same support and failed.
And you may have nailed it, taking the Tribe job would give him the opportunity to show he can turn shit into shinola and develop some young players.
And I'm not sure Sandy has shown anything managerial ?
By the way how is the ankle?
by WiscTribeFan » Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:46 pm
by skatingtripods » Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:59 pm
by motherscratcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:04 pm
skatingtripods wrote:For Francona to have time to do anything, the Indians have to sign him to a 4-5 year deal. That's an eternity in manager time. They've also fired each of their last two managers with a year left on their contracts.
Everyone says that it's Francona's job to lose. I hope that's not the case. I'm not interested in him. He won with a lot of talent already in town and an owner with deep pockets. He has neither in Cleveland.
Let Sandy grow alongside the team.

by motherscratcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:08 pm
by peeker643 » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:13 pm
motherscratcher wrote:Apparently Hoynes reported that Albert Belle contacted Shapiro about the manager position.
That would be awesome. Holy shitburgers that would be awesome.
by motherscratcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:41 pm
by Cerebral_DownTime » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:44 pm
Fin
by motherscratcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:55 pm
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Fin
Thank God, I thought that terrible bit would never end.
by peeker643 » Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:01 pm
motherscratcher wrote:Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Fin
Thank God, I thought that terrible bit would never end.
It' kind of felt that way when I was writing it.
However, it's not to shabby for a rush job between extractions. It's like the MVP race, you have to consider all facets and factors.
by skatingtripods » Tue Oct 02, 2012 5:31 pm
by WiscTribeFan » Tue Oct 02, 2012 5:35 pm
by Cerebral_DownTime » Tue Oct 02, 2012 5:38 pm
skatingtripods wrote:Nick Camino @CaminoTribe
#Indians closer Chris Perez said "most of the problems walked out the door last week." Obviously meaning Acta firing.
by motherscratcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 6:37 pm
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:skatingtripods wrote:Nick Camino @CaminoTribe
#Indians closer Chris Perez said "most of the problems walked out the door last week." Obviously meaning Acta firing.
What a douche.
by pup » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:39 pm
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