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MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

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MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Bayou Tribe » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:53 am

Looking foward to the CWS field being set after this weekend, but I thought I'd throw this out before. I know college baseball is still somewhat of a regional sport in terms of following, but I really think these are the steps they can take to change that.

The discussions would center around sponsorship for more scholarships, use of wooden bats, and adjusting dates of the college season as well as entry date for the draft.


http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/eye-on-baseball/18955297/ncaa-mlb-in-talks-for-partnership-to-help-college-baseball
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Govbarney » Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:06 am

Until they adjust the date the season starts College baseball will never be popular north of the mason dixon line.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Bayou Tribe » Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:14 am

Govbarney wrote:Until they adjust the date the season starts College baseball will never be popular north of the mason dixon line.



If there's a stumbling block in this whole thing, that's gonna be it. They already run 4-6 weeks past the conclusion of the spring semester with the start they have now, so the only option is shortening the season (or narrowing the post-season field).

The big win for college baseball this past season has been the mlb moving the signing date. In years past, players would negotiate up until the last minute of a late August cut-off, leaving college coaches no time to replace those voids in the roster before school started. It's mid-July now, which sets up a reasonable 6 weeks worth of a "second recruiting season".
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Govbarney » Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:38 am

Every year I try to go to a few OSU baseball games. But its tough to follow, by the time OSU starts playing home games its about a month and a half into the season.

I say make it a Summer semester/quarter sport and hold the World Series in August. Times have changed, and most D1 athletes are expected to be around during the Summer anyway to make up for lost time, and training.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Bayou Tribe » Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:48 am

That would be ideal on the college end, but you'd have conflict with the mlb draft and subsequent signing deadline. There's a tight window they'd have to fit it in, if it's possible at all.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Cerebral_DownTime » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:25 am

Get rid of the damn metal bats. That noise gives me a dull pain right behind my eyes.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Govbarney » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:30 am

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Get rid of the damn metal bats. That noise gives me a dull pain right behind my eyes.


To expensive to use wood. This year they started using a new metal bat which acts more like wood, teams are no longer hitting 15 Home runs a game. Much better product.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Cerebral_DownTime » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:40 am

Govbarney wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Get rid of the damn metal bats. That noise gives me a dull pain right behind my eyes.


To expensive to use wood. This year they started using a new metal bat which acts more like wood, teams are no longer hitting 15 Home runs a game. Much better product.


Too expensive?
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby gotribe31 » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:54 am

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:
Govbarney wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Get rid of the damn metal bats. That noise gives me a dull pain right behind my eyes.


To expensive to use wood. This year they started using a new metal bat which acts more like wood, teams are no longer hitting 15 Home runs a game. Much better product.


Too expensive?


That's the worst excuse ever, especially now that composite wood bats break pretty much as often as metal bats.

MLB has already done enough for college baseball with the idiotic new CBA that basically encourages high schoolers to go to college unless they're drafted in the first round. Selig needs to clean up his own backyard before messing around with other stuff.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby pup » Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:17 pm

gotribe31 wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:
Govbarney wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Get rid of the damn metal bats. That noise gives me a dull pain right behind my eyes.


To expensive to use wood. This year they started using a new metal bat which acts more like wood, teams are no longer hitting 15 Home runs a game. Much better product.


Too expensive?


That's the worst excuse ever, especially now that composite wood bats break pretty much as often as metal bats.

MLB has already done enough for college baseball with the idiotic new CBA that basically encourages high schoolers to go to college unless they're drafted in the first round. Selig needs to clean up his own backyard before messing around with other stuff.


Cost is not even close. You are talking 30 aluminum bats versus what I would guess is 3000 wood bats over the course of a season. So many college hitters would need 3 wood bats to get through a game.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:16 pm

pup wrote:
Cost is not even close. You are talking 30 aluminum bats versus what I would guess is 3000 wood bats over the course of a season. So many college hitters would need 3 wood bats to get through a game.


We've got a wood bat summer league in town (lot of KSU boys in past years) and those college guys destroy wood bats. Certainly a cost issue.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby leadpipe » Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:16 pm

Erie Warrior wrote:
pup wrote:
Cost is not even close. You are talking 30 aluminum bats versus what I would guess is 3000 wood bats over the course of a season. So many college hitters would need 3 wood bats to get through a game.


We've got a wood bat summer league in town (lot of KSU boys in past years) and those college guys destroy wood bats. Certainly a cost issue.


They could easily handle the bat situation through sponsorships, they just wouldn't be as profitable as they are now.

A. High performance aluminum bats.

B. A composite that would give similiar ball reaction as wood that would last forever.

C. Wood.

They can make ALL of the above. There is one reason they won't make B.

The NFL players wear inferior helmets for the same reason. $$$$$$$$$$

The main issue is with MLB, which hasn't done a thing right to grow the sport in eons. There are good reasons offered in this thread, but the decline of the "National Pastime" into a "regional summer sport" is the bulk of the problem.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:01 am

It's not unusual these days to pay upwards of $400 for the top of the line BBCOR that everyone has to have.

Conversely I bought two Brett Bros. Gobon, #5's a 33.5 for older son and 33 for younger, for $99 apiece. I bought them because they came with a 4-month guarantee. The kids used all last summer/fall season with the HS and now my older one used his in the perfect game tournament in ft. myers. Still hasn't shattered. Yet I know kids who've been on the same team with us who've gone through at least 6 in the same amount of time. Knock on Wood? A lot of has to do with swing mechanics, because a lot of college guys don't really stay inside the ball but are so athletic that they still punch out hits when it hits below the sweet spot. Not the case of course with a wood bat, you stand a good chance of shattering it.

Now if you have a sponsored deal where higher end (not MLB grade, but higher-end consumer) bats are in the $80 range, you might be ok. Would you shatter 5 of them in a season? Does a sponsored team just order up 10 bats per head?

Also on the cost thing technically you are both correct, my pricing out the bat is really not pertinent to the college game where teams are typically locked into a specific manufacturer. So I would assume costs could go up based upon numbers of bats needed.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:03 am

Getting back to the games how about the Stanford pitching staff?

If I am the coach I want that bullpen water tested I think the slipped a few mickey's into the water cooler.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Bayou Tribe » Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:05 pm

I was going to come in here last night and use the LSU/Stony Brook game as an example of how much better the quality of the game has become on the college level...

and then Stanford happened.





But on the original topic -- Stony Brook is legit. Very good team, really an injustice that they were a 4 seed. Their centerfielder, Jankowski, was taken in the 1st rd by the Padres. Watching him yesterday, he's the best opposing player I've seen at The Box in a long time. Really special talent.

Game 2 just got under way. Gausman on the mound for the Tigers. Time to pay the piper.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Sat Jun 09, 2012 2:17 pm

Golden Flashes on at 11 tonight. Beat the Ducks!
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Govbarney » Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:01 pm

Erie Warrior wrote:Golden Flashes on at 11 tonight. Beat the Ducks!



what channel?
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby peeker643 » Sat Jun 09, 2012 5:31 pm

Govbarney wrote:
Erie Warrior wrote:Golden Flashes on at 11 tonight. Beat the Ducks!



what channel?


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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:51 pm

Gators rolling.

On the wood bat subject just about every Perfect Game Tournament and Showcase that I've seen is wood bat. I would venture a guess that most D1 hitters have been using wood to some extent, just not in college games. Not everyone gets invited but all the summer leagues are wood bat too correct?
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby pup » Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:05 am

The problem with the "inside pitch" argument is nobody pitches there because there is no benefit. Guys just fist shit over the infield.

You put woods in those hitters hands, within 3 years the inner half will be pounded. Absolutely pounded.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:22 pm

Pup every major summer showcase seems to be wood bat. In fact I am not so sure every one of them isn't wood. My point is most of the upper level players have faced stiff competition with wood. Aren't all summer leagues like cape cod/alaska wood bat? It can't be that foreign to them.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby pup » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:20 pm

dmiles wrote:Pup every major summer showcase seems to be wood bat. In fact I am not so sure every one of them isn't wood. My point is most of the upper level players have faced stiff competition with wood. Aren't all summer leagues like cape cod/alaska wood bat? It can't be that foreign to them.


Foreign to which side? What percentage of pitches thrown by any individual are with someone holding wood? Most teams use wood all fall I would imagine, but pitchers are still working on what is going to get guys out in the Spring. And what percentage of the pitchers in the summer showcases (talking HS I assume?)go to college? They just finished their high school season knowing the 4 runs they gave up all year were from stiffs duck farting some balls 135 feet to right field at a bad time.

The cost issue is a much bigger deal beyond the programs still playing today. Is anyone throwing a sponsorship deal at (insert shitty D1 program)? Does D2 go wood? D3? NAIA? JUCO? All JUCO or just Arizona/Texas/Cali/FL Juco? Anyone throwing 3,000 wood bats to Lakeland Community College?
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:29 am

It is very difficult to find the guys in Blue who give much on the inside strike. It better be over the black, I rarely see that gift strike on the inside corner. The outside corner is a different matter, at both HS levels and college you can get that call off the black, and my point is pitchers will still be working outside as well.

I agree on your point regarding some of the not-so-competitive D3s or any lower level college ball. (Many D3's play damn good ball). I've seen some young coaches in either HS or Travel who've only been out of college for a year or two, usually from some small school I've not heard of, and I think "that dude actually played college ball". Heck sometimes they can't throw or swing as well as me and I am old fat fuck 43. So I would imagine there are many schools out there to which wood would just be brutal.

As an aside I am quite in favor of BBCOR, it's been a tremendous boost to my kids anyway so perhaps I am just being biased about what's working well for us. With the old composite, the game was all about fast-twitch athletes. Now you have to be capable of barreling that ball up. The downside to BBCOR is way too god-damned much bunting for sacrifice.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby pup » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:49 am

dmiles wrote:It is very difficult to find the guys in Blue who give much on the inside strike. It better be over the black, I rarely see that gift strike on the inside corner. The outside corner is a different matter, at both HS levels and college you can get that call off the black, and my point is pitchers will still be working outside as well.

I agree on your point regarding some of the not-so-competitive D3s or any lower level college ball. (Many D3's play damn good ball). I've seen some young coaches in either HS or Travel who've only been out of college for a year or two, usually from some small school I've not heard of, and I think "that dude actually played college ball". Heck sometimes they can't throw or swing as well as me and I am old fat fuck 43. So I would imagine there are many schools out there to which wood would just be brutal.

As an aside I am quite in favor of BBCOR, it's been a tremendous boost to my kids anyway so perhaps I am just being biased about what's working well for us. With the old composite, the game was all about fast-twitch athletes. Now you have to be capable of barreling that ball up. The downside to BBCOR is way too god-damned much bunting for sacrifice.


I think the umpiring has taken its lead from the performance of the players. Everything is away and they tend to "look" that way which gives you some more room to work out there.

BBCOR is a great change for the game. I think the sac bunt will die down once players become accustomed to the bats. There are so many guys that have never needed to get the barrel to the ball effectively that are riding on schollies right now that all they can do to be productive is bunt. Watching some high school games this year, the difference was 100% noticeable on 75% of the players. Somewhat noticeable on 20%. No difference for about 5%. And i think this was year 2 in Ohio for BBCOR. As it trickles down, kids will become better hitters at younger ages and it wall carry through.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:47 pm

pup wrote:
dmiles wrote:
I think the umpiring has taken its lead from the performance of the players. Everything is away and they tend to "look" that way which gives you some more room to work out there.

BBCOR is a great change for the game. I think the sac bunt will die down once players become accustomed to the bats. There are so many guys that have never needed to get the barrel to the ball effectively that are riding on schollies right now that all they can do to be productive is bunt. Watching some high school games this year, the difference was 100% noticeable on 75% of the players. Somewhat noticeable on 20%. No difference for about 5%. And i think this was year 2 in Ohio for BBCOR. As it trickles down, kids will become better hitters at younger ages and it wall carry through.


Years and years of bad hitting instruction that worked great for hot bats is being exposed. ESPN the other night was talking about some kid who looked like a star as a freshmen but production really dropped off these last two years. It's exactly as you say the new bat hurt him.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:00 pm

pup wrote: There are so many guys that have never needed to get the barrel to the ball effectively


The LaPorta Effect?

This is VA's first year for HS BBCOR. Runs are down, SACs are up, but so is the quality of baseball. A lot of 1 run ball games decided by quality base running and proper relays- throwing behind guys- stealing bases.

Our DH most of the year hit 6th and his only job was to hit a deep fly ball once or twice a game.

It was all about getting a guy on base and moving him up.

As was mentioned somewhere earlier, 3-4-5 guys were still very solid hitters, the big difference is the other guys who used to be able to drive a mis-hit ball into a gap or over the fence. Now they are GIDPS or a Can o' Corn.
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Re: MLB & NCAA in talks to further college baseball...

Unread postby dmiles » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:57 am

Good point Erie.

Is it even possible for anyone to break LaPorta's record at UF for homers? Cripes they have some seriously good hitters in right now and nobody is even close.
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