Moderators: peeker643, swerb, pup, papacass
by Triple-S » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:22 pm
Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.
by e0y2e3 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:25 pm
by bac5665 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:40 pm
by e0y2e3 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:42 pm
by e0y2e3 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:45 pm
by bac5665 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:55 pm
by Cleveland Matt » Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:28 am
by JJN » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:45 am
bac5665 wrote:And, for the record, Basketball is easily my least favorite of the big 4 sports. But I do want to support my Cavs. I just don't know how to do that and root against them.
by Prosecutor » Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:32 am
by e0y2e3 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:07 pm
by Orenthal » Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:06 pm
by e0y2e3 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:18 pm
by Orenthal » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:53 pm
by JJN » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:02 pm
by e0y2e3 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:07 pm
by e0y2e3 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:09 pm
by leadpipe » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:13 pm
Prosecutor wrote:I hate to throw cold water on the party, but there's actually a chance the Cavs might not totally suck this year.After losing 26 consecutive games last year the Cavs finished out the season by going 11-18. I checked out the starting lineups for a couple of those games at random. For games 73 and 79 the starting lineup was -Hickson DavisParkerHollinsGeeVarajao and Jamison were injured. So with that starting lineup the Cavs had a winning percentage of .379, which if maintained over the entire season, would have been the 8th worst record in the NBA. That was over 29 games, more than a third of the season.If the Cavs were to come back this year with the same roster, we could expect them to win more games than seven other teams. There are some really crappy teams in this league. However, without making any moves between now and the start of the season, they've added Varajao, Jamison, Kyrie Irving, Thompson, and Cresspi. They lost JJ Hickson and Parker. They still have Davis, Boobie, Eyenga, Gee, Samuels, Hollins, Erden, Harangody and Sessions, although a couple of those guys will have to be cut. I don't know - think this year's team might be improved over the group that went 11-18? I understand that an NBA superstar has more value than in other sports because there are only five players on the court at a time and you can't prevent the superstar from getting the ball on every possession. Albert Pujols only gets to bat once every nine times. Football has 11 guys on the field. But in basketball one player can take over a game, like LeBron did when he single-handedly destroyed the Pistons in that playoff game where he scored something like 36 consecutive points. So it's no wonder NBA fans are more obsessed with tanking for a top lottery pick, especially since the true franchise players like Jordan, Olajuwon, Magic, Bird, etc never get past the top three picks. But I can't see the Cavs being the worst team in the league this year, or even close, unless they amnesty Davis and trade Varajao and Jamison for future draft picks.
by e0y2e3 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:14 pm
by Cerebral_DownTime » Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:40 pm
by noles1 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:59 pm
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Chris Paul wants a trade to the New York Knicks? Fuck him. You pay what you owe, bitch. No more asshole ego super teams.
by JJN » Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:40 am
I'm actually warming up to this idea JJN. It would take them from just unwatchable to comicly unwatchable.
by peeker643 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:09 am
Cerebral_DownTime wrote: No more asshole ego super teams.
by e0y2e3 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:45 am
by Prosecutor » Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:30 am
leadpipe wrote:Do you have a device that calculates the percentage of NBA players that give a shit the last 20 games of the season?I take it that you're implying the only reason the Cavs won some games at the end of the season was because they were playing to win and their opponents didn't give a shit? Is Scott a master motivator or something? After losing 26 in a row you'd think it would be the Cavs that would roll over and play out the string.And it would also behoove you to know the over/under for how many games Baron Davis plays this season, and the over/under on how many games he plays that he gives a rats ass about.Yeah, it would behoove me. It sounds like you're giving Davis some of the credit for those wins last year, and coincidentally, the Cavs improved considerably after he arrived. I'm assuming Irving's presence, and to a lesser degree, Sessions if he isn't moved, will enable the Cavs to ration Scott's minutes so he'll play in most of the games, just like he did last year. As for him not giving a rat's ass, if he ever was going to mail it in he would have done that at the end of last season after arriving in freezing Cleveland to play for the worst team in the league and a coach who he fought with earlier in his career. He played hard for the Cavs last year in meaningless games. Is there any reason to think his attitude has changed since April? Again, if you fell for Baron Davis' act in LA, fine. But if he was gonna be a lazy ass in his home, where he has other vested interests, you'd be a moron to think he's gonna lay it on the line for a bad team - in Cleveland, Ohio.Did he "lay it on the line" after coming over last year? Or did the Cavs win some games despite Davis being a lazy ass? They are gonna blow. No big deal. Just the way it is. Probably won't set the NBA record for consecutive losses, that I'll give you.Grant says they're trying to sign Anthony Parker. If they are gonna blow, it won't be because they're trying to.
by pup » Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:01 pm
by e0y2e3 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:13 pm
by pup » Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:33 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:"Anthony Parker is a vital part of this team..."- the joke regime that runs this team and Prosecutor.
by peeker643 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:18 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:"Anthony Parker is a vital part of this team..."- the joke regime that runs this team.
by e0y2e3 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:21 pm
by Prosecutor » Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:09 pm
pup wrote:Signing Anthony Parker.Does that mean they are trying to win?Or trying to lose?
by peeker643 » Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:42 pm
Prosecutor wrote:pup wrote:Signing Anthony Parker.Does that mean they are trying to win?Or trying to lose?Great question. I suppose the answer depends on whether you think Parker is better than Manny.
by Prosecutor » Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:38 pm
peeker643 wrote:Parker might be the 8th or 9th guy in a good team's 8-man rotation. Harris isn't even that but because he's 22 you can see if there's any potential there.If you're running either of them out there with this team you're losing 70% of your ball games.
by peeker643 » Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:00 am
Prosecutor wrote:peeker643 wrote:Parker might be the 8th or 9th guy in a good team's 8-man rotation. Harris isn't even that but because he's 22 you can see if there's any potential there.If you're running either of them out there with this team you're losing 70% of your ball games.Agree with your assessment of Parker, but that starting lineup of Parker, Hickson, Davis, Hollins and Gee didn't lose 70% of their games last year (actually it was 62%). Take out Hickson, add Irving, Thompson, Varajao, Jamison, and Cresspi. What percentage does that give you?
by motherscratcher » Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:10 am
by Madre Hill, Superstar » Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:47 am
by Prosecutor » Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:54 am
motherscratcher wrote:Prosecutor wrote:peeker643 wrote:Parker might be the 8th or 9th guy in a good team's 8-man rotation. Harris isn't even that but because he's 22 you can see if there's any potential there.If you're running either of them out there with this team you're losing 70% of your ball games.Agree with your assessment of Parker, but that starting lineup of Parker, Hickson, Davis, Hollins and Gee didn't lose 70% of their games last year (actually it was 62%). Take out Hickson, add Irving, Thompson, Varajao, Jamison, and Cresspi. What percentage does that give you?Why do you keep assuming that the entire rest of the league is exactly the same?
by pup » Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:35 pm
by leadpipe » Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:06 pm
by Prosecutor » Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:49 pm
pup wrote:You have yet to explain why you think the return of 2 players that "lead" the team to an NBA record losing streak, combined with a guy that will be begging to get out of town and will play that part to Wince Carter levels, means the team is going to resemble a winner.You're blaming Varajao and Jamison for the losing streak? I think they'll be an improvement over Hollins and Hickson. We'll see. The concern about Davis is legitimate. But you have yet to explain why he would do the Wince Carter thing. Last winter he was traded from his home town in SoCal to a bad weather team that just set a record for consecutive losses to play for a coach he was at war with earlier in his career. If he was ever going to dog it, that would have been the time. Yet he came in and led the team to 11 wins in 29 games - a huge improvement over the previous 53 games. So why would he lay down this year? I suspect he's matured from his young hothead days and he wants to adopt the elder statesman/mentor role. That's the glass half full approach. You seem convinced he'll suddenly decide he wants out of here and become a cancer - the glass half empty approach. You could be right, but I don't see that based on last year. I guess we'll find out soon enough.You have yet to accept the fact the team that won 38% of the time late in the year against teams playing out the string and doing a better job than we were in jockeying for position for the ping pong balls."Doing a better job than we were in jockeying for position for the ping pong balls"? So you're saying the Cavs were trying to lose, but their opponents were trying harder? That's why the Cavs won 38% of their games? Well, four of those wins were against playoff teams. Maybe they were trying for lower seeds for some reason.Who is scoring for this team? An 84 year old Jamison? Who else?The scoring will be balanced. No more 28 ppg from one guy. For example, in the Mar. 29 win over Miami, Hickson scored 21, Parker 20, Hollins 13, Davis 10, Gee 6, and Sessions chipped in with 11 off the bench. Harangoty, Eyenga, and Gibson scored 9, 7, and 5, respectively for a total of 102 points. LeBron and Wade each played 43 minutes in case you were thinking that the Heat was deliberately trying to lose for some reason. The Cavs basically won that game with defense. This team will be one of the worst in the league. Young legs or not.DavisParkerCaspiTwanAndyYou think that team can score enough points to win in the NBA? And we have not even gotten to the deplorable level of defense that group will be putting out there.That looks like a better starting five to me than last year's group:Davis Parker HicksonHollinsGeeThe bench will be better with Irving and Thompson, plus guys who were starting at various times last season (Hollins, Eyenga, Gee) will be coming off the bench.
by Prosecutor » Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:20 pm
leadpipe wrote:You know how I know the Cavs aren't going to be good this year Pros?I watch the GD games. I watch the Cavs, and I watch the talent on other teams.I understand the time it takes for rookies to get acclimated and REALLY contribute - even 1st rounders.Good Christ, this ain't that hard. They've got far too many guys that are going to play major minutes that can't score in an open gym - and a rookie at the point to get them the ball - unless the soon to be injured malcontent has his historically fat ass at that position.And they will have to make leaps and bounds just to be decent defensively, which again, with the combination of rookies, horrid defenders and few shot blockers (if any) in the middle...good luck.If you stink on offense and stink on defense, you will stink.Not sure why you're looking for some sort of disseration on this. The reason many who think they aren't going to be good haven't told you why is because anyone who isn't a GD moron can easily recognize this.And by the way, your "short season, young leags" theory. Well, you could argue that it hurts them more than helps them because you'd like as many games as possible for Irving and the other young players to figure shit out. A young team that can already PLAY, I'll buy that thory - a team that has as much, if not more work to do than anyone in the league....It'd be better if they played a hundred.
by JJN » Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:22 am
Prosecutor wrote:I'm not. Some teams will be better, some worse. Based on the roster changes since last year, I think the Cavs will be better (as of this moment).In the 2010-11 season there were 8 teams that won less than 40% of their games.In 2009-10, it was 10 teams.In 2008-09, it was 8 teams.History proves that in any given year, 8-10 teams win less than 40%. I'm assuming that will occur again this year. Any problem with that?After acquiring Baron Davis, the Cavs won 38% of their games, despite not having Varajao and Jamison. I'm asking if there is a legitmate reason to believe the Cavs will fail to improve 2% by replacing Hickson and some guys at the end of the bench like Joey Graham and Manny Harris with Kyrie Irving, Tristan Thompson, AV, Jamo, and Cresspi. I also think the compressed schedule, with about 48 fewer off days but only 16 fewer games, will benefit young teams like the Cavs and hurt older teams like the Celtics, who rely heavily on a few aging stars. There are a number of people making "Cavs are gonna suck" type statements without providing any evidence to support that opinion. I want to hear some kind of reasoned argument as to why the Cavs will win fewer than 38% of their games.If they amnesty Davis and go with a rookie at point guard who didn't play last year and also trade Jamison and Varajao for a draft picks, then all bets are off. Grant says there will be a lot of wheeling and dealing over the next 10 days. I'm waiting to see how the Cavs decide to play it - go for wins or a better ping pong ball.
by Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:28 pm
by FUDU » Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:53 pm
by motherscratcher » Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:19 pm
by e0y2e3 » Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:24 pm
by Demeatloaf » Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:30 pm
by e0y2e3 » Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:50 pm
by Prosecutor » Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:21 pm
Remember that one time when Pros said that the Cavs will be better at scoring now that they don't have a guy who can score 28ppg.
JJN wrote:Why the Cavs will sucka report by JJNGrade 51. Not, in fact, a young team, not by the weighted average of minutes. The 7 guys who should get the majority of the minutes as the roster stands right now (assuming we bring back AP) is like this:Kyrie 19TT 20Casspi (not Cresspi or Croissant or however the hell you keep spelling it) 23Davis 32Jamo 35Varejao 29Parker 36Of those young players, TT can't shoot and Casspi can't defend anyone. The rest of our young players are, at this point, hot garbage. They stink. 2. You are assuming that being young means they are NBA ready. The "rookie wall" should occur much, much earlier this year. The NBA schedule is really tiring, even more so when you haven't had the required conditioning. Older players may suffer, but they know how to handle the grind. You think that a player who played 11 games total last year with no preseason is going to be ready to go into a 66 game season with 3 games in 3 nights? Davis always has to play himself into shape. Jamison hasn't played since Feb. Varejao is coming off foot surgery and hasn't played in almost a full year. How the hell do you think this team is going to have fresh legs?3. We sucked last year, and we didn't really get a ton better. The 2 playoff teams we beat once BD actually started playing? The Knicks once and the Heat once. The Knicks were still in disarray after acquiring Carmelo. Other than that, we beat the Wiz, the Pistons twice, the Kings, Bobcats, and the Raptors. After the BD trade, our winning percentage was 36% Comparing that to other teams' winning percentage for their whole seasons, there would have been 5 teams worse than us. We had the worse point differential for the season, a whole 1.6pts worse than the next closest team.That is why were are going to suck this year.
by motherscratcher » Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:28 pm
Prosecutor wrote:Remember that one time when Pros said that the Cavs will be better at scoring now that they don't have a guy who can score 28ppg.What I actually said was..."The scoring will be balanced. No more 28 ppg from one guy."Maybe I should explain that "balanced scoring" doesn't have the exact same meaning as "more scoring." Nah. You knew that. You're the smartest guy on this board.
by Prosecutor » Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:37 am
Thank you. Finally, someone says it. Will you tell that to e0y? He always acts like I'm an idiot or something.
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