Man Urban Meyer cannot get here fast enough!

[motherscratcher]

Butchel CC is about to get the Vest to coach the Zippers.

Zach Jackson and ESPN are saying it's a rumor. I have a source as well telling me he's interested.

That carwash guy sure gets around don't he?

[Cerebral_DownTime]

I'm going to the game tonight and I hope Urban will float down from the rafters in a suit made of $100 bills and grace us all with his presence.

[fundamentals]

I'm going to the game tonight and I hope Urban will float down from the rafters in a suit made of $100 bills and grace us all with his presence.

That might just happen.

Mr. Bianchi from the Orlando Sentinel chimes in on "The Urban Liar":

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl- ... 4082.story

[motherscratcher]

"O-Lie-O State"

This Bianchi guy is very clever.

He also needs a closet full of douches for his enormous vagina.

[Cerebral_DownTime]

Bianchi is a hack and even glancing at his mindless hate spewing "articles" is giving his opinions more credence than they deserve. I would say that I would like to see him eaten by a Bull Shark.... but that's too far, think of the poor shark. It having to choke down his bloated man tanned carcass is obviously animal cruelty.

[dmiles]

That D-bag is morning drive time talk show host too. Wondering how with a name like Bianchi he sounds like such a southern neck. Shouldn't be at least be a paisan with that name? The typical fast-talking Ex-new yorker down here is what I would expect, but he's closer to Jim Nabors.

He ends every show with:
Peace, Love, and Boiled Peanuts

Except on Friday he ends with a loud almost yelled saying
The Weekend is Here. We'll have a can of beer.

I tune in on Friday mornings on the way to work just to see if he says it every time and sure enough he does it. Awful radio presence.

[noles1]

Sabino was.

I'm more so talking about getting a five star Florida DE that allegedly is obsessed with FSU to immediately want to come up here for an offical.

The list of national recruits talking about Meyer is insane.

http://247sports.com/Article/Meyers-hir ... lass-50725

That is serrrrrrrrrrious pull.

Is it Edwards? He has been interested in OU from past visits. Still a very strong FSU lean with family ties there too. That said, Meyer getting some of these guys on visits this quickly is really impressive. I think Meyer will use this boost to jump on speed and premier athletes, get as many as he can get more than likely.

Maybe get him to give away Archie Griffin's son's schollie to make more room. ;) One I so vehemently argued about years ago... (not even certain he is still on the team to be honest)

[noles1]

I'm going to the game tonight and I hope Urban will float down from the rafters in a suit made of $100 bills and grace us all with his presence.

That might just happen.

Mr. Bianchi from the Orlando Sentinel chimes in on "The Urban Liar":

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl- ... 4082.story

Guy is a turd of epic proportions. Has always been. UF grad that wears the blue and orange on his sleeve with every keystroke. Don't bother taking him seriously. No one else in Florida (sans Gator-homers) do.

UF people just cannot stand to believe the one simple fact. That when this all boils down. OSU is a better more prestigious place to coach at than Florida. It very well likely will ALWAYS be that way.

OSU, Michigan, Texas, USC, ND, Alabama, Oklahoma those are legacy programs. They are on a far different level to college historians than FSU, Miami, Florida, Va Tech, etc. It's just the way it is. Not to say those 2nd tier aren't great premier type jobs but a guy like Meyer looks at OSU as the highest point on the mountain top. UF fans and homers are driven absolutely nuts by that right now.

[Sea Foam Green]

OSU, Michigan, Texas, USC, ND, Alabama, Oklahoma those are legacy programs. They are on a far different level to college historians than FSU, Miami, Florida, Va Tech, etc. It's just the way it is. Not to say those 2nd tier aren't great premier type jobs but a guy like Meyer looks at OSU as the highest point on the mountain top. UF fans and homers are driven absolutely nuts by that right now.

I don't know that this is true. UF has the 2nd or 3rd largest Athletic department and budget in the country. It also sits in a hotbed of recruiting. It's a pretty good 'get' for a coach.

I really think it's either or both of:

1.) He's from Ohio and grew up rooting for the Buckeyes and its truly his dream job. I don't know if OSU is going head to head with UF to lure a coach that has no ties to either state, that we'd have an inherent advantage.
2.) There's some truth to the rumors that there was some shady shit going on at UF/in the SEC that he just didn't want to put up with. [<--- If that's true, Jesus how shady must the SEC be if he left there and then willingly came to a place that's been plagued by 'scandal' for 8 months?]

[pup]

OSU, Michigan, Texas, USC, ND, Alabama, Oklahoma those are legacy programs. They are on a far different level to college historians than FSU, Miami, Florida, Va Tech, etc. It's just the way it is. Not to say those 2nd tier aren't great premier type jobs but a guy like Meyer looks at OSU as the highest point on the mountain top. UF fans and homers are driven absolutely nuts by that right now.

I don't know that this is true. UF has the 2nd or 3rd largest Athletic department and budget in the country. It also sits in a hotbed of recruiting. It's a pretty good 'get' for a coach.

I really think it's either or both of:

1.) He's from Ohio and grew up rooting for the Buckeyes and its truly his dream job. I don't know if OSU is going head to head with UF to lure a coach that has no ties to either state, that we'd have an inherent advantage.
2.) There's some truth to the rumors that there was some shady shit going on at UF/in the SEC that he just didn't want to put up with. [<--- If that's true, Jesus how shady must the SEC be if he left there and then willingly came to a place that's been plagued by 'scandal' for 8 months?]

There is a difference between having a large budget and being a HISTORIC program. A very large one at that.

[leadpipe]

OSU, Michigan, Texas, USC, ND, Alabama, Oklahoma those are legacy programs. They are on a far different level to college historians than FSU, Miami, Florida, Va Tech, etc. It's just the way it is. Not to say those 2nd tier aren't great premier type jobs but a guy like Meyer looks at OSU as the highest point on the mountain top. UF fans and homers are driven absolutely nuts by that right now.

I don't know that this is true. UF has the 2nd or 3rd largest Athletic department and budget in the country. It also sits in a hotbed of recruiting. It's a pretty good 'get' for a coach.

I really think it's either or both of:

1.) He's from Ohio and grew up rooting for the Buckeyes and its truly his dream job. I don't know if OSU is going head to head with UF to lure a coach that has no ties to either state, that we'd have an inherent advantage.
2.) There's some truth to the rumors that there was some shady shit going on at UF/in the SEC that he just didn't want to put up with. [<--- If that's true, Jesus how shady must the SEC be if he left there and then willingly came to a place that's been plagued by 'scandal' for 8 months?]

There is a difference between having a large budget and being a HISTORIC program. A very large one at that.

I would add a number 3.

That being an intelligent football guy understanding the easiest path to domination. He can come to OSU and control an entire region of the country, or go to the SEC and have to deal with a half dozen teams from his own conference (thus around the block) vying for the top ten every year.

[fundamentals]

I keep hearing that Meyer left Florida because of all the shady SEC activity, puhhhhlease. He was arguably as much a part of it as anyone. People forget where Cam Newton originally went to school. Lead was right. The Big Ten is more apt to be dominated by one school than the SEC. Big fish in a shrinking pond. The Buckeyes stand to dominate for a very long time with Meyer in the fold.

[motherscratcher]

I would add a number 3.

That being an intelligent football guy understanding the easiest path to domination. He can come to OSU and control an entire region of the country, or go to the SEC and have to deal with a half dozen teams from his own conference (thus around the block) vying for the top ten every year.

This is a really good point. Ohio is pretty much a consensus top 5 HS football state and it is 90% locked down before Meyer rolls out of bed in the morning. He has legacy and Tressel to thank for that. A lot of these kids, not all but a lot, have parents and grandparents that love tOSU and they grow up dreaming of playing as a Buckeye. I guess you have that in Florida also, but not nearly to the degree that we have here.

But even bigger is Tressel absolutely dominating for a decade. These kids know nothing other than OSU dominance. Last year doesn't changenthat IMO. These kids are mostly smart enough ton know what happened. Pat Fuckin Forde and Fat Urkel can stand on soapboxes and pontificate about the evils of JT and tOSU all theynwant, but at the end of the day the kids know that a few players signed a jersey to get a tattoo and got busted. I just don't think they are going to give a shit.

Now you add Meyers name to the mix....well, you see what's happening.

Recruiting? A lot of Meyer's recruiting will consist of picking up the phone and saying "You coming or what?...yeah? great, I'll see you in the spring.". He's not spendingnhours on end over and over convincing kids of why they should pick Ohio State over Cincinnatti.

[jb]

"O-Lie-O State"

This Bianchi guy is very clever.

He also needs a closet full of douches for his enormous vagina.

"Butthurtanchi"

See what I did?

[jb]

So what are the expectations for next season?

They were in a rebuild year once the offense was gutted. Alot of kids got PT early.

They have some key positions to fill, but they don't play in the SEC. They'll likely get tripped up somewhere, but shouldn't happen more than twice with their schedule.

The scUM game is gonna be out of this world next year.

[e0y2e3]

Scout's Buckeye Insiders did a really good two hour call in Q and A yesterday:
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/college-in ... rban-meyer

My favorite point, was easily, pointing out that they have been told Urban was bothered by Tressel's continual settling for Ohio Kids if he thought the kid was nice when he could and should have been out getting and finishing the national kids.

Also interesting, per recruits, Tressel was not a good closer because he never won the "living room interview" portion of recruiting. Message Board Warriors have spread the myth of Tress being able to sell mom and dad, not reality.

Fuck The Vest, burn that shit.

[danwismar]

They were in a rebuild year once the offense was gutted. A lot of kids got PT early.

They have some key positions to fill, but they don't play in the SEC. They'll likely get tripped up somewhere, but shouldn't happen more than twice with their schedule.

The scUM game is gonna be out of this world next year.

That sounds about right.

Defense was gutted too, of course....7 starters gone and Williams injured. We (okay...I) wanted to think the young talent was going to step up seamlessly, and Heacock was going to work his magic, but guys like Sabino, Howard, Klein, Moore, Johnson, and certainly Moeller underperformed the expectations of them, and Heacock turned out not to be a miracle worker. By the end of the season, teams were doubling Simon, and the pass rush disappeared.

[fundamentals]

I don't see how in the world that team won't win at least 10 games next season.
Would be an epic fail in my estimation if that is not attained.

[e0y2e3]

Next years schedule is a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge joke.

The B1G sucks.

Yeah, 10 wins or bust.

[fundamentals]

Next years schedule is a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge joke.

The B1G sucks.

Yeah, 10 wins or bust.

Upon a third look at the Buckeyes' schedule, can't see how they won't win 11-12 games easily. Most difficult game logistically is the one at Camp Randall, but they will have an extra week to prepare for Wisconsin. Might even go undefeated in regular season and I don't even have blinders on.

http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa-12/big- ... hedule.php

[e0y2e3]

Wisky will be featuring another rental QB:

http://www.uhnd.com/bb/forum/index.php? ... gid=122241

[FUDU]

The 2012 schedule is so easy we already have the B1G CCG on it.

[noles1]

I keep hearing that Meyer left Florida because of all the shady SEC activity, puhhhhlease. He was arguably as much a part of it as anyone. People forget where Cam Newton originally went to school. Lead was right. The Big Ten is more apt to be dominated by one school than the SEC. Big fish in a shrinking pond. The Buckeyes stand to dominate for a very long time with Meyer in the fold.

I agree with this. As someone that followed the recruiting stories of Pouncey twins, Harvin and Matt Elam just to name a few, let's not be so quick to give Urban a pass because of his dislike for the way the game is played. This guy has shown he can play it better than anyone not named Saban.

The biggest issue with Meyer, without question, is the agents and scouts at practices. That is THE blood issue with Urban. Don't fall into the easy issue of "dirty recruiting" of frosh. Look at the "preying of his existing players", that's the one that really boils him.

[gnati]

My favorite point, was easily, pointing out that they have been told Urban was bothered by Tressel's continual settling for Ohio Kids if he thought the kid was nice when he could and should have been out getting and finishing the national kids.

I'll go contrarian because I can...

Bobby Bowden makes the point (and yes, he is who he is but on this point I think he has standing) that part of the reason Florida State began to lose their way was in essence they began to believe the hype and lost their way in recruiting. In real terms what he said was when Florida State became Hollywood, they literally began to recruit Hollywood. No longer busting the bushes in Live Oak the way they did, but instead chasing the biggest shiny object from everywhere in the country. You had players from Washington State or New England or Pennsylvania who were Parade All Americans who gknew they were good athletes/players but had no loyalty to Florida State or the program in anyway. This collection of all-stars wasn't about team and when the first bump in the road came they either jumped ship or looked out of number 1. The prima donna factor, the entitlement factor led to problems on and off the field. This isnt even addressing the issue of the inexact science of it all and some of these guys, no matter the hype, dont pan out. (JB Bait - War Joe Pickens).

I guess what I am saying is this isn't fantasy football. You need Jimmies and Joes, but you also need grunts, role players, guys who will sell out for the program to keep some sort of balance in the locker room and around the team. Was it necessary to offer Archie's nephew - hell no - but I think there is a place for the hard working Ohio kid who may not be a 5 star but can help the team in other ways. Too many is a bad thing, but not enough could be just as bad.

React.

[jb]

My favorite point, was easily, pointing out that they have been told Urban was bothered by Tressel's continual settling for Ohio Kids if he thought the kid was nice when he could and should have been out getting and finishing the national kids.

I'll go contrarian because I can...

Bobby Bowden makes the point (and yes, he is who he is but on this point I think he has standing) that part of the reason Florida State began to lose their way was in essence they began to believe the hype and lost their way in recruiting. In real terms what he said was when Florida State became Hollywood, they literally began to recruit Hollywood. No longer busting the bushes in Live Oak the way they did, but instead chasing the biggest shiny object from everywhere in the country. You had players from Washington State or New England or Pennsylvania who were Parade All Americans who gknew they were good athletes/players but had no loyalty to Florida State or the program in anyway. This collection of all-stars wasn't about team and when the first bump in the road came they either jumped ship or looked out of number 1. The prima donna factor, the entitlement factor led to problems on and off the field. This isnt even addressing the issue of the inexact science of it all and some of these guys, no matter the hype, dont pan out. (JB Bait - War Joe Pickens).

I guess what I am saying is this isn't fantasy football. You need Jimmies and Joes, but you also need grunts, role players, guys who will sell out for the program to keep some sort of balance in the locker room and around the team. Was it necessary to offer Archie's nephew - hell no - but I think there is a place for the hard working Ohio kid who may not be a 5 star but can help the team in other ways. Too many is a bad thing, but not enough could be just as bad.

React.

"WTF are you talking about?"

Sincerely,

Dan Kendra

Agree for the most part, but not sure Lee was saying that you never bring in a Dane or Wilhelm or Doss, either.

Realizing this is indeed a very inexact science as we've discussed before, my big thing is that when you bring in mister 5 star, you'd better get mister 5 star. I am reminded by the Charlie Manuel blast at Shap when he went out the door about the Escobars of that era, "when you say you got a 5 tool player, you might really want to make sure he's a 5 tool player."

Some of the touted players over the past couple classes just flat out blew. Klein, Sabino, Berry, all worthless. Too many misses.

And you have nerve running Wildcat smack this year, sir.

[e0y2e3]

I have no issue with anything you wrote gnati.

My only issue is that we constantly settled and constantly missed out on closing a few big national guys a year becaues Tress was just as comfortable keeping his fence up around Ohio (and Ohio Football is no longer what it once was).

There is a reason when Tress had an Ohio kid that was extremely talented in Mo Clarret he won a title. And when Ted Ginn was there he made a title game. And Beanie....

I'm not saying he shouldn't have focused on controlling Ohio (Urban is doing this too), but that he was too comfortable with just having Ohio to push for and close a higher and more appropriate ratio of out of state kids in an SEC World.

[jb]

(and Ohio Football is no longer what it once was).

Truth.

And you can add Pennsylvania and times that statement by 3.

[swerb]

I don't buy that OH football is way down. And agree that FSU lost their way, and that it could easily happen here in Columbus.

Jim Tressel locked down this state. And supplemented it with top national recruits that fit his mold. And how can you argue with his track record? 10 seasons, a national title, 7 BCS games, a winning bowl record, 6 Big Ten Championships, 8-1 against Michigan.

While the Meyer "mold" opens tOSU up to a new type and class of offensive skill position recruits, I hope Meyer makes locking down OH just as much of a priority as Tressel.

[jb]

I don't buy that OH football is way down.

I guess we are talking about two different things, and I tend to follow one more than the other.

the first is the number of blue chip recruits. I'll let the furls and dans tell me about that compared to years past.

The second is whaat the teams do on the field. The elite Ohio teams have gotten their heads handed to them on the big time interstate elite matchups the past several seasons.

I think Bosco is still scoring on Eds.

And if you told me that the Cincy area elite were unable to compete with the KY eliete, I'd have laughed at you years past.

[e0y2e3]

Winning the B1G with Ohio Talent was nice for a decade. No complaints, but I'm over that.

I want an SEC caliber football team.

That is something OSU had once, maaaaaaaaaaaaaybe twice during the Tresselball era.

[noles1]

Problem with Bobby Bowden's analogy is that it neglects the fact he had his son running the offense. Also that Kendra got hurt, Mauer went pro baseball, Jared Jones and his hot dog-eating obsession (google that one for a laugh), McPherson couldn't stop hitting the bookie up and Chris Rix played too damn early.

That's what was more wrong with FSU for 5-6 years than anything Bobby Bowden claims about national recruits.

As for Urban, I think ultimately he is going to take a balanced approach to local and national recruiting. It will just come down to the simple fact that those big-time national guys need to hit. For every Percy Harvin there is a Fred Rouse. You just have to get lucky sometimes, pure and simple.

[gnati]

Problem with Bobby Bowden's analogy is that it neglects the fact he had his son running the offense. Also that Kendra got hurt, Mauer went pro baseball, Jared Jones and his hot dog-eating obsession (google that one for a laugh), McPherson couldn't stop hitting the bookie up and Chris Rix played too damn early.

That's what was more wrong with FSU for 5-6 years than anything Bobby Bowden claims about national recruits.

.

I'm familiar with FSU issues, I have a sheep skin (non condom division) to show for my time there, I spent way too much time spinning that damn wheel at Poor Pauls Pour House, and I still laugh my ass off at Florida State, Florida State, Florida State....WOOOH as a cheer.

But I digress.

Bobby has alot of faults, some you addressed, some you didn't...but I think his overall point is valid. I think the approach that JT took is far too conservative, despite it being very effective at winning the Big Dime and Change. I think an effort to turn a college football team into a video game where you collect 5 star recruits from around the country would be a nightmare - much worse results. Some balance of the two with your share of program guys who can fill a certain role (besides waiving a towel on the sideline) I think is the sweet spot. there has actually been some criticism of The Pope of German Village's later recruiting classes at UF - that he focused too much on sizzle and not enough on worker bee types which has at least something to do with where they are now. Perhaps fair, perhaps not - but I hope as he goes along and cleans up over the next couple years, and every indication is he will, he does it with some sort of balance.

[swerb]

My whole thing is that I think people are taking what Tressel did and the Tressel model totally for granted.

Won the Big Ten damn near every year. Lived in the top 5. And beat the shit out of Michigan every season. Won a title and played in two other title games. A decade of sustained success.

You don't pull that shit off without winning living rooms and winning parents. End of story. Regardless of what a couple disgruntled former recruits say.

If Pryor doesn't go Mo C on the program, there's no blip this year either. They win 10 games and are in another BCS game.

That is a run of success on par with the greatest 10-12 year runs during the last 30 years. Look at the recent struggles of Texas, Florida, Michigan, Nebraska, FSU, UGA, Miami Flo, Penn State, and UCLA.

People act like just cause you're at a program the caliber of tOSU, that the DD wins annually and BCS bowl berths are a given. They're not. Tressel did it right here for a long time. He laid the GD blueprint. Not to say that blueprint can't be tweaked now that you got a new offense. But to throw the blueprint away? F that.

[e0y2e3]

Everything you say is true and I am glad The Vest was able to remind us what we should strive for as a program.

That said, if the B1G doesn't suck for the majority of his tenure......

I just tired of striving to beat the middle, I want to define the top.

[swerb]

Everything you say is true and I am glad The Vest was able to remind us what we should strive for as a program.

That said, if the B1G doesn't suck for the majority of his tenure......

I just tired of striving to beat the middle, I want to define the top.

Define suck. If not the best conference in America is your definition of suck, then ... OK ... the Big Ten sucks. I would argue that the Big Ten has been the second best conference in America over the last 12 years behind the SEC. Just about as many BCS bowl wins since the inception in 1998. 12-13 against the SEC in bowl games since 2002. Tressel's teams whooped really good Arkansas and Oregon teams the last two years, and shoulda beat Texas the year before that.

Always an excuse out there for the naysayers. I look and see a program that has been dominant for a decade that would be perceived totally differently if not for two bad losses to SEC teams in title games other programs would die just to get to.

Bottom line - if you don't want to "strive to beat the middle and define the top", that's easier said than done, and requires a lot of luck. Ask Texas. Ask FSU. Ask Florida, who was just there, and is now on par with South Florida.

[e0y2e3]

You'll get no argument from me re: me being a greedy and spoiled fan.

That said, list the top ten individual teams of the last decade and tell me how many big ten teams make the list.

Second best is second best, but when the top of the top is THAT much better you can clearly differentiate.

[JCoz]

Everything you say is true and I am glad The Vest was able to remind us what we should strive for as a program.

That said, if the B1G doesn't suck for the majority of his tenure......

I just tired of striving to beat the middle, I want to define the top.

I agree to a point, but the B10 was fairly strong through 06....it was really in 07 that things really started to nosedive with the conference, with UM being the obvious big nut there...

But for the first 6 years of JT's 10, the B10 was very tough, even the middle was better with some of those Glen Mason teams at Minny...Purdue was better, PSU was better UM was better.

But no doubt this team will now be looking beyond the B10 to define itself and that carries some excitement.

[JCoz]

My whole thing is that I think people are taking what Tressel did and the Tressel model totally for granted.

I do agree with this. I was saying the other day, that even with better coaching and better recruiting, the reality is that Meyer is going to have a hard time replicating the sheer numbers that you are talking about.

7 B10 titles, 1 NC, 3 NC Game appearances, 7 BCS bowls, 4 BCS wins, 9-1 vs UM. sheer # of wins...

Expecting more than that is unrealistic. Now, due to the sometimes frustrating nature of Tresselball, you might get a little less and still feel better about it in the end, right or wrong. I think people would exchange some terrible losses vs lesser competition for a couple OOC stompings of top competition....course in the end that might not get you any further per say, just feel better about it.

All you need to do is take a look at what USC did under Carrol to see an example of what I'm talking about.

Carrol was a moster recruiter in a very weak conference which he dominated, they crushed OOC opponants, but would drop some games to the stiffs in conference, and in the end, how many more NC's did he win with the far better recruiting and (you can argue this if you want) better coaching?

[furls]

I don't buy that OH football is way down.

I guess we are talking about two different things, and I tend to follow one more than the other.

the first is the number of blue chip recruits. I'll let the furls and dans tell me about that compared to years past.

The second is whaat the teams do on the field. The elite Ohio teams have gotten their heads handed to them on the big time interstate elite matchups the past several seasons.

I think Bosco is still scoring on Eds.

And if you told me that the Cincy area elite were unable to compete with the KY eliete, I'd have laughed at you years past.

I will do something mathematically rigorous... throw in some regression analysis and come to some conclusions.

I will be considering State population, NFL draft outcome, # of scholarship athletes per each state, draft position (32nd pick etc.) and I'll see what pops out on the other end. If there are other variables that I am missing let me know and I will throw them into the model.

I'll run a second regression tying each of the major scouting services to NCAA wins for BCS schools in order to see to what extent # of *'s translates to wins. I will lag the variables by 1, 2, and 3 years to account for classes "growing up." and we will see what shakes out.

This will take a while and it is probably something I will do for the front page. Probably take a week to compile the data.

[furls]

You have to look at NCAA recruiting as being more akin to the MLB draft than the NBA/NFL draft. You pick kids based on talent and potential. The 5* kids are generally kids that have a very high concensus opinion of their potential as college athletes. Most 5* kids are not entertaining 10-15 offers, the generally 30-40+ from every school in the country, so if Jamaal Berry is a bust you have to ask yourself why did 30+ of the leading talent evaluators in the country guess wrong.

90% of the time it has very little to do with the play of the kid on the field. Generally it is the kids ability to develop. There are a lot of factors that weigh into that, coaching, work ethic, off field behavior, etc.

tOSU has missed a lot on OOS 5* kids, but have generally done better with in state 4-5* kids. My personal opinion is that a lot of this has to do with actually knowing the kid and seeing him live. If you are not watching the kid live you miss what he is doing on the plays that do not appear on his highlight reel. What does he do for the other 40 defensive snaps per game. That can tell you alot about his work ethic and coachability.

This also explains why tOSU has a very high batting average with camp offers to 3* and below kids. These are kids that come to tOSU prior to their junior years for a few days of coaching. These offers have yielded players like James Laurinaitis, Malcolm Jenkins, Dane Sanzenbacher, AJ Hawk, etc. No one was really on any of those kids, but when tOSU had a chance to coach them up, they had a chance to see how coachable the kid is, what his instincts are and what he is really like on the field.

As for the death of Ohio football, I think it is overstated. Still a great state for recruiting. Still the key to every team in the midwest. Problem is that coaching across the midwest at the college level has been abysmal for the last 10 years (ND, scUM, PSU, MSU etc.). I will work up some numbers to see the shifts, but I think the point we are going to see is that the number of elite HS kids (rated by #*'s is lower), but the # of kids going to the NFL is going to be largely the same.

I think this is because of ranking bias and an undue amount of attention placed on southern/southeastern high school recruits. I have long said that southern kids tend to be overrated by .5* and northern kids underrated by .5*. Some services don't even have a serious scouting effort in the midwest and actually require the schools to build the rankings for them (ESPN I am talking about you!), and it is indicative of a larger flawed perception of HS football players in general.

How many times have you heard, "Southern Speed?" When you are talking about college teams it makes some sense, build your team to your environment, put a premium on passing and getting guys that can make plays in space when the ball is delivered. That same idea does not make sense if you play in the 30MPH winds in Champagne, but to imply that an entire prospect pool is inherently slower due to geographic location is idiotic. Yet I hear "recruiting experts" say it all the time and no one calls them on it.

So I will play the stupid game. If southern kids are faster, why are the faster? Is there some advantage to being closer to the earth's equator by about 1000miles? Is it because warm weather implies better athletes? If so, what is the mechanism? Are the football players playing the south at a genetic advantage based on population isolation, a precursor to specitation? The arguments are illogical and inherently flawed, particularly because many of the people making the same argument argue that population shift as a contributing factor. So they are literally the same kids. These people give me headaches and I cannot believe that they have jobs.

[e0y2e3]

Also worth noting, OSU is currently in dire straights re: LB depth and the last two top Ohio HS LBs are in Texas and Bama.

[JCoz]

Thats true, and thats really a lesson in the whole, "we are stacked anyways, thats one we could afford to lose" attitude that sometimes accompanies missing out on top talent.

[jb]

I don't buy that OH football is way down.

I guess we are talking about two different things, and I tend to follow one more than the other.

the first is the number of blue chip recruits. I'll let the furls and dans tell me about that compared to years past.

The second is whaat the teams do on the field. The elite Ohio teams have gotten their heads handed to them on the big time interstate elite matchups the past several seasons.

I think Bosco is still scoring on Eds.

And if you told me that the Cincy area elite were unable to compete with the KY eliete, I'd have laughed at you years past.

I will do something mathematically rigorous... throw in some regression analysis and come to some conclusions.

I will be considering State population, NFL draft outcome, # of scholarship athletes per each state, draft position (32nd pick etc.) and I'll see what pops out on the other end. If there are other variables that I am missing let me know and I will throw them into the model.

I'll run a second regression tying each of the major scouting services to NCAA wins for BCS schools in order to see to what extent # of *'s translates to wins. I will lag the variables by 1, 2, and 3 years to account for classes "growing up." and we will see what shakes out.

This will take a while and it is probably something I will do for the front page. Probably take a week to compile the data.

You, uh, going uderwater for a while and have some between shift free time Furls? ;-)

[googleeph2]

But no doubt this team will now be looking beyond the B10 to define itself and that carries some excitement.

I love Jim Tressel, and yes- he set the bar very high.

But you're right- tOSU will be measured by national championships more than ever now.

[noles1]

My whole thing is that I think people are taking what Tressel did and the Tressel model totally for granted.

Won the Big Ten damn near every year. Lived in the top 5. And beat the shit out of Michigan every season. Won a title and played in two other title games. A decade of sustained success.

You don't pull that shit off without winning living rooms and winning parents. End of story. Regardless of what a couple disgruntled former recruits say.

If Pryor doesn't go Mo C on the program, there's no blip this year either. They win 10 games and are in another BCS game.

That is a run of success on par with the greatest 10-12 year runs during the last 30 years. Look at the recent struggles of Texas, Florida, Michigan, Nebraska, FSU, UGA, Miami Flo, Penn State, and UCLA.

People act like just cause you're at a program the caliber of tOSU, that the DD wins annually and BCS bowl berths are a given. They're not. Tressel did it right here for a long time. He laid the GD blueprint. Not to say that blueprint can't be tweaked now that you got a new offense. But to throw the blueprint away? F that.

Agreed, Swerb. Think that is getting lost in the allure of Urban right now. Urban's got a ton of momentum but I think it's a bit of a misnomer to say we are going to the next level when, in fact, we have been there all along.

I would add that had Mo C not went Mo C we could have had another title sprinkled in there. And don't even get me started on more hypotheticals like what if we had just suspended Tat-gate for the bowl and the first 2 games this year. Hell, we could be talking OSU-LSU for BCS title.

[e0y2e3]

Yeah, it would have been pretty awesome seeing LSU ring up 75 on this shitty defense.

[furls]

I don't buy that OH football is way down.

I guess we are talking about two different things, and I tend to follow one more than the other.

the first is the number of blue chip recruits. I'll let the furls and dans tell me about that compared to years past.

The second is whaat the teams do on the field. The elite Ohio teams have gotten their heads handed to them on the big time interstate elite matchups the past several seasons.

I think Bosco is still scoring on Eds.

And if you told me that the Cincy area elite were unable to compete with the KY eliete, I'd have laughed at you years past.

I will do something mathematically rigorous... throw in some regression analysis and come to some conclusions.

I will be considering State population, NFL draft outcome, # of scholarship athletes per each state, draft position (32nd pick etc.) and I'll see what pops out on the other end. If there are other variables that I am missing let me know and I will throw them into the model.

I'll run a second regression tying each of the major scouting services to NCAA wins for BCS schools in order to see to what extent # of *'s translates to wins. I will lag the variables by 1, 2, and 3 years to account for classes "growing up." and we will see what shakes out.

This will take a while and it is probably something I will do for the front page. Probably take a week to compile the data.

You, uh, going uderwater for a while and have some between shift free time Furls? ;-)

Nope, I am just a math geek of the highest order, and I really think this study could lead to some very interesting results.

[Cerebral_DownTime]

Really OT but I didn't think it needed a new thread.

It appears Laquinton Ross will be eligible Dec 9th.

[FUDU]

My only concern about Urban, and it is a very slight concern, is his non JT like conservative approach to game planning/calling in regards to losing that occasional game you shouldn't which JT built a solid reputation on (<---- as time went on though it became over stated).

If being in the real hunt virtually every year requires accepting that risk above as opposed to just being in the hunt and winning "all" those games then count me in.

But I think Rich makes a solid point above, if OSU wins just one game out of the 07/08 NCGs the reputation of the program is totally changed and a significant chink gets put into the SECs rep.

[dmiles]

My only concern about Urban, and it is a very slight concern, is his non JT like conservative approach to game planning/calling in regards to losing that occasional game you shouldn't which JT built a solid reputation on (<---- as time went on though it became over stated).

If being in the real hunt virtually every year requires accepting that risk above as opposed to just being in the hunt and winning "all" those games then count me in.

But I think Rich makes a solid point above, if OSU wins just one game out of the 07/08 NCGs the reputation of the program is totally changed and a significant chink gets put into the SECs rep.

To counter, once OSU lost those two BCS title games, with that one-loss OSU would be a tough sell to the voters. Beating Arky and Oregon helped cushion some of that but let's say Tat-gate never happened and OSU only lost to someone like Purdue on the road. Old reputation says, tOSU gets smoked by LSU, so there would still be Bama sentiment in today's climate. Sure OSU turned that around a little the last two years, but that perception is still out there. My guess is Urban's presence will clean that slate assuming the Arky/Oregon wins didn't do it.