Moderators: peeker643, swerb, skatingtripods
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:08 am
by Spin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:50 am
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:06 am
by motherscratcher » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:19 am
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:44 am
motherscratcher wrote:Sounds like a good and reasonable plan. But I think it distracts from the most important part of that article, which is the hilariously large, Allen & Gintery portrait of Arace right next to the text. And the hilarity is taken to a whole 'nother level when you realize that you can actually click to enlarge the already enormous portrait.High high comedy. Well done Dispatch.
by Spin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:55 am
by motherscratcher » Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:04 pm
Spin wrote:Would an NHL team have done better in Cleveland than the Cavs have done? I think so. I think there are more potential hard core hockey fans in NE Ohio (who would go to games even when the team sucks) than there are hard core pro basketball fans. Myself included.
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:10 pm
by Spin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:15 pm
motherscratcher wrote:Spin wrote:Would an NHL team have done better in Cleveland than the Cavs have done? I think so. I think there are more potential hard core hockey fans in NE Ohio (who would go to games even when the team sucks) than there are hard core pro basketball fans. Myself included.Based on what?
Putting another team of any kind in Cleveland right now would be insane.
by swerb » Tue Aug 23, 2011 1:39 pm
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:09 pm
by swerb » Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:17 pm
Govbarney wrote:I believe you are right Swerb; a hypothetical 1 for 1 swap of the CBJ & CAVs would not work for all the reasons you mentioned, if that swap happened today, and adding a 4th Major league team to the North Coast is ludicrous.However the question was, if the roles where reversed and The Barons stuck around back in the 70s, and the Cavs moved, would the Greater Cleveland area have been a better NHL town then it currently is a NBA town. Part of me says no, simply because the NBA is more popular then the NHL (though that historically fluctuates). Part of me says yes because I look at the success of hockey in places like Pittsburgh, and Buffalo both cities demographically smiler to the Cleveland area in Race and income.
by Govbarney » Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:49 pm
Swerb wrote:Now - I think things are so much different here than back then. The city of Cleveland has gone from like the 10th most populus in America to like the 70th. White flight and poor leadership in the city has gutted it, with more people in the burbs, making it tougher to get to games. And Browns aside ... the fan base right now simply will not support non-winning teams at the box office. It's a total "show-me" professional sports city right now.
by Spin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:56 pm
swerb wrote:All things being equal (quality of team, alpha dog star player, facility, etc) hockey would not draw as well as the NBA up here. No way, no how. The NBA has a 40 year history in Cleveland. Hockey has no history anyone alive here remembers.
by peeker643 » Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:49 pm
Spin wrote:swerb wrote:All things being equal (quality of team, alpha dog star player, facility, etc) hockey would not draw as well as the NBA up here. No way, no how. The NBA has a 40 year history in Cleveland. Hockey has no history anyone alive here remembers.The Barons would have had a 35 year history by now.
by Cerebral_DownTime » Tue Aug 23, 2011 6:03 pm
by Govbarney » Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:08 am
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:It's not a bad idea. Saves fans of both teams money on travel. I've been saying for long time that they every few years there should be a Browns/Bengals game at The Shoe. A lot of fans down here of both teams + the best stadium in sports= a easy sellout. It's also a nice reward for all the loyal fans here. I've spent a lot of money on that shitty franchise, they should give back.
by Spin » Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:09 am
by RickNashEquilibrium » Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:18 am
by RickNashEquilibrium » Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:25 am
peeker643 wrote:Personally, I think the area could support an NHL team as well as (if not better now) than the Cavs. The demographics Swerb noted are important. It's extremely expensive for anyone to go down to the Q and take a family to a Cavs game. Especially if they don't want a sherpa and oxygen bottles to help them find their seats. And while hockey isn't huge on the east side there are tons of wes t side teams that dominate the high school hockey scene in Cleveland. The east side teams that exist are all located in money areas too where the game is growing. There's a large core of hockey fans in Toledo who would shave an hour so off their commute coming to Cleveland.
by motherscratcher » Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:50 am
RickNashEquilibrium wrote:For those of you who don't know, Tom Reed, who's been covering the Jackets in the Dispatch for the past few years, has been picked up by the Cleveland Plain-Dealer to cover the Cavs starting this year. Personally, I like Tom the most out of the Columbus hockey reporters as he seems to be much more objective and in tune with the rest of the hockey world outside of Columbus.
by RickNashEquilibrium » Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:26 pm
motherscratcher wrote:But...but...what about Mary Schmitt Boyer?
by Govbarney » Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:41 pm
RickNashEquilibrium wrote:Hockey seems to be growing more on the east side in terms of interests, the problem is funding and costs. Getting ice time is still a huge issue on this side of town with Gilmore being the only real location to play pickup games for young kids, and even then its more of a free skate with varying age groups. Mentor Civic Center is the only other close rink and its impossible to get significant time there. Mentor hockey is getting very popular, and a huge draw to parents with young kids looking to get into sports. There is still hope, but with the lack of funding for east side public schools not name Mentor, it will be a very slow growth.
by skatingtripods » Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:48 pm
by Spin » Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:05 pm
skatingtripods wrote:NHL hockey would never make it. The AHL can because the team's owner has plenty of alternative methods of making money. He makes very little, if any, on the Monsters.
by skatingtripods » Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:54 pm
Spin wrote:Unless Gilbert owned the NHL team, they couldn't make it.
by Govbarney » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:07 pm
by skatingtripods » Thu Aug 25, 2011 12:05 pm
by Govbarney » Thu Aug 25, 2011 2:33 pm
skatingtripods wrote:Could be beneficial, but the ice conditions at the Q would have to be vastly improved first. Quite frankly, a 2 hr drive down 71 isn't all that bad and there are plenty of ticket deals at the box office. I'd go to a game here, but I'd much rather just take the trip to Columbus, be jealous of how nice the whole area is, and then come back home after the game.Does Nationwide even have a court to put down? Seems like a meaningless expenditure for a team already hemorrhaging money.
by skatingtripods » Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:09 pm
Govbarney wrote:Nationwide has done both NCAA Men's and woman's Bball games, and Cavs Pre-Season games, so the courts not the issue.
by Triple-S » Wed May 16, 2012 7:40 pm
Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.
by skatingtripods » Wed May 16, 2012 8:03 pm
Triple-S wrote:I don't think Columbus really needs a Pro-team honestly (Crew may prove an exception). The Bucks, pretty much dominate the landscape there, and with good reason. Also, when you're two hours away from Cincy, and two hours away from Cleveland, both who have a very much well established tradition in Pro sports (Reds, Tribe, Cavs, Browns, f-the Bengals, but them too), it kind of is pointless to have a team that goes "We're Columbus's team, and only Columbus's team", much like I've seen the Jackets marketing strategy go.
The aforementioned teams have all done a great job reaching down to the area and keeping a presence within C-Bus. The Cavs? To me, don't need to play games down in C-Bus to prove they've got fans down there. The Jackets? Seem like they would to bring fans down there. Because they've failed to really bring fans from the NEOhio region to support them.May I pose this thought to you. If, lets say, in 2000, Cleveland was given a franchise instead of the State Capital, and, again, they were not pushed out of the city during the LeQuit era. Would we have seen a similar amount of support that the Reds, Tribe, etc receive from CBus?
by Triple-S » Wed May 16, 2012 9:05 pm
skatingtripods wrote:A pro hockey franchise won't make it in Cleveland. Everybody's allegiance is already with another team and hockey tickets are astronomically expensive. Somewhere around 35% of the Monsters attendance is on freebies and/or buy one get one free tickets.Not many people are going to travel for hockey. The weather sucks. There are a lot of games on school nights.
by Govbarney » Wed May 16, 2012 9:14 pm
skatingtripods wrote:A pro hockey franchise won't make it in Cleveland. Everybody's allegiance is already with another team and hockey tickets are astronomically expensive. Somewhere around 35% of the Monsters attendance is on freebies and/or buy one get one free tickets.Not many people are going to travel for hockey. The weather sucks. There are a lot of games on school nights.One problem with CBJ and exposure in Cleveland is that the Cavs take precedence on FSN Ohio when both are on. Time Warner has a FSN CBJ channel (or they did when I had it), but, still, not many people around here care about the Jackets.Furthermore, the youth program out of Columbus has to play as a member of the Cleveland Suburban Hockey League. That's why they have their own problems down there. There aren't enough kids interested in hockey.
by Govbarney » Wed May 16, 2012 9:18 pm
by skatingtripods » Wed May 16, 2012 10:56 pm
Triple-S wrote:Sadly, I had heard from someone within the Monsters organization that the reason that so many games are on School nights was due to the fact that the Hershey Bears and several of the older AHL teams get first dibs on the prim-o home games, thus leaving the younger teams like the Monsters with the typical lower attended games.Despite that, I had heard that yes, they do draw well.Are we so sure that everyone could keep their allegiances with say the Penguins, if they had a hockey team of their own? I know that the very least, I'd drop being an Oilers/Jets fan at a moments notice, if we did finally get a team at the Q.
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