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Wide Reciever Help

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Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby swerb » Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:10 pm

Nothing but question marks at the position, and they gotta get Colt a vet to make catches between the hashes.

Not sure what Shurmur's plans are with Evan Moore, who I like. If he's a TE primarily in the WCO, we appear to be set there with him, Ben Watson, and 5th rd pick Jordan Cameron.

Greg Little is intriguing. Shit or get off the pot time for Mo Mass and Robiskie ... I am higher on the latter. Carlton Mitchell is still only 23, allegedly grew like 7 inches this offseason, and is great on Twitter. Cribbs - who the F knows what, if anything, you can do with this cat at this point.

Everyone else is garbage. Actually, some of the above guys may be garbage too.

You got a good OL. You got some real nice options in the backfield with Hillis, Hardesty, Marecic, and whoever they bring in to be the 3rd down back. Looks like Vickers is gonzo ... which is crazy to me regardless of what offense you run.

Go get your young QB some help at WR. Don't make us count on a bunch of question marks in their early 20's.

A couple UFA options that could fit - Brandon Stokley, who played real good down the stretch for the Seahawks in the playoffs. And Mark Clayton, former Ravens #1 who was traded to the Rams and got off to a great start last year before injuring his knee.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby Triple-S » Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:54 pm

swerb wrote:You got a good OL.


Image

yeah, this guy should do wonders starting at RT!

my plant foot is aching just thinking about it.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby pup » Wed Jul 06, 2011 7:58 am

Can't help but think this is the place Mike H tries to swing his big stick in free agency.

Make a push for Sidney Rice.

That comes up short, fall back on James Jones/Malcolm Floyd.

Start digging a little deeper if need be and pick from Mike Sims Walker/Mark Clayton/Santana Moss.

And if all else fails, go get Hank Baskett. Other free agents should flock to C-Town once the post game parties turn into Playmate Bashes!
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby yogi » Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:41 am

I was watching the Dallas Cowboy's "Hard Knocks" from 2 or 3 years ago and was impressed with their "rookie" WR , Danny Amendola (sp?)and his struggles to make the team (He ended up on the Cowboys PS).

Now I know he was one of Bradford's go to guys last year with the Rams. I believe he would be a legit target as the slot for Colt. A guy that would serve Colt like Brian Brennan did all those years ago for Bernie.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby gotribe31 » Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:55 am

yogi wrote:I was watching the Dallas Cowboy's "Hard Knocks" from 2 or 3 years ago and was impressed with their "rookie" WR , Danny Amendola (sp?)and his struggles to make the team (He ended up on the Cowboys PS).

Now I know he was one of Bradford's go to guys last year with the Rams. I believe he would be a legit target as the slot for Colt. A guy that would serve Colt like Brian Brennan did all those years ago for Bernie.


I still love how every white WR in the league reminds everyone in Cleveland of Brian Brennan.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby FUDU » Wed Jul 06, 2011 11:01 am

swerb wrote:Nothing but question marks at the position, and they gotta get Colt a vet to make catches between the hashes.

Not sure what Shurmur's plans are with Evan Moore, who I like. If he's a TE primarily in the WCO, we appear to be set there with him, Ben Watson, and 5th rd pick Jordan Cameron.

Greg Little is intriguing. Shit or get off the pot time for Mo Mass and Robiskie ... I am higher on the latter. Carlton Mitchell is still only 23, allegedly grew like 7 inches this offseason, and is great on Twitter. Cribbs - who the F knows what, if anything, you can do with this cat at this point.

Everyone else is garbage. Actually, some of the above guys may be garbage too.

You got a good OL. You got some real nice options in the backfield with Hillis, Hardesty, Marecic, and whoever they bring in to be the 3rd down back. Looks like Vickers is gonzo ... which is crazy to me regardless of what offense you run.

Go get your young QB some help at WR. Don't make us count on a bunch of question marks in their early 20's.

A couple UFA options that could fit - Brandon Stokley, who played real good down the stretch for the Seahawks in the playoffs. And Mark Clayton, former Ravens #1 who was traded to the Rams and got off to a great start last year before injuring his knee.

I agree with Rich on the guy we have and the overall need, but it sure doesn't sound/feel like this FO is going to go through with any of this in free agency.

Who are the best two FA WR's available anyway?
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:31 pm

Really, this FA WR class isn't that exciting. Rice is the prize, a good player, but he'll get way overpaid. The one I'm most interested in is Steve Smith (the NY version), but he has knee issues, not to mention that he might be Restricted (Sidney too). From an article that seems like 2 years ago:

Santonio Holmes (U) - I don't see any way in Hell that the Jets let him get away, but if they do, he should be at the top of anyone's list. So happy the Steelers gave him away for nothing.

Vincent Jackson (U) - Vincie got Franchised again by the Chargers, so it is unlikely that he will be available through Free Agency. He could, however, be had through a trade - for the right price. And that price will likely be ridiculous. So cross him off your list.

Terrell Owens (U) - Yeah, I know that he had a pretty decent season in 2010. But he doesn't belong on a young, building team that is likely to struggle. Would be a mistake, and I doubt that Heckert gives him a second thought.

Randy Moss (U) - Same as above, minus the decent 2010 part.

Braylon Edwards (U) - I'd rather eat an old shoe filled with afterbirth than have Braylon back, even if he would come back (which is less likely than world peace). Besides, someone will pay him way more than he's worth to make 2 catches a game.

Donte Stallworth (U) - I crack myself up.

Plaxico Burress (U) - I know a lot of you don't want to touch this guy with a 10 foot pole, but nothing breathes humility into a man like some incarceration. I don't see him in the same Buyer Beware category as TO and Moss. Plax is a big target who's been hugely productive in this league. He's older (he'll be 34 by the start of the season), but he's had a couple years to let his body mend, so you might be able to squeeze 2 more good seasons out of him. And, with Eric Mangini's Morality Wall no longer in place, the Cleveland Front Office might be willing to take a chance on a guy like Plax.

TJ Houshmandzadeh (U) - Ehhhhhh... I dunno. He's been pretty much useless the last 2 years. He'll be 34 this year too, but he's a used-up-I-got-paid-a-couple-years-ago-and-I-ain't-bustin'-my-ass-anymore 34. Probably not what a team like Cleveland needs.

Santana Moss (U) - He'll only be 32 this year, so he's a spring chicken. It seems like Moss has been tailing off over recent years, but that's really only because Washington is so bad year after year. He had 93 catches for 1115 yards and 6 TD's last season - not too shabby. In the last 8 years, his WORST year was 790 yards receiving, a number that it normally takes Browns' Receivers 3 or 4 years to reach. Not sure what he's looking for financially, but could be worth a look if the price is right.

Andre Davis (U) - I honestly didn't know he was still in the league. Good for him; that's a pretty long career for a guy that never was/never will be very good.

Mark Clayton (U) - This is someone that we should keep our eye on, because he was with Shurmur in STL last year and was having a surprisingly good season until he went down with a knee injury in Week 5. In the first 4 games, he had 300 yards receiving, which would extrapolate to a 1200 yard season (if you feel compelled to do such things). Enough cannot be said for him knowing the Shurmur version of the WCO, especially with the shortened offseason a-comin', so do not be at all shocked if the Browns have serious interest in him should his knee be up to snuff.

Lance Moore (5) - Very productive, but ultimately is a 3rd WR on a good Receiving corps. I have a feeling that he'll stay in New Orleans, but if he's set free, you can't really turn up your nose at someone as productive as he is (depending on cost, of course).

Malcolm Floyd (5) - I'm somewhat wary of this guy. He's never been overly productive, and he seems to get hurt every year (although he did make it through all 16 games in 2009). Still, he's a big target, and likely an upgrade on what we already have.

Sidney Rice (4) - Rice might be the prize of the WR FA market, and therefore it is highly unlikely he chooses to come to Cleveland. If you look at his stats, he had that one wicked-awesome year in 2009, but hasn't done much else. Granted, last season was severely hampered by injury, but I have serious doubts whether he'll be worth the insane amount of cash-eesh it would take to get him to become a Brown.

Steve Smith (4) - To me, this is the better option. He'll still cost a pretty penny, have no doubt, but I see him as more solid overall. His career path has been very similar to Rice's, but he's perhaps more durable. Again, it will be very tough to get him to come to Cleveland, and it's difficult for me to believe the Giants will just let him walk, but you never know...

James Jones (4) - If this dude could catch the ball consistently, I'd say he should be the Browns' Numero Uno prey. He knows the WCO, plays in shitty weather, he's got size and speed... everything a growing boy needs but the ability to hold onto the pigskin. Still, I'd be very interested at the right price.

Steve Breaston (4) - Everyone caught 150 passes in Arizona when Kurt Warner was still there, so a more accurate measure of his skills might be found in his numbers with the - um - less than stellar QB's in 2010: 13 games, 47 catches, 718 yards, 1 TD, 15.3 avg. as a #2 WR. Not really that bad considering his passers were even worse than Cleveland's and that the Browns' #1 WR (Mo Mass) only had 483 yards receiving.

Devin Aromashadu (4) - Every year, someone in my league drafts this guy as their "fantasy sleeper", and every year they drop him by Week 4. He's never done much, never distinguished himself even amongst a very pedestrian WR corps in Chicago. I don't see him as an improvement on even the guys we already have.

Mike Sims-Walker (4) - Sims-Walker is one of those "nice" players. Nice size, not great. Nice speed, not great. Nice production, not great. If you go out and nab a guy like MSW, do you solve your #1 WR problem? No. Certainly not. But he could be a very solid #2.

Laurent Robinson (4) - If we learned anything from the 2009 influx of ex-Jets, it's that new Head Coaches like to bring in players from the former teams. They know the players, the players know them, they know the system... it's helpful in many ways. So a sort of under-the-radar guy like Robinson might be a likelihood: He knows the Coach and System, and Cleveland will probably lay more attention on him than anyone else (especially for someone of his limited productivity). If you find yourself apt to freak out should the Browns go out and sign him early, please start working it into your reality now so that your blood pressure will be below the danger level when/if this should come to pass.

Early Doucet (R) - I am not wont to add many Restricted Free Agents to these lists, since they're so hard/expensive to sign away. A lot of people seem to like this guy's potential, though, so I'm tossing his name into mix anyway
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby HoodooMan » Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:51 pm

Free wha?
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby swerb » Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:02 pm

Good breakdown Chris/Hiko. Clean that up and I will run it front page ...
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Wed Jul 06, 2011 4:13 pm

swerb wrote:Good breakdown Chris/Hiko. Clean that up and I will run it front page ...


That article already ran a couple months ago, back when I had hope that this mess would be over quickly.

http://www.theclevelandfan.com/cleveland-browns/1-browns-archive/7923-the-browns-outsider-free-agency-wr
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby HoodooMan » Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:25 pm

So clean that shit up, then.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:46 pm

HoodooMan wrote:So clean that shit up, then.


I know. Standards have raised between April and now.

I only did WR and DL, as continuing on the FA warpath with no idea what/when/who felt like pissing in the wind.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby Prosecutor » Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:30 pm

If Breaston averaged 15.3 ypc with QBs worse than the Browns, sign me up for some of that. Besides, he reminds me of Brian Brennan.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby mistero » Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:06 am

1. Mo Mass
2. Greg Little
3. Robo
4. Cribbs
5. Carlton Mitchell
6. Norwood and more driftwood

Point being these guys all have upside (save Cribbs). You're gonna bump someone off the roster before you know if they're any good. I think we need to show patience with this group and stay the course. Save the money for the defense.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:46 am

mistero wrote:1. Mo Mass
2. Greg Little
3. Robo
4. Cribbs
5. Carlton Mitchell
6. Norwood and more driftwood

Point being these guys all have upside (save Cribbs). You're gonna bump someone off the roster before you know if they're any good. I think we need to show patience with this group and stay the course. Save the money for the defense.


I dunno. I think that if you bring in a bona fide veteran WR, you know you have one legit guy, and the rest of the guys with upside will have to prove themselves. Cuz they could also be busts - none of them is a proven starter at this point.

I just have a feeling Shurmur will be getting one of his ex-Rams WR's.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby mistero » Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:15 pm

Didn't Walrus say these guys weren't so bad? They just needed a chance. Holgren and Heckert are both on the record saying we're ok at WR. I don't think we see any new faces there.

Besides this team is going to run through the TE's. :salute:
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:39 pm

mistero wrote:Didn't Walrus say these guys weren't so bad? They just needed a chance. Holgren and Heckert are both on the record saying we're ok at WR. I don't think we see any new faces there.

Besides this team is going to run through the TE's. :salute:


What Front Office types say and what they really think are often different. Just b/c Holmgren or Heckert say right now that we're set there doesn't mean much to me. It's not like they're gonna say "These guys suck, we're going balls to the wall in Free Agency to replace them", even if they secretly thought it.

I'm not disagreeing with you that standing pat at WR wouldn't be the worst thing in the world and all that some of these guys need is an opportunity. But throwing a bunch of unproven youngsters at a problem and hoping one of them comes out smelling like roses is what the Browns have done with great unsuccess since The Return. I see no issue with bringing in proven players at ALL positions to raise the bar.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby bucknutz94 » Sun Jul 10, 2011 12:18 pm

Prosecutor wrote:If Breaston averaged 15.3 ypc with QBs worse than the Browns, sign me up for some of that. Besides, he reminds me of Brian Brennan.


I laughed. Thank you.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby yogi » Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:58 am

gotribe31 wrote:
yogi wrote:I was watching the Dallas Cowboy's "Hard Knocks" from 2 or 3 years ago and was impressed with their "rookie" WR , Danny Amendola (sp?)and his struggles to make the team (He ended up on the Cowboys PS).

Now I know he was one of Bradford's go to guys last year with the Rams. I believe he would be a legit target as the slot for Colt. A guy that would serve Colt like Brian Brennan did all those years ago for Bernie.


I still love how every white WR in the league reminds everyone in Cleveland of Brian Brennan.


WTF was I thinking, comparing a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB to a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB?


Forgive me.

I meant to compare Amendola to Wayne Chrebet. :cheers:
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:31 pm

yogi wrote:
gotribe31 wrote:
yogi wrote:I was watching the Dallas Cowboy's "Hard Knocks" from 2 or 3 years ago and was impressed with their "rookie" WR , Danny Amendola (sp?)and his struggles to make the team (He ended up on the Cowboys PS).

Now I know he was one of Bradford's go to guys last year with the Rams. I believe he would be a legit target as the slot for Colt. A guy that would serve Colt like Brian Brennan did all those years ago for Bernie.


I still love how every white WR in the league reminds everyone in Cleveland of Brian Brennan.


WTF was I thinking, comparing a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB to a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB?


Forgive me.

I meant to compare Amendola to Wayne Chrebet. :cheers:


SD:

Why do all white receivers have to be small and slow for you to luv em , can't we get one thats big and fast like Moore or better, if they just gotta be white for you to fall in luv.


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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby gotribe31 » Mon Jul 11, 2011 2:20 pm

yogi wrote:
gotribe31 wrote:
yogi wrote:I was watching the Dallas Cowboy's "Hard Knocks" from 2 or 3 years ago and was impressed with their "rookie" WR , Danny Amendola (sp?)and his struggles to make the team (He ended up on the Cowboys PS).

Now I know he was one of Bradford's go to guys last year with the Rams. I believe he would be a legit target as the slot for Colt. A guy that would serve Colt like Brian Brennan did all those years ago for Bernie.


I still love how every white WR in the league reminds everyone in Cleveland of Brian Brennan.


WTF was I thinking, comparing a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB to a small white guy without burner speed and good hands with a knack to get open and on page with his QB?


Forgive me.

I meant to compare Amendola to Wayne Chrebet. :cheers:


Nah, he's more Jordan Shipley to me
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby Love child of shawn kemp » Mon Jul 11, 2011 3:03 pm

Poor man's Anthony Gonzalez
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby hiko » Mon Jul 11, 2011 3:33 pm

The Brian Brennan's and Wayne Chrebet's of the world are nice stories, but they're really under-talented guys that overcame their skills deficit with hard work.

What's wrong with getting some guys that are really talented too?

I mean, a Brian Brennan is a nice thing to have, but he's hardly a team maker. If you have one, then nice for you. But I don't know if you go out looking for one.

I wish more of these WR's that were available - white, black, purple, chartreuse - reminded me of Calvin Johnson.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Mon Jul 11, 2011 4:00 pm

hiko wrote:The Brian Brennan's and Wayne Chrebet's of the world are nice stories, but they're really under-talented guys that overcame their skills deficit with hard work.

What's wrong with getting some guys that are really talented too?

I mean, a Brian Brennan is a nice thing to have, but he's hardly a team maker. If you have one, then nice for you. But I don't know if you go out looking for one.

I wish more of these WR's that were available - white, black, purple, chartreuse - reminded me of Calvin Johnson.



SD:

Amen .....IIRC Megatron is a transforming truck , I'll take one of them.

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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby yogi » Tue Jul 12, 2011 12:31 pm

SoulDawg74 wrote:
hiko wrote:The Brian Brennan's and Wayne Chrebet's of the world are nice stories, but they're really under-talented guys that overcame their skills deficit with hard work.

What's wrong with getting some guys that are really talented too?

I mean, a Brian Brennan is a nice thing to have, but he's hardly a team maker. If you have one, then nice for you. But I don't know if you go out looking for one.

I wish more of these WR's that were available - white, black, purple, chartreuse - reminded me of Calvin Johnson.



SD:

Amen .....IIRC Megatron is a transforming truck , I'll take one of them.

SoulDawg


Me too.

But being realistic, how many ubber talented, semi-low maintenance WRs are ever on the FA Market? And if some were, what are the Browns chances of landing one?

I've always held to the thinking that you get your talent from the draft and you attempt to fill your holes in FA.
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Re: Wide Reciever Help

Unread postby OldDawg » Tue Jul 12, 2011 10:10 pm

If I recall, Brennan had some nice receivers with him as well. Sign me up for needing us to get a real NFL receiver and then hope a couple of these projects develop. I don't want no intern doing my open heart surgery. The intern can sew me up when its over, but get me a real doctor, not someone who hopes to be one.
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