Movies, Music, TV, Books, Pop Culture

by **e0y2e3** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:08 pm

Since you dolts are all Facebooky these days with your 5? and you're "best songs of the last 20 years" I figured this would be a good place to drop this.

AV Club does a question of the week re: pop-culture and this weeks is centered around what TV, book or movie series, to you, should have just stopped at ______ point. The key to the question is not focusing on ____ show getting bad at x point (most do), but instead what STORY would have actually been much BETTER off had they just stopped telling it.

I'll drop mine later, still thinking.

by **hermanfontenot** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:18 pm

Off the top of my head: they should have ended "The Sopranos" after either Season 3 or Season 4.

by **e0y2e3** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:27 pm

You mean you didn't enjoy a half a season of exploring what being a gay guy on the run in New Hampshire would be like?

That's a hell of an example FWIW and where I was leaning toward.

by **Triple-S** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:31 pm

The Simpsons after Phil Hartman died.
The Office after Charles Miner showed up.

by **e0y2e3** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:00 pm

^ I often wonder if you can actually read

by **RickNashEquilibrium** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:05 pm

The Shield after Lem was killed.

Dune after "God Emperor". The prequels Brian Anderson came out with can still be released in this scenario, I just think the whole Dune series could have been finalized at the end of that book without tacking on "Heretics" and "Chapterhouse".

by **mitch** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:07 pm

ER after Dr. Greene died.
24 after Season 5.
Fantastic Four movies after the idea was approved (and before the first movie was made).
Any "big" group after the lead singer leaves (Journey, Styx, Van Halen)
X-Men movies after the second film
Superman movies after the second
Dune books after Dune Messiah

by **RickNashEquilibrium** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:08 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:Since you dolts are all Facebooky these days with your 5? and you're "best songs of the last 20 years" I figured this would be a good place to drop this.

To add, you are such a presumptuous son of a bitch, and I love ya for it :cheers:

by **waborat** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:15 pm

When the mountain line trapped Kim in the shelter with the goofball on 24

When Bill wanted yet a 4th wife on Big Love

The squealin piggies in Deliverance

by **RickNashEquilibrium** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:16 pm

mitch wrote:ER after Dr. Greene died.
Yes, absolutely.

Dune books after Dune Messiah[
Hmmmm, I gave that some thought, and I suppose it would have been a great ending with Paul going blind and finalizing his deification by walking into the desert. Children gets off the path a bit, especially with the nature of his return, but I felt the story of Leto II and him becoming what Paul could not was great storytelling. FYI - Messiah is still my favorite book of the original series, House Atreides and House Harkonnen are my faves overall.

by **hermanfontenot** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:17 pm

"Oz" after Adebisi was killed.

by **swerb** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:21 pm

"24" is the obvious one.

Show started amazing and each season got progressively worse.

Big Love on HBO is another.

by **Love child of shawn kemp** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:42 pm

The movie would have been too short without it but I always liked the basic training portion of Full Metal Jacket better than when they shipped out to viet nam. Would have been a great ending scene of the bathroom wall splattered and then the credits roll.

by jb » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:50 pm

"The Drive" after Brennan scores the TD.

( No one is reading ur question as written, dude )

::doh::

by **motherscratcher** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:05 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:Since you dolts are all Facebooky these days with your 5? and you're "best songs of the last 20 years" I figured this would be a good place to drop this.

AV Club does a question of the week re: pop-culture and this weeks is centered around what TV, book or movie series, to you, should have just stopped at ______ point. The key to the question is not focusing on ____ show getting bad at x point (most do), but instead what STORY would have actually been much BETTER off had they just stopped telling it.

I'll drop mine later, still thinking.

If I'm being honest, I'm not sure I'm capable of doing this. I don't know how to separate out a show getting bad and pretend I don't know when that happens.

The first 2 that come to mind would be:

1. The West Wing - after Rob Lowe leaves, season 4 I think. This works because I don't think the show ever was terrible for a sustained period even after that, but it seems like it would have been a fitting end.

2. ER - but not when Greene left. That show started to suck well before Greene left. I'd say after season 4 or 5 if I had to guess. I just remember watching promos for ER well after I'd given up on it and there would be gunmen in the ER taking hostages and helicopters crashing into the side of the hospital. I would just shake my head in wonder that so many people still watched such a retarded show.

by **e0y2e3** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:12 pm

West Wing was mentioned in the original article: http://www.avclub.com/articles/should-h ... ner,54961/

by **Cerebral_DownTime** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:14 pm

hermanfontenot wrote:"Oz" after Adebisi was killed.

That show just got weird.

by jb » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:43 pm

"Platoon" after Elias gets whacked by Barnes.

Saving Pvt Ryan after the invasion scene, which we ALL KNOW was NOT the opening scene.

by **skatingtripods** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:59 pm

To be honest, I don't think I've really watched a show long enough to have an answer to this. Prison Break ended after 4 seasons because it got canceled, but I'm sure it would have gotten to the point where there was an answer that fit the parameters of the question.

Never watched 24, Oz, Sopranos, or some of the others mentioned above. Wife watched the last season of Big Love and got the first two from the library, but all I can say about that was that the ending could be seen from the moon and it was as anti-climactic as could be.

Dexter will probably get to the point where the show should have ended also, but, since new versions of books keep coming out, the show will go on and on.

by **e0y2e3** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:02 pm

Oh Dexter - good one.

Their was a very good story told in season 1. The following seasons (4 aside) just become a repetitive procedural and ruined any and all shine it had.

by **Cerebral_DownTime** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:10 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:Oh Dexter - good one.

Their was a very good story told in season 1. The following seasons (4 aside) just become a repetitive procedural and ruined any and all shine it had.

I bailed on that snooze fest after season 2.

by **Gradysmanldy** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:11 pm

24 is absolutely the bell ringer of a show that should have cut the cord sooner; I tell all my friends who get into it later on to just stop at 5. (6 and 7 were turrible)

Other:
Nip/Tuck after the 1st season
The Riches
Entourage after season 3
My first marriage after the 3rd year when all the fun friends had been phased out

by **skatingtripods** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:12 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:Oh Dexter - good one.

Their was a very good story told in season 1. The following seasons (4 aside) just become a repetitive procedural and ruined any and all shine it had.

I'm not sure that I'd say that the show has no shine. I think it has lacked in character development. Without Julia Stiles's character continuing with Dexter might be a big mistake to the future of the show. There's only so much farther they can take it with Deb not finding out who Dexter really is.

I'll say this, though. I don't get excited to watch it and really only watch it because the wife loves it.

by **davemanddd** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:13 pm

"heroes" before the writers strike completely sodomized the series.

by **waborat** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:18 pm

jb wrote:
Saving Pvt Ryan after the invasion scene, which we ALL KNOW was NOT the opening scene.

mind of an elephant

Full Metal Jacket was a good one, 2 entirely different movies...

Another, as soon as Vince signs on for Medellin on Entourage and when the twn of Agrestic burns down in Weeds

by **Gradysmanldy** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:20 pm

Yeah, god Heroes went to shit in a hurry. Im not sure how you add Veronica Mars to something and make it SO MUCH WORSE

by **peeker643** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:34 pm

waborat wrote:
jb wrote:
Saving Pvt Ryan after the invasion scene, which we ALL KNOW was NOT the opening scene.

mind of an elephant

Full Metal Jacket was a good one, 2 entirely different movies...

Another, as soon as Vince signs on for Medellin on Entourage and when the twn of Agrestic burns down in Weeds

For my money Weeds has about half dozen examples e0y is looking for. I still watch it, it amuses me, she's a hot 40+ and all of that, but it goes off on some directions it shouldn't that take a long time to resolve IMO.

The youngun' wacking the chick with the croquet mallet should have ended there (or reasonably soon thereafter) and that maybe that whole on the lam/hotel employee/youngun hanging with park moms thing afterward wouldn't still make me nauseous...

by **FUDU** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:58 pm

jb wrote:"Platoon" after Elias gets whacked by Barnes.

Saving Pvt Ryan after the invasion scene, which we ALL KNOW was NOT the opening scene.

by **hiko** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:30 pm

peeker643 wrote:
waborat wrote:
jb wrote:
Saving Pvt Ryan after the invasion scene, which we ALL KNOW was NOT the opening scene.

mind of an elephant

Full Metal Jacket was a good one, 2 entirely different movies...

Another, as soon as Vince signs on for Medellin on Entourage and when the twn of Agrestic burns down in Weeds

For my money Weeds has about half dozen examples e0y is looking for. I still watch it, it amuses me, she's a hot 40+ and all of that, but it goes off on some directions it shouldn't that take a long time to resolve IMO.

The youngun' wacking the chick with the croquet mallet should have ended there (or reasonably soon thereafter) and that maybe that whole on the lam/hotel employee/youngun hanging with park moms thing afterward wouldn't still make me nauseous...

Good call. By Season 4, that show had lost its damn mind.

Heroes is another good call. They should just call the 1st season a miniseries and be done with it.

24 went on like 4 seasons too long.

Moonlighting should've ended with David and Maddie fucking.

The Star Wars series should've stopped after 1983. Possibly 1980.

The Piano would've been much better had it ended after the opening credits.

Lost was a season or 2 too long.

That 70's Show. When half your cast leaves, time to call it quits.

Saturday Night Live?

The Steelers-Cardinal Super Bowl. That should've ended about a minute earlier.

And how about The Drive? That should've ended with about 3 minutes left on the clock.

Oh, and let us not forget my first marriage. Preferrably before it started.

by **Cerebral_DownTime** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:36 pm

Scrubs went on too long.

by **rebelwithoutaclue** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:01 pm

Most of mine have been said. Dexter, though I'll say after season 2 but it redeemed itself with John Lithgow as the Trinity Killer and went straight back to crap after that. Weeds, stopped watching right after she got pregnant with the Mexican gangster's baby.

And there's really people that think that the Normandy invasion is the opening scene of SPR? First scene: cemetary. How can that be debated?

by **Rat_Tail** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:21 pm

Weeds is pretty much the only current narrative show that I watch.

The show does a good job of cliff-hanging especially at the end of each season. Which is why I still watch.

I think the show could've ended before she met the Mexican President/drug-lord because since then the main characters have just been on the run and the story just jumps around too much.

by **waborat** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:02 am

For us old guys, All In The Family when Archie opens the bar ;-) ;) :wink:

by **hermanfontenot** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:10 am

I thought "The X-Files" went off the rails when it started getting deep into the Smoking Man-Government Conspiracy stuff. I just never could get into that aspect of the show. I liked the early seasons when Mulder and Scully (who was smokin' hot back in the day) would go to some small town to investigate some strange occurence.

To go back to "The Sopranos," the Vito-as-gay-gangster subplot didn't bother me all that much. I just grew to detest the characters. They were loathsome, without any redeeming qualities- all except Tony. I can't stay with a show if I hate the characters and I hated the characters on "The Sopranos" by the end.

I loved "Lost" all the way through the end. The only part I didn't like was the Nikki-and-Paulo subplot in Season 3 and they killed those characters off with a quickness. But I never did buy into the Sayid-and-Shannon romance.

by **FUDU** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:17 am

GWB's presidency.

Cop Rock.

This thread ended with JB though.

by **General** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:00 pm

Civilization after the advent of the "Hip-Hop culture".

by **RickNashEquilibrium** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:15 pm

General wrote:Civilization after people stopped thinking for themselves..

Fixed it for ya.

by **General** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:33 pm

RickNashEquilibrium wrote:
General wrote:Civilization after people stopped thinking for themselves..

Fixed it for ya.

I can live with that.

by **e0y2e3** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:51 pm

I'd really like to know what you condsider hip-hop culture.

Also would like to know how and why it annoys you more than 80s hair band culture.

Kids are typically idiots, why does this certain brand of idiocracy bother you?

Also I'd like to know why Jerry Roche is a ridiculous sexist that I am going to flame for years on end at this point.

by **General** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:25 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:I'd really like to know what you condsider hip-hop culture.

I consider that crazy "thumpity thump" crap that seems to be coming out of every speaker, the stupid hats on sideways, pants sagging, and a whole host of other more volatile issues but I am not Jerry Roche.

Also would like to know how and why it annoys you more than 80s hair band culture.

80's hair bugged me too, but I was 25 years younger.
Kids are typically idiots, why does this certain brand of idiocracy bother you?

You are right here, only now do I see what an idiot I was during the 70's and 80's. as I get further away from it, while I try to understand and empathize, it get's more difficult.
Also I'd like to know why Jerry Roche is a ridiculous sexist that I am going to flame for years on end at this point.

Sometimes you really shouldn't say what's on your mind.

Have at it, as I know you will.

by **e0y2e3** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:39 pm

Word bro. I asked because I thought you were better than Jerry - I hate women - Roche.

Not gonna argue with a word of that.

PS: FWIW: (DOUBLE :!!) that behavior you described is more white trash than hip-hop.

by **FUDU** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 3:28 pm

Of course it is eye, of course it is.

::wereallyneedagoodsarcasmemoticonroundhere::

by **mitch** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:39 pm

hermanfontenot wrote:
To go back to "The Sopranos," the Vito-as-gay-gangster subplot didn't bother me all that much. I just grew to detest the characters. They were loathsome, without any redeeming qualities- all except Tony. I can't stay with a show if I hate the characters and I hated the characters on "The Sopranos" by the end.

I loved "Lost" all the way through the end. The only part I didn't like was the Nikki-and-Paulo subplot in Season 3 and they killed those characters off with a quickness. But I never did buy into the Sayid-and-Shannon romance.

Agree on both...although I did like the last 8 episode mini-season and how they wrapped up a lot of things (and then left the ending 100% wide open).

Lost had a couple of not-so-good years (especially Paulo/Nikki), but the last two seasons were excellent.

I'm worried that True Blood might be one that should have ended after the first season.

Big Love was awful for the last three seasons...I personally cheered when Bill got plugged at the end.

Entourage should have possibly ended a few years ago...but I sorta liked the Vince goes Charlie Sheen BEFORE Charlie Sheen bit from last year.

by **dem425** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:03 pm

After watching the last two episodes of the "Office", the entire series should have ended when Michael popped the question to Holly. I like Wil Ferrell, but those last two were friggin trainwrecks.......

Also, "Supernatural" could have ended season 5 after Sam dragged Lucifer into the hole..........

Like Costanza tried to do, can't some of these programs go out on a high note.........

by **swerb** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:48 pm

The Sopranos, even at its worst, was still pretty good. I also liked the last season and the ending, after I had time to absorb what happened.

Stopped watching Weeds after the town burned down, have felt bad about not being able to go back and watch the last 2-3 seasons yet. Good to hear the last couple sucked.

Moonlighting was a good call by Hiko. One of the first shows I ever watched.

by **hermanfontenot** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:54 pm

As much as I loved "Lost" I can see why people got so frustrated with it. I just watched all six seasons on DVD, so I didn't have to wait a week between episodes. Even so, I got annoyed when they'd have multiple plot lines going at once, a season building up to a climax... and then the entire thing would grind to a halt because they'd spend an episode on Richard Alpert's backstory, or Jacob/Man in Black's backstory- IOW an episode where NOTHING WOULD HAPPEN.

For people stuck waiting a week between episodes it must have been maddening.

by **FUDU** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:17 pm

swerb wrote:The Sopranos, even at its worst, was still pretty good. I also liked the last season and the ending, after I had time to absorb what happened.

Stopped watching Weeds after the town burned down, have felt bad about not being able to go back and watch the last 2-3 seasons yet. Good to hear the last couple sucked.

Moonlighting was a good call by Hiko. One of the first shows I ever watched.

Loved Moonlighting, first adult series I ever got into (as a kid).

FTR Cybil was my first Diane.

by **waborat** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:18 pm

swerb wrote:The Sopranos, even at its worst, was still pretty good. I also liked the last season and the ending, after I had time to absorb what happened.

Stopped watching Weeds after the town burned down, have felt bad about not being able to go back and watch the last 2-3 seasons yet. Good to hear the last couple sucked.

Moonlighting was a good call by Hiko. One of the first shows I ever watched.

That's what's funny, as ridiculous as Soprano's, Weeds, Entourage, etc has gotten, they're still better than most of the other crap on tv...

I cheered along w/ Mitch when Hendrickson took the gut shot at the end of Big Bore

by **waborat** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:22 pm

FUDU wrote:
Loved Moonlighting, first adult series I ever got into (as a kid).

Same, unless Taboo counts? Kay Parker was my first Diane;-) ;) :wink:

Moonlight & LA Law were gold in the late 80s

by **e0y2e3** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:01 pm

1) True Blood should have been taken behind the shed long ago. Effing got terrible.

2) I like to pretend that seasons 4 and 5 of Weeds don't exist but I liked this past season. A lot. I think that is because I gave up on it being a comedy and fully embraced that it is now a dark family drama.

3) Last season of Entourage didnt suck. The last four did. I hate myself for still watching it. How to Make It In America is better.

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