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Other soccer leagues

Unread postby swerb » Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:44 pm

Loosely know about the Premier League and the Champions League ... and obviously the MLS. And then, if I'm correct, there's a very strong league in Spain and Italy.

Some questions ...

How do you see these games on TV? Is there some kind of cable soccer channel you can subscribe to?

Which league(s) are most worth following?

Do they suspend play in these other leagues for the Champions League games?

What's leagues have most of the star players we're seeing in the World Cup?

Are there major rule changes from league to league? Or do all follow the rules of the World Cup?
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby British_Pharaoh » Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:12 pm

swerb wrote:Loosely know about the Premier League and the Champions League ... and obviously the MLS. And then, if I'm correct, there's a very strong league in Spain and Italy.

Some questions ...

How do you see these games on TV? Is there some kind of cable soccer channel you can subscribe to?

Which league(s) are most worth following?

Do they suspend play in these other leagues for the Champions League games?

What's leagues have most of the star players we're seeing in the World Cup?

Are there major rule changes from league to league? Or do all follow the rules of the World Cup?



La Liga with the likes of Barcelona is an entertaining league to watch.

They have a lot of African players too and they play more attacking football with flair and style in Spain

Whereas Serie A in Italy is very tactical and defense minded.


Spain and England are the best leagues to watch for the multitude of players in this world cup.

Italy's Serie A will have more of the South American players you're seeing
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Mon Jun 28, 2010 5:43 am

swerb wrote:Which league(s) are most worth following?


Spain and England for the best quality

swerb wrote:Do they suspend play in these other leagues for the Champions League games?


No.

The league games take place on a Saturday/Sunday and the Champions League games are on Tuesday/Wednesday (the "Europa League" - basically the 2nd tier of European competition - plays on Thursday)

swerb wrote:What's leagues have most of the star players we're seeing in the World Cup?


Again, Spain and England - specifically at teams like Barcelona (Messi, Xavi), Real Madrid (Ronaldo, Higuain, Xabi Alonso) etc

swerb wrote:Are there major rule changes from league to league? Or do all follow the rules of the World Cup?


All rules are the same all throughout the game. In fact, to the point that one of the reasons that FIFA refused to bring in technology is because they wanted the game to be the same at the World Cup as it is at grass roots, play in the park level.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby swerb » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:40 pm

Am I reading this right? No playoffs in the Premier League. Most points at the end of 38 games is the winner?

Also, it seems like there is a huge difference between the haves and the have nots in the EPL, and also no sort of salary cap ... not unlike one the problems of American baseball. That accurate?
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby Cease » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:40 pm

swerb wrote:Am I reading this right? No playoffs in the Premier League. Most points at the end of 38 games is the winner?

Also, it seems like there is a huge difference between the haves and the have nots in the EPL, and also no sort of salary cap ... not unlike one the problems of American baseball. That accurate?


You are correct on both accounts. From what I've read, it's pretty top-heavy with the "Big Four"- Liverpool, Man U., Chelsea, and Arsenal, dominating the top of the standings every year. Bottom 3 teams are relegated each season to a lower league- which keeps things interesting on the bottom. Regionalism, I suppose keeps things interested in the middle, even if your club is a "have not."

No playoffs is so dang foreign to this US sports watcher, but because teams (up to 8?) get placed in Champions League and UEFA Europa League (and others?), there is something to play for beside the Cup.

No salary caps for players or teams, no limit to the number of players signed by a club. It's a pretty unique set up- kinda like the old taxi-squad days. I'm not around it enough to know what Joe Englishman thinks of the whole set up as a structure- would love to hear opinions...

A total of 44 clubs have competed in the Premier League, but only four have won the title: Arsenal (3 titles), Blackburn Rovers (1), Chelsea (3), and Manchester United (11 trophies). The current champions are Chelsea, who won the 2009–10 season.


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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Tue Jun 29, 2010 4:53 am

Yep, no salary cap.

Biggest wallet wins - this normally would mean a big 4 of Arsenal, Manchester Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool. But, Liverpool are so damn in debt (thank you Tom Hicks and George Gillett) that they've probably been passed by Manchester City (possibly the richest team in the world) and Tottenham.

It is solely a league system without any playoffs in the EPL. However, there are playoffs in the lower divisons (The pecking order goes EPL, Championship, League 1, League 2).

As Cease mentioned, the bottom 3 teams in the EPL get relegated (to the Championship) on a yearly basis - this obviously means that 3 teams from the Champtionship need to get promoted to the EPL - the top 2 are promoted automatically and the 3-6 placed teams playoff for the final place. This works the same all the way down.

The problem with this system is, well, money!

The TV money etc is so much better for EPL teams that when teams get relegated it can be a death knell financially - as they will still have players on the books making Premier League salaries. The FA have instituted something called "Parachute Payments" where they still give a portion of EPL TV money to a relegated club and this amount reduces by the year.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:05 am

Alright- This shit is fascinating. Although I fear at the end of the day I'm going to look at this and believe MLB has its head on right after seeing how EPL soccer handles its bank.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:22 am

Premier League club's net debt at the end of the 2008/09 season had increased to £3.3bn from £3.2bn the year before.

However, just under half of that was "soft loans" from club owners.

Almost two-thirds, or more than £1.9bn, of the total net debt related to Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Manchester United.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/10249101.stm

Yep.... the EPL bank is an interesting one!

Have a Google of "portsmouth fc administration" if you really want to see how these clubs spend money with no real regard.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby Spin » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:33 am

I have Time Warner, and got the Sports Bundle, and it has Fox Soccer Channel. It has most of those leagues and tournaments, but I don't know how current the games are.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:39 am

Spin wrote:I have Time Warner, and got the Sports Bundle, and it has Fox Soccer Channel. It has most of those leagues and tournaments, but I don't know how current the games are.


Fox Soccer Channel shows live EPL games, I believe.

I actually watch it through an online feed every now and then when the game isn't being televised in the UK.

Similar to National Blackouts in the US (eg. Saturday Baseball blacked out by Fox), TV companies in the UK are not allowed to show games that kick off at 3pm GMT on a Saturday - essentially to keep people going to the games.

Liverpools games at this time I usually try and catch through the internet - so you might want to check out FSC at 10am ET on a Saturday starting mid August.
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby swerb » Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:35 pm

Is there any kind of draft of any sort? Or is it all essentially free agency?

Most Premier League games Saturday mornings? Prolly early here. Sounds like Champions League games happen at the same time, but during the week?
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Re: Other soccer leagues

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:30 pm

swerb wrote:Is there any kind of draft of any sort? Or is it all essentially free agency?

Most Premier League games Saturday mornings? Prolly early here. Sounds like Champions League games happen at the same time, but during the week?


No draft.

I can't speak as to how it works in other countries, but in England each team has there own academy which develops players from the ages of I think about 10-12 (if not younger) all the way through the age of 16/17 when, if they are good enough, they can get a pro contract (or be told they're not good enough and get nothing). These kids will be spotted by team scouts whilst just playing for their local kids league teams.

It is my understanding that there are rules in place which means that the kids these teams sign to their academy must live within a certain catchment area of the City/Town the team plays in - this means obviously that the rich teams can't just throw big money at the best kids in the country.

In terms then of the transfer of players - trades don't really happen. If a player is out of contract then they can sign anywhere else at seasons end without any compensation to their old team. Also, there is no minimum amount of time that a player is controlled by a team (like the 6 years service time in Baseball) - you're controlled for as long as your contract.

If a player is in contract then essentially a team will pay a Transfer Fee to buy him out of contract with his old team and negotiate a new contract with the new team.

Back to the schedule of the Premier League and Champions League: -

When the fixtures are determined all games are scheduled for Saturday afternoons at 3pm GMT from August through May. The league doesn't stop at any point (they do have Winter Breaks in some European Leagues for two weeks over the Xmas period, but not in England) although some weekends throughout the season the Premier League will skip a week for either FA Cup (starting in Jan) or International (either Friendlies or qualifiers for major championships such as the World Cup or European Championships) game - the International breaks are organised by UEFA (Union of European Football Associations) for all leagues throughout Europe at the same time.

Some of these 3pm GMT (-5 hours for ET) Saturday games are then moved for the purposes of TV coverage - like I said earlier, 3pm Saturday games can't be shown on TV in the UK although some are shown in the US. Normally a game will be moved to 12.45pm on Saturday, 5.30pm on Saturday, 1pm on Sunday, 4pm on Sunday and 8pm on Monday (all GMT) and these will be shown on National TV in the UK - these will tend to be the marquee matchups and, later in the season, will be games that look like they are going to decide who wins the league, who gets relegated etc.

The Champions League starts in September and plays the first Group stage (similar set-up to the World Cup - 8 groups of 4 teams, play eachother home and away, top two teams qualify for the next round) every other Tuesday/Wednesday until December.

The Champions League then takes a break until February when it comes back with the knock out stages and they play again every week on a Tuesday/Wednesday until the final in May.
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