Mangy took a Five and got Change for 11

[jb]

As long as the Steelers and Ravens draft the way they do and are two of the best ran teams in the NFL year in an year out. Winning the divison is a pipe dream right now. The Steelers just won 2 super bowls in the spead of 4 years with two different coaches. If the Browns are trying to copy them it is going to take a better draft then what they gave us this year.

Also Jamal Lewis is done and he is not a 1,000 yard rusher anymore he got 1002 yards last year. Being a 1,000 is worth nothing anymore. If that is what a 1000 yard season looks like. Lewis is slow and can't even hit the holes anymore. I am just shocked when I seen he got 1000 yards last season. I did not know he got like 800 carries last year.

First off, we will not be able to do it in one year's draft. However, this year was a great start and if we can come away with ths many solid contributors every year, we will contend for the division title consistently.

Second off, Jamal Lewis IS a 1000 yard rusher. Now, certainly he has lost a step. But lets look at some facts. The second half of last season we basically played without any real passing threat, so the defenses were keying on Jamal. Yet he still managed to get 1000 yards. You may say 1000 is worth nothing. However, only 16 backs (50% of the NFL) attained 1000 yards last year. Jamal rushing average was only .3 less then LT. Is he as good as he used to be? No. But if we can get our passing game going, watch him get 1300+ yards this year

He also got shit cleaned out of his ankles again. That seemed to really rejuvinate him last time he had the procedure. But the clock is ticking faster on the big bowling ball.

[jb]

We have a solid Oline with depth,

nah. Not even close at RT .

St Clair played OLT in Chicago and they wanted him stay and play at ORT. They offered him a 4.5 Million dollar contract but I guess that wasn't enough. ORTs are not typically highly paid but I guess da Bears wanted him bad enough to offer a contract to him.

Not what I mean. Look at his record, and his career as a starter. It isn't good. It isn't even betterthan Shaeffer. We won't have a good OL until there are no weak links, bw .

Mack gets rid of one. Maybe porkchop will make that a second and we can get one more year out of Tucker if he stays happy. A big ole ORT instead of Massaquoi sure woulda been nice. Don't want to be thrown under the bus for being "negative", but it is what it is.

St Calir ain't all that just cause he signed with us.

[Doc]

What did you all expect? At #5...who, Michael Crabtree? Is Crabtree worth more than Mack, Massoquoi, Elam, Coleman, a CB and a RB? Probably not, but I'll listen. Not to mention the top 5 money for another WR. Remember...the system doesn't just make Graham Harrell into Joe Montana...it makes good wide receivers into superstars. If Crabtree fails, then what? TCE? Let's get the foundation set.

I'm not going to knock ya'lls opinions. It'd be unfair. I kinda wanted Maualuga and Beanie at 21, but I'm not complaining...there's a bigger picture. It's not sexy. But it almost seems as though someone up in Berea has a gameplan about how they want to build the team. Like everyone else who's tried, I'm willing to give them a couple years...I'm not really expecting playoffs next year so I guess I'm fine without a star coming out of this draft.

And, as I mentioned in another thread...it takes 2 to tango. This ain't Madden. You call it getting fleeced...I call it fair. Why is it fair...because both teams agreed to the deal. It's like some of you believe we'd deliberately make trades to make us worse. You don't think that if there was a guy at 5 that they wanted, that they wouldn't have taken him?

I'm drinking the Kool-Aid. You guys don't have to, but I am. Like it or not, Mangini and Kokinis have a plan for this team. You might disagree with the plan, but it exists. The draft and free agency have certainly demonstrated this. It might not work. We might've drafted a bunch of Einstein's that can't play football. But, we don't know right now. I'm willing to buy into the plan, and I hope it works. But Mangini and Kokinis run this team, and they want their type of guys on this team. Free agency, the draft, and the trades have certainly established that. You can go arm chair QB and nitpick the moves...but if you're expecting Crabtree's and Maualuga's knowing full well that those types of personalities aren't gonna jive with the coach, then you're going to be pretty disappointed for at least the next few years.

[Danny Tanner]

Believe me I want nothing more then to eat my words and the Browns and this new coaching staff's plan does work out and we are playing for divison titles and making long runs into the playoffs. Like i said I just don't like 3 things from the draft. I feel we did not get enough in the trade that we moved down in and I don't like taking the 2 WR with some of the other talent on the board. I want nothing more then for the Browns to be good and I am just so sick of rebuilding every 4 years it just make you think one way I guess. And that is to not get your hopes up too high because it is a long way down to fall every year.

[Erie Warrior]

Erie, I think you might need to step back and look at big picture, and not just one or two guys. I do not think the Browns are looking for LT jr. Rather, they are looking for 22 pieces of a puzzle that will connect together and play as one cohesive unit. It does not matter if Rey was available in the 4th round, we would not have drafted him. He does not have the character Mangini is looking for. Did they reach in the 2nd? Probably. But as it has been said here, there is no guarantee those guys would of been around for their next pick. The only thing they could guarantee was that they could take them then and there. Mangini is following the Steelers/Patriots draft textbook to a tee. Now it just depends on how well they can coach the guys up in the fall in regards to how successful it will turn out. Barring any major injuries, I see us qucikly becoming a .500 or better team this year of next.

Can't step back, I have none of that optimism left. The whole stinking film is IMAX size. There were better football players available, in the Browns' area of need, with at least 2 of those second round picks. I'm ok with the trade down, I'm ok with Mack and one of Robo, Massoqui and Hawaii Guy. Not all three. Too many question marks with those guys. This isn't a good team for the young bucks to learn and grow from.

A doctor can write down instructions for a heart transplant, but that doesn't mean I can read them and do it successfully. Am I the only one that is sick of FO guys coming in and trying to copy another team's blue print. This team is different than the team they left. It has different needs, different players, different everything. Fuck every coach and GM who says "we run my system". Here's an idea, evaluate your talent first, and address the needs to make you successful as soon as possible. The Browns don't have too many more "next year"s left.

I know the Brown's have a team full of mediocre retreads. I know they can't hang with the Steelers or the Ravens, and may split with the Bengals. And I know that my glass if half empty until they prove me wrong. History is on my side, and I think so is logical thinking. No homer glasses here.

Anyone who says they had David Veikune on their board in the second round is a liar.

[Lubber]

Anyone who says they had David Veikune on their board in the second round is a liar.

Several mocks had him going in the 3rd. Browns did not have a 3rd, therefore took him in the 2nd.

[SoulDawg74]

We have a solid Oline with depth,

nah. Not even close at RT .

SD:

Get that weak shit outta here

You musta forgot T ucker was the best lineman we had last year which includes Joe Thomas when he wasn't hurt , and he happens to play RT never mind St Clair and porkchop can also do same.

Plenty time to see if one of these Utes like McKinney can make a splash or we find a udfa when you really have to only look at upgrading or depth in one spot.

Steinbech Thomas and Mack with four guys to fill the other two spots , and all having experience ,
and their forte being run blocking

SoulDawg

[SoulDawg74]

Anyone who says they had David Veikune on their board in the second round is a liar.

Several mocks had him going in the 3rd. Browns did not have a 3rd, therefore took him in the 2nd.

SD:

Told that dickhead the same 6 hours ago .

and

I'm still waiting on his answer to who we could have picked in the fourth round that was his equal let alone his better.

Pretty bad when a fuckin moron is so clueless he doesn't even know he's stoopid , let alone
thinks he got all the answers.


SoulDawg

[Mr. MacPhisto]

SD:

Get that weak shit outta here

You musta forgot T ucker was the best lineman we had last year which includes Joe Thomas when he wasn't hurt , and he happens to play RT never mind St Clair and porkchop can also do same.

Plenty time to see if one of these Utes like McKinney can make a splash or we find a udfa when you really have to only look at upgrading or depth in one spot.

Steinbech Thomas and Mack with four guys to fill the other two spots , and all having experience ,
and their forte being run blocking

SoulDawg

+1

I'd be worried about RT if the other guys on the line sucked. They don't and having three really good OLs to your left (Thomas, Steinbach, Mack) and one pretty good one (Hadnot), all with experience, means that the pressure is off the RT.

I don't see any guy on the OL having to carry more than his fair share of the weight. It's not like a line where you've only got a couple of really good guys. I think these guys will mesh well and RT will be fine. Tucker did well last year. We have depth.

The OL just doesn't worry me at this point.

Quite frankly, I see few big worries. The defense won't be spectacular but I don't think it'll be bad either. Reports I've read over the past two days indicate that many think Elam can be pretty good at S. Mangini brought in some guys he knows to stabilize the D, especially when it comes to the running game. He's added guy that may help establish a pass rush, huge weakness for Browns D for the past decade. Who knows how good the secondary is when the QB has 10 seconds? Someone will get open by then.

Mangini clearly wants to put pressure on the QB and minimize the time the secondary needs to be stuck in coverage. I don't think ANYONE has made a real effort to do so until now. They've drafted A GUY in the past, but never really looked at it from a team perspective.

The OL will be good. The receiving corps will be good and Braylon in a contract year has a good chance of reverting to 2007 1200 yard form. We will be able to run the ball. We should see more of Harrison, a guy who was a monster when he had the ball last season. Lewis will still get carries and can still bang out yards. And Davis was a steal.

I think we actually have a coach who is a leader now and a man who knows what kind of players work for him. About bloody time.

[BooyaCS]

The draft is a crap shoot. It always has been always will be. There will be busts (Maualuga) and boom players. There will be steals and solid contributors.

Right now we cannot determine anything until we actually see on the field performance. This is why you have scouts to scout colleges and come up with players. Walsh went to small schools all the time. The Patriots have less than exciting drafts yet are consistently good. So does Pittsburg.

Just because the guys you were pimping weren't picked doesn't mean this draft sucks. It is incomplete until we can see some production (or lack thereof) on the field.

[SoulDawg74]

Ziner >

Dude, once you remove your mouth from the ManKok, why dont you check out the bolded section and then bitch to more of us how we dont know dick about football. All your credibility left the forum with that sentence.

SD:

Whose us .,

Let em know I don't suck cock , so you'll have to take my place.

Ratlift knows this offense, and is Mangy's hand picked straw to stir the drink in the QB mix .

Which means you don't know Dick, as I said in the first place .

Ziner

Thanks for coming.

SD:

Thats what your mom said when the best part of you was still running down my leg.

Now that your all grown up and can thank me yourself .

Your certainly welcome.


SoulDawg

[Erie Warrior]

SD:
Told that dickhead the same 6 hours ago .
and
I'm still waiting on his answer to who we could have picked in the fourth round that was his equal let alone his better.

Pretty bad when a fuckin moron is so clueless he doesn't even know he's stoopid , let alone
thinks he got all the answers.


SoulDawg

Says DA and the long term contract. I've yet to see any take of yours that has panned out, ever. It's crazy, everyone else is stoopid, yet you have all the answers.

Sincerely, Kelly Unitas

You think the guy is worth the pick, I don't.

[Toxicadam]

Now I understand why the Browns are still the number 1 team in town.

[Ziner]

Ziner >

Dude, once you remove your mouth from the ManKok, why dont you check out the bolded section and then bitch to more of us how we dont know dick about football. All your credibility left the forum with that sentence.

SD:

Whose us .,

Let em know I don't suck cock , so you'll have to take my place.

Ratlift knows this offense, and is Mangy's hand picked straw to stir the drink in the QB mix .

Which means you don't know Dick, as I said in the first place .

Ziner

Thanks for coming.

SD:

Thats what your mom said when the best part of you was still running down my leg.

Now that your all grown up and can thank me yourself .

Your certainly welcome.


SoulDawg

1. How much you want to bet your boy Ratliff does even come close to seeing the field as a starter for the Browns this year? There is a reason the Jets drafted Sanchez.

2. I know Ratliff knows the offfense you pompous ass, and that is why Mangini brought him in here, to have a BACKUP that does, but that doesnt mean he is going to start over Brady or DA. Your implication that he will is flat out wrong and shows your lack of football intelligence. But go on, continue to tell everyone how "stoopid" they are, everyone will surely turn to you for your informed takes.

3. Are you 4 years old? Did you bring my mother in to this? She's long passed away and I think it would be wise of you to shut your fucking mouth about her and every other topic you dont know dick about.

4. Thanks for coming you piece of shit.

[SoulDawg74]

SD:
Told that dickhead the same 6 hours ago .
and
I'm still waiting on his answer to who we could have picked in the fourth round that was his equal let alone his better.

Pretty bad when a fuckin moron is so clueless he doesn't even know he's stoopid , let alone
thinks he got all the answers.


SoulDawg

Says DA and the long term contract. I've yet to see any take of yours that has panned out, ever. It's crazy, everyone else is stoopid, yet you have all the answers.

Sincerely, Kelly Unitas

You think the guy is worth the pick, I don't.

SD:

Exactly which guy are you bitchin about now,
I lose tract since your list is so long.

Before Saturday I didn't know Viekune from Adams house cat and neither did you , but that ain't the point.

Guy costs us nothing to find out if he has what it takes to develop as an OLB in comparison to anybody we would have picked in the first.

We got him at 52 with a pick we didn't have at the start of the draft, and he has to make the same conversion Gholston couldn't make as a top three pick last year for Mega dollars.

Investman wise to find out , we're on house money.

The fact the Pros on the Browns , in their opinion would bypass bigger names because they thought they choose this kid later is worth waiting to see pan out.

On Ratlift .

Dude is a straight throw in , but he knows the offense and ran the Jet offense better than the rest of the QB's including Farve in that exhibition loss to the Jets.

Gives us the flexibility to move A QB later and not be left Butt Nekid.

Harrell goes to the incubator to see if we can grow him some legs.

and BTW

Unless you don't want to confirm that your not the 20/20 hindsight stutterin second guessin Jackoff moron which I called you out on.

Time to Pony up with the answer to the question you were asked yesterday.

Who in the fourth round should they have taken instead of Viekune


SoulDawg

[bw]

[jb]

We have a solid Oline with depth,

nah. Not even close at RT .

SD:

Get that weak shit outta here

You musta forgot T ucker was the best lineman we had last year which includes Joe Thomas when he wasn't hurt , and he happens to play RT never mind St Clair and porkchop can also do same.

Plenty time to see if one of these Utes like McKinney can make a splash or we find a udfa when you really have to only look at upgrading or depth in one spot.

Steinbech Thomas and Mack with four guys to fill the other two spots , and all having experience ,
and their forte being run blocking

SoulDawg

Stop the bluster. Most of us sobered up after draft day.

An offensive line isn't about individusla. It is about the group. It is about technique, chemistry and playing together. That is why OLs w/ a collection of so-so players can look like HOF groups, and those like the Bobby Ross Lions can look like garbage.

The Browns have no legitimate RT. That's a fact and none of your nonsense can change that.

Why is it a fact?

How many starts at ORT has Ryan Tucker, he of bad knee, other issues, and pay cut , had in the past 2 seasons.

How many?

How many has John St Clair had after his rookie year in St Louis when he got Kurt warner killed and set his caree back 5 years?

How many?

Put down the spleef, Keiff. Empty the bong, Chong. Clean out the bowl, Cole. And stop talking yer shit.

Vs NFL defenses that are 3 - 4's and 4 - 3 Tampa 2's, the pressure off the edge makes the ORT every bit as crucil as the so-called Franchise OLT vs traditional 4 - 3's.

We got a big issue there that is on an island. This is not an interior OLman who can be covered up more readily.

Or in the words of George Santayana, those who forget Freddie Childress are condemned to relive him.

RT is an issue. Maybe Heiden & the new guy from Buffalo can help chip. But that takes away the passing game and play action on the run, and allows a LB to stay open for a second or two.

[bw]

Dood? Where do you get your information? You're virtually always a stright up guy but -- C'mon.

http://www.chicagobears.com/team/player74.html

John St Clair profile

2003 - Participated in all 16 regular season games and St. Louis' lone playoff game as a reserve tackle and on special teams.
2002 - Established career high by starting all 16 games for Rams offense that ranked 13th in NFL, 2nd in passing… Started Games 1-16 - Games 1-12 and 16 at RT, Games 13-15 at RT.
2001 - Inactive for St. Louis' 16 regular season games and all 3 playoff contests. 2000 - As a rookie, inactive for Rams 16 regular season games and 1 playoff contest.

edit:

http://www.chicagobears.com/news/NewsSt ... ry_id=5295
Oct 29, 2008
Resurgent Bears offensive line proving doubters wrong

LAKE FOREST, Ill. – Some considered a Bears offensive line that entered the season with new starters at three of five positions a question mark. But for the players involved, all dire predictions went in one ear and out the other>>

<<<The biggest surprise to some has been the performance of St. Clair, who many thought would be backing up rookie first-round pick Chris Williams this season.

“He’s proven a lot of people wrong,” said offensive coordinator Ron Turner. “Those questions more were from the outside than they were inside. A lot of guys in that locker room and the coaches had a lot of confidence in John.

“He’s played very good football for us. He’s a great worker and we’re not surprised at how he’s playing. I think everyone on the outside is. He’s played quite a bit for different guys, and whenever he’s gotten in to play, he’s always been productive and he’s played well.”

[jb]

Dood? Where do you get your information? You're virtually always a stright up guy but -- C'mon.

http://www.chicagobears.com/team/player74.html

John St Clair profile

2003 - Participated in all 16 regular season games and St. Louis' lone playoff game as a reserve tackle and on special teams.
2002 - Established career high by starting all 16 games for Rams offense that ranked 13th in NFL, 2nd in passing… Started Games 1-16 - Games 1-12 and 16 at RT, Games 13-15 at RT.
2001 - Inactive for St. Louis' 16 regular season games and all 3 playoff contests. 2000 - As a rookie, inactive for Rams 16 regular season games and 1 playoff contest.

bw - I will always take the correction on facts, so thank you. You're right, I'm wrong on the rookie season issue.

But he was aweful in St Lou, bw. he was run out of town on a rail.


http://www.nfl.com/players/johnst.clair/careerstats?id=STC266361

Pretty sure he replaced another fromer Soul Dawg prematurely annointed superstar in Qasim Mitchell for the Bears.

He simply isn't a bona fide NFL RT veteran strater, Bw. You can dispute the rest, but you can't dispute that immutable fact.

He may be better than I give him credit for, but he's not an upgrade over Shaffer just cause we signed him. We still have issues there. And as you well know, one weak link on an OL can spell big trouble in this game of matchups.

Look, even I am willing to be patient now. We can't change culture and fill all the holes in one year enough to compete with the two best teams in the conference (another fact based on the championship game) . Hopefully St Clair can be a decent patch and we can get the new tire next off season. But to proclaim the OL as "done" is not accurate AFAIC.

How "decent" the journeyman right side can be still will dictate what this offesne can or can't do as much or arguably MORE than who is under center.

As the OL goes, so does your O go.

[bw]

Dood? Where do you get your information? You're virtually always a stright up guy but -- C'mon.

http://www.chicagobears.com/team/player74.html

John St Clair profile

2003 - Participated in all 16 regular season games and St. Louis' lone playoff game as a reserve tackle and on special teams.
2002 - Established career high by starting all 16 games for Rams offense that ranked 13th in NFL, 2nd in passing… Started Games 1-16 - Games 1-12 and 16 at RT, Games 13-15 at RT.
2001 - Inactive for St. Louis' 16 regular season games and all 3 playoff contests. 2000 - As a rookie, inactive for Rams 16 regular season games and 1 playoff contest.

bw - I will always take the correction on facts, so thank you. You're right, I'm wrong on the rookie season issue.

But he was aweful in St Lou, bw. he was run out of town on a rail.


http://www.nfl.com/players/johnst.clair/careerstats?id=STC266361

Pretty sure he replaced another fromer Soul Dawg prematurely annointed superstar in Qasim Mitchell for the Bears.

He simply isn't a bona fide NFL RT veteran strater, Bw. You can dispute the rest, but you can't dispute that immutable fact.

He may be better than I give him credit for, but he's not an upgrade over Shaffer just cause we signed him. We still have issues there. And as you well know, one weak link on an OL can spell big trouble in this game of matchups.

Look, even I am willing to be patient now. We can't change culture and fill all the holes in one year enough to compete with the two best teams in the conference (another fact based on the championship game) . Hopefully St Clair can be a decent patch and we can get the new tire next off season. But to proclaim the OL as "done" is not accurate AFAIC.

How "decent" the journeyman right side can be still will dictate what this offesne can or can't do as much or arguably MORE than who is under center.

As the OL goes, so does your O go.

Agree completely with the last part. Don't necessarily disagree with the rest.

I have to wonder............... When Heiden was in for the injured Mr Armani Suit in the Giants game, we played extremely well. Not only did the OL keep DA mostly upright but the running game was actually present. Hmmmmm, sez I. Could it be because Heiden is a better blocker than the aforementioned Mr Armani Suit? Could it be because Heiden is just simply a 'willing blocker?'

And (this is my opinion so it must have a grain of truth to it) Eli Manning did NOT defeat the Pats in the Soupie Bowl. Period. The Gints D-Line did. Tom Brady, like other mortals, has trouble completing passes when he's flat on his back or running for his life. So that D-Line of the Gints that we faced last year on Monday Night was pretty decent.

I don't know how well St Clair is going to do but it certainly can't hurt if the opposing defense has to worry about a TE that can actually block somebody every now and then.

Not going 'circular' on you, just thinking out loud.

[Erie Warrior]

Time to Pony up with the answer to the question you were asked yesterday.

Who in the fourth round should they have taken instead of Viekune


SoulDawg

Up thread:

36th- Never hidden my man love for Rey, so that's my pick. If not him, why not go Sintim or E. Brown as a pass rusher/ OLB?

50th- Still need a WR, Pat Turner. Better than either Robiskie or Massoqui. I would have gone RB with Greene or McCoy

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

For my money, I go Malauga/ Sintim, Turner, McCoy.

[rebelwithoutaclue]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

[Danny Tanner]

I could not agree more with teh Warrior. Just because we needed to add some depth to the WR core does not mean you reach to fill the position. They should have taken the best available players with those 2nd round pick. Rey, Mccoy, and I have no doubt the kid from Hawaii and both WR would have still been there with the 3rd second rounder. Who cares if the two WR we got would have been taken. I have no doubt in my mind if we passed up Robo and Masso no one would think twice about saying man why did we pass these guys up to take Rey and Mccoy, if you can honestly say that you would have you are fooling yourself. Everyone is so high on these two WR we drafted is because we are stuck with them now and of course they are Browns now and I hope they pan out but I will always be looking at the guys we pased up to take them and think what might have been.

[pup]

I could not agree more with teh Warrior. Just because we needed to add some depth to the WR core does not mean you reach to fill the position. They should have taken the best available players with those 2nd round pick. Rey, Mccoy, and I have no doubt the kid from Hawaii and both WR would have still been there with the 3rd seconder. Who cares if the two WR we got would have been taken. I have no doubt in my mind if we passed up Robo and Masso no one would think twice about saying man why did we pass these guys up to take Rey and Mccoy, if you can honestly say that you would have you are fooling yourself. Everyone is so high on these two WR we drafted is because we are stuck with them now and of course they are Browns now and I hope they pan out but I will always be looking at the guys we pased up to take them and think what might have been.

Here is the part you are missing:

If Rey was there at 52, they would not have taken him. They do not like him as a linebacker. Why? I don't know. I did, but who the hell am I?

And yes, one of the three guys may have been an option at 52. But they wanted ALL THREE.

[rebelwithoutaclue]

Rey, Mccoy, and I have no doubt the kid from Hawaii and both WR would have still been there with the 3rd seconder.

Aside from the point that Rey was picked right after our FIRST 2nd-rounder, you and everyone else need to quit saying that "I have no doubt _________ would still be around." Just stop, OK Miss Cleo?

[Ziner]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

[rebelwithoutaclue]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

My post was more to the point of, as most in this thread have been, you can't predict the future. I was trying to sensationalize it to get the point across but you're right, I'm sorry. Carry on with your useless predictions of who MIGHT have been there on a draft 4 days ago and whether or not we might have picked them if they were or were not there.

[bw]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

[Erie Warrior]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Between 50 and 52 was Buffalo- orginally I've heard the 'boys wanted him, but it's not unreasonable to think he would have fallen to 52. I think the Bills may have a handle on WR.

Prior to 50 Massoqui was on the board, no one took him. Robiskie probably would have been take before 50 or 52, Massoqui would not have.

Stupid? Nice take.

[SoulDawg74]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

SD:

Just to follow up because EW still hasn't told us who was better in the fourth round than Viekune let alone explained how we're gonna have a passing game with no receivers.

The Browns camoflauging their intent to snag wideouts was like hiding in plain sight.

We traded our best hands TE lost Joe Viscious to injury and will soon see Stallworth doing the perp walk on his way to a long vacation at the grey bar hotel.

Which left us with one countem one NFL caliber starting receiver and that moron was a mess last year.

A cluelss fucking Joke blaming his dropped passes sorry route running and chickenshit heart on the fans not liking him because he's from Meatchicken.

ROBO is the only NFL ready receiver out of this draft that could realistically expected to produce immediate dividends after being plugged into that gaping maw that was left with the departure of the Viscious one.

Massy has true slot moves executes out of breaks
with more straight line speed than Edwards who gets caught from behind on bombs.

Beats the shit outta the smurfs we got in the slot now with Patton and Steptoe with the caveat the kid has the skill set to possibly develop into a true number one receiver should Maylon continue her panty waist ways .

Unlike last year we can now deploy a true three wide out look and actually make defensive backs sweat.

The Browns didn't take chances on one guy being enough they took two so beret of talent was our passing game last year , it was that important to make sure that problem was addressed.

and

as anemaic as our pass rush was last year they obviously identified the threat of not having decent receivers for your QB as a bigger problem.

BTW anybody got the dope on KING KONG.

The Jackson State product had 24 sacks stands 6'3" tall and weighs 270 lbs and their projecting him as an additional edge rusher.


SoulDawg

[jb]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

Got links? A link?

Because I couldn't find one w/ any cred that had him < 32 .

All I saw had him at about a mid 2nd. Even Shram, a big fan, didn't say he was a 1st rounder.

4.6 ers don't go in round one unles they are > 6 ' 4" or so.

I don't hate the pick, but as you pointed out to me, let's stay on the fact keel.

[e0y2e3]

During the draft Mayock on the NFLN said that the Giants were seriously considering Robiskie with their first rounder. He said it could easily be him or Nicks. They went with Nicks.

[SoulDawg74]

52nd- McCoy and Greene still on the board, as I would bet Massoqui and maybe Robiskie would be (no other WRs taken during that stretch)

I'm sorry but this might be the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. No other WR's were taken in that stretch? No shit, the only 2 expected to go in that stretch, the ones we took, were already gone. To suppose that they'd still be there is as laughable now as it is the first time you said (wrote, whatever) it.

Really it is that stupid??? so Massaquoi was actually picked at 50 and you are saying it is stupid that he would be there at 52. Now thats stupid.

Additionally I dont think it is off the charts unreasonable that Robiskie would still be there too. It was only 18 picks after he went. While it wasnt completely unreasonable that Robiskie was taken at 36, who would have been stunned if he dropped to 52... not me.

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

Got links? A link?

Because I couldn't find one w/ any cred that had him < 32 .

All I saw had him at about a mid 2nd. Even Shram, a big fan, didn't say he was a 1st rounder.

4.6 ers don't go in round one unles they are > 6 ' 4" or so.

I don't hate the pick, but as you pointed out to me, let's stay on the fact keel.

SD:

nitpickin and graspin at straws beret of the reality of the situation is for Bitches JB .

Cmon man your a better than that.

So if a guy is projected a mid second rounder and 6 coutem 6 wideouts went in the first round and you don't have that projected mid second round pick which was projected outta somebodies ass not in the real time sequence of events leading upto that pick .

You gonna slap em a cross the knuckles for getting him when they could with the pick they had in hand , really doesn't make a fuck of a lot of sense.

Did we fill a big need with a capable prospect or didn't we.

Quick whats the difference between 6'3" and six foot four.



Yeah , I thought so

SoulDawg

[peeker643]

This is officially the greatest thread ever.

[jb]

During the draft Mayock on the NFLN said that the Giants were seriously considering Robiskie with their first rounder. He said it could easily be him or Nicks. They went with Nicks.

Did he then have to apologize to Nicks?



I'll take it. Just sayin' I hadn't seen it.

[jb]

Quick whats the difference between 6'3" and six foot four.

is it.... the length of yer cock?

There, NOW it's the greatest thread ever.

I edited an added that in case anyone thinks I'm not just messing with yah.

2

Browns' reached for need. Period. You know I'm right. Ur tellin me I'm right. They had other needs, too. They are a 4 win team. But they reached a lil for a WR. Not as much as for the next wide out and project, so I ain't bitching about 'biskie. Just callin a reach a reach like water is wet. And you reply sayin "yeah". We'll all find out if that was the way to do soon nuff.

I don't hat ethe 'biksie pick. Just calling him a small reach at 2nd 5, and he would have been a bigger reach for the Gints as he doesn't have deep NFL speed, and no where on any reputable projectrion did I see biskie in round one..

[SoulDawg74]

bw

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

JB.

Got links? A link?

Because I couldn't find one w/ any cred that had him < 32 .

All I saw had him at about a mid 2nd. Even Shram, a big fan, didn't say he was a 1st rounder.

4.6 ers don't go in round one unles they are > 6 ' 4" or so.

I don't hate the pick, but as you pointed out to me, let's stay on the fact keel.

SD:

nitpickin and graspin at straws beret of the reality of the situation is for Bitches JB .

Cmon man your a better than that.

So if a guy is projected a mid second rounder and 6 coutem 6 wideouts went in the first round and you don't have that projected mid second round pick which was projected outta somebodies ass not in the real time sequence of events leading upto that pick .

You gonna slap em a cross the knuckles for getting him when they could with the pick they had in hand , really doesn't make a fuck of a lot of sense.

Did we fill a big need with a capable prospect or didn't we.

Quick whats the difference between 6'3" and six foot four.

JB>

is it.... yer cock?

SD:

Nooooooo, but thanks fer askin.

I would give ya "THEE" answer since you can't figuire it out , Butt EW will start ballin and snifflin again if i bust out with some more your momma smak.

Btw did ya ask me to be smart or was you fishin like Braylon askin that DB if he liked modeling and thangs.

JB>

There, NOW it's the greatest thread ever.

SD:

Indeed...it just might have some possibilities.

JB>

Browns' reached for need. Period. You know I'm right. We'll all find out if that was the way to do soon nuff.

SD:

Didn't say they didn't , but the draft is to better yourself , not some NENTENDO kids game , where you draft a higher rated punter when you need somebody , anybody to Catch the fuckin Football.

BTW theres a link outta Chi town that Angelo
a former Youngstowner and the Bears GM would have taken Robo at 49, but who says Jacksonville doesn't snag him sooner three spots after us with their known problems at that spot .

Again i ask ya, did we fill a hole at a dire position of true need with a capable performer or what.

If we didn't then you got a point .


SoulDawg

[SoulDawg74]

bw

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

JB.

Got links? A link?

Because I couldn't find one w/ any cred that had him < 32 .

All I saw had him at about a mid 2nd. Even Shram, a big fan, didn't say he was a 1st rounder.

4.6 ers don't go in round one unles they are > 6 ' 4" or so.

I don't hate the pick, but as you pointed out to me, let's stay on the fact keel.

SD:

nitpickin and graspin at straws beret of the reality of the situation is for Bitches JB .

Cmon man your a better than that.

So if a guy is projected a mid second rounder and 6 coutem 6 wideouts went in the first round and you don't have that projected mid second round pick which was projected outta somebodies ass not in the real time sequence of events leading upto that pick .

You gonna slap em a cross the knuckles for getting him when they could with the pick they had in hand , really doesn't make a fuck of a lot of sense.

Did we fill a big need with a capable prospect or didn't we.

Quick whats the difference between 6'3" and six foot four.

JB>

is it.... yer cock?

SD:

Nooooooo, but thanks fer askin.

I would give ya "THEE" answer since you can't figuire it out , Butt EW will start ballin and snifflin again if i bust out with some more your momma smak.

Btw did ya ask me to be smart or was you fishin like Braylon askin that DB if he liked modeling and thangs.

JB>

There, NOW it's the greatest thread ever.

SD:

Indeed...it just might have some possibilities.

JB>

Browns' reached for need. Period. You know I'm right. We'll all find out if that was the way to do soon nuff.

SD:

Didn't say they didn't , but the draft is to better yourself , not some NENTENDO kids game , where you draft a higher rated punter when you need somebody , anybody to Catch the fuckin Football.

BTW theres a link outta Chi town that Angelo
a former Youngstowner and the Bears GM would have taken Robo at 49, but who says Jacksonville doesn't snag him sooner three spots after us with their known problems at that spot .

Again i ask ya, did we fill a hole at a dire position of true need with a capable performer or what.

If we didn't then you got a point .


SoulDawg

[jb]

bw

I would. Robiskie was THE most NFL ready WR in the Draft. No doubt about it. At all. And WR is the most difficult position to learn in the NFL next to QB.

And Dallas went apoplectic after we took Massaquoi. It's well known that was the only pick they were interested in of 2nd half of the 2nd round. That's why they traded out.

And most draft boards had Robiskie as 1st round material.

JB.

Got links? A link?

Because I couldn't find one w/ any cred that had him < 32 .

All I saw had him at about a mid 2nd. Even Shram, a big fan, didn't say he was a 1st rounder.

4.6 ers don't go in round one unles they are > 6 ' 4" or so.

I don't hate the pick, but as you pointed out to me, let's stay on the fact keel.

SD:

nitpickin and graspin at straws beret of the reality of the situation is for Bitches JB .

Cmon man your a better than that.

So if a guy is projected a mid second rounder and 6 coutem 6 wideouts went in the first round and you don't have that projected mid second round pick which was projected outta somebodies ass not in the real time sequence of events leading upto that pick .

You gonna slap em a cross the knuckles for getting him when they could with the pick they had in hand , really doesn't make a fuck of a lot of sense.

Did we fill a big need with a capable prospect or didn't we.

Quick whats the difference between 6'3" and six foot four.

JB>

is it.... yer cock?

SD:

Nooooooo, but thanks fer askin.

I would give ya "THEE" answer since you can't figuire it out , Butt EW will start ballin and snifflin again if i bust out with some more your momma smak.

Btw did ya ask me to be smart or was you fishin like Braylon askin that DB if he liked modeling and thangs.

JB>

There, NOW it's the greatest thread ever.

SD:

Indeed...it just might have some possibilities.

JB>

Browns' reached for need. Period. You know I'm right. We'll all find out if that was the way to do soon nuff.

SD:

Didn't say they didn't , but the draft is to better yourself , not some NENTENDO kids game , where you draft a higher rated punter when you need somebody , anybody to Catch the fuckin Football.

BTW theres a link outta Chi town that Angelo
a former Youngstowner and the Bears GM would have taken Robo at 49, but who says Jacksonville doesn't snag him sooner three spots after us with their known problems at that spot .

Again i ask ya, did we fill a hole at a dire position of true need with a capable performer or what.

If we didn't then you got a point .


SoulDawg

Yeah - So'd Al Davis with Bey.

More to it than yer question. That is the point.

[peeker643]

No more quotes for a while gentlemen.

I just tried to read who wrote what, vomited and then threw up again after taking some other stuff to stop my spins.


NO MORE QUOTES PLEASE

Shouldn't be like the Olympics with an increased degree of difficulty just to read as the event goes on.

[Ziner]

Peek>

NO MORE QUOTES PLEASE

Shouldn't be like the Olympics with an increased degree of difficulty just to read as the event goes on.

Ziner:

Wouldnt be so hard to read it, if some people could learn how to use a message board

Ziner

[peeker643]

Peek>

NO MORE QUOTES PLEASE

Shouldn't be like the Olympics with an increased degree of difficulty just to read as the event goes on.

Ziner:

Wouldnt be so hard to read it, if some people could learn how to use a message board

Ziner

It just keeps getting better.

[bw]

Hey, SD!?! Hit JB with the 'Water Buffalo' thingie but don't let him know I put you up to it. I'm on thin ice around here as it is.

[jfiling]

Peek>

NO MORE QUOTES PLEASE

Shouldn't be like the Olympics with an increased degree of difficulty just to read as the event goes on.

Ziner:

Wouldnt be so hard to read it, if some people could learn how to use a message board

Ziner

Well played, sir. I'm amazed how some of the people who quote the most here can't figure out how to do it properly.

[SoulDawg74]

>>>>>>SNIP<<<<<<

JB>

Browns' reached for need. Period. You know I'm right. We'll all find out if that was the way to do soon nuff.

SD:

Didn't say they didn't , but the draft is to better yourself , not some NENTENDO kids game , where you draft a higher rated punter when you need somebody , anybody to Catch the fuckin Football.

BTW theres a link outta Chi town that Angelo
a former Youngstowner and the Bears GM would have taken Robo at 49, but who says Jacksonville doesn't snag him sooner three spots after us with their known problems at that spot .

Again i ask ya, did we fill a hole at a dire position of true need with a capable performer or what.

If we didn't then you got a point .

JB>


Yeah - So'd Al Davis with Bey.

More to it than yer question. That is the point.

SD:

One has naught to do with the other , I'm not as quick to condemn Davis for this pick as the National
Raiduh hatin pundits.

Bey had extenuating circumstances with his QB's and that offense in College and this is about picking guys who translate to the Pro game.

Bey was a gamble in some peoples minds JB
at that spot butt he was still a first round projection , but look at it from Al Davi's perspective.

No other receiver had his size to speed ratio, and Crabtree had a busted foot and no reliable forty time , a double negative for a team looking for a deep threat BIG BODIED weapon for a QB who can throw the ball from one endzone to the other.

You can make the point maybe he could have gotten him after trading down but with 6 to 8 receivers projected as first round picks in real time why would you take that chance "IF" this was the wideout you most coveted.

Further who was gonna trade with Al with his record for Rape and pillaging other teams .

You want to talk about reaches look at Pat White
going in the second too the Dulphins when others had him pegged as a fourth round QB prospect.

The Dulphins had him rated all along as a second round talent so go figuire.

Lot of difference between Al reaching as you claim at 7 , vs the Browns picking up somebody at 36 instead of gambling and waiting until #50.

At seven if you miss , its gonna cost ya 15 to 20 million in guaranteed jack .

The difference between 36 and 50 is about 2 million on the total life of the contract if that .

Further with six receivers gone and Robo being the next on deck how are you reaching with ROBO rated as a second round pick and you pick him in the second.

IMO they were targeting Beanie wells or Robo with their second and may have been fielding calls trying to move back up to get Wells when he got snagged, so they sure as hell weren't gonna gamble on Robo being there at 50 or take a chance and move below Jacksonville at 39 and expect he'd still be there.

With Mualaga still there when we picked ROBO, I just new we were gonna grab him and then make a play for Robo or a receiver later , but I'm cool with how it turned out after analysing why they did what they did and with seeing the pickup of VieKune ,who has it all over Rey in developing as a three down OLB.

Better size more strength a bonafide pass rushing move and the athleticism and speed to play the pass.

Would have loved to net RAY or Beanie and still like the pickup of Robo just as well since they still addressed linebacker with two draft picks.

Gotta like the 6th round pick running back , perfect example of a kid getting screwed with the coach getting fired and the ""O"line imploding , kinda like judging Bey the Raiders pick with the Collegiate version of Ken Dorsey tossing him the ball his senior year.

SoulDawg

[SoulDawg74]

Hey, SD!?! Hit JB with the 'Water Buffalo' thingie but don't let him know I put you up to it. I'm on thin ice around here as it is.

SD:

bw that would be a low blow , almost like date rape or something.

I'm sure he doesn't want to be reminded for penning the dumbest ass post in the history of sport.

Yeah your all wet SoulDawg for pimpin ,

Ben Rottenberger , he's just Scott Mitchell redux .

Naw , i wouldn't even do that to an asshole like EW
or was that Ziner , without identifying marks can't tell one Bung from the other..


SoulDawg

[jb]

Hey, SD!?! Hit JB with the 'Water Buffalo' thingie but don't let him know I put you up to it. I'm on thin ice around here as it is.

SD:

bw that would be a low blow , almost like date rape or something.

I'm sure he doesn't want to be reminded for penning the dumbest ass post in the history of sport.

Yeah your all wet SoulDawg for pimpin ,

Ben Rottenberger , he's just Scott Mitchell redux .

Naw , i wouldn't even do that to an asshole like EW
or was that Ziner , without identifying marks can't tell one Bung from the other..


SoulDawg

For one a yous, Kelly Unitas.

For the other, Obama's popularity ratings, April's consumer confidence polls, and the repeated use in the media of "beginnig global economic recovery".

[bw]

For the other, Obama's popularity ratings, April's consumer confidence polls, and the repeated use in the media of "beginnig global economic recovery".

[SoulDawg74]

]

SD:

bw that would be a low blow , almost like date rape or something.

I'm sure he doesn't want to be reminded for penning the dumbest ass post in the history of sport.

Yeah your all wet SoulDawg for pimpin ,

Ben Rottenberger , he's just Scott Mitchell redux .

Naw , i wouldn't even do that to an asshole like EW
or was that Ziner , without identifying marks can't tell one Bung from the other..

For one a yous, Kelly Unitas.

For the other, Obama's popularity ratings, April's consumer confidence polls, and the repeated use in the media of "beginnig global economic recovery".

SD:

Duh didn't Kelly whip your boys ass in the school yard just like in predicted he would .

Wasn't that the same hero who was cryin like Miss Maylon when kelley took his place and showed what an offense looked like with a real QB in that Bmore game

and how'd that advice you gave us to pass on Rottenberger turn out.

and

Puhlease don't show us how dumb you are expecting Obama to fix soimething in 100 days that Dubya fucked up for 8 years.

Yeah thats fair .

Five dollar a gallon gas killed the golden goose, and the Bushes are Exxon whores.

Now smoke that while you ride on that water Buffalo

SoulDawg

[jb]

Puhlease don't show us how dumb you are expecting Obama to fix soimething in 100 days that Dubya fucked up for 8 years.

Yeah thats fair .

Five dollar a gallon gas killed the golden goose, and the Bushes are Exxon whores.

Don't sing at me. Go talk at yer geriatric buddy Rod Smart in No Holds Barred. U'd have some fun there. Said that, I wanna leave the pol outta here after I strayed in. My bad.