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Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

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Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby skatingtripods » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:22 pm

Clifton's agent, Darek Braunecker, had this to say:

"If they want to discuss it, we're open to the discussion," said Darek Braunecker, Lee's agent. "That ball's in their court, in that regard."


http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd ... Id=rss_cle


With that in mind, this opens up some discussion. Do you actually negotiate an extension coming off a career year that he will probably never repeat? Which Cliff Lee are we most likely to see, '05 and '08 or '06 and '07? Are we sold on him being an ace of this staff, and will he settle for a 4 year deal at age 32?
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby carnegie44115 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:27 pm

Had this in another post,

Yeah I saw that as well, not sure how I feel about it though, I mean obviously it would be great to sign Lee to an extension, I know on the open market Lee would command a good amount, but I don't think Lee worries as much about that, he doesn't strike me as that kind of a guy. I say we could tear up his current contract and give him a 4 yr/$48 M contract starting in 2009. Problem is we would need to find more money and more space to sign him since he is only getting paid 5.75 this year. The Indians would need to unload guys like Masa and Dellucci unless there was some extra cash Dolan has stashed to put into something that is important like keeping our Ace.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:28 pm

Tough call. I was wondering when this would happen since they re-upped Fausto so quickly. I'd be tempted to let him walk. No way do I see a 4 year, 45 million type thing. I think it's safe to say that Shapiro's Sooper Compooter would poo-poo that idea. Isn't it?
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:34 pm

The problem with extending Lee is that Lee and agent will want an extension based on his 2008 season whilst the Indians will be looking for something more towards his body of work level.

I guess he'll be looking for a Haren type extension, not that he'll get it - but that's looking at $12m+ per season.

What the Indians sort of have to their advantage is the opportunity to add money to Lee's $5.75m deal in 2009 and his $9m option for '10. I guess the Indians would need to add at least another 2 years onto that (signing Lee through age 34) to get him to sign.

If I had to guess what it would take: -

2009 - $8m
2010 - $11m
2011 - $12m
2012 - $12m

So, that's a 2 year $28.25m extension..... seems about right to me..... although maybe too rich for the Indians blood.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby consigliere » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:44 pm

Would be absolutely silly to extend him right now. Just too up and down the last two years. We need to see him for half a season this year to gauge which version of Lee he is, 2007 or 2008. A year ago at this time he was an overpaid bum for crying out loud.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby skatingtripods » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:47 pm

Consigliere wrote:Would be absolutely silly to extend him right now. Just too up and down the last two years. We need to see him for half a season this year to gauge which version of Lee he is, 2007 or 2008. A year ago at this time he was an overpaid bum for crying out loud.


To play devil's advocate, if he goes out and puts up an 18-7 with a 3.20, then he's completely unreachable after we activate his option for 2010.

That said, I agree with you. I wouldn't extend him right now and I don't know why the question was even brought up at this point in time. I just figured it could make for good discussion.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby carnegie44115 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:51 pm

Consigliere wrote:Would be absolutely silly to extend him right now. Just too up and down the last two years. We need to see him for half a season this year to gauge which version of Lee he is, 2007 or 2008. A year ago at this time he was an overpaid bum for crying out loud.



Yeah I would definitely have to agree with Tony here after thinking a little more about it, I still think we could afford to wait until next year when his option comes up and when the Indians have dumped some more salary, i.e. Masa K, Dellucci, and Betancourt. If they can't come to an agreement, then pick up his option and hope for the best, and also I guess with the pipeline of talent coming after 2010, would we really need Lee or Westbrook?

A 2011 rotation could look like, of course barring any trades or injuries,

Fausto
Huff
Laffey
Reyes
Rondon
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby 1Perry » Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:33 pm

"If they want to discuss it, we're open to the discussion,"


Nothing wrong with discussing it.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby WarAdmiral » Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:33 pm

carnegie44115 wrote:[

A 2011 rotation could look like, of course barring any trades or injuries, or sore arm, has been signings.

Fausto
Huff
Laffey
Reyes
Rondon


I had to add to your post, hope you didn't mind :cheers:
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby exiledbuckeye » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:21 pm

carnegie44115 wrote:Had this in another post,

Yeah I saw that as well, not sure how I feel about it though, I mean obviously it would be great to sign Lee to an extension, I know on the open market Lee would command a good amount, but I don't think Lee worries as much about that, he doesn't strike me as that kind of a guy. I say we could tear up his current contract and give him a 4 yr/$48 M contract starting in 2009. Problem is we would need to find more money and more space to sign him since he is only getting paid 5.75 this year. The Indians would need to unload guys like Masa and Dellucci unless there was some extra cash Dolan has stashed to put into something that is important like keeping our Ace.


4/48 for the reigning Cy Young winner? I think you start at 4/60 or they laugh their way out of the room. Carlos freaking Silva got a 4/48 last year, for crying out loud.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby carnegie44115 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:47 pm

exiledbuckeye wrote:
carnegie44115 wrote:Had this in another post,

Yeah I saw that as well, not sure how I feel about it though, I mean obviously it would be great to sign Lee to an extension, I know on the open market Lee would command a good amount, but I don't think Lee worries as much about that, he doesn't strike me as that kind of a guy. I say we could tear up his current contract and give him a 4 yr/$48 M contract starting in 2009. Problem is we would need to find more money and more space to sign him since he is only getting paid 5.75 this year. The Indians would need to unload guys like Masa and Dellucci unless there was some extra cash Dolan has stashed to put into something that is important like keeping our Ace.


4/48 for the reigning Cy Young winner? I think you start at 4/60 or they laugh their way out of the room. Carlos freaking Silva got a 4/48 last year, for crying out loud.



This is for a Cy Young winner yes, but one great year out of middle of the road years and one god awful year. Plus he loves playing for Cleveland, yes I know CC says he did too, but come on really can you not tell those two are two different guys, wouldn't you like to make 12M this year instead of 5.75?
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby ole uncle charle » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:57 pm

Baseball is in a sad, sad place. If we wait until after this season and our #1 SP wins 18+ games (which we will need to contend) we cant afford to resign him. If he goes 12-10 there is no way we make the playoffs but at lesat we will be able to resign a pitcher we really dont want.

Sounds like a good ol' Cleveland win, win to me!
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby carnegie44115 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:25 pm

ole uncle charle wrote:Baseball is in a sad, sad place. If we wait until after this season and our #1 SP wins 18+ games (which we will need to contend) we cant afford to resign him. If he goes 12-10 there is no way we make the playoffs but at lesat we will be able to resign a pitcher we really dont want.

Sounds like a good ol' Cleveland win, win to me!



After this season its a lock even if he wins the Cy again courtesy of a $9 M team option.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby MTF » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:38 pm

exiledbuckeye wrote:
4/48 for the reigning Cy Young winner? I think you start at 4/60 or they laugh their way out of the room. Carlos freaking Silva got a 4/48 last year, for crying out loud.


He's 30 now, and he'll be 32 after the 2010 season (when his current deal is done). I don't know how many 32 year old pitchers get 4 year extensions, taking him through age 36 (and the 2014 season), but I'd guess not very many. Have the Shapiro-era Indians ever given out that long a deal to a pitcher? I don't think so.

If he were to take a shorter deal, like maybe a two year extension, and fatten up the money he gets in 2009 and 2010 instead of looking to get a long extension, I'd be more interested. Of course, Shapiro might have different ideas and you can absolutely be sure that Lee does.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby carnegie44115 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:45 pm

MTF wrote:
exiledbuckeye wrote:
4/48 for the reigning Cy Young winner? I think you start at 4/60 or they laugh their way out of the room. Carlos freaking Silva got a 4/48 last year, for crying out loud.


He's 30 now, and he'll be 32 after the 2010 season (when his current deal is done). I don't know how many 32 year old pitchers get 4 year extensions, taking him through age 36 (and the 2014 season), but I'd guess not very many. Have the Shapiro-era Indians ever given out that long a deal to a pitcher? I don't think so.

If he were to take a shorter deal, like maybe a two year extension, and fatten up the money he gets in 2009 and 2010 instead of looking to get a long extension, I'd be more interested. Of course, Shapiro might have different ideas and you can absolutely be sure that Lee does.


MTF, I would like to point out that the 4/48 deal came from my original post, where I was stating it would tear up his current contact and start in 2009 when he is still 30. Not sure if exiledbuckeye was thinking that, but I am assuming that as well.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby MTF » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:48 pm

Thanks for clearing that up, and if that's the deal then I'd be more interested.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby Toxicadam » Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:03 pm

Sorry .. a pitcher like Cliff Lee (older than 28 and Cy Young winner) you flip for more prospects at mid-season (of his FA season).

It's the only way our franchise can remain a winner going into the future.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby dazindiansfanuk » Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:38 am

Looks like Shapiro and Co are going to try and get an extension done now if Ownership gives the go-ahead.

"At this point it doesn't do any good to talk about guys specifically. We are just to the point now where we'd shift focus and identify players we'd look at concerning talk long term or extension scenarios. The first step would be to evaluate that, the second step would be to put some value to that, the third step would be to take it to ownership and propose that. Once we go through all that, we'd take it to the player.

"We're going to walk through that process in the next two weeks. If we get to that point where ownership says yes, we'd try to do it now."


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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby slegend » Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:14 am

Now that we are entering the Great Depression Part II and Cleveland migrates closer and closer to a ghost town... The odds are better that Cleveland files for bankrupcy and sells off its players in a court settlement versus re-signing Cliff Lee to a new contract.

Any player would be open to a contract discussion. But throw out some legit numbers:

Minimum Salary: $15M [Perhaps Lee is the one to finally give a hometown discount, which would be the first]
Maximum Salary: $18M [Likely market value]

His agent will point to years 05, 06, 08 and claim that Lee is an elite pitcher. The agent will toss out the 07 season "lost due to pitching with injuries"....

You want to sign Cliff Lee to a new contract? He "might" accept the following:

2009: Raise his salary to $14M, add 5 seasons at $16M
2010-11-12-13-14: $16M

We are not signing players for nearly $100M and 6 years guaranteed... We would not be that for Sabathia, Manny, Thome or Babe Ruth if he returned to earth in his prime...

We signed our type of veteran to an extension - the deal handed to Westbrook to be a solid "MOR" starter for several years...

We have to match Cliff Lee's market value with the extension, and I think 6 seasons and probably $17M per is that value... The smallest number would be 4 seasons and probably $16M per season....
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby jameseboy » Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:44 am

Should have extended him last season..can you imagine the grief on the boards if that had happened. lol..
Buy low sell high..wrong time to extend Lee.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby tribefan333 » Sat Feb 07, 2009 12:19 pm

The Cleveland Indians are NOT - NOT - NOT - NOT - resigning Cliff Lee to a major deal, say around 15 million, one year removed from getting booed off the field and then winning the Cy Young.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby Stu » Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:10 pm

slegend wrote:Minimum Salary: $15M [Perhaps Lee is the one to finally give a hometown discount, which would be the first]


Jake's contract was certainly under fair market value.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby Commodore Perry » Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:10 pm

We've still got Lee for 2 more years. Why negotiate now after was the best season of his career? Talk to him after next season, when his stats come back down to earth again.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby bookelly » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:14 am

Man are we quick to crap on the guy who just won the Cy Young on these boards. Maybe the guy really can pitch. At least talk to him about an extension, and see what he's looking for.
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Re: Lee Open To Contract Extension Talks

Unread postby Commodore Perry » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:33 pm

There's no problem just talking about extending him... in a perfect world.

Maybe it will all work out, and maybe everyone will be professional about it.

But here is my concern:

Cliff Lee: I want $X over X years.

Shap: We're not paying you that.

Lee: I won the Cy Young last year.

Shap: You sucked the year before (but in Shap speak).

Lee: Well now I'm a headcase again. The chip on my shoulder is back.


Like I said, worse case. But that's my concern. Contract talk can just screw up a players concentration. And again, we have him for TWO more years. There's no urgency.
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