OSU vs. Wisconsin

[JCoz]

For all the crap that went down, we had em within 3 and a third and 5. Checkwa got turned around like Snooky in the sack for the first down and Wisky got a breath of confidence back.

That play was a crippling conversion. Indeed my thoughts on whether these CB's are good enough have changed in the last couple weeks.

[furls]

This team was constructed to stop the spread. It is essentially a 3-3-5 or at best a 3.5-3-4.5 if you want to count the hybrids as 1/2. These guys were just not ready to get punched in the face like that.

I think we may have forgotten that we have to win our conference (undefeated) to play for a title. That means that we have to be able to body up with the big boys in Wiscy and Iowa. All is not lost, the Bucks can win the conference they just need Iowa to knock off MSU, then the Bucks need to win out.

The problem with the team as I see it, is that they just don't have the skill players to compete right now. The defense adjusted and played pretty well in the second half, granted they had to sell out to stop the run, but teams do that all the time. The Buckeyes really have NO playmakers on offense. No ONE. Not one Buckeye skill position player is a guy that would play first string on the B10 all star team. NOT ONE.

[JCoz]

This team was constructed to stop the spread. It is essentially a 3-3-5 or at best a 3.5-3-4.5 if you want to count the hybrids as 1/2. These guys were just not ready to get punched in the face like that.

I think we may have forgotten that we have to win our conference (undefeated) to play for a title. That means that we have to be able to body up with the big boys in Wiscy and Iowa. All is not lost, the Bucks can win the conference they just need Iowa to knock off MSU, then the Bucks need to win out.

The problem with the team as I see it, is that they just don't have the skill players to compete right now. The defense adjusted and played pretty well in the second half, granted they had to sell out to stop the run, but teams do that all the time. The Buckeyes really have NO playmakers on offense. No ONE. Not one Buckeye skill position player is a guy that would play first string on the B10 all star team. NOT ONE.

Are we talking besides Pryor?

I don't think this is a skill position issue. Are they below what you'd like to see? yeah, definitely, but the offense as a whole is plenty good enough to get the job done.

ST's has been hurting us badly all season. If we had even average ST's the opinion on the bucks would be allot different.

Defense and ST's killed us Saturday.

You can't go down 21-0 in the first 15 minutes, give up 31 points on the road at night at Wisconsin and point to the skill positions on offense and say that's what is missing. No, I think the offense performed admirably at times.

This offense was plenty good enough for a team with a defense as good as this one. Problem was that they weren't ready for Wisconsin's style, when they sobered up after the blitzkrieg wiscy attacked them with, UW didn't score again for about 35 minutes.

Injuries hurt us badly in the stake in the heart 4th q Wisconsin drive. Newsome was taken advantage of a couple of times for big first downs.

I'm telling you, this team wasn't exposed for having fatal flaws other than the injuries and ST's.

I think this team is truly NC caliber (not perfect, but this isnt a perfect year in college) but for crucial injuries and historically bad ST's.

I really think that though our WR's and RB's are not all-stars, its more than enough to be a very good offense.

I think you'll see a big recovery and the bucks will roll into Iowa with a head of steam. Season is full of ups and downs.

I feel bad for Purdue this weekend.

[furls]

I'm telling you, this team wasn't exposed for having fatal flaws other than the injuries and ST's.

I think this team is truly NC caliber (not perfect, but this isnt a perfect year in college) but for crucial injuries and historically bad ST's.

I really think that though our WR's and RB's are not all-stars, its more than enough to be a very good offense.

I think you'll see a big recovery and the bucks will roll into Iowa with a head of steam. Season is full of ups and downs.

I feel bad for Purdue this weekend.

This team has plenty of fatal flaws:

1. They cannot get pressure with 4 on any kind of a regular basis. It was masked some early in the season when they were playing church league teams.

2. This defense is not constructed to stop the big eaters at Wiscy. This defense is designed to stop finesse offenses. If Wisconsin had any need to throw the ball, they could have scorched the defense because the only way the Bucks stopped the run was when they sold out to do so by run blitzing off the edge and packing the box. The safety play was fucking atrocious. I guess that falls into your "injury" box as Barnett and Moeller are injured, but since neither of them are coming back this year, I am going to go ahead and call it fatal.

3. The offense, as you said, is good. And I agree that Boom and the WRs are not all-stars, but you show me that last NC team that had such average play from its WRs and RBs? There is not one WR on this team that requires a double team.

4. The STs are abyssmal. That is a fatal flaw. OSU would seriously be better off to just kick every kick off out of bounds, at least against decent teams. As bad as the special teams are; they had nothing to do with Wisconsin running the ball through OSU's 8 man front like it was the Maginot line. That game revealed a lot more than bad special teams, that team revealed that this OSU defense lacks the size and physicality to compete with a power running team without selling out to stop the run.

5. Look, this is not a great OSU team and it is certainly not a NC caliber team. Could they win out in the B10? Sure, but at this point, I have not seen a ton to be optimistic about.

I think a more likely scenario is a 10-2 regular season. I fully expect the Bucks to continue to feast on the Purdues and scUMs, but I am not sure that they get out of Iowa City in one piece. Not a bad team, just not the team that you think (or I thought) it is. Like I said after the Illinois game, maybe 2012 is the year. Hopefully some playmakers emerge.

[FUDU]

Curious as to how you two think OSU matches up against Oregon. The Ducks offense has pretty much the same pieces as it did last year, almost identical production from specific positions.

[furls]

I think OSU's D matches up much better against the Ducks because this team is designed to stop finesse teams. The Ducks definitely are a running team, but it is how they do it that is different. The Ducks spread the field and run the ball, more like DickRod, as opposed to the 3 TE sets you get from Wisconsin.

I don't think the Bucks would completely shut down the ducks but they would definitely play them better defensively than anyone the Ducks have faced as of yet.

[JCoz]

I'm telling you, this team wasn't exposed for having fatal flaws other than the injuries and ST's.

I think this team is truly NC caliber (not perfect, but this isnt a perfect year in college) but for crucial injuries and historically bad ST's.

I really think that though our WR's and RB's are not all-stars, its more than enough to be a very good offense.

I think you'll see a big recovery and the bucks will roll into Iowa with a head of steam. Season is full of ups and downs.

I feel bad for Purdue this weekend.

This team has plenty of fatal flaws:

1. They cannot get pressure with 4 on any kind of a regular basis. It was masked some early in the season when they were playing church league teams.

2. This defense is not constructed to stop the big eaters at Wiscy. This defense is designed to stop finesse offenses. If Wisconsin had any need to throw the ball, they could have scorched the defense because the only way the Bucks stopped the run was when they sold out to do so by run blitzing off the edge and packing the box. The safety play was fucking atrocious. I guess that falls into your "injury" box as Barnett and Moeller are injured, but since neither of them are coming back this year, I am going to go ahead and call it fatal.

3. The offense, as you said, is good. And I agree that Boom and the WRs are not all-stars, but you show me that last NC team that had such average play from its WRs and RBs? There is not one WR on this team that requires a double team.

4. The STs are abyssmal. That is a fatal flaw. OSU would seriously be better off to just kick every kick off out of bounds, at least against decent teams. As bad as the special teams are; they had nothing to do with Wisconsin running the ball through OSU's 8 man front like it was the Maginot line. That game revealed a lot more than bad special teams, that team revealed that this OSU defense lacks the size and physicality to compete with a power running team without selling out to stop the run.

5. Look, this is not a great OSU team and it is certainly not a NC caliber team. Could they win out in the B10? Sure, but at this point, I have not seen a ton to be optimistic about.

I think a more likely scenario is a 10-2 regular season. I fully expect the Bucks to continue to feast on the Purdues and scUMs, but I am not sure that they get out of Iowa City in one piece. Not a bad team, just not the team that you think (or I thought) it is. Like I said after the Illinois game, maybe 2012 is the year. Hopefully some playmakers emerge.

Other than ST's and Injuries, that I said myself Furls.

And I think you are wrong about how good the team is, and not factoring in the landscape of teams this season. The NC scene is fairly weak compared to previous years. It is very much like 2007. And this team is much better than the 07 squad.

This team is allot better than they showed Saturday. But the injuries are really starting to take their toll, both on Defense and ST's. I read that for the Wisconsin game we had 11 contributors to the D and ST's out for the game.

The weight you've placed on last Saturday in you analysis of the team is readily apparent. IMO You've made way too many judgments on the team in general based on the Wisconsin game.

We'll see where the team stacks up at the end of the season. But we'll never be as good as we were at the beginning of the year because of the injuries.

[FUDU]

Other than ST's and Injuries, that I said myself Furls.

And I think you are wrong about how good the team is, and not factoring in the landscape of teams this season. The NC scene is fairly weak compared to previous years. It is very much like 2007. And this team is much better than the 07 squad.

This team is allot better than they showed Saturday. But the injuries are really starting to take their toll, both on Defense and ST's. I read that for the Wisconsin game we had 11 contributors to the D and ST's out for the game.

The weight you've placed on last Saturday in you analysis of the team is readily apparent. IMO You've made way too many judgments on the team in general based on the Wisconsin game.

We'll see where the team stacks up at the end of the season. But we'll never be as good as we were at the beginning of the year because of the injuries.

Are you judging how good the team was early in the season based upon health, or based upon results against garbage opponents?

[jb]

I'm telling you, this team wasn't exposed for having fatal flaws other than the injuries and ST's.

I think this team is truly NC caliber (not perfect, but this isnt a perfect year in college) but for crucial injuries and historically bad ST's.

I really think that though our WR's and RB's are not all-stars, its more than enough to be a very good offense.

I think you'll see a big recovery and the bucks will roll into Iowa with a head of steam. Season is full of ups and downs.

I feel bad for Purdue this weekend.

This team has plenty of fatal flaws:

1. They cannot get pressure with 4 on any kind of a regular basis. It was masked some early in the season when they were playing church league teams.

2. This defense is not constructed to stop the big eaters at Wiscy. This defense is designed to stop finesse offenses. If Wisconsin had any need to throw the ball, they could have scorched the defense because the only way the Bucks stopped the run was when they sold out to do so by run blitzing off the edge and packing the box. The safety play was fucking atrocious. I guess that falls into your "injury" box as Barnett and Moeller are injured, but since neither of them are coming back this year, I am going to go ahead and call it fatal.

3. The offense, as you said, is good. And I agree that Boom and the WRs are not all-stars, but you show me that last NC team that had such average play from its WRs and RBs? There is not one WR on this team that requires a double team.

4. The STs are abyssmal. That is a fatal flaw. OSU would seriously be better off to just kick every kick off out of bounds, at least against decent teams. As bad as the special teams are; they had nothing to do with Wisconsin running the ball through OSU's 8 man front like it was the Maginot line. That game revealed a lot more than bad special teams, that team revealed that this OSU defense lacks the size and physicality to compete with a power running team without selling out to stop the run.

5. Look, this is not a great OSU team and it is certainly not a NC caliber team. Could they win out in the B10? Sure, but at this point, I have not seen a ton to be optimistic about.

I think a more likely scenario is a 10-2 regular season. I fully expect the Bucks to continue to feast on the Purdues and scUMs, but I am not sure that they get out of Iowa City in one piece. Not a bad team, just not the team that you think (or I thought) it is. Like I said after the Illinois game, maybe 2012 is the year. Hopefully some playmakers emerge.

Other than ST's and Injuries, that I said myself Furls.

And I think you are wrong about how good the team is, and not factoring in the landscape of teams this season. The NC scene is fairly weak compared to previous years. It is very much like 2007. And this team is much better than the 07 squad.

This team is allot better than they showed Saturday. But the injuries are really starting to take their toll, both on Defense and ST's. I read that for the Wisconsin game we had 11 contributors to the D and ST's out for the game.

The weight you've placed on last Saturday in you analysis of the team is readily apparent. IMO You've made way too many judgments on the team in general based on the Wisconsin game.

We'll see where the team stacks up at the end of the season. But we'll never be as good as we were at the beginning of the year because of the injuries.

The only injuries the Buckeyes have are a lobotimy and a heart transplant where they forgot to put the new organ in. No head and no heart in big games, esp on the road, for years.

A fantastically overrated bunch talent-wise, however. Furls is spot on.

[JCoz]

The only injuries the Buckeyes have are a lobotimy and a heart transplant where they forgot to put the new organ in. No head and no heart in big games, esp on the road, for years.

A fantastically overrated bunch talent-wise, however. Furls is spot on.

That's completely ridiculous JB.

11 Starters from coverage teams and Defense out at Wisky and they only have figurative injuries? Please.

They aren't overrated in talent unless you've done that rating yourself. The rating is relative.

No head or Heart in big games or road games? I love how the Oregon win now is just another garbage win. Forget how the team was leaving behind scorched earth for months coming into that Rose bowl and most talking heads predicted a run-away victory for the Ducks.

I guess the Rose bowl IS kinda like playing EMU.

Forget the heart the team displayed after the Purdue game last year, grinding teams into a pulp on the ground despite no bell cow back, an average Oline, No threat to pass the ball and a running QB with a torn ligament in his knee.

No Heart.

We also showed no heart against Texas in the Fiesta vs a team many thought should have been in the NC game, with a true Frosh starting QB with a bum throwing shoulder, taking that team to the absolute limit before giving way at the end. Yeah, they really didn't show any heart at all while leaving it out on the field that night.

Furls may be right that this years team isn't good enough for a NC, but you aren't both saying the same thing.

Regardless this is EASILY a top 5 team even with the injuries, so remember that when you decide to toss around shallow, bullshit hyperbole like "fantastically overrated bunch" and "No heart or head".