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Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

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Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:58 pm

Per NFL Network.

And ESPN http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4732205

System sucks when kids work their asses off, get to a BCS game and the coach bails. I don't begrudge Kelly taking the job. Just the timing of it all. And it happens every year.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby jack_tors » Fri Dec 11, 2009 8:05 am

Peeker643 wrote:Per NFL Network.

And ESPN http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4732205

System sucks when kids work their asses off, get to a BCS game and the coach bails. I don't begrudge Kelly taking the job. Just the timing of it all. And it happens every year.


I agree, those kids deserved a fair shot at UF.

Not sure the validity of the source but I heard ESPN reporting Kelly gave Cincy a shot at keeping him by asking that they upgrade their football facilities to match that of other big time programs. They repeatedly declined and that did not sit well with him.. If its true, doesnt make his move right but makes it a little more clear why it happened.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby WiscTribeFan » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:38 am

Read about this in the paper this AM. His UC players are really pissed off about this situation.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby fundamentals » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:43 am

WiscTribeFan wrote:Read about this in the paper this AM. His UC players are really pissed off about this situation.


Heard a soundbyte from Ginyard this a.m. and he was not happy, said college football is a business, nothing more.
"It's all about winning for me, and I think the Cavs are committed to doing that," he said. "But at the same time I've given myself options to this point, and like I said before, me and my team, we have a game plan that we're going to execute, and we'll see what we get."

"We had a great time together."
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:12 am

jack_tors wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:Per NFL Network.

And ESPN http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4732205

System sucks when kids work their asses off, get to a BCS game and the coach bails. I don't begrudge Kelly taking the job. Just the timing of it all. And it happens every year.


I agree, those kids deserved a fair shot at UF.

Not sure the validity of the source but I heard ESPN reporting Kelly gave Cincy a shot at keeping him by asking that they upgrade their football facilities to match that of other big time programs. They repeatedly declined and that did not sit well with him.. If its true, doesnt make his move right but makes it a little more clear why it happened.


I don't blame ND or Kelly and I don't blame the players a bit for being pissed.

The NCAA needs to get a hold of this situation with a moratorium on coaching changes/interviews, etc until after Jan8th. Make it hurt to better be able to stop the innuendo and bullshit. Loss of scholarships to any university in violation, coaches fined, whatever.

Everyone could have gotten what they wanted if the kids mattered at all. It just would have been 3 weeks from now. And the athletes, who can't leave without sitting out a year, wouldn't have gotten fucked in the ear in this way either.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby motherscratcher » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:07 pm

Peeker643 wrote:
jack_tors wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:Per NFL Network.

And ESPN http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4732205

System sucks when kids work their asses off, get to a BCS game and the coach bails. I don't begrudge Kelly taking the job. Just the timing of it all. And it happens every year.


I agree, those kids deserved a fair shot at UF.

Not sure the validity of the source but I heard ESPN reporting Kelly gave Cincy a shot at keeping him by asking that they upgrade their football facilities to match that of other big time programs. They repeatedly declined and that did not sit well with him.. If its true, doesnt make his move right but makes it a little more clear why it happened.


I don't blame ND or Kelly and I don't blame the players a bit for being pissed.

The NCAA needs to get a hold of this situation with a moratorium on coaching changes/interviews, etc until after Jan8th. Make it hurt to better be able to stop the innuendo and bullshit. Loss of scholarships to any university in violation, coaches fined, whatever.

Everyone could have gotten what they wanted if the kids mattered at all. It just would have been 3 weeks from now. And the athletes, who can't leave without sitting out a year, wouldn't have gotten fucked in the ear in this way either.


This exactly. It's ridiculous that these players get left in the lurch for the bowl game. I don't blame them for being pissed.

At the same time you can't blame Kelly for taking the ND job. As much as I hate ND it's a no brainer coaching move.

Anyone else have confidence that the NCAA would institute such a logical policy? I think it will happen right after SD invites Quinn over for dinner.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:04 am

Motherscratcher wrote:At the same time you can't blame Kelly for taking the ND job. As much as I hate ND it's a no brainer coaching move.

... I'll be nice and leave the comment there.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby motherscratcher » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:22 pm

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:
Motherscratcher wrote:At the same time you can't blame Kelly for taking the ND job. As much as I hate ND it's a no brainer coaching move.

... I'll be nice and leave the comment there.


Don't be nice, dude. Tear me a new one if I deserve it. Moving from Cincinnati to Notre Dame isn't a "can't pass up" opportunity for a coach?
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby FUDU » Sun Dec 13, 2009 2:13 pm

I don't think this changes UC's chances at all. The system and playbook is still in place.

It might even be added motivation, who knows they might make a game of it for 45 minutes now due to this.

I personally feel Florida is going to destroy them.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:05 pm

Motherscratcher wrote:Don't be nice, dude. Tear me a new one if I deserve it. Moving from Cincinnati to Notre Dame isn't a "can't pass up" opportunity for a coach?

Nah, nothin' about tearing you a new one.

Cincy to ND is at best a lateral move. The only difference is how much exposure he'll get on NBC.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:45 pm

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:
Motherscratcher wrote:Don't be nice, dude. Tear me a new one if I deserve it. Moving from Cincinnati to Notre Dame isn't a "can't pass up" opportunity for a coach?

Nah, nothin' about tearing you a new one.

Cincy to ND is at best a lateral move. The only difference is how much exposure he'll get on NBC.


You really don't believe this is a lateral move do you?

The major TV contract in itself is a MAJOR deal.

Moving from a conference in which you can run the table and not gt the nod, to being "Notre Dame" as an independant. Huge.

Someone that knows what they are doing can get that program back near the top quickly.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:41 pm

Lead Pipe wrote:
Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:
Motherscratcher wrote:Don't be nice, dude. Tear me a new one if I deserve it. Moving from Cincinnati to Notre Dame isn't a "can't pass up" opportunity for a coach?

Nah, nothin' about tearing you a new one.

Cincy to ND is at best a lateral move. The only difference is how much exposure he'll get on NBC.


You really don't believe this is a lateral move do you?

The major TV contract in itself is a MAJOR deal.

Moving from a conference in which you can run the table and not gt the nod, to being "Notre Dame" as an independant. Huge.

Someone that knows what they are doing can get that program back near the top quickly.


I''l tell ya this, if ND is 13-0 playing the schedule UC played, Texas is MF-ing the whole BCS system.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:46 pm

Exactly.

For political reasons alone, still a G-R-E-A-T job.

Again, they aren't close to a playoff, so getting a job where subjective opinion is a part of the big picture....

No way in holy hell ND isn't playing in the championship game this year, or any year they are unbeaten - I don't care if 8 teams run the table, ND will be in the final two.

It's the way it is.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:06 am

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:Cincy to ND is at best a lateral move. The only difference is how much exposure he'll get on NBC.


That is laughable. You think ND and Cincy are recruiting the same talent?

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/n ... &type=lgns

Weis should be forever thanked for proving that highly sought recruits still want to play in South Bend. His problem wasn’t beating Southern California or Florida for talented high school prospects, even with Notre Dame’s higher academic standards. Indeed, only Florida, Alabama, USC, Tennessee and Ohio State signed more Rivals.com five-star recruits the past four years than Notre Dame.


How many 5-star recruits would even take a visit to Cincy? At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby motherscratcher » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:24 am

Not to mention ND's pockets are probably quite a bit deeper than Cinci's. Does anyone know what his salary is yet? And, what it was at Cincinnati?
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:22 pm

And the whole "God" thing. Always good the have that guy in your corner.

It's BS he left the kids hangin' for the bowl game. Finish it out.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:06 pm

Erie Warrior wrote:And the whole "God" thing. Always good the have that guy in your corner.

It's BS he left the kids hangin' for the bowl game. Finish it out.


Nope. Too much at stake in recruiting over the next month to do this. Put a freeze on recruiting for everyone during this time and you might see a change.

And you juniors, no leaving early for the NFL. Finish it out.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:36 pm

Ziner wrote: At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.


Not exactly. Admission requirements are night and day. Will ND allow Kelly to bend the rules a la Holtz? Maybe. Still, a huge difference between Cincy and ND in terms of class rank and test scores. Huge.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:40 pm

mattvan1 wrote:
Ziner wrote: At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.


Not exactly. Admission requirements are night and day. Will ND allow Kelly to bend the rules a la Holtz? Maybe. Still, a huge difference between Cincy and ND in terms of class rank and test scores. Huge.


True. But there are solid scholar athletes out there currently going to Stanford or Vanderbilt or other such schools because ND is at rock bottom. ND used to lock those cats up before they could 'settle' on other schools.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:43 pm

Pup wrote:
Erie Warrior wrote:And the whole "God" thing. Always good the have that guy in your corner.

It's BS he left the kids hangin' for the bowl game. Finish it out.


Nope. Too much at stake in recruiting over the next month to do this. Put a freeze on recruiting for everyone during this time and you might see a change.

And you juniors, no leaving early for the NFL. Finish it out.


Big difference IMO between finishing out a contract and finishing out a season. I don't think Kelly or any other coach should have to finish out some 7 year deal when another job opens. But finishing out a season that has 4 more weeks to run??

The recruiting thing is legit. It'd have to be addressed.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:43 pm

mattvan1 wrote:
Ziner wrote: At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.


Not exactly. Admission requirements are night and day. Will ND allow Kelly to bend the rules a la Holtz? Maybe. Still, a huge difference between Cincy and ND in terms of class rank and test scores. Huge.


Perhaps you missed this quote.

Weis should be forever thanked for proving that highly sought recruits still want to play in South Bend. His problem wasn’t beating Southern California or Florida for talented high school prospects, even with Notre Dame’s higher academic standards. Indeed, only Florida, Alabama, USC, Tennessee and Ohio State signed more Rivals.com five-star recruits the past four years than Notre Dame.


Can Kelly recruit any kid in the country? No, of course not. However there are still plenty of kids who have the grades to get in to ND that Cincy couldnt touch because of program prestige. How many times have you seen a kid deciding between ND and Cincy, grades or not? If they cant get in to ND most likely they are deciding between the other heavy weights, Cincy is not a heavy weight. ND hasnt been a heavy weight on the field, but they are when it comes to recruiting.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Erie Warrior » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:55 pm

Pup wrote:
Nope. Too much at stake in recruiting over the next month to do this. Put a freeze on recruiting for everyone during this time and you might see a change.

And you juniors, no leaving early for the NFL. Finish it out.


Apples to oranges for players and coaches. Coaches have a job, players are trying to get one. I understand the recruiting aspect, but you know Kelly gave plenty of "finish the job", "do it to the best of your ability, all the time", "no one believes in you but this family" type speeches, so for him to bail before the job is done, to leave his family is hypocritical.

Just business, not personal. But you've got to sell it as personal to get everyone to buy in, to form a team.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:10 pm

Erie Warrior wrote:
Pup wrote:
Nope. Too much at stake in recruiting over the next month to do this. Put a freeze on recruiting for everyone during this time and you might see a change.

And you juniors, no leaving early for the NFL. Finish it out.


Apples to oranges for players and coaches. Coaches have a job, players are trying to get one. I understand the recruiting aspect, but you know Kelly gave plenty of "finish the job", "do it to the best of your ability, all the time", "no one believes in you but this family" type speeches, so for him to bail before the job is done, to leave his family is hypocritical.

Just business, not personal. But you've got to sell it as personal to get everyone to buy in, to form a team.


If playing football at the Division 1 level, in a BCS conference is not a job, I don't know what is.

You think some Notre Dame kid is going to be concerned that Kelly's speeches have less meaning because he didn't finish his job at UC? Because that is the only players he is concerned with.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:11 pm

Erie Warrior wrote:
Pup wrote:
Nope. Too much at stake in recruiting over the next month to do this. Put a freeze on recruiting for everyone during this time and you might see a change.

And you juniors, no leaving early for the NFL. Finish it out.


Apples to oranges for players and coaches. Coaches have a job, players are trying to get one. I understand the recruiting aspect, but you know Kelly gave plenty of "finish the job", "do it to the best of your ability, all the time", "no one believes in you but this family" type speeches, so for him to bail before the job is done, to leave his family is hypocritical.

Just business, not personal. But you've got to sell it as personal to get everyone to buy in, to form a team.


Don't hate the playa, hate the game.

Once hired, Kelly owes it as much to his new team to recruit and keep recruits as he does to his old team. It's happened before, and it will happen again. Unless the NCAA figures out a way to fix it, it is goign to continue to be a problem. Just dont hold your breathe.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:12 pm

Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:37 pm

Pup wrote:Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin


No one's saying it's not common place Pup. What we're saying is it isn't right. No matter how many more times it happens and to who.

That doesn't even begin to discuss the bullshit rules that require a kid to sit out a year if he transfers because his coach left.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby JCoz » Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:45 pm

Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin


No one's saying it's not common place Pup. What we're saying is it isn't right. No matter how many more times it happens and to who.

That doesn't even begin to discuss the bullshit rules that require a kid to sit out a year if he transfers because his coach left.


Definitley an effed up system, but trying to fix the transfer deal is impossible. Could you imagine the feeding frenzy around a team who's coach gets fired or takes another job?

At the end of the day the kids sign a LOI to The Ohio State University (or whoever), not Jim Tressel's football college. There would be alot more negative than positive coming from a rule change RE:Coaches leaving, IMO.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:10 pm

Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin


No one's saying it's not common place Pup. What we're saying is it isn't right. No matter how many more times it happens and to who.

That doesn't even begin to discuss the bullshit rules that require a kid to sit out a year if he transfers because his coach left.


What I am saying is, the kids at Cinci that benefited from him dumping CMU to get a head start on the recruiting class greatly responsible for this year's success should not be crying foul.

If someone meets their spouse/girlfriend/sig other while that person is in a relationship, don't come crying when that person cheats on you. Especially if you look like Cincinnati and the new one looks like Notre Dame.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:28 pm

Pup wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin


No one's saying it's not common place Pup. What we're saying is it isn't right. No matter how many more times it happens and to who.

That doesn't even begin to discuss the bullshit rules that require a kid to sit out a year if he transfers because his coach left.


What I am saying is, the kids at Cinci that benefited from him dumping CMU to get a head start on the recruiting class greatly responsible for this year's success should not be crying foul.

If someone meets their spouse/girlfriend/sig other while that person is in a relationship, don't come crying when that person cheats on you. Especially if you look like Cincinnati and the new one looks like Notre Dame.


But it doesn't have to be that way. Put a moratorium on job transfers and recruiting for the four weeks between the bowl selections and the BCS title game. No letters to prospects, no phone calls, focus solely on the bowl season.

I don't know if it's legal or enforceable but it would theoretically eliminate this kind of situation and bad blood. And also consider allowing players recruited by one regime to transfer to another school and not sit out a year if the coach that recruited them leaves for another school. Yes, more players would probably move but the game is transient anyway with players jumping programs or leaving for the NFL as underclassmen.

Just thinking out loud.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Dec 14, 2009 10:25 pm

Ziner wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:
Ziner wrote: At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.


Not exactly. Admission requirements are night and day. Will ND allow Kelly to bend the rules a la Holtz? Maybe. Still, a huge difference between Cincy and ND in terms of class rank and test scores. Huge.


Perhaps you missed this quote.

Weis should be forever thanked for proving that highly sought recruits still want to play in South Bend. His problem wasn’t beating Southern California or Florida for talented high school prospects, even with Notre Dame’s higher academic standards. Indeed, only Florida, Alabama, USC, Tennessee and Ohio State signed more Rivals.com five-star recruits the past four years than Notre Dame.


Can Kelly recruit any kid in the country? No, of course not. However there are still plenty of kids who have the grades to get in to ND that Cincy couldnt touch because of program prestige. How many times have you seen a kid deciding between ND and Cincy, grades or not? If they cant get in to ND most likely they are deciding between the other heavy weights, Cincy is not a heavy weight. ND hasnt been a heavy weight on the field, but they are when it comes to recruiting.


Are you sure it's the allure of ND and not the allure of Charlie Weis? If the ND prestige is so dreamy, then why did their recruiting classes suck before Weis arrived?
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:32 am

mattvan1 wrote:
Ziner wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:
Ziner wrote: At ND Kelly can recruit kids he couldnt have dreamed of at Cincy.


Not exactly. Admission requirements are night and day. Will ND allow Kelly to bend the rules a la Holtz? Maybe. Still, a huge difference between Cincy and ND in terms of class rank and test scores. Huge.


Perhaps you missed this quote.

Weis should be forever thanked for proving that highly sought recruits still want to play in South Bend. His problem wasn’t beating Southern California or Florida for talented high school prospects, even with Notre Dame’s higher academic standards. Indeed, only Florida, Alabama, USC, Tennessee and Ohio State signed more Rivals.com five-star recruits the past four years than Notre Dame.


Can Kelly recruit any kid in the country? No, of course not. However there are still plenty of kids who have the grades to get in to ND that Cincy couldnt touch because of program prestige. How many times have you seen a kid deciding between ND and Cincy, grades or not? If they cant get in to ND most likely they are deciding between the other heavy weights, Cincy is not a heavy weight. ND hasnt been a heavy weight on the field, but they are when it comes to recruiting.


Are you sure it's the allure of ND and not the allure of Charlie Weis? If the ND prestige is so dreamy, then why did their recruiting classes suck before Weis arrived?


Because the previous coach was worse than Weis.

He went ahead and sent Washington back several years after Notre Dame.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby hermanfontenot » Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:20 am

mattvan1 wrote:If the ND prestige is so dreamy, then why did their recruiting classes suck before Weis arrived?


Because it's tough to recruit from a golf course.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:31 am

Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:Wonder what UC thought of this Brian Kelly decision:

2006: In his third season, the Chippewas posted a 9-4 record under Coach Kelly en route to winning the MAC Championship and qualifying for the Motor City Bowl. At the end of the 2006 season, Coach Kelly left to accept the Cincinnati coaching vacancy three days after CMU won the 2006 MAC Championship. He did not coach CMU in their bowl game. Coach Kelly's record at Central Michigan in three seasons was 19-16.


Just sayin


No one's saying it's not common place Pup. What we're saying is it isn't right. No matter how many more times it happens and to who.

That doesn't even begin to discuss the bullshit rules that require a kid to sit out a year if he transfers because his coach left.


What I am saying is, the kids at Cinci that benefited from him dumping CMU to get a head start on the recruiting class greatly responsible for this year's success should not be crying foul.

If someone meets their spouse/girlfriend/sig other while that person is in a relationship, don't come crying when that person cheats on you. Especially if you look like Cincinnati and the new one looks like Notre Dame.


But it doesn't have to be that way. Put a moratorium on job transfers and recruiting for the four weeks between the bowl selections and the BCS title game. No letters to prospects, no phone calls, focus solely on the bowl season.

I don't know if it's legal or enforceable but it would theoretically eliminate this kind of situation and bad blood. And also consider allowing players recruited by one regime to transfer to another school and not sit out a year if the coach that recruited them leaves for another school. Yes, more players would probably move but the game is transient anyway with players jumping programs or leaving for the NFL as underclassmen.

Just thinking out loud.


That would work for me.

Never going to happen. I am guessing the state finals are well attended by recruiters. When would the moratorium start? As soon as you play your last game? After the final Championship game? Do people that start early have an advantage? Or people that play late?

Lots of questions to have to answer to basically save the mid tier conferences from getting smacked by their own system. Don't poach. Karma is a whore.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:33 am

HermanFontenot wrote:
mattvan1 wrote:If the ND prestige is so dreamy, then why did their recruiting classes suck before Weis arrived?


Because it's tough to recruit from a golf course.


I put Ty and Robert Davies in the same class as Mark Shapiro.

They recruited poorly because they had a built in excuse to recruit poorly, just like Shapiro has a built in excuse to be cheap.

"I got the best kids I could that I knew would qualify"

equals

"Budgetary Constraints"
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:06 am

Pup wrote: Don't poach. Karma is a whore.


Yeah tell that to Florida, Alabama and LSU. At least Meyer coached Utah in their bowl. Poaching will never end, because that is how you get the best coaches
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby motherscratcher » Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:57 am

Ziner wrote:
Pup wrote: Don't poach. Karma is a whore.


Yeah tell that to Florida, Alabama and LSU. At least Meyer coached Utah in their bowl. Poaching will never end, because that is how you get the best coaches


This. The pool of worthy coaches to get the big time college jobs who aren't already coaching is very shallow. If you can't poach a coach, you can't get a coach.

The system sucks and is unfair. The kids get screwed. But, there are probably too many variables to ever really do anything about it.

Bummer, man. This is a bummer.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:13 pm

Ziner wrote:
Pup wrote: Don't poach. Karma is a whore.


Yeah tell that to Florida, Alabama and LSU. At least Meyer coached Utah in their bowl. Poaching will never end, because that is how you get the best coaches


See, they don't really have to worry about being poached.

The system sucks. No argument. But it isn't changing. And if you are the recipient of a coach by poaching, don't cry when he gets re-poached.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby aoxo1 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:16 pm

These lower level schools all know the score. As do the players attending.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:31 pm

Pup wrote:
Ziner wrote:
Pup wrote: Don't poach. Karma is a whore.


Yeah tell that to Florida, Alabama and LSU. At least Meyer coached Utah in their bowl. Poaching will never end, because that is how you get the best coaches


See, they don't really have to worry about being poached.

The system sucks. No argument. But it isn't changing. And if you are the recipient of a coach by poaching, don't cry when he gets re-poached.


I think we are saying the same thing, I was just using Bama, UF and LSU as examples that poaching can get your Nat'l Champions and/or appearances in the games so karma isnt that big of a whore. The best coaches are coaching on other teams, that's the way it is. It isnt the best situation but it is what it is.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby WarAdmiral » Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:24 pm

When Calipari left Memphis for Kentucky, there was a faction, that thought he was crazy and that the move was a lateral move. GoldHammer from KNR got on national TV spewing this very stupidity, and he had no clue, to the difference between the two jobs. Calipari is mining the shit out of the UK job. Twitter king, website, charity works, and the list goes on and on, what a person with the right mindset can do with one of these programs, that have a long tradition and a worldwide fan base.

The same applies here. Kelly could milk this for millions, if he is a good enough coach, to build it into his own cash cow. I don't know if he has the personality for it, but a person with wit, and can coach, will be the king of a virtual nation. Hell, he could pocket some jack from writing a book, if he has some success. It is endless, where the money grows on trees.

All that aside, there is legacy. Who doesn't want to leave a legacy. Rebuilding ND legacy>>>>>>>>> building Cincinnati legacy.

Anyone comparing ND with Cincinnati is not thinking clearly IMO, although it could eat him up, if he can't handle the pressure.

I can't stand ND btw. There were two teams, my father raised me to hate from the crib. ND and the Yankees.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Lubber » Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:52 pm

The NCAA can't keep boosters from giving kids money or teams from practicing out of season. You think they will be able to govern the period between end of season and bowls as a no-communication period? NO WAY.

Secondly, the Cincy kids did not get screwed. They are not playing for Kelly. they are playing for Cincy and for themselves. For any of those kids who truly and personally care for Kelly, they should be able to understand that when a great opportunity arises, you need to take advantage of it. Cincy is still playing in a BCS bowl game. It is the same players. Same system and coordinators.

The system does suck for both coach and players, but I really do not see anything changing any time soon.

Lastly, as a Cincy player, would you really want to have Kelly coaching you knowing full well most of his attention is going into "Who should I rrecruit at ND", "how do i replace Jimmy C at QB", etc. Not me, I would want a fully focussed coach.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby BSchultz17 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 7:11 pm

I might be way off here, but wasn't it the University of Cincinati's decision and not Kelley or Notre Dame's for him not to coach in the bowl game? The way I understood it was that Notre Dame waited to announce Kelley's hiring until they found out whether or not he would be coaching in their bowl game. Look at Bobby Bowden at Flordia State, he is coaching their bowl game. Charlie Weis coached Notre Dame against Stanford knowing that his firing would be announced after that game. It sucks for the kids, and it's unfortunate that the NCAA doesn't step in and address it, but I think blaming Kelley or Notre Dame or the NCAA may miss the mark slightly. UC was just as quick to show Kelley the door as he was to walk through it after they learned that he was dumping them for the more popular girl.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Wed Dec 16, 2009 10:57 am

What a dick this guy is.

And what hack of an institution would be a part of this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4746710
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:03 am

Pup wrote:What a dick this guy is.

And what hack of an institution would be a part of this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4746710


Dude,

Why you turning people and institutions into dicks?

It ain't the players, it's the game. That was the original thought in the thread before straw men and bullshit made it another famous TCF 'Either/Or'.

WTF... because more people are getting bent over it must be ok. Makes sense... :thumb up:
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby pup » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:07 am

Peeker643 wrote:
Pup wrote:What a dick this guy is.

And what hack of an institution would be a part of this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4746710


Dude,

Why you turning people and institutions into dicks?

It ain't the players, it's the game. That was the original thought in the thread before straw men and bullshit made it another famous TCF 'Either/Or'.

WTF... because more people are getting bent over it must be ok. Makes sense... :thumb up:


Just giving my opinion on the entire situation. And UC people crying foul.

Not everything is commented on based solely on the words within the TCF boards. :thumb up:
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Ziner » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:12 am

Well maybe if Kelly doesnt workout ND can try that guy since he likes to get Kelly's sloppy seconds
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby Larvell Blanks » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:25 am

I think that the reason UC players are crying foul and getting pissed is because Kelly told these guys, "I'm not going anywhere" and by his reaction to ND questions during the press conference after the Pitt game.

I liken it to Tribe fans with Jim Thome and his "you'll have to tear the jersey off my back" situation.

Just my opinion but what do I know.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:46 am

Pup wrote:Not everything is commented on based solely on the words within the TCF boards. :thumb up:


My apologies if you were referring to Doug from Xenia. It's just that this is the TCF thread and it's been TCF people going back and forth on it so I wasn't aware you were referring to outside people who probably aren't on TCF and don't read TCF. ;-) ;) :wink:

Let's see if we can sum up the entire, ugly business with what we can all agree on or have learned:

1) The situation sucks for the kids and is unfair.
2) There's nothing you can do and nothing the NCAA probably cares to change.
3) Big guys take the little guys lunch money all the time. It's just the way of the world.
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby fundamentals » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:51 am

Peeker643 wrote:
1) The situation sucks for the kids and is unfair.
2) There's nothing you can do and nothing the NCAA probably cares to change.
3) Big guys take the little guys lunch money all the time. It's just the way of the world.


Peeks, you forgot the part of the players not crying about it in public. :salute: :nanner:
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Re: Brian Kelly Takes ND Coaching Job

Unread postby peeker643 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:06 pm

fundamentals wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:
1) The situation sucks for the kids and is unfair.
2) There's nothing you can do and nothing the NCAA probably cares to change.
3) Big guys take the little guys lunch money all the time. It's just the way of the world.


Peeks, you forgot the part of the players not crying about it in public. :salute: :nanner:


No one wants to talk about that anymore Rob. Not when their Heis-Man/He-Man stud RB bawled like a baby on the podium and not when they shook themselves and took another look.

Not when they read what the Glenville team did for young Mr. Witta and his teammates and what Tebow did for a chick with a brain tumor.
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