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Tebow the greatest player ever?

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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Sun Dec 06, 2009 12:49 pm

Imagine when Tebow finds out the truth about Santa Claus? Tim, coach Myer isn't him.

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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Dec 06, 2009 2:22 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:That said, fuck Tim Tebow and his faith. He can eat geezes out for all I care, but that shit has nothing to do w/ what is being bitched about in this thread. Guy just essentially pulled an LBJ post Magic series (albeit w/ a different method of venting, but the same vent was going on, nonetheless) and we have our resident bulimic sixteen year old dancing on the grave. That I get and expect, but I expect better from you Doug. You're smarter than that.

If he had done what Lebron did I'd have nothing to say about that. It was a tough loss.

I'm in the same range as Donny here: Great player. Great legacy. Quite possibly the one guy in professional sports you really wish your kid took as a role model.

And the outright leader of the Florida Gators who all but turned into French Guy Crying At The Surrender after getting run out of the SEC Championship Game. Every hata from Triple-S down to the rest of the SEC fanbase just got the gut laugh of the year at him. You're the face of the pre-eminent CFB program in the nation. You have to suck it up.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby pod2dawg » Sun Dec 06, 2009 3:24 pm

Boys, boys, boys,...Tebow has earned the right to cry, put Biblical references under his eyes, chant, sing, dance, gator chop or pretty much do whatever else he wants after That career. I knew he was destined to greatness caus I cheered against him every game along the way.

Next he becomes a millionaire in April. I quit betting against him a long time ago. If he doesn't make it as QB on Sundays, he could convert to another position. If he doesn't make it in football, he'll make it in life just fine.

Right now he'd be an upgrade at LB, TE, maybe safety or QB, RB for us. :hic:

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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby Lubber » Sun Dec 06, 2009 3:54 pm

Triple-S wrote:
Larvell Blanks wrote:Sorry, but at times your "sour grapes" takes diminish some of the quality posts you have.


Admittingly I get a little to emotional and ignore logic on occasion in some posts. I've tried to get better with it, but what's the point of being a fan without a little passion? Again, I've tried to become a better poster on the board realizing that I do have shortcomings.

Did I get a little carried away making fun of Tebow? Yeah, but I think a good portion of the country was finally relieved to see that team lose. You look at any given board or talk to any random person in the state of ohio right now, I can almost gurantee they were happy to see Florida go down. My own personal reasons aside, you have to admit it will be nice not having to hear for the next month about how this will be the greatest college team ever and the 50 pieces ESPN will do on Tebow ad nausiem.

Also, Ingram was a beast in that game :), and to counter eeyore's statement, Danielson and Verne almost seemed suicidal when they knew Tebow and Florida were going to lose.


You can be a fan all you want. But just make your post knowledgable and credible. When Drew Brees cries after losing to fat Elway in the Super Bowl to ruin their pefect season, you will claim that the Steelers cheated and Brees is just showing his emotion as a warrior on the field.

What is wrong with Florida being the greatest team ever? Do you enjoy failure? As Pipe as said, it is refreshing to see a non-Pacman, Chris Henry type of player comes up through the collegiate ranks and stay all 4 years, and stay out of trouble off the field. Let me ask you a question, if you had a son, would you be embarassed to have a Tim Tebow clone? I would not, but it seems you would kick him to the curb and laugh him for crying and showing his emotion.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Sun Dec 06, 2009 4:01 pm

I'll worry about that when Tim Tebow's dad starts posting on TCF.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby Triple-S » Sun Dec 06, 2009 4:29 pm

Lubber wrote:You can be a fan all you want. But just make your post knowledgable and credible. When Drew Brees cries after losing to fat Elway in the Super Bowl to ruin their pefect season, you will claim that the Steelers cheated and Brees is just showing his emotion as a warrior on the field.

What is wrong with Florida being the greatest team ever? Do you enjoy failure? As Pipe as said, it is refreshing to see a non-Pacman, Chris Henry type of player comes up through the collegiate ranks and stay all 4 years, and stay out of trouble off the field. Let me ask you a question, if you had a son, would you be embarassed to have a Tim Tebow clone? I would not, but it seems you would kick him to the curb and laugh him for crying and showing his emotion.


First off, if the Steelers do make a run for the Super Bowl ala 2006, and play the Saints, I don't see the Saints having a chance in that scenario. I love Drew Brees to death, but that defense is too damn good. Unless Polamalu is hurt, I don't see the Saints walking away with a victory.

And why are you jumping at me for calling Douchlisberger "fat elway", I pretty much mean that in a very complimentary way. He is that to a T., dude is ELWAY, and he proved it in Super Bowl XLII. Doesn't mean I hate him any less, but I do think he is a good player.

Is it refreshing? Eh, depends. It's one thing, if the guy was featured once in a while on a gameday segment or talked about every once in a while, but again to be talked at ad-nausiem length is old.

Do I enjoy failure? No, I just can't stand Florida.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby Lubber » Sun Dec 06, 2009 4:53 pm

Triple-S wrote:
Lubber wrote:You can be a fan all you want. But just make your post knowledgable and credible. When Drew Brees cries after losing to fat Elway in the Super Bowl to ruin their pefect season, you will claim that the Steelers cheated and Brees is just showing his emotion as a warrior on the field.

What is wrong with Florida being the greatest team ever? Do you enjoy failure? As Pipe as said, it is refreshing to see a non-Pacman, Chris Henry type of player comes up through the collegiate ranks and stay all 4 years, and stay out of trouble off the field. Let me ask you a question, if you had a son, would you be embarassed to have a Tim Tebow clone? I would not, but it seems you would kick him to the curb and laugh him for crying and showing his emotion.


First off, if the Steelers do make a run for the Super Bowl ala 2006, and play the Saints, I don't see the Saints having a chance in that scenario. I love Drew Brees to death, but that defense is too damn good. Unless Polamalu is hurt, I don't see the Saints walking away with a victory.

And why are you jumping at me for calling Douchlisberger "fat elway", I pretty much mean that in a very complimentary way. He is that to a T., dude is ELWAY, and he proved it in Super Bowl XLII. Doesn't mean I hate him any less, but I do think he is a good player.

Is it refreshing? Eh, depends. It's one thing, if the guy was featured once in a while on a gameday segment or talked about every once in a while, but again to be talked at ad-nausiem length is old.

Do I enjoy failure? No, I just can't stand Florida.


Not jumping on you at all for Fat Elway. That is how you refer to him, so I was just helping you out...

So, since you can't stand Florida, if Tebow was at tOSU or West Lafayette and talked about ad-nausiem length on ESPN, how would you feel then?
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby Ziner » Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:50 am

jfiling wrote:After looking back, I have to be the guy who ripped on his faith. This isn't the forum to debate the validity of his faith, but I do question his selective use of the New Testament.

Matthew 6:5-6 says:
"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.


J, I love this point, I think I even brought this up in some other Tebow thread. This drives me nuts. I could care less that he is religious, but like it says, dont be a hypocrite. Dont publically display your religion like that, it just makes him look foolish.

That said, great player, fun to watch, and like someone else said there arent many player in sports who you would rather your kids pick as a role model.

And just stop with the crying crap, Tebow isnt the first, happens all the time.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:13 am

Ziner wrote:
jfiling wrote:After looking back, I have to be the guy who ripped on his faith. This isn't the forum to debate the validity of his faith, but I do question his selective use of the New Testament.

Matthew 6:5-6 says:
"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.


J, I love this point, I think I even brought this up in some other Tebow thread. This drives me nuts. I could care less that he is religious, but like it says, dont be a hypocrite. Dont publically display your religion like that, it just makes him look foolish.

That said, great player, fun to watch, and like someone else said there arent many player in sports who you would rather your kids pick as a role model.

And just stop with the crying crap, Tebow isnt the first, happens all the time.


Right?

I mentioned Victor in the Boston dugout and after being traded.

Did I miss the 'Allen Iverson Crying at 76ers Press Conference'? Maybe he got filleted and gutted and I just didn't see it.

Or maybe Roger Federer after he lost to Nadal in January.

Bruce Smith at the news of his HoF induction? Favre, Jordan, Vermeil? Wondering why Tebow gets singled out I guess.

I get the Florida hate and the resentment over the media blowing him regularly. But damn.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby fundamentals » Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:25 am

The scripture verses used by Tebow are by choice. The one questioned about hypocrites might be a reference to those who believe but do not practice their faith. From what we have seen with Tebow, he carries out his faith. Why can't he profess it? You can flash gang symbols and do all other kinds of things and you can't openly be a Christian. Rubbish.

I have a buddy of mine who mocks Tebow all of the time and Christians in general. That's fine, do what you gotta do but let me know the next time someone is in need, who do you pray to? Just my take on that. So lemme get this straight, it's ok to act like a goof and dance around like a maniac, paint your face, scream, holler and yell for a sports team, but the guy cries and loves Christ, and he is a baby, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn. I guarantee there's guys on here who have cried after a team they don't even play for loses, so seriously, a guy who is directly involved with a game, has no "right" to cry? Dumb.

He's been a great college player, might not be the best..........ever, doesn't matter. The End.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby aoxo1 » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:00 pm

The scripture Tebow quotes seems to be directly relevant and appropriate, given the kind of bromides commonly spouted and the actions which supposed men of faith often partake in.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:06 pm

I guarantee there's guys on here who have cried after a team they don't even play for loses, so seriously, a guy who is directly involved with a game, has no "right" to cry? Dumb.

I've cried over games, I was also 14 years old at the time.

Excellent point though on the comparison of boyz and their gang symbols being often overlooked.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:12 pm

fundamentals wrote:I have a buddy of mine who mocks Tebow all of the time and Christians in general. That's fine, do what you gotta do but let me know the next time someone is in need, who do you pray to? Just my take on that. So lemme get this straight, it's ok to act like a goof and dance around like a maniac, paint your face, scream, holler and yell for a sports team, but the guy cries and loves Christ, and he is a baby, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.



Tim's faith is his matter.

But crying after experiencing his level of success is as classless as the boorish behaviour you contract.

Win with class, lose with class. Crying in public instead of congratulating his opponanent and just walking off show issues.

He's also soft.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby fundamentals » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:33 pm

JB wrote:Tim's faith is his matter.

But crying after experiencing his level of success is as classless as the boorish behaviour you contract.

Win with class, lose with class. Crying in public instead of congratulating his opponanent and just walking off show issues.

He's also soft.


I didn't follow his every move when the game was over, not sure if he ever offered to shake hands or not. If he didn't shake hands with anyone, I would take issue with it since as you said, "you win with class, and lose with class". Dude isn't soft. He has had his brains beaten in for four years. IMO. Soft because he cries? Nope, just because you cry doesn't mean you still aren't a "man".
"It's all about winning for me, and I think the Cavs are committed to doing that," he said. "But at the same time I've given myself options to this point, and like I said before, me and my team, we have a game plan that we're going to execute, and we'll see what we get."

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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:46 pm

JB wrote:
fundamentals wrote:I have a buddy of mine who mocks Tebow all of the time and Christians in general. That's fine, do what you gotta do but let me know the next time someone is in need, who do you pray to? Just my take on that. So lemme get this straight, it's ok to act like a goof and dance around like a maniac, paint your face, scream, holler and yell for a sports team, but the guy cries and loves Christ, and he is a baby, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.



Tim's faith is his matter.

But crying after experiencing his level of success is as classless as the boorish behaviour you contract.

Win with class, lose with class. Crying in public instead of congratulating his opponanent and just walking off show issues.

He's also soft.


I agree the faith thing is his business. I also admit I'm sick of hearing all about it from the media that seems to want to erect statues of the kid as a symbol of all that is right with the world.

Maybe he is. I'm just tired of him.

But....

From what I saw he went out of his way to offer congratulations and effusively praised Alabama's team and university after the game and at the press conference aterward.

And I just want to know if the 'win with class, lose with class' and boorish behavior/softness also applies to Victor Martinez when he cried at the end of the '07 playoffs against the Red Sox. Publicly, on camera, from the dugout. Did it show Martinez had 'issues' and whether or not he was soft.

Did Tebow winning his titles in previous years extinguish his right to emote about this opportunity that he let slip away? Did his public display target him as 'soft' in your opinion or is there something else in his game that gave that indication?

You think he cried because he lost that game or because it was a last chance to take his team and university to a title game? Does it even matter what the reason was or are public tears just a sign of weakness in general.

I ask because I watched Allen Iverson cry at his 76ers press conference, Federer crying after losing to Nadal, Bruce Smith crying upon learning he was elected to the HoF, Jordan crying after a title, etc.

Honestly, I don't think he was crying because of one game. Rather it was the finality of the situation, his last go round, an era and chapter ending, etc.

Not being a dick, I just don't have an issue with the guy. At least not for that. That he played poorly is an issue.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:14 pm

Peeker I call a little BS on your choice of counter argument here.

Victor Martinez, Federer & AI etc...those are the examples you are putting up to suggest a double standard of some sort. Context. It is college football season, at its peak. Tim Tebow is the proverbial face of the sport for the moment, Mr. Perfect if you will, often in performance and in his leadership (up until a certain recent moment). VMart is a nobody in the scope of things, even in baseball, hell in that series one might even suggest that considering it was v a star studded team from Boston. AI, pfft, not even worth bringing up. Federer, you're talking about tennis, tennis, you're talking about tennis etc etc etc.

If you are only interested in people publicly saying they thought it was ridiculous those guys cried then fine, it was, but that was a given, that IMO wasn't even necessarily worthy of more than a quick seconds worth of acknowledgment. VMart and particularly AI have NEVER been propped up as examples of uber strength and leadership and as men of virtual infallibility.

Tebow has been since he day he landed on a college campus. Quite a bit of difference.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:33 pm

FUDU wrote:Peeker I call a little BS on your choice of counter argument here.

Victor Martinez, Federer & AI etc...those are the examples you are putting up to suggest a double standard of some sort. Context. It is college football season, at its peak. Tim Tebow is the proverbial face of the sport for the moment, Mr. Perfect if you will, often in performance and in his leadership (up until a certain recent moment). VMart is a nobody in the scope of things, even in baseball, hell in that series one might even suggest that considering it was v a star studded team from Boston. AI, pfft, not even worth bringing up. Federer, you're talking about tennis, tennis, you're talking about tennis etc etc etc.

If you are only interested in people publicly saying they thought it was ridiculous those guys cried then fine, it was, but that was a given, that IMO wasn't even necessarily worthy of more than a quick seconds worth of acknowledgment. VMart and particularly AI have NEVER been propped up as examples of uber strength and leadership and as men of virtual infallibility.

Tebow has been since he day he landed on a college campus. Quite a bit of difference.


Donny, contrary to popular belief, I'm not arguing or countering here. I know you can't see or infer the context of what I'm typing but I'm asking a simple question and not in order to contest or further an opinion or argument. You have your opinion. I get it. It's one that's shared by a lot of people out there.

I have mine. I had no issue with the kid shedding some tears despite the fact I thought it was funny to see (probably for many of the reasons you find it to be).

I just don't hold it against him and don't think it rally tells you what kind of man or adult the kid is/will be.

Tebow is young. Physically gifted and precocious but young and still relatively immature. That was his last SEC title game and a he left a team and teammates he cares about on the doorstep with a poor game.

If a guy like Jordan can cry when he wins a title despite winning many) I'm not sure why it's in bad taste for a 22 yr old kid who feels like he just let his entire school down to do the same thing.

So why does crying make him fallible? And did Tebow prop himself up as a symbol of manhood and strength or did the people who hold the microphones do that? I think some people are holding him to a standard or a steroetype that he had no part in creating.

That's all.

Nothing more.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby fundamentals » Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:55 pm

Peeker643 wrote:So why does crying make him fallible? And did Tebow prop himself up as a symbol of manhood and strength or did the people who hold the microphones do that? I think some people are holding him to a standard or a steroetype that he had no part in creating.


I echo the same thought. Since when does crying make you weak? If you have kids, get use to it. I guess when someone passes away in your family, that's not ok either? The kid invested a great deal of time, energy, and effort into making his team as competitive as possible. I thought it was about the journey just as much as the destination and I think Tebow figures that too.

I guess I will make plans to fist pump and raise a forty instead when something saddens me? Guys on here ripped me and others when LBJ didn't shake hands and now we are getting all over a 21 year old kid for crying? He's a human and makes mistakes.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby The Brook » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:25 pm

Brees would have never lost a game in college if he played with the talent Tebow has around him. Brees was easily a better college QB and in the NFL there will never even be a discussion. Half of the starters during Tebow's career at Florida have been or will be drafted in the first 4 rounds of the NFL draft. He was throwing to wide open recievers and running through gigantic holes his entire college career. He's really really good, but he's not on the same level as Drew Brees as a QB talent wise (leadership I'd say they are about equal)
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jack_tors » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:36 pm

The Brook wrote:Brees would have never lost a game in college if he played with the talent Tebow has around him. Brees was easily a better college QB and in the NFL there will never even be a discussion. Half of the starters during Tebow's career at Florida have been or will be drafted in the first 4 rounds of the NFL draft. He was throwing to wide open recievers and running through gigantic holes his entire college career. He's really really good, but he's not on the same level as Drew Brees as a QB talent wise (leadership I'd say they are about equal)


I think another thing that could be added is that Tebow fits into that system like a round peg in a round hole. I am taking nothing away from the kid but he is the prototypical QB for that offense and that offense is perfectly designed for him. Its like a match made in heaven. I think this has a significant part of his success. Again, taking nothing away cause he still made the plays and was clutch but put him into another system that doesnt fit his strengthens and you get.. Terrell Pryor?
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby leadpipe » Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:29 pm

jack_tors wrote:
The Brook wrote:Brees would have never lost a game in college if he played with the talent Tebow has around him. Brees was easily a better college QB and in the NFL there will never even be a discussion. Half of the starters during Tebow's career at Florida have been or will be drafted in the first 4 rounds of the NFL draft. He was throwing to wide open recievers and running through gigantic holes his entire college career. He's really really good, but he's not on the same level as Drew Brees as a QB talent wise (leadership I'd say they are about equal)


I think another thing that could be added is that Tebow fits into that system like a round peg in a round hole. I am taking nothing away from the kid but he is the prototypical QB for that offense and that offense is perfectly designed for him. Its like a match made in heaven. I think this has a significant part of his success. Again, taking nothing away cause he still made the plays and was clutch but put him into another system that doesnt fit his strengthens and you get.. Terrell Pryor?


Now all the receivers were wide open and there were huge holes to run thru. (Despite that the guy is considered as good a short yardage runner as there ever was because he created holes in the toughest of situations).

Christ.

Look, here's my problem with this thread - and I'll preface this by saying that I am not a religious guy. I hate media hype, and I wouldn't draft Tim Tebow in any round.

However, this thread is typical, actually the definition of hatred for a guy clouding reality.

I mean, before Saturday, there wasn't much to pick on the guy about, so the "Yeah, but he'll be a horrible pro...." was the championing call of the haters. Or "Yeah, but look at all that talent....." As if most top recruit QB's don't play with top recruits from other positions around them.

Then, he plays poorly Saturday, shows some emotion, than all of the sudden he's king of the pussies even though he'd kill anyone reading this with a single blow. That, and as noted above, he's far from the first athlete to do this.

Now, last years Bama game for example, the one in which he put a team on his back, short their best playmaker, against a defense that certainly didn't allow "huge holes" or "wide open receivers," leading them to the NC is suddenly worthless, but the one game he falls short all of the sudden he's a stiff.

Some are so delusional to believe crying will be the guys legacy. No, really, two National Championships a Heisman will be remembered far more by most, save the guys who want to make themselves feel good by bringing it up.

Again, Tim Tebow, in my opinion, is a project player in the NFL, whether it be QB, or if someone is going to move him to another position. This isn't a high draft pick, it's damn near a free agent. Irrelevant to how good a college football player he was. Tim Tebow was a better college player than Drew Brees. Period. Or was he worse than Chuck Long?

Lastly, here's my personal opinion of the whole deal. One, he didn't ask for the media to blow him. And two, the religious stuff, well, the reason it doesn't bother me is it doesn't reek at all of insincerity. The guy was raised in a religious family, he really is going on those missions. He isn't being a good guy to impress anyone.

You know the guy interviewed after the game and says "First and foremost, I'd like to thank the Lord..." than hops into the postgame prayer at midfield, along with their 3 felonies and 4 bastard kids.

Well, that ain't him.

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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:31 am

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:And the outright leader of the Florida Gators who all but turned into French Guy Crying At The Surrender after getting run out of the SEC Championship Game. Every hata from Triple-S down to the rest of the SEC fanbase just got the gut laugh of the year at him. You're the face of the pre-eminent CFB program in the nation. You have to suck it up.


Truth.

You really nailed it here Doug.

Edit - There is also an important point to be made in that this was in no way a shocker / stunner. They got blown the fuck out. Teabow had about 30 minutes to compose himself to the inevitable.
Last edited by jb on Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:34 am

Peeker643 wrote:
JB wrote:
fundamentals wrote:I have a buddy of mine who mocks Tebow all of the time and Christians in general. That's fine, do what you gotta do but let me know the next time someone is in need, who do you pray to? Just my take on that. So lemme get this straight, it's ok to act like a goof and dance around like a maniac, paint your face, scream, holler and yell for a sports team, but the guy cries and loves Christ, and he is a baby, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.



Tim's faith is his matter.

But crying after experiencing his level of success is as classless as the boorish behaviour you contract.

Win with class, lose with class. Crying in public instead of congratulating his opponanent and just walking off show issues.

He's also soft.


I agree the faith thing is his business. I also admit I'm sick of hearing all about it from the media that seems to want to erect statues of the kid as a symbol of all that is right with the world.

Maybe he is. I'm just tired of him.

But....

From what I saw he went out of his way to offer congratulations and effusively praised Alabama's team and university after the game and at the press conference aterward.

And I just want to know if the 'win with class, lose with class' and boorish behavior/softness also applies to Victor Martinez when he cried at the end of the '07 playoffs against the Red Sox. Publicly, on camera, from the dugout. Did it show Martinez had 'issues' and whether or not he was soft.

Did Tebow winning his titles in previous years extinguish his right to emote about this opportunity that he let slip away? Did his public display target him as 'soft' in your opinion or is there something else in his game that gave that indication?

You think he cried because he lost that game or because it was a last chance to take his team and university to a title game? Does it even matter what the reason was or are public tears just a sign of weakness in general.

I ask because I watched Allen Iverson cry at his 76ers press conference, Federer crying after losing to Nadal, Bruce Smith crying upon learning he was elected to the HoF, Jordan crying after a title, etc.

Honestly, I don't think he was crying because of one game. Rather it was the finality of the situation, his last go round, an era and chapter ending, etc.

Not being a dick, I just don't have an issue with the guy. At least not for that. That he played poorly is an issue.



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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:13 am

Peeker I am not wishing the guy any ill will what so ever, I personally find it refreshing that the media is hyping up a guy who isn't screaming "and one" for a change.

However there is a difference between a guy crying after winning and a guy crying after losing. No different than crying after the birth of one's own child, crying after winning, while maybe not manly looking to many fans, is not by any means a show of selfishness or some level of disappointment. However crying after losing is, call it unfair if you want but that signifies disappoint or even resentment to some degree. In the case of a guy like Tebow with all the accolades and trophies it does look quite selfish.

As said a few times up thread already you just cannot do it if your the Tebow of your team and sport.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:20 am

Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby hermanfontenot » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:22 am

FUDU wrote:In the case of a guy like Tebow with all the accolades and trophies it does look quite selfish.


Only to people who are prepared to find any and every reason to hate on the kid in the first place.

To me, he looked like a passionate player who was bitterly disappointed by a loss.

We piss and moan about players who don't "get it," who don't match the passion of the fans, who laugh and joke with opposing players after a loss. Then we turn around and nail a guy who does get it, who does care.

I think it's ridiculous.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:30 am

Lead Pipe wrote:Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.

Dude, seriously reread the thread, you do this a lot. VMart cried OK fine, I saw it, I laughed, didn't feel I needed to do anymore than laugh, why b/c VMart is a nobody. So enough with the apples and oranges comparison of losing athletes crying.

Also, again for everyone, I don't hate on Tebow, he is not my favorite player nor do I think he'll be a QB in the pro's but I do not come in here during CFB season and rip the guy. He was/is a great college football player.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby hermanfontenot » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:35 am

FUDU wrote:VMart cried OK fine, I saw it, I laughed, didn't feel I needed to do anymore than laugh, why b/c VMart is a nobody.


Nice.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:35 am

Lead Pipe wrote:Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.



Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:44 am

FUDU wrote:
Lead Pipe wrote:Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.

Dude, seriously reread the thread, you do this a lot. VMart cried OK fine, I saw it, I laughed, didn't feel I needed to do anymore than laugh, why b/c VMart is a nobody. So enough with the apples and oranges comparison of losing athletes crying.

Also, again for everyone, I don't hate on Tebow, he is not my favorite player nor do I think he'll be a QB in the pro's but I do not come in here during CFB season and rip the guy. He was/is a great college football player.


Just as he didn't ask the media to blow him, is the same reason this isn't apples to oranges.

They cried for the same reason. The perception of each is different. Price he pays for being great I suppose.

But the overall point on the crying....yeah, you laughed, a lot of us laughed, but that's the extent of it. To imply that all of the sudden the guy's legacy is going to be effected by it is more than ridiculous.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:50 am

JB wrote:
Lead Pipe wrote:Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.



Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.


So he didn't show character post game. Sounded like a guy who was both gracious and sincere to me.

Had he not cried, and made sorry excuses in the presser, not giving Bama credit, like every other guy does, would that have made him a better "sport"

I'm lost on this one I guess, because in the grand scheme of things, Tim Tebow crying, aside from fodder for some, means absolutely nothing.

N-O-T-H-I-N-G.

It means nothing, it changes nothing. It's a whole lot of nothing.

And JB, I respect you as much as any poster on here, but surely you can site me a hundred examples over all the major sports of men crying over losing. Not saying it should happen, or be lauded, but it's a reality.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jfiling » Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:08 am

I think one can respect Tebow and still hate him. I also think one can rip on him for crying, even if it creates a double standard.

If nobody here can ever let personal bias get in the way of a take, the board is going to dry up and die.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby fundamentals » Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:36 am

JB wrote:
Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.


There are people on this board who have wept when their "favorite" team hasn't won a game, so I can't believe we are going to be critical of a kid who embodies college sports and cried after a game. When is it acceptable for a man to cry? I guess when you have spent thousands of hours working toward a particular goal and it doesn't come to fruition, you just walk down the tunnel and hope Mean Joe Green gives you a Coke and a smile.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jack_tors » Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:40 am

fundamentals wrote:
JB wrote:
Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.


There are people on this board who have wept when their "favorite" team hasn't won a game, so I can't believe we are going to be critical of a kid who embodies college sports and cried after a game. When is it acceptable for a man to cry? I guess when you have spent thousands of hours working toward a particular goal and it doesn't come to fruition, you just walk down the tunnel and hope Mean Joe Green gives you a Coke and a smile.


Or Troy Polamalu tosses you the business shirt ripped off some Coca Cola employee. ;-) ;) :wink:
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby FUDU » Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:45 am

...and Lead to the point about it looking selfish, that you disagree with, answer me this, why in the world is he crying to begin with?

IMO until he does something significant on a football field again that imagine of him crying will not go away. It will not DEFINE his life, nor should it, but after all the positive acclaim he received up until that point the media will have that picture handy and ready to go. Fair, of course not, no different than Tiger's personal life being opened up like can of green peas, but Tiger wasn't shy about having his family there on the 18th hole either. Tebow knows the cameras are watching.

Simply cannot have it both ways.

I have no problem with Tebow crying, just do it inside the locker room, or how about this approach, put a towel over your head. It's been done for years.

Hell I get a tear in my eye when Neil Page figures out Dell Griffith's deal in the train station, coincident that I always go grab a pop when that is shown on XMas even night, I think not.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby noles1 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:43 am

Couple thoughts...

Tebow as a player was unmasked yet again, this time though was as glaring as ever. Guy is not a QB, glad we can finally put it to bed. Again, I blame Meyer and UF more than anything.

I don't mind the crying on the field as the game was coming to a close. I agree that a towel would have been better off for him and his lasting image but it is what it is.

In the presser, you got to man up and have it together. That's a good 30 minutes after the game, after you have cried with your teammates in the locker room and everything. That takes a bit of a man up.

All this said, to those that followed Tebow since he was younger this is not a surprise. There have been videos and comments to him being super sensitive for years. Hell, he whined like a baby at the Elite 11 camp when he didn't win a passing drill. You are talking about a home-schooled kid that comes from a deeply religious background. Also, all this attention he gets, I believe there is a big part of him that craves and loves every second of it. College for him is akin to many guys high school years, especially as the football jock that owns everything. There is still some legitimacy, no doubt, like the Playboy All-American stance and ducking out of titty photos with women.

The fact that we discuss so much of the kid at least shows how great of a player he is/was. Not all-time, IMO as stated before but a damn good player. I think he will slot in with the Eric Crouch's and Tommie Frazier's of the college football lore when all is said and done.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:25 pm

FUDU wrote:Hell I get a tear in my eye when Neil Page figures out Dell Griffith's deal in the train station, coincident that I always go grab a pop when that is shown on XMas even night, I think not.


What a 'mo. :hide: :nanner: :woot:

Who you hiding that tear from, if I may ask?
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby aoxo1 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:30 pm

I'll just say that watching Tebow, I always thought UF had a chance. Even in that championship game, right up until that throw behind the guy on 4th down (yes, even after the end zone INT) I thought they might pull it out.

As a lifelong Cleveland fan, I generally always feel the opposite. The only other guy who occasionally reaches that level for me is LeBron, and not consistently.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:17 pm

FUDU wrote:...and Lead to the point about it looking selfish, that you disagree with, answer me this, why in the world is he crying to begin with?

IMO until he does something significant on a football field again that imagine of him crying will not go away. It will not DEFINE his life, nor should it, but after all the positive acclaim he received up until that point the media will have that picture handy and ready to go. Fair, of course not, no different than Tiger's personal life being opened up like can of green peas, but Tiger wasn't shy about having his family there on the 18th hole either. Tebow knows the cameras are watching.

Simply cannot have it both ways.

I have no problem with Tebow crying, just do it inside the locker room, or how about this approach, put a towel over your head. It's been done for years.

Hell I get a tear in my eye when Neil Page figures out Dell Griffith's deal in the train station, coincident that I always go grab a pop when that is shown on XMas even night, I think not.


Don't know exactly why he cried.

Neither do you.

Some possibilities would include;

His team losing a chance to be great.

His team losing the National Championship

Him feeling he let the team down

Him realizing that the loss signified the end of his college experience

and of course, for you;

Him feeling that this loss tarnished HIS greatness.

Him not playing well cost him the Heisman

Him feeling that people's perceptions of him were going to change.

You obviously lean towards the latter ones I suppose, whereas I, based on how he's carried himself in life and in football up to this point lean towards a few of the former.

And you are right, you can't have it both ways - but he doesn't need both ways. The crying will be a blip on the radar compared to everything else.

clearly.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:12 pm

Lead Pipe wrote:
But the overall point on the crying....yeah, you laughed, a lot of us laughed, but that's the extent of it. To imply that all of the sudden the guy's legacy is going to be effected by it is more than ridiculous.



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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:14 pm

Lead Pipe wrote:
JB wrote:
Lead Pipe wrote:Looked selfish?

To you and who else?

Even many that would join you in busting his balls wouldn't be doing it because they felt it was selfish.

so, again, because Victor diddn't have championships or as many accolades, his crying was not "selfish" or selfishly driven bawling.

Is this what you're trying to say? Because if it's even close, stop, just stop.

Holy Christ.



Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.


So he didn't show character post game. Sounded like a guy who was both gracious and sincere to me.

Had he not cried, and made sorry excuses in the presser, not giving Bama credit, like every other guy does, would that have made him a better "sport"

I'm lost on this one I guess, because in the grand scheme of things, Tim Tebow crying, aside from fodder for some, means absolutely nothing.

N-O-T-H-I-N-G.

It means nothing, it changes nothing. It's a whole lot of nothing.

And JB, I respect you as much as any poster on here, but surely you can site me a hundred examples over all the major sports of men crying over losing. Not saying it should happen, or be lauded, but it's a reality.



Feh, it's good Piper. We're just chewing the fat bro.

But I digress. Those others who cried are dorks, too.

Men don't cry in public.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:29 pm

fundamentals wrote:
JB wrote:
Piper, maybe I'm the devil too, but I'm right with FUDU. It's easy to win, hard to lose. Character blah blah blah.

Show some.

You can still hate to lose and lose with dignity.

A grown ass man crying about losing a football game is not dignified.

Men don't cry over losing. Period.


There are people on this board who have wept when their "favorite" team hasn't won a game, so I can't believe we are going to be critical of a kid who embodies college sports and cried after a game. When is it acceptable for a man to cry? I guess when you have spent thousands of hours working toward a particular goal and it doesn't come to fruition, you just walk down the tunnel and hope Mean Joe Green gives you a Coke and a smile.



a ) When something truly tragic happens, like a death in your immediate family, and then in private after you've fulfiled your obligations. Losing a freaking football game is not tragic.

b ) He met his goal. Twice. Since Walter camp, you can count college teams with players who did that on one, maybe two, hands IIRC. How many kids don't even break .500 and work their asses off? How many college teams took the ohfer collar this season in D 1, DII and D III after working their asses off in 2 a days ? He cried because he didn't win a national title every year he played. Boo freaking hoo. Spare me. Bill Walton and Silk Wilkes didn't cry in 1974. Linehart didn't cry in 06. I can leave Piper's list in the dust with a vapor trail Chuck Yeager would envy.

c) I never cry as a fan when my team doesn't win. I just do another shot, pop another beer, and come to these boards to cathart and piss the world off. But I never cry. It just isn't that important.

BTW - I have no interest in calling into question Tim's overall character. From all accounts he's a great kid. But weeping after you've won two national championships just smacks of being spoiled rotten. So yeah, maybe he does embody major college sports. :lmfao:

And at the risk of strating an Eyo / Proove, which I don;t want to do, I just have to innocently ask you....If Teabow weren't an on-his-sleeve- everyone-look-at-me-Christian, would you be so vehement about this? I'm being serious.
Last edited by jb on Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby hermanfontenot » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:34 pm

Larry Bird cried after Indiana State lost the '79 NCAA title game.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:38 pm

HermanFontenot wrote:Larry Bird cried after Indiana State lost the '79 NCAA title game.



I in no way recall that, Jesse. You need to provide a link.

Call.

He did cry when he called Magic privately after Magic announced his HIV.

Now Adam Morrison.... ?

Rep ruined.

Edit -
And here it is. Advantage you, sir. Well done.

(And Bird was a dork that day, too)

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=hill/070511
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:49 pm

JB wrote:
c) I never cry as a fan when my team doesn't win. I just do another shot, pop another beer, and come to these boards to cathart and piss the world off.


That's healthier and better for everyone!!

Man I wish you'd just cry. ;-) ;) :wink: :lmfao:

You cry during "Brian's Song"?
"Great minds think alike. The opposite is also true."

"None of us is as dumb as all of us."


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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:51 pm

Peeker643 wrote:
JB wrote:
c) I never cry as a fan when my team doesn't win. I just do another shot, pop another beer, and come to these boards to cathart and piss the world off.


That's healthier and better for everyone!!

Man I wish you'd just cry. ;-) ;) :wink: :lmfao:

You cry during "Brian's Song"?


Throat lump. Max.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:55 pm

JB wrote:
Peeker643 wrote:
JB wrote:
c) I never cry as a fan when my team doesn't win. I just do another shot, pop another beer, and come to these boards to cathart and piss the world off.


That's healthier and better for everyone!!

Man I wish you'd just cry. ;-) ;) :wink: :lmfao:

You cry during "Brian's Song"?


Throat lump. Max.


http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/st ... ill/070511

http://www.i-am-bored.com/bored_link.cfm?link_id=29958

Lou Gehrig was a pussy. ;-) ;) :wink:
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby hermanfontenot » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:59 pm

JB wrote:
HermanFontenot wrote:I in no way recall that, Jesse. You need to provide a link.

Call.


Book passage. "The Encyclopedia of the NCAA Tournament" Jim Savage (Dell Publishing, 1990)

Page 440:

"After the final loss, a frustrated, disheartened Bird, who had earlier spoken so nonchalantly about victory, sat on the bench, head bowed, and cried. Winning really mattered after all."


Oh, and...



7:15.
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby mattvan1 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:46 pm

People cry. It's ok. I cried the first time my kid scored on his HS team. I cried when my daughter made her All Star team in softball. My kids cry after tough losses/boyfriend/girlfriend breakups. Tim Tebow is a kid - it's not that big of a deal. It's who he is. It absolutely does not detract from his legacy at UF whatsoever.

I hate to drop the "you never played the game" card but I am tempted. For fuck's sake - regardless of the the media attention I ask for all that is pure in sports just treat the kid as a kid and let it go.

And I still think he sucks as a QB.

YMMV
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Re: Tebow the greatest player ever?

Unread postby jb » Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:25 pm

mattvan1 wrote:People cry. It's ok. I cried the first time my kid scored on his HS team. I cried when my daughter made her All Star team in softball. My kids cry after tough losses/boyfriend/girlfriend breakups. Tim Tebow is a kid - it's not that big of a deal. It's who he is. It absolutely does not detract from his legacy at UF whatsoever.

I hate to drop the "you never played the game" card but I am tempted. For fuck's sake - regardless of the the media attention I ask for all that is pure in sports just treat the kid as a kid and let it go.

And I still think he sucks as a QB.

YMMV



Feh.

I didn't cry as a 13 year old when we lost the right to play for city as Jason and Judd Garrett left cleat marks on my head. It sucked, but I didn't cry. I left it on a muddy field and knew I did what I could have done.


* I * was a kid.

My son's LL rec league team lost their semi-final to a worse team after being 20 - 0 and he started sniffling. I told him losing sucked and it was OK to not like to lose - but - that knowing how to lose was important and that he should stop sniffling if he did his best. Then I gave him a lifesaver. * HE * was a kid.

Tim Teabow? A kid?

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

Those guys are professionals. Don't kid yourself.

BTW - I NEVER said you can't cry after an ended relationship in private. Just not over a GD GAME in public.

Tasteless. Weak.

Achilles never cried on the battlefield. Teddy Roosevelt would have kicked Teabow in the jimmie.
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