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Unread postby swerb » Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:26 am

Pinella to the Cubs, and says he wants to bring ARod over with him.

Macha whacked in Oaktown.

And my boys the Nationals appear primed to hire Joe Girardi, which would make me very happy.

Giants, Rangers, A's, Nationals still officially looking for skippers.

Torre survives in NY, looks like Grovers gonna make it in Seattle.

Some of the names that keep popping up for the vacancies ...

Dust Baker
Joey Cora (just can't picture that - but I said the same thing bout Guillen)
Terry Pendelton
Tony Pena (like him)
Girardi
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Unread postby furls » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:10 am

Can we start looking?
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Unread postby pup » Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:59 pm

Tony Pena in Cleveland...I would love it.
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Unread postby consigliere » Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:04 pm

Pup wrote:Tony Pena in Cleveland...I would love it.


Absolutely not.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:48 am

Absolutely not


Is this because Wedge will not be fired, or would you not want Pena to manage even if the job was available?
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Unread postby ACrank » Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:37 pm

Pena quit on the Royals....

not sure i would want him if the spot were to be open either....

say what you want about Wedge - he isn't going to quit on the Indians (regardless of how much some of you want him to)
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:17 pm

Pena is vastly over-rated. People are all into him because of his fiery personality.....but he'd be a time bomb here. Plus, if he was such a hot commodity, why aren't other teams breaking down his door to hire him?

Even if Wedge were fired, I wouldn't want him.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:17 pm

I would say the Royals quit on him just as much as he quit on them.

When is the last time ANY Cleveland team had a manager/head coach with some freaking fire? We wonder why our teams are always so boring and by the book, yet all of our leaders just sit there and preach the "staying the course" garbage. Fuck the course. Get fired up and win some god damn games!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Unread postby ACrank » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:34 am

i could care less about whether or not a manager/coach has fire...thats an overrated commodity in my opinion....

(ps Wedge has shown fire, but usually when that happens people complain about it too...)
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Unread postby pup » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:31 am

Wedge has shown fire? When? Fire is not running out of a dugout on a terrible call and immitating Lou Pinella. I don't need to see the fire. The fire should be in the clubhouse and you can tell the difference betwen a manager with fire and one without by the WAY his team plays the game.

The Indians are to emotion what the Yankees are to thrifty.
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Unread postby ACrank » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:43 am

If the fire is in the dugout - how do you expect to be able to see it?
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:21 am

The Indians are to emotion what the Yankees are to thrifty.


Speaking of the Yanks, that Torre guy has a lot of fire.

BTW, Leyland isn't a fiery guy. Nor is La Russa. Those guys handle things in-house much the same as Wedge. Obviously, their players seem to listen and respond to them more than the Indians do to Wedge....but they have the same style. Pretty much emotionless in the dugout, but vocal in the lockerroom.
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Unread postby furls » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:27 am

What bothers me the most about the Indians is the universal loss of fundamentals on the team. The ENTIRE team, with one or two exceptions, is regressing. That is a trend, and trends point to leadership.

Whether it is in the field, on the base paths, or at the plate; the team shows a complete and total lack of discipline and baseball smarts. Now either they need someone to teach this (doubtful, they already know it at this point) or they need someone to enforce it and make it a "culture of the team."

Leyland is firey. DId you hear what he said about the Tigers in the first week of the season when they lost big to the Indians? Yikes. Did you hear what he said this last week about how he was not happy with his team right now? He basically said that they seemed a little bit to pleased with themselves and that he was going to take care of that.
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:36 am

Leyland is firey. DId you hear what he said about the Tigers in the first week of the season when they lost big to the Indians? Yikes. Did you hear what he said this last week about how he was not happy with his team right now? He basically said that they seemed a little bit to pleased with themselves and that he was going to take care of that.


Which, really is no different than what Wedge said almost all year in the papers at times about the team and specific players. The difference is, the Detroit players responded to Leyland calling them out....the Indians didn't with Wedge.

Leyland is about as emoitionless as they come in the dugout.....and aside from the few times he opened to the press, much of the stuff was handled behind the scenes and in-house. Just like Wedge and the Indians.

Leyland hardly compares to Tony Pena or Ozzie Guillen. Pena and Guillen are "fiery" guys. Guys like Torre and Leyland are not (and I also believe in the long run players respect these guys more).
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Unread postby furls » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:55 pm

I agree, that he is not fiery like Guillen.

I do think that it is pretty clear that no one is listening to Wedge anymore!
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Unread postby pup » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:00 pm

Speaking of the Yanks, that Torre guy has a lot of fire.

BTW, Leyland isn't a fiery guy. Nor is La Russa



If the fire is in the dugout - how do you expect to be able to see it?


Which is why my definition was:


The fire should be in the clubhouse and you can tell the difference betwen a manager with fire and one without by the WAY his team plays the game.


Fire = Inspiration. Each collection of 25 guys requires a different type of fire. I am not talking about fire in terms of yelling and screaming. I am talking about getting EVERYTHING out of those 25 guys. Torre does that (until he got overloaded with players with no passion), Leyland does it. With LaRussa, this is one of the greatest coaching jobs he has ever done and his approach to relish the chance to play in a game 7 is exactly what I am talking about.

Baseball is played with passion. The Indians do not play with passion. They play like it is their job. Big difference.
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