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7/16/07 Chisox @ Tribe

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7/16/07 Chisox @ Tribe

Unread postby tribefan333 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 4:31 pm

Game #4 this year for me! Should still be a good game between inner-division teams. You guys can add all the fun stuff.

Go tribe!
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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 4:35 pm

Tell Cliff to keep the ball down.
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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:26 pm

Nice, of the first three hitters, Lee retires exactly no one! Woo woo!

Then he gets two Ks and a forceout to escape down 1-0.

Meanwhile, the Indians go down in order, so it's 1-0 after 1.
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Unread postby buddycowley » Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 pm

swb,

Will be FedExing a bottle of Mylanta and a Fungo Bat to prevent TV breakage if Lee continues to emulate a Non-Pitcher.

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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:52 pm

Hey, a scoreless inning.

How about some offense now?
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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:02 pm

Okay, leadoff double, steal of third, and no runs scored does not count as "offense."
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Unread postby Hoover » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:03 pm

Blake's in his usual 2nd half swoon.

Danks is not as good as he's looking so far. They've gotta break through soon.
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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:08 pm

1-2-3 4th for Lee. Maybe he's locking in. Or maybe he pitched to mACKowiACK, Fields, and Uribe.
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Unread postby Steve Buffum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:10 pm

Okay, THAT counts as "offense."
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:20 pm

Steve Buffum wrote:1-2-3 4th for Lee. Maybe he's locking in. Or maybe he pitched to mACKowiACK, Fields, and Uribe.


At least he's finally locking in on those guys, who were 2-3 the first go-round tonight.
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Unread postby drum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:22 pm

nice play by JB. after 2 bad ones tonight
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Unread postby hermanfontenot » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:32 pm

Feels like the dam is about to break in our favor.
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Unread postby hermanfontenot » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:33 pm

Or not.
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Unread postby FUDU » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:34 pm

Hey how bout that Jim Thome.


[hiding behind couch]

Seriously though, he leads the team in BA and OPS and is second in almost everything else, and he is having a down year. I find that surprising even though I am a fan.

What happened to the ChiSox offense this year?
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Unread postby Tribefan24 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:51 pm

another lack of showing so far by our offense

and once again our pitcher doesnt keep us in the game
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:53 pm

How long can we afford to keep Ferd on this roster??
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Unread postby Tribefan24 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:55 pm

Hi Oktane wrote:How long can we afford to keep Ferd on this roster??


i was just gonna say that


get rid of this kid


we prolly will and he will end up being good ...... ive had enough of his garbage

we were somewhat in the game... now its over
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:57 pm

Tribefan24 wrote:
Hi Oktane wrote:How long can we afford to keep Ferd on this roster??


i was just gonna say that


get rid of this kid


we prolly will and he will end up being good ...... ive had enough of his garbage

we were somewhat in the game... now its over


Not over...but close. I know Ferd's got stuff, but sheesh. The guy can't get me out right now. Either send him down to figure it out or trade him to a team that likes his stuff and thinks they can turn him into a "pitcher". He is not that right now.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:59 pm

Hi Oktane wrote:
Tribefan24 wrote:
Hi Oktane wrote:How long can we afford to keep Ferd on this roster??


i was just gonna say that


get rid of this kid


we prolly will and he will end up being good ...... ive had enough of his garbage

we were somewhat in the game... now its over


Not over...but close. I know Ferd's got stuff, but sheesh. The guy can't get me out right now. Either send him down to figure it out or trade him to a team that likes his stuff and thinks they can turn him into a "pitcher". He is not that right now.


Now its over!
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Re: 7/16/07 Chisox @ Tribe

Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:01 pm

tribefan333 wrote:Game #4 this year for me! Should still be a good game between inner-division teams. You guys can add all the fun stuff.

Go tribe!


Sorry Tribefan. Hopefully, the first 3 were better.
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Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:01 pm

Lee needs to get straightened out quickly. Cabrera is just gawdawful.

But Lee just looks completely out of whack. His finish is all over the place, his command is nil and he's consistently behind good hitters 2-0, 2-1 or 3-1 and tonight is what happens when you do that.

Jesus, the White Sox may have a fight at the bat rack to get a crack at Cabrera.
I can't imagine he'll be a big leaguer tomorrow at this time.

Jensen Lewis getting the call.
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Unread postby drum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:01 pm

Debut!

hopefully we can sign cabrera soon
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Re: 7/16/07 Chisox @ Tribe

Unread postby drum » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:08 pm

Hi Oktane wrote:
tribefan333 wrote:Game #4 this year for me! Should still be a good game between inner-division teams. You guys can add all the fun stuff.

Go tribe!


Sorry Tribefan. Hopefully, the first 3 were better.


Ouch, sorry you had to drive that far to see a pounding. Anytime at the Jake is fun though
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Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:28 pm

Wedge just got a three-year extension, and he immediately shows why by bringing in Cabrera when the game was still within reach. The announcers were calling for Perez with the bases loaded and Wedge sticks with Cliffy. He gives up a two-run single, then it's Cabrera time, and it's lights out.

Gutierrez goes yard and all of a sudden we have five runs on the board with three innings left. If Wedge gets Cliff out of there and brings in Perez before the Chisox broke the game open we could easily be tied right now.

Unfortunately, I believe Cabrera is out of options and will have to be put on waivers if we want to send him down.

So far I like Jensen Lewis. He's making them swing and miss. Let's see what he can do with Thome.
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Unread postby swerb » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:56 pm

Lewis has looked good. Misses bats and his ball has a little hump on it.

Sad thing is, Ferd Cabrera doesn't implode and this is a ball game right now.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:03 pm

Prosecutor wrote:Unfortunately, I believe Cabrera is out of options and will have to be put on waivers if we want to send him down.


Precisely why you have to put him in these situations, so you can see what you have. This will be a good thing in the longrun b/c, presumably, Ferd's roster spot will ultimately be filled with a non-stiff.
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Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:07 pm

This team keep looking at guys like Lofton and Nixon and Delucci while Gutierrez continues to take advantage of every opportunity. I know you'd like an experienced stick for the stretch run but still.......

Why go out and pay for a platoon OF when you have a couple kids in Gutierrez and Franisco giving you all you can ask of them.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:11 pm

I'm having flashbacks to 1995. Unfortunately Blake is up instead of Jim Thome.
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Unread postby swerb » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:15 pm

Hi Oktane wrote:I'm having flashbacks to 1995. Unfortunately Blake is up instead of Jim Thome.

LOL

This team is scrappy though.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:19 pm

I guess Wedge is managing his ass off now. :lol:
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:32 pm

This just in...

Perez = Good
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Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:34 pm

If we lose this one's on Wedge. He brings in Cabera with runners on in a close game in the 6th inning. What is he, nuts? The way Cabrera has been pitching lately, you don't use him in a close game, especially a division game. Even the announcers were surprised when Wedge brought him in.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:35 pm

Prosecutor wrote:If we lose this one's on Wedge. He brings in Cabera with runners on in a close game in the 6th inning. What is he, nuts? The way Cabrera has been pitching lately, you don't use him in a close game, especially a division game. Even the announcers were surprised when Wedge brought him in.


What if we win? :idea:
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Unread postby CP » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:40 pm

Hi Oktane wrote:What if we win? :idea:


If they do it's in spite of Wedge... aside from his numerous gaffes in the 6th inning (which aren't hindsight when your TV is in jeopardy before the bad moves pan out) and pinch-hitting Nixon for anyone but a guy with no limbs...
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Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:40 pm

Solid work by Nixon. I enjoyed how he took the fastballs down the middle and opted to put a good swing on the splitter that bounced two feet in front of the plate.

At least he has time to fil up the pie tin should they bail him out.
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Unread postby CP » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:47 pm

Peeker643 wrote:Solid work by Nixon. I enjoyed how he took the fastballs down the middle and opted to put a good swing on the splitter that bounced two feet in front of the plate.

At least he has time to fil up the pie tin should they bail him out.


As soon as Peralta ended the 8th with a crappy AB in a crucial situation, I called both the Nixon PH and result of it. My wife looked at me perplexed when I was venting prematurely but I could see the Nixon-for-Michaels PH coming too soon for my own good.

To think we dumped Guthrie from the 40-man to make room for Trot without ever giving Guthrie a chance as a SP. Yeah I know that's hindsight in a way on whether Guthrie would pan out, and we were loaded with starters, but if he had gotten anywhere near the number of opportunities afforded to Jason Davis, he'd still be here.
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Unread postby Tribefan24 » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:47 pm

i would much rather have michaels hitting against a RH then Trot piece of trash Nixon hitting at all

wedges decisions tonight were terrible

in order of why we lost tonight :

1) Cliff Lee
2) Eric Wedge
3) Fernando "i will no longer be an indian in the morning" Cabrera



this is a tough loss
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Unread postby cleveland yankees » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:49 pm

:cry :cry: nixon sucks
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Unread postby CP » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:49 pm

Tribefan24 wrote:i would much rather have michaels hitting against a RH then Trot piece of trash Nixon hitting at all

wedges decisions tonight were terrible

in order of why we lost tonight :

1) Cliff Lee
2) Eric Wedge
3) Fernando "i will no longer be an indian in the morning" Cabrera



this is a tough loss


I'm not sure I'd put Lee first. Cabrera is a MLB reliever, or so his soon-to-be-updated resume will say, and he needs to give up less than 4 runs per appearance and allow less than 100% of his inherited runners to score.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:50 pm

Tribefan24 wrote:i would much rather have michaels hitting against a RH then Trot piece of trash Nixon hitting at all

wedges decisions tonight were terrible

in order of why we lost tonight :

1) Cliff Lee
2) Eric Wedge
3) Fernando "i will no longer be an indian in the morning" Cabrera



this is a tough loss


I don't see it as a tough loss. Although you don't want to lose in the division, especially at home, they almost came back and won when everyone had written them off. Trust me, the Tribe feels better about themselves for the rest of the series than the Chisox, who almost found yet another way to lose. The Indians are resilient and fight to the end.
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Unread postby Hi Oktane » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:55 pm

CP wrote:
Tribefan24 wrote:i would much rather have michaels hitting against a RH then Trot piece of trash Nixon hitting at all

wedges decisions tonight were terrible

in order of why we lost tonight :

1) Cliff Lee
2) Eric Wedge
3) Fernando "i will no longer be an indian in the morning" Cabrera



this is a tough loss


I'm not sure I'd put Lee first. Cabrera is a MLB reliever, or so his soon-to-be-updated resume will say, and he needs to give up less than 4 runs per appearance and allow less than 100% of his inherited runners to score.


Regardless of how you rank them, Ferd will be gone tomorrow (or as close-to as possible) and Lee will still be in the rotation. Right now, his performance and how quickly he can fix it is far more crucial to this club and their chances of winning the division. He's just not right.
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Unread postby pod2dawg » Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:05 pm

cleveland yankees wrote::cry :cry: nixon sucks


If Bonds is the "cream-n-clear" Trot is the human Synvisc experiment. And it isn't working.
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Unread postby cleveland yankees » Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:12 pm

pod2dawg wrote:
cleveland yankees wrote::cry :cry: nixon sucks


If Bonds is the "cream-n-clear" Trot is the human Synvisc experiment. And it isn't working.


i dont know what that means can you explain that in "14-year old terms?"
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Unread postby pod2dawg » Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:23 pm

No problem Cle-Yank,

First you know about Bonds using "cream-n-clear" ( testosterone & growth hormone) rubbing it onto and into his body contributing to his freakish size, power, and looks. Well, I agreed with you on Trot and tried to be funny and alluded to Synvisc ( a chicken cartilage derivative Doctors inject into patients with bad knees ) . Have you seen Trot run? He kind of looks like he is on roller skates, looks like bad knees to me and I'm sure the Tribe Docs have probably tried these.....not working.
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Unread postby cleveland yankees » Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:27 am

k ty
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Bright side

Unread postby jb » Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:42 am

We get a B List after a loss by Cliff Lee.

It ought to be suitable for framing.

I really thought we were gonna do it in the 9th, and yes, Trot is flotsam.
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Unread postby Prosecutor » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:39 am

Wedge made three huge mistakes last night.

1. He left Lee in the game with the bases loaded, one out, and the Tribe trailing 3-2 in the 6th. The announcers were calling for Perez, who has been nails in those situations lately. (In fact, he came in and struck out the side later in the game). Anyway, Lee gives up a two-run single and it's 5-2.

2. Then, he brings in Cabrera with two runners on and the game still within reach. Cabrera implodes and it's 11-2. If Cabrera had been pitching well, I wouldn't second guess Wedge. But the guy hasn't had a good outing since April, and he hasn't pitched in 10 days. When Wedge brought him in I was thinking, "It's it a little early to concede this game?"

3. Hafner gets a single in the 8th with two out to make it 11-10. Wedge brings in Ben Francisco to run for him. Why he used Francisco instead of Rouse I have no idea. If he had Rouse pinch run, he would have had Francisco to pinch hit in the 9th instead of Nixon. Francisco has been outstanding against right-handers.

Maybe he thought if Francisco ran for Hafner, then Francisco would bat in Hafner's spot next time around, instead of Rouse. True, but he could always pinch hit Francisco for Rouse if it came to that. AFIAC, Wedge wasted our best pinch hitter and had nobody left but Nixon to pinch hit for Michaels with the game on the line.

The hilarious thing is that in Hoynes column in the PD this morning, he uses last nights game as evidence of why Wedge got the contract extension.

I think that Wedge has done a good job overall this year, but he really laid an egg last night. The only thing that makes sense is the point someone made earlier; that Cabrera is out of options and they need to throw him in the fire and see if he responds, as opposed to burying him deep in the bullpen and only using him in garbage time.
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Unread postby Prosecutor » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:53 am

After going back and checking Cabrera's stats, I stand corrected. In Cabrera's last seven appearances he has pitched 11 innings, given up 3 earned runs, and struck out 8. It looked like he was starting to find himself again after a very rocky May.

Against the White Sox this year he pitched 2.2 innings and gave up one hit, no runs, and struck out five.

So I suppose there was some justification for bringing in Cabrera in that situation.

I still would have liked to see Francisco at the plate in the 9th with Gutierrez on second, though.
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Unread postby peeker643 » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:57 am

At some point you have to use Cabrera. Apparently that was it. And by using him Wedge may have helped this team immensely. They can't ignore the bullpen issue any more. They're short. They bring Perez on there and they're stretching the hell out of the two guys that are effective in Perez and Raffy.


The game last night should have hit the front office upside the head with the fact that they need another bullpen arm to seal some leaks.
Nixon blows and it would be nice to have someone different than him. But as I said last night, Gutierrez and Francisco are giving all they have.

Against RHP the two are 20/69, 5 HR. Nixon has two fewer HRs and 8 more RBI in 120 more abs.

Concentrate on the bullpen, not on a left handed platoon hitter. You can get something better than Nixon during the waiver period.
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Unread postby OldDawg » Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:07 am

Prosecutor wrote:Wedge made three huge mistakes last night.

1. He left Lee in the game with the bases loaded, one out, and the Tribe trailing 3-2 in the 6th. The announcers were calling for Perez, who has been nails in those situations lately. (In fact, he came in and struck out the side later in the game). Anyway, Lee gives up a two-run single and it's 5-2.

2. Then, he brings in Cabrera with two runners on and the game still within reach. Cabrera implodes and it's 11-2. If Cabrera had been pitching well, I wouldn't second guess Wedge. But the guy hasn't had a good outing since April, and he hasn't pitched in 10 days. When Wedge brought him in I was thinking, "It's it a little early to concede this game?"

3. Hafner gets a single in the 8th with two out to make it 11-10. Wedge brings in Ben Francisco to run for him. Why he used Francisco instead of Rouse I have no idea. If he had Rouse pinch run, he would have had Francisco to pinch hit in the 9th instead of Nixon. Francisco has been outstanding against right-handers.


I would add not using Shoppach as a pinch hitter in the ninth either for Michaels or for Barfield (who was looking mystified at the plate last night). Shoppach is batting .330 this year and is an experienced player who can handle a little pressure. I don't get it.
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