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Could Marte get dealt this year???

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Could Marte get dealt this year???

Unread postby MadThinker88 » Fri May 25, 2007 4:07 pm

:idea:

Might Marte become a trading chip for Shapiro as the season goes on? If so, what clubs might be interested in trying to salvage Marte ??

The way things are going, it is clear that Peralta has rebounded to a degree after a horrid 2006, but it is also become clear that a more defensive minded player at short would greatly help the pitching staff. Astrubal Cabrera looks to be that guy. Unless Marte can take charge of the opportunity given to him, perhaps a move over to 3rd for Peralta might be the best for everyone involved.
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri May 25, 2007 4:12 pm

I most certainly believe Marte could be dealt this year. While he has struggled, he is still very young with upside. A team like the Pirates, Devil Rays or whomever....teams trying to build and who will be much more patient with a young player most certainly will be interested in Marte.

I think a position switch for Peralta is looming. Not during the season, but maybe in the offseason. Peralta at 3B, and someone from within like Cabrera at SS or a FA signing makes sense.
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Unread postby VultureHxC » Fri May 25, 2007 4:20 pm

i know this has been mentioned before but i don't think shapiro would trade marte because of the brandon phillips debaucle. he doesn't want to give up on a guy that could be a very good player just because they are very young and struggling with limited experience in the majors. we saw it happen to phillips and now he puts up solid numbers and plays a pretty decent 2nd base. marte could become the same way. and if he develops defensively and plays like he did in the low minors, i think that makes peralta less of a defensive liability for now. i do see a trade of marte in the next year or two if cabrera proves to be a major league hitter or a suitable FA SS becomes available and is signed/traded for but marte needs to prove to be a solid player before that trade can happen.
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Unread postby StewieG » Fri May 25, 2007 4:43 pm

VultureHxC wrote:i know this has been mentioned before but i don't think shapiro would trade marte because of the brandon phillips debaucle. he doesn't want to give up on a guy that could be a very good player just because they are very young and struggling with limited experience in the majors. we saw it happen to phillips and now he puts up solid numbers and plays a pretty decent 2nd base. marte could become the same way. and if he develops defensively and plays like he did in the low minors, i think that makes peralta less of a defensive liability for now. i do see a trade of marte in the next year or two if cabrera proves to be a major league hitter or a suitable FA SS becomes available and is signed/traded for but marte needs to prove to be a solid player before that trade can happen.


I see where you're coming from. But this situation isn't the same. We got rid of Phillips because Wedge can't deal with punks, no matter how talented they are.

If we trade Marte, it's to improve the team. Phillips was a dump, pure and simple.
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Unread postby DarNoor » Fri May 25, 2007 6:23 pm

Speaking of Wedge and Phillips, has Wedge ever answered for that? I have never heard him make any comments about his involvement with that whole situation. Come to think of it, i haven't heard Shapio talk about it either.
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Unread postby jfiling » Fri May 25, 2007 7:47 pm

Consigliere wrote:I think a position switch for Peralta is looming. Not during the season, but maybe in the offseason. Peralta at 3B, and someone from within like Cabrera at SS or a FA signing makes sense.


Until he finally decided to do some offseason conditioning, I was starting to think that Peralta might be the answer at right guard for the Browns.

He's definitely going to end up at 3b at some point in his career; maybe AzCab will make it sooner rather than later.

I get to see AzCab play Monday, and I think Chuck Lofgren is getting the start. I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.
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Unread postby pup » Fri May 25, 2007 8:09 pm

I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Shit yes we want them.
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Unread postby MadThinker88 » Fri May 25, 2007 8:10 pm

I get to see AzCab play Monday, and I think Chuck Lofgren is getting the start. I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Post away. I was hoping to get to that game but it was sold out before this past Wednesday. I'll be at the game on June 5 so I will post any observations I have after that game.
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Unread postby swerb » Fri May 25, 2007 8:15 pm

Pup wrote:
I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Shit yes we want them.

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Unread postby jfiling » Fri May 25, 2007 8:30 pm

MadThinker88 wrote:
I get to see AzCab play Monday, and I think Chuck Lofgren is getting the start. I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Post away. I was hoping to get to that game but it was sold out before this past Wednesday. I'll be at the game on June 5 so I will post any observations I have after that game.


LOL, the game's sold out because losers like me got free tickets from Subway.

Rich, you'll get a article-worthy, um, article from me for this. Assuming that I'm right and Lofgren is starting.
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Unread postby MadThinker88 » Fri May 25, 2007 8:42 pm

[quote="jfiling"]
LOL, the game's sold out because losers like me got free tickets from Subway. [/quote]

Why to you think I'm going on June 5???? They are using that game as an overflow day for the May 28 promotion. :lol:
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Unread postby jfiling » Fri May 25, 2007 8:50 pm

Swerb wrote:
Pup wrote:
I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Shit yes we want them.

Without a doubt JD ...


Hey, if you really want me to review something, I'm going to see Shaw/Blades on the 30th at the Tangier.

Somehow, I have a weird feeling there might only be two other members of the entire forum that give a rat's ass about that :? :-? :???:
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri May 25, 2007 10:45 pm

jfiling wrote:I get to see AzCab play Monday, and I think Chuck Lofgren is getting the start. I'll give some amateur scouting reports if anyone wants them.


Definitely!

Pass along what you see. If ya don't write about it, I could even include you in my report next week. :mrgreen:
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Unread postby captain_wahoo » Sat May 26, 2007 12:17 am

How about Marte, Fernando Cabrera, Cliff Lee, and Gutierrez to the Marlins for Miguel Cabrera?
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Unread postby StewieG » Sat May 26, 2007 12:37 am

I say hell yes.

They say hell no.

Let me put it this way: If we trade that, to get Miguel Cabrera, I will drive up to Cleveland and please Shapiro myself with some sort of sex act. They will want so much more.
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Unread postby consigliere » Sat May 26, 2007 8:19 am

One caveat to all the Marte talk:

Don't give up him too soon. It is normal for fans to sour on guys when they don't produce, and one of the hardest things as a baseball fan is to be patient with players.

Marte is definitely struggling.....but I am in no rush to dump him. Guy is still VERY young and has upside. Since we are in contender mode, the best modus operandi of the org to take it to stick him in Buffalo and play. I don't think we can survive with him flailing away, even at the bottom of the batting order, in Cleveland this year.

That said, I have no problem using him as bait in a trade.....but I ain't dumping him. I still see good things in him, and it is WAY too early to write him off (cf. Phillips, Brandon).
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Unread postby ArtGold » Sun May 27, 2007 5:22 pm

Right now we would be selling low, and the return for Marte will be significantly less than we paid a couple years ago. I think he will still probably work out, Matt Williams, Mike Schmidt and Dean Palmer all got off to fairly poor starts their first 500-800 ABs, but were able to get into decent grooves.

I expect him to probably be OK, and hit in the .250-.260 range with 25 plus HRs annually, and a decent number of walks. I saw the comments about Peralta and his size, but I think he is fine right where he is and will not get heavy. Cal Ripkin wasn't a small SS, and did OK for a few years.
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Unread postby Babrook » Sun May 27, 2007 7:23 pm

captain_wahoo wrote:How about Marte, Fernando Cabrera, Cliff Lee, and Gutierrez to the Marlins for Miguel Cabrera?


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Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun May 27, 2007 8:02 pm

Peralta is putting up huge offensive numbers for a shortstop, and Shap likes that. As a 3rd baseman his offense would be good, but nothing special. So I'm inclined to think they're happy with Jhonny at SS, especially since his defense has improved.

That being said, they traded Kouzmanoff to get a key starter and they could do the same with Marte if it could get them a right-handed power bat in left field.
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Unread postby furls » Sun May 27, 2007 9:53 pm

I'd dump Marte in a heartbeat for a bag of balls. I stand by my initial take on Marte after the Crisp trade.

If you have a "great" prospect than you dont trade him unless you are getting something totally awesome in return. He was dealt to the tribe for a what some of you are calling an average outfielder, either you are wrong and crisp is better than previously stated, the red sox are stupid, or the marte is overrated. You pick.
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Unread postby paulcousineau » Thu May 31, 2007 10:46 am

I think a position switch for Peralta is looming. Not during the season, but maybe in the offseason. Peralta at 3B, and someone from within like Cabrera at SS or a FA signing makes sense.


I seem to remember the Indians trying this in Buffalo when both Phillips and Peralta were there and his quickness (or lack thereof) made him a lousy 3B.

I'm not sure you can just say, let's move the guy to 3B if he's not suited for the position.

I've had NO problem with Peralta's fielding this year, completely independent of his hitting. Unless Cabrera completely crushes AA and AAA pitching this year, he won't see Cleveland until mid-2008 or even 2009.

A lot can happen between now and then.
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Unread postby Mcreek » Sat Jun 02, 2007 6:08 pm

Consigliere wrote:I most certainly believe Marte could be dealt this year. While he has struggled, he is still very young with upside. A team like the Pirates, Devil Rays or whomever....teams trying to build and who will be much more patient with a young player most certainly will be interested in Marte.

I think a position switch for Peralta is looming. Not during the season, but maybe in the offseason. Peralta at 3B, and someone from within like Cabrera at SS or a FA signing makes sense.


Not so fast on the Cabrera to SS and Honny to third with Barfield struggles at second especially with his woeful plate discipline. Shapiro can't afford to make another bonehead move of a slow developing prospect like Marte and Brandon Phillips. Hart took alot of heat and deservedly so for giving away the likes of Burnitz-Giles-Sexson, Casey, Graves, Kline. So far Shapiros list is sample size but starting to grow with the likes of Luke Scott, Ryan Church, Jeremy Guthrie and Brandon Phillips. Lets not add Marte to this list for crying out loud.
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Unread postby ArtGold » Sun Jun 03, 2007 2:11 pm

I don't know how much patience the Tribe will have with Marte. If options begin to emerge from the farm system in the next year or so, they may be inclined to deal him, and let Blake be the short term solution.

Depends on what he can get for you, either himself or as part of a package.

Goedert and Hodges may ultimately be better options for Cleveland beginning as early as 2009. In the meantime, Blake is competent given all else we have in our lineup. Should neither work out or be ready, we could take a look at Peralta or ACab at 3rd, both are actually pretty big guys and I'm not sure a ACab move wouldn't make as much sense as moving the established and hopefully successful Peralta.

Even overlooked guys like Rod Choy Foo could plug the hole at 3rd base in an emergency. I think he wouldn't do horribly, nor would Inglett, on a part time fill in basis. Inglett's arm isn't bad, I have actually seen this in person, and am comfortable he could man the position in an emergency.

I like Barfield at 2nd, I think he will turn into a solid contributor and perhaps even a borderline all star.
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Unread postby Mcreek » Sun Jun 03, 2007 2:57 pm

Marte's days are numbered because he will be out of options next year wich will lead to another Brandon Phillips fiasco. They won't leave him on the bench next year since he can only play 3rdbase and Blake will be extended 2-3 years. So to quote Wedge after the Phillips/Vazquez debacle" He isn't a good fit" and will either be traded for a marginal prospect or DFA'. Inglett or Rouse will be the 2008 version of Vazquez.

Goedert and Hodges are both shaky defensively. Hodges has plate discipline issues as well as injury problems. Goedert as you know was a little old for low A and will have to repeat his success at the tough Carolina league. In any case best case scenario is one of them will be ready by 2010. Astrubal won't be ready until 2009 but hopefully he continues to post great numbers accrossed the board.
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