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Is there any chance for the playoffs?

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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby leadpipe » Fri Aug 08, 2014 5:03 pm

justmebd wrote:I don't remember if I said it here, so I'll repeat it: Terry Francona was a big part of the Indians short-lived playoff run last year. He willed that team to it's one postseason game IMO.

Not going to happen two years in a row with cheap owners and a front office that's more concerned with winning meaningless MLB Front Office honors than talking said cheapass owners into actually fielding a winning team.

"We're the best run mid-market team in the league" is the kind of BS I hear coming from that shitstain Shapiro on a regular basis. Who gives a fuck? Where's our ring?

This front office has been completely incapable of drafting and developing talent with any kind of consistency. The 90's Front Office did that in spades. I'm not sure Shapiro and Antonetti know the difference between sabremetrics and a hot dog.

I get it, the Dolans aren't going to pay Cy Young award winners. So guess what, the fans will hate you and stop attending games. Like has been stated in this thread before, spend money to make money you twats.

If The Klubes pitches his way to a Cy Young, the Dolans have two choices, pay him or sell the team. If they just go out and trade him like they did C.C. and Lee, I don't give two shits about their bold new stadium renovation, the attendance will continue to drop. Especially if you get the kind of return those two trades brought in (Not much).


But in essence, you are explaining why managers don't matter.

Francona is very much like HALL OF FAME manager Joe Torre, albeit a little more alert. Anyways, player friendly guys who say the right things and pretty much know how to run a clubhouse - beer and fried chicken aside.

But here's how their REALLY similiar to each other. When they got good players that perform well they win, when they got mediocre players that perform poorly they lose. Check their records. Darn near perfect correlation in this regard EVERY year.

Kinda like Casey Stengel.

Or a block of wood.

Hays in the barn by the time you're a big leaguer. Good teams win, bad teams lose, no matter what old guy is propped up at the end of the bench.

Point being, if any of you out there think that Terry Francona is giving the Indians some sort of advantage over other teams in the league, you're going to be disappointed in the results.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby TouchEmAllTime » Fri Aug 08, 2014 5:05 pm

motherscratcher wrote:
1Perry wrote:Hindsight and all but with one move the team would likely be a real wild card threat. If they had signed Kazmir.


On the other hand they could have thrown their lot back in with Ubaldo


I wish we could have him going every five days instead of Josh Tomlin.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby 1Perry » Fri Aug 08, 2014 5:18 pm

motherscratcher wrote:
1Perry wrote:Hindsight and all but with one move the team would likely be a real wild card threat. If they had signed Kazmir.


On the other hand they could have thrown their lot back in with Ubaldo



They could have and you would think the obvious would make a difference but obviously it doesn't.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby motherscratcher » Fri Aug 08, 2014 5:43 pm

1Perry wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:
1Perry wrote:Hindsight and all but with one move the team would likely be a real wild card threat. If they had signed Kazmir.


On the other hand they could have thrown their lot back in with Ubaldo



They could have and you would think the obvious would make a difference but obviously it doesn't.


I don't know what that means.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby justmebd » Sat Aug 09, 2014 7:59 pm

leadpipe wrote:
justmebd wrote:I don't remember if I said it here, so I'll repeat it: Terry Francona was a big part of the Indians short-lived playoff run last year. He willed that team to it's one postseason game IMO.

Not going to happen two years in a row with cheap owners and a front office that's more concerned with winning meaningless MLB Front Office honors than talking said cheapass owners into actually fielding a winning team.

"We're the best run mid-market team in the league" is the kind of BS I hear coming from that shitstain Shapiro on a regular basis. Who gives a fuck? Where's our ring?

This front office has been completely incapable of drafting and developing talent with any kind of consistency. The 90's Front Office did that in spades. I'm not sure Shapiro and Antonetti know the difference between sabremetrics and a hot dog.

I get it, the Dolans aren't going to pay Cy Young award winners. So guess what, the fans will hate you and stop attending games. Like has been stated in this thread before, spend money to make money you twats.

If The Klubes pitches his way to a Cy Young, the Dolans have two choices, pay him or sell the team. If they just go out and trade him like they did C.C. and Lee, I don't give two shits about their bold new stadium renovation, the attendance will continue to drop. Especially if you get the kind of return those two trades brought in (Not much).


But in essence, you are explaining why managers don't matter.

Francona is very much like HALL OF FAME manager Joe Torre, albeit a little more alert. Anyways, player friendly guys who say the right things and pretty much know how to run a clubhouse - beer and fried chicken aside.

But here's how their REALLY similiar to each other. When they got good players that perform well they win, when they got mediocre players that perform poorly they lose. Check their records. Darn near perfect correlation in this regard EVERY year.

Kinda like Casey Stengel.

Or a block of wood.

Hays in the barn by the time you're a big leaguer. Good teams win, bad teams lose, no matter what old guy is propped up at the end of the bench.

Point being, if any of you out there think that Terry Francona is giving the Indians some sort of advantage over other teams in the league, you're going to be disappointed in the results.

Well, not really. I said Francona willed the team to the playoffs last year, so I am giving him credit. Then I followed that up by saying the FO is so bad it doesn't matter this year, so while that would appear to validate your point, it really does not.

I think with a borderline team like the Indians last year, the manager does make a difference. Too much either way, and yes, the manager is meaningless. Last year was a "Case Study" of when a manager can and does make a difference.

I think the Indians this year have regressed, so Francona is swimming against the current. That being said, I do think he's helped keep this team from completely cashing it in like they did under Acta, so there's another point for my argument, FWIW.

I hate the Dolans.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby leadpipe » Sat Aug 09, 2014 10:30 pm

justmebd wrote:
leadpipe wrote:
justmebd wrote:I don't remember if I said it here, so I'll repeat it: Terry Francona was a big part of the Indians short-lived playoff run last year. He willed that team to it's one postseason game IMO.

Not going to happen two years in a row with cheap owners and a front office that's more concerned with winning meaningless MLB Front Office honors than talking said cheapass owners into actually fielding a winning team.

"We're the best run mid-market team in the league" is the kind of BS I hear coming from that shitstain Shapiro on a regular basis. Who gives a fuck? Where's our ring?

This front office has been completely incapable of drafting and developing talent with any kind of consistency. The 90's Front Office did that in spades. I'm not sure Shapiro and Antonetti know the difference between sabremetrics and a hot dog.

I get it, the Dolans aren't going to pay Cy Young award winners. So guess what, the fans will hate you and stop attending games. Like has been stated in this thread before, spend money to make money you twats.

If The Klubes pitches his way to a Cy Young, the Dolans have two choices, pay him or sell the team. If they just go out and trade him like they did C.C. and Lee, I don't give two shits about their bold new stadium renovation, the attendance will continue to drop. Especially if you get the kind of return those two trades brought in (Not much).


But in essence, you are explaining why managers don't matter.

Francona is very much like HALL OF FAME manager Joe Torre, albeit a little more alert. Anyways, player friendly guys who say the right things and pretty much know how to run a clubhouse - beer and fried chicken aside.

But here's how their REALLY similiar to each other. When they got good players that perform well they win, when they got mediocre players that perform poorly they lose. Check their records. Darn near perfect correlation in this regard EVERY year.

Kinda like Casey Stengel.

Or a block of wood.

Hays in the barn by the time you're a big leaguer. Good teams win, bad teams lose, no matter what old guy is propped up at the end of the bench.

Point being, if any of you out there think that Terry Francona is giving the Indians some sort of advantage over other teams in the league, you're going to be disappointed in the results.

Well, not really. I said Francona willed the team to the playoffs last year, so I am giving him credit. Then I followed that up by saying the FO is so bad it doesn't matter this year, so while that would appear to validate your point, it really does not.

I think with a borderline team like the Indians last year, the manager does make a difference. Too much either way, and yes, the manager is meaningless. Last year was a "Case Study" of when a manager can and does make a difference.

I think the Indians this year have regressed, so Francona is swimming against the current. That being said, I do think he's helped keep this team from completely cashing it in like they did under Acta, so there's another point for my argument, FWIW.

I hate the Dolans.


There's not a team that makes this years playoffs that wouldn't make it with ANY major league manager leading them, and there ain't a team not making the playoffs that would if you gave them the "best" manager.

Again, history of the league...couldn't name a manager that consistently had guys "overacheive." Torre was great in the lockkeroom - until he went to LA without Jeter. O'neill and Williams. Scoscia was the next genius in handling the bullpen when career minor leaguer Donnelly was out of his mind and K-Rod was electric. Than they regressed - and he wasn't. Is LaRussa the genius, or Matheny, maybe any hump you throw in a great organization is gonna win.

The HISTORY of the league. Hundred GD years.

By the way, a guy on his couch, with any kind of familiarity with the team, can predict about any move a major league manager is gonna make. Christ, relief specialists, platoons...it's all set-up before the season starts, and they all do the same shit. Francona ain't willing anyone more or less in a given year. He's a good guy that the players like, that sits there on the bench chewing gum for three hours.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:22 pm

What tremendous grit and fortitude shown by this team winning two straight after the 4 game losing streak!!

:hide:



I was happy to see the guy I've been touting the last few months as the number 2 bullpen arm make a very good start. He was Kluber like for those 5 innings!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun Aug 10, 2014 5:52 pm

Tribe keeps hanging around. Carrasco stepped up with five scoreless innings. Kipnis had three hits from the leadoff spot and JRam had a hit and two sacrifices from the 2-hole. That's three productive at-bats, which is more than we ever got from Asdrubal in that spot. The table-setters did their job and Brantley got the job done with 2 RBI's.

Kipnis is 8-for-21 over the last five games for a .429 average. He won't keep that up, but it sure beats Michael Bourn in the leadoff spot.

Unfortunately, Murphy is on the DL. The guy was hitting .343 since the All-Star break, so the timing is bad. The good news is they finally pulled the plug on Swisher, who has a bum knee which is clearly affecting his ability to hit. Now Holt and Walters get their shot.

The odds are pretty long for the playoffs since the Indians will have to climb over four teams to get that second wild card spot.

Chisenhall's average continues to plummet as he consistently gets two strikes on him and then chases a pitch out of the zone. He's also pulling everything, unlike in the first half when he was using the whole field. I think that 3-HR game ruined him.

Since that amazing game on June 9 when he went 5-for-5 with 3 HR's and 9 RBI's, Chiz has hit .213 with 4 HR's and 14 RBI's in 178 AB's. Actually, when Francona gave him a day off on June 12, Chiz had an 8-game hitting streak going where he was an incredible 18-for-35. After the day off, he went into a tailspin from which he never recovered. He had a total of 5 RBI's the entire month of July. He's hitting .182 in August. He went from the best hitter in baseball (.393) to one of the worst in 48 hours.

If Tito had watched Bull Durham he'd know you never mess with a streak.

So on we go, staying within one hot streak of the wild card. But the Royals are the team that's hot now.

These next 14 games will be crucial because its a soft spot in the schedule and the Indians have a chance to make up some ground.

Arizona - 13 games under .500 (2 games)
Baltimore - 17 games over .500 (3 games)
Minnesota - 13 games under .500 (3 games)
Houston - 20 games under .500 (3 games)
White Sox - 6 games under .500 (3 games)

After those 14 games it's do-or-die with seven in a row against KC and Detroit. If we're still in the running after these next five series, we'll have some interesting baseball to watch.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby jerryroche » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:54 am

Excellent post, Pros.

But in a larger sense, does making the playoffs really matter if it's one-and-out like last year? Mediocre is still mediocre.

I love the game of baseball, but I don't think that merely "making the playoffs" is an acceptable goal at any time of the season for any team. But that's just Jerry being Jerry.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:07 am

Grit & Fortitude!!!

Won't Quit!!!!

Still in it!!!!

Francona!!!!

Next month critical!!!!

Yawn.

I'm sure Bauer, Carrasco, Tomlin, Salazar and House will step up behind Kluber and run this shit down.

Jesus. Watch and enjoy but stop with the playoff stuff.

Brohio!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:29 am

jerryroche wrote:Excellent post, Pros.

But in a larger sense, does making the playoffs really matter if it's one-and-out like last year? Mediocre is still mediocre.

I love the game of baseball, but I don't think that merely "making the playoffs" is an acceptable goal at any time of the season for any team. But that's just Jerry being Jerry.


Are you honestly telling me September of 2013 was not enjoyable to follow?? Seriously? Yes, why play any games at all. Professional sports is pretty much idiotic following your theory to the end. Call me crazy, but I'm pretty sure we had a better chance to advance to the first round last year playing that game than if they had gone 71-91.

What people really don't like to accept is that losing games is 100 percent as important as winning games. The fact remains that without the losing team, you have zero winning teams. You simply can't have a champion without someone who loses it, with all the losers falling in line behind that loser. I would argue almost it is indeed more important to lose than win.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby jerryroche » Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:54 am

scrambler wrote:Are you honestly telling me September of 2013 was not enjoyable to follow?? Seriously? Yes, why play any games at all. Professional sports is pretty much idiotic following your theory to the end. Call me crazy, but I'm pretty sure we had a better chance to advance to the first round last year playing that game than if they had gone 71-91.
What people really don't like to accept is that losing games is 100 percent as important as winning games. The fact remains that without the losing team, you have zero winning teams. You simply can't have a champion without someone who loses it, with all the losers falling in line behind that loser. I would argue almost it is indeed more important to lose than win.

You're not crazy. Your loyalty is admirable. Your logic is almost impeccable -- except for losing being more important than winning. It's only more important if you learn lessons from the losing -- but down at Progressive Field, it's always wash, rinse, repeat.

And, yes, last September was exciting. I would venture to say that the old adage "Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst" may apply here, just like it has in past seasons.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:14 pm

Like I said, with four teams to get past the chances are very slim. But with 11 of the next 14 games against sub-.500 teams (some of them VERY sub-.500), the Tribe could tease us for a while longer.

But then comes seven games against KC and Detroit - the Bataan death march. If we could only figure out a way to start Kluber in three of those games.

Remember that one year when the Twins went 81-81, won their division, and went on to win the World Series behind three wins by Frank Viola? OK, so that's a once in a century occurance, but it happened last century.

Just sayin'.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:26 pm

You forgot

Grinders!


peeker643 wrote:Grit & Fortitude!!!

Won't Quit!!!!

Still in it!!!!

Francona!!!!

Next month critical!!!!

Yawn.

I'm sure Bauer, Carrasco, Tomlin, Salazar and House will step up behind Kluber and run this shit down.

Jesus. Watch and enjoy but stop with the playoff stuff.

Brohio!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Thu Aug 14, 2014 6:20 am

Very discouraging 12-inning shutout loss to the D-Backs.

The outfield is a mess. Bourn is still out, Murphy is injured. Dickerson is hitting .087 in August ((2-for-23). After getting off to a great start he has 5 hits in his last 41 AB's.

Raburn is hitting a robust .143 in August. This comes on the heels of .182 and .188 in June and July. He shouldn't be anywhere near a batter's box, but with the injuries to Bourn and Murphy, Francona doesn't have much choice.

Actually, he does. Now that Holt and Walters are on board there's no reason to play Raburn.

With Bourn and Murphy out and Raburn and Dickerson all but useless at the dish, Francona is in a bind.

I can't stand to watch Mike Aviles hit. He hacks awkwardly at any pitch within spitting distance of the strike zone. I've never seen a uglier swing by a non-pitcher in the major leagues. He practically falls down after every swing. Aviles is hitting .167 in August with an OBP of .211. He's also a double-play machine. I hate to see him or Raburn coming up with a runner on first and less than two out. In that situation I'm hoping for a strikeout to limit the damage.

I can't see the Indians making the playoffs this year as long as Aviles, Raburn, and Dickerson are getting playing time. When they're all in the lineup at the same time, like last night, you get 12 innings with no runs scored.

I don't get why Tito didn't pinch hit Chisenhall for Aviles with two runners on and one out late in the game. Maybe the D-Backs would have brought in a lefty, but I'd still rather have Chiz hitting. Instead he stuck with Aviles and of course he grounded into an inning-ending double play.

We sure have a great bullpen, though. Although we lost the game when CC Lee issued a leadoff walk in the 12th. As soon as he walked that guy I knew the game was over. Never walk the leadoff hitter - they always score.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby redneckofsc » Thu Aug 14, 2014 7:08 am

This offense reminds me of the days of Blake, Boone, and Broussard. Just pitiful.

The days of Ramirez, Thome, Justice, Belle, Sexson, Burks, Gonzalez, etc are gone and will never come close to coming back.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Larvell Blanks » Thu Aug 14, 2014 8:30 am

Prosecutor wrote:Very discouraging 12-inning shutout loss to the D-Backs.

The outfield is a mess. Bourn is still out, Murphy is injured. Dickerson is hitting .087 in August ((2-for-23). After getting off to a great start he has 5 hits in his last 41 AB's.

Raburn is hitting a robust .143 in August. This comes on the heels of .182 and .188 in June and July. He shouldn't be anywhere near a batter's box, but with the injuries to Bourn and Murphy, Francona doesn't have much choice.

Actually, he does. Now that Holt and Walters are on board there's no reason to play Raburn.

With Bourn and Murphy out and Raburn and Dickerson all but useless at the dish, Francona is in a bind.

I can't stand to watch Mike Aviles hit. He hacks awkwardly at any pitch within spitting distance of the strike zone. I've never seen a uglier swing by a non-pitcher in the major leagues. He practically falls down after every swing. Aviles is hitting .167 in August with an OBP of .211. He's also a double-play machine. I hate to see him or Raburn coming up with a runner on first and less than two out. In that situation I'm hoping for a strikeout to limit the damage.

I can't see the Indians making the playoffs this year as long as Aviles, Raburn, and Dickerson are getting playing time. When they're all in the lineup at the same time, like last night, you get 12 innings with no runs scored.

I don't get why Tito didn't pinch hit Chisenhall for Aviles with two runners on and one out late in the game. Maybe the D-Backs would have brought in a lefty, but I'd still rather have Chiz hitting. Instead he stuck with Aviles and of course he grounded into an inning-ending double play.

We sure have a great bullpen, though. Although we lost the game when CC Lee issued a leadoff walk in the 12th. As soon as he walked that guy I knew the game was over. Never walk the leadoff hitter - they always score.


What about the other 6 in the lineup? It's not like they were wearing out the basepaths either.

This team won't make the playoffs b/c they are inconsistant and a poor offense overall.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby WiscTribeFan » Thu Aug 14, 2014 8:46 am

redneckofsc wrote:This offense reminds me of the days of Blake, Boone, and Broussard. Just pitiful.

The days of Ramirez, Thome, Justice, Belle, Sexson, Burks, Gonzalez, etc are gone and will never come close to coming back.


Actually, they are, just not with the Indians. The Cubs are going to have a pretty impressive offense in the very near future.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby redneckofsc » Thu Aug 14, 2014 9:21 am

WiscTribeFan wrote:
redneckofsc wrote:This offense reminds me of the days of Blake, Boone, and Broussard. Just pitiful.

The days of Ramirez, Thome, Justice, Belle, Sexson, Burks, Gonzalez, etc are gone and will never come close to coming back.


Actually, they are, just not with the Indians. The Cubs are going to have a pretty impressive offense in the very near future.


And they will be sending out the equivalent of Mark Clark, Chad Ogea, Dave Burba, wash outs like Jack McDowell, and Doc Gooden to the mound.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby CAVSTRIBEBROWNSin07! » Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:49 am

redneckofsc wrote:
WiscTribeFan wrote:
redneckofsc wrote:This offense reminds me of the days of Blake, Boone, and Broussard. Just pitiful.

The days of Ramirez, Thome, Justice, Belle, Sexson, Burks, Gonzalez, etc are gone and will never come close to coming back.


Actually, they are, just not with the Indians. The Cubs are going to have a pretty impressive offense in the very near future.


And they will be sending out the equivalent of Mark Clark, Chad Ogea, Dave Burba, wash outs like Jack McDowell, and Doc Gooden to the mound.


Except the Cubs can go out this offseason and sign Lester and Scherzer for $50+ million without blinking an eye. Or Scherzer this year and Price next year. That's why they're willing to trade Samardzija for Addison Russell.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:44 am

Prosecutor wrote:Very discouraging 12-inning shutout loss to the D-Backs.

The outfield is a mess. Bourn is still out, Murphy is injured. Dickerson is hitting .087 in August ((2-for-23). After getting off to a great start he has 5 hits in his last 41 AB's.

Raburn is hitting a robust .143 in August. This comes on the heels of .182 and .188 in June and July. He shouldn't be anywhere near a batter's box, but with the injuries to Bourn and Murphy, Francona doesn't have much choice.

Actually, he does. Now that Holt and Walters are on board there's no reason to play Raburn.

With Bourn and Murphy out and Raburn and Dickerson all but useless at the dish, Francona is in a bind.

I can't stand to watch Mike Aviles hit. He hacks awkwardly at any pitch within spitting distance of the strike zone. I've never seen a uglier swing by a non-pitcher in the major leagues. He practically falls down after every swing. Aviles is hitting .167 in August with an OBP of .211. He's also a double-play machine. I hate to see him or Raburn coming up with a runner on first and less than two out. In that situation I'm hoping for a strikeout to limit the damage.

I can't see the Indians making the playoffs this year as long as Aviles, Raburn, and Dickerson are getting playing time. When they're all in the lineup at the same time, like last night, you get 12 innings with no runs scored.

I don't get why Tito didn't pinch hit Chisenhall for Aviles with two runners on and one out late in the game. Maybe the D-Backs would have brought in a lefty, but I'd still rather have Chiz hitting. Instead he stuck with Aviles and of course he grounded into an inning-ending double play.

We sure have a great bullpen, though. Although we lost the game when CC Lee issued a leadoff walk in the 12th. As soon as he walked that guy I knew the game was over. Never walk the leadoff hitter - they always score.


It's reached the point where I'm actually looking forward to Bourn's return. He's not good but he's better than Raburn and Dickerson.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 16, 2014 9:58 pm

Really? Perhaps? I have remained fairly upbeat in confirming the team is still in the playoff race. Mostly because weird things happened last fall mainly that in Ubaldo Jimenez starts the team went 6-0 in September with him pitching brilliantly. Not one person could have foresaw that happening.

I've been bullish on Carrasco all summer insisting he should be the main setup guy ahead of Shaw since he'd not been good in the bullpen but brilliant. His bullpen stats were overwhelming. Francona pretty much refused to upgrade him from his mopup role throughout but finally turned to him to start again as all other options had run their course Granted it's only been two starts, but they've both been brilliant. Sometimes you just luck into things. Yes, it's only two starts, but it's been 4 straight months of him pitching superbly. Maybe??
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun Aug 17, 2014 8:52 am

As Zach Meisel pointed out:

Over the last six games, Indians starting pitchers have limited the opposition to three earned runs over 39 innings (0.69 ERA), with five walks and 42 strikeouts over the span.


Some of those games were against the weak D-Backs lineup, but there's nothing wrong with the Orioles lineup, even with Machado out and Chris Davis struggling. So far this series the O's have scored one run in 20 innings on Kluber, Carrasco, and the pen.

Carrasco has now thrown 12 shutout innings in two starts. His approach of pitching from the stretch and going all out from the first pitch (as if he's only going to pitch one inning) is working beautifully. If he can keep it up he could be this year's Ubaldo.

I suppose if the starters can keep pitching like this we have a shot. The problem is that KC has come on strong and taken the division lead rather than fading away. So now we have to overtake Detroit (among others) and I have a hard time seeing us doing that.

Maybe if we can manipulate the rotation so we have Kluber, Bauer, and Carrasco facing the Tigers....
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby British_Pharaoh » Sun Aug 17, 2014 9:30 am

If Carrasco and Kluber keep doing their shit. If Tomlin and Bauer can have more quality starts than not the rest of the way then we can do it.

4.5 games back of WC and 5 in the division. I think division is the best shot because there are only 2 teams to surmount, whereas with the WC there are 4 teams ahead of us.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:43 am

Prosecutor wrote:As Zach Meisel pointed out:

Over the last six games, Indians starting pitchers have limited the opposition to three earned runs over 39 innings (0.69 ERA), with five walks and 42 strikeouts over the span.


Some of those games were against the weak D-Backs lineup, but there's nothing wrong with the Orioles lineup, even with Machado out and Chris Davis struggling. So far this series the O's have scored one run in 20 innings on Kluber, Carrasco, and the pen.

Carrasco has now thrown 12 shutout innings in two starts. His approach of pitching from the stretch and going all out from the first pitch (as if he's only going to pitch one inning) is working beautifully. If he can keep it up he could be this year's Ubaldo.

I suppose if the starters can keep pitching like this we have a shot. The problem is that KC has come on strong and taken the division lead rather than fading away. So now we have to overtake Detroit (among others) and I have a hard time seeing us doing that.

Maybe if we can manipulate the rotation so we have Kluber, Bauer, and Carrasco facing the Tigers....


Of course there is no way the starting pitching will keep going like this. It's impossible. Just like in early June we knew Chisnehall wasn't really a .400 hitter or Santana wasn't really a .150 hitter. It is tougher this year.....last year we only had to pass either Texas or Tampa when we were 4.5 back on September 1st. We ended up passing both of them thanks to winning 10 straight to close the year. This year we have to pass two of Seattle, KC, and Detroit. And with that I'm not even considering Toronto or NY. It's not likely, but certainly doable. I will keep faith. I've been ecstatic with what Carrasco has done this year. Things like that excite me for some reason. That's been fun as has the development of Brantley into a star...not to mention Kluber becoming a legit Cy Young candidate.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby bookelly » Sun Aug 17, 2014 7:22 pm

It's a different team with Droobs and Swisher gone. Pitching steps up as soon as those statues leave? Coincidence? Nope.

I hope they call up Ushula and DH Lonnie. That kid Walters looks great but he's not quite ready. Maybe after the rosters expand we can make a run with the kids and the plus defense they bring. Clearly our starters are much more comfortable pitching to contact now. Notice how far they are going into games.

We still have a great shot. Hang on...
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Sun Aug 17, 2014 10:40 pm

This year we have to pass two of Seattle, KC, and Detroit. And with that I'm not even considering Toronto or NY


Not true. The Angels are 72-50 and have one wild card spot locked up. So the Tribe has to pass Seattle, Detroit, New York and Toronto, all of whom have better records.

The good thing is our schedule is favorable, the pitching has been solid, and the defense is better. The offense is still very inconsistent. We might have the worst hitting outfield in baseball with Bourn, Dickerson, Raburn and sometimes Aviles getting playing time. Brantley is the only productive hitter we have in the OF.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Mon Aug 18, 2014 8:18 am

The next 9 games are against some of the weak sisters of the AL. The Tribe needs to win at least six, and seven would be better. This is their chance to move up into a position to challenge for that second wild card spot before they have to take on KC and Detroit.

Unfortunately, the offense has only generated 30 runs in the last 11 games. That isn't going to get it done, unless the starters continue to totally dominate, which is unrealistic.

The problem is simply that the batting order has too many minor leaguers (JRam, Walters, Perez), major league backups (Dickerson, Aviles), and slumping starters (Chisenhall, Kipnis, Bourn), leaving Brantley, Gomes, and Santana as the only productive bats right now.

They need Chisenhall, Kipnis, Bourn, and one of the rookies to step up.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Wed Aug 20, 2014 7:03 am

So far, so good as the Tribe takes the opener against the Twins 7-5, despite being down 5-0 after the first five hitters. Great job by Bauer in settling down and getting into the 5th inning with no more runs allowed to give the offense a chance.

Francona did a tremendous job managing the game, as he brought in the right pitcher in the right situation every time. He managed like a playoff game, using eight pitchers. After Arcia's three-run jack made it 5-0 with nobody out in the first, the Indians pitched a 9-inning shutout.

The move to pinch hit Holt for Dickerson may have been a no-brainer, but it was another Francona move that worked to perfection.

Joe Mauer can hit a line drive against the Indians any time he wants to. That guy is an amazing hitter. He's so consistent at hitting line drives up the middle that Aviles just played him there and that's how they got him in the 8th with two out and two on.

Tribe has won 6-of-8. They haven't had a hot streak all year, so now is the time they need to put one together with the next eight games against sub-.500 teams.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Wed Aug 20, 2014 7:12 am

Prosecutor wrote:
This year we have to pass two of Seattle, KC, and Detroit. And with that I'm not even considering Toronto or NY


Not true. The Angels are 72-50 and have one wild card spot locked up. So the Tribe has to pass Seattle, Detroit, New York and Toronto, all of whom have better records.

The good thing is our schedule is favorable, the pitching has been solid, and the defense is better. The offense is still very inconsistent. We might have the worst hitting outfield in baseball with Bourn, Dickerson, Raburn and sometimes Aviles getting playing time. Brantley is the only productive hitter we have in the OF.


What I said was completely true. I was assuming Angels and A's in playoffs. I said I wasn't considering Tor and NY...obviously we have to finish ahead of both of them. I was simply stating we'd finish ahead of them. That means we have to pass two of KC Det and Sea...one of those can finish ahead of us and we can make the playoffs. WE don't have to pass Detroit and Seattle both if we pass KC.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Wed Aug 20, 2014 5:58 pm

scrambler wrote:
What I said was completely true. I was assuming Angels and A's in playoffs. I said I wasn't considering Tor and NY...obviously we have to finish ahead of both of them. I was simply stating we'd finish ahead of them. That means we have to pass two of KC Det and Sea...one of those can finish ahead of us and we can make the playoffs. WE don't have to pass Detroit and Seattle both if we pass KC.


OK, I see what you're saying. If we pass Detroit and Seattle, for example, KC wins the division and we get the second wild card. But I think you're making it sound easier than it will be. As it stands now the division leaders are Baltimore, Los Angeles, and KC. In the race for the two wild card spots we have....

A's 74-51
Tigers 67-56
Mariners 68-58
Yankees 63-60
Blue Jays 65-62
Indians 63-61

I can't see us making up 10.5 games on the A's (or the 74-50 Angels if the A's pass them up). So we have to pass up four teams to get in. Yeah, I guess if you just arbitrarily dismiss two of them, we only need to pass the other two.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Prosecutor » Thu Aug 21, 2014 8:14 am

The Tribe has now pitched 17 straight shutout innings against the Twins, or should I say, the Twinkies. They're not the same team without Morneau and Willingham, although Mauer is always good for a couple of hits and Dozier is a tough out.

Kluber should have another good start this afternoon, but we need the offense to continue to scrape together 3-4 runs per game. This lineup never has a big inning because there are too many weak spots, but as long as a couple of guys step up every night and the pitching holds out...

Hard to believe House has a 3.80 ERA. He's like a left-handed Josh Tomlin - he can struggle through 5-6 innings if he consistently hits his spots. He kept getting into trouble and then getting out by making good pitches with RISP.

Hagadone has really put it together this year. He's only pitched about 17 innings with the Tribe, but he has been effective and Tito is starting to use him in big situations. It's great to see the Tribe getting contributions from young up-and-coming players like Hags, JRam, CC Lee, Salazar, Bauer, Walters, and Roberto Perez. Next year they'll replace some of the dead wood on the roster like Giambi, Dickerson, Raburn, and probably Aviles, although Aviles' glove is starting to grow on me. Speaking of dead wood, Axford and Cabrera are already gone.

Bourn has surprised me. He's actually healthy and putting up some quality at-bats. Just in time.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:00 pm

The three game over .500 mark is the unbreakable barrier this year! They've hit it a few times....last time the first 3 games right after the all star break. Would've thought Kluber would get them to break it today, but alas does not look like it will occur. Not his best outing today but certainly adequate. Hughes has been really good this year, he was just better than Kluber today.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:51 pm

Quite a display of prolific baseball in those 8th and 9th innings tonight!!!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby peeker643 » Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:32 pm

scrambler wrote:Quite a display of prolific baseball in those 8th and 9th innings tonight!!!


Embarrassing.

Appears Francona rested on his many laurels and successes of last season and completely disregarded defense and base running this season.

:hide:

On a serious note, this team is disgustingly lax defensively. That's inexcusable.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 23, 2014 1:39 am

It's just the state of a .500 ball club I guess. i posted earlier on the 3 games above .500 was the multiple times high point of the team this year. I really thought this time with Kluber and Carrasco back to back they would shoot above it, but two one run scored games followed as well even with both pitching ok or even pretty well, it's back to back losses. I could somewhat understand Hughes outpitching Kluber but tonight this Peacock guy is not a very good pitcher so far, should not have been a loss with Carrasco pitching really well. Brantley is in a pretty extended cold spell for the first time this year as well....highlights how much the team is dependent on him producing. I'll still hang out and follow them closely for a few more weeks until it's completely over!!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Pabo » Sat Aug 23, 2014 9:09 am

peeker643 wrote:
scrambler wrote:Quite a display of prolific baseball in those 8th and 9th innings tonight!!!


Embarrassing.



Embarrassing is right.

Here's what Tyler Holt had to say for himself after being caught trying to steal third:

"I don't wanna say it waterfalled, but it kinda just (did as we) tried to make something happen afterwards," he said. "I felt like I gotta good jump, maybe just...I thought I saw maybe fastball away. It just happened to be a bad pitch to steal on. At least I wasn't thrown out by a mile, but bang-bang. But that's the way I play. I try to get in scoring position after something like that happens."

Umm...hey Tyler, you already were in scoring position. If that's the way you play, you need to go play somewhere else.
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- J. Giambi caught stealing, catcher to third

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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby peeker643 » Sat Aug 23, 2014 9:28 am

Still wondering how a world-class, difference-making manager allows a 25 yr old rookie with a grand total of 8 games worth of experience to have the green light there.

And wondering how that world-class, difference making dynamo apparently forget to hit infield fungos all spring long.

Odd.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby leadpipe » Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:03 pm

peeker643 wrote:Still wondering how a world-class, difference-making manager allows a 25 yr old rookie with a grand total of 8 games worth of experience to have the green light there.

And wondering how that world-class, difference making dynamo apparently forget to hit infield fungos all spring long.

Odd.


Still 5 weeks left for Francona to will em' Brian.

Perhaps just telling the fellas to catch the balls that come their way and not do stupid little league shit on the bases would be the better approach - but between attaboys and gum chewing, it appears Terry is a little short on time.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby peeker643 » Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:25 pm

leadpipe wrote:
peeker643 wrote:Still wondering how a world-class, difference-making manager allows a 25 yr old rookie with a grand total of 8 games worth of experience to have the green light there.

And wondering how that world-class, difference making dynamo apparently forget to hit infield fungos all spring long.

Odd.


Still 5 weeks left for Francona to will em' Brian.

Perhaps just telling the fellas to catch the balls that come their way and not do stupid little league shit on the bases would be the better approach - but between attaboys and gum chewing, it appears Terry is a little short on time.


Tito's will, Giambi's critical veteran presence in the locker room and God's blessings should get it done.

Just wish one of those things actually was real.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby RedDawg53 » Sat Aug 23, 2014 6:42 pm

Tribe just picked up Chris Gimenez from the Rangers for future considerations... yeah, things suck

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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 23, 2014 7:38 pm

Referencing my earlier post....just looked it up and Brantley 2 for his last 27. He struggles, the whole offense goes to pot.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 23, 2014 9:18 pm

I guess more vintage 2014 Tribe baseball....Dickerson makes a strong throw ahead of the runner but not perfect and Perez can't stop it...physical error. Salazar fails to back up home plate so he gives them an additional free run...numbskull error. Salazar pitches very well again, but his boneheaded play giving them an extra run could cost them the game. Such is the season. Even with all this stuff it appears they are still way, way outplaying the Browns tonight!!!
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:31 pm

Hurray!! Tyler Holt did not try to steal third in the 9th inning....see naysayers, Francona learned him up!! Tribe wins, Tribe wins!! Jose Ramirez walk off single. It's always awesome when the Tribe wins.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby leadpipe » Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:50 pm

The team honored their skipper on Francona Jersey Night by having the starting pitcher fail to back up home, costing them another honorary run on defense.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Am I Here Again? » Sun Aug 24, 2014 2:08 am

leadpipe wrote:...Perhaps just telling the fellas to catch the balls that come their way and not do stupid little league shit on the bases would be the better approach...

Hey, don't insult the Little Leaguers. I saw parts of those games today. Sometimes I think our Tribe could take lessons from the kids.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby leadpipe » Sun Aug 24, 2014 2:16 pm

Am I Here Again? wrote:
leadpipe wrote:...Perhaps just telling the fellas to catch the balls that come their way and not do stupid little league shit on the bases would be the better approach...

Hey, don't insult the Little Leaguers. I saw parts of those games today. Sometimes I think our Tribe could take lessons from the kids.


Jose Ramirez was just out by 100 feet, on a 90 foot basepath, trying to score on a wild pitch.

Which illicited this commentary by Rick Manning:

"What are we DOING?"
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby Am I Here Again? » Sun Aug 24, 2014 3:09 pm

Which explains why I'm defending the Little League kids and not the Tribe "kids". ;-)
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby scrambler » Sun Aug 24, 2014 4:41 pm

Tribe wins!! Tribe wins!!! I don't care what anyone says, it's always fun when the Tribe wins. The wins upset many I know.
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Re: Is there any chance for the playoffs?

Unread postby 1Perry » Sun Aug 24, 2014 4:53 pm

I think it's the games they reasonably should be expected to win but don't that upset many. It's the boneheaded plays that as noted you see the LLWS players making that the Tribe doesn't that make people upset.

If the team wasn't last in the league in fielding they would be right there IMO.
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