Text Size

Cleveland Cavaliers & The NBA

When does it become Cavalier Time?

Talk Cavs hoops and other items from the NBA here.

Moderators: peeker643, swerb, pup, papacass

When does it become Cavalier Time?

Unread postby pup » Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:54 pm

I know the Wizards series was a foregone conlcusion, and the Cavs have not gone out of their way to finish them off in any of the 3 games, but damn. They are on their way to sweeping a 1st round playoff series. They have home court advantage for a solid series against the Nets.

I know the draft is a huge deal and that has taken our focus away from the Cavs. The Tribe is in first place. It is a wierd time for us Clevelanders, and we might just be missing a team on their way to the NBA Finals. Jump on the wagon this evening and lets get the mojo working for round 2!

Cavs finish the Wizards off in splendid fashion tonight. 104-82. Bring on the Nets!
Home Run Leaders as RHB 5/7/13

Mark Reynolds (10)
User avatar
pup
Closet Shapiro Fan
 
Posts: 12020
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:15 pm
Location: Eastlake, Ohio
Favorite Player: Vince Shubrownicek
Least Favorite Player: Any other coach

Unread postby Dozen » Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:09 pm

I dunno why, but the Nets scare the living hell out of me........ Hope Toronto extends their series a few more games and the Cavs can finish the Wizards off tonight!
http://www.thesportshole.com

http://www.youtube.com/TheSportsHole


I have never seen so many kok heads all lumped together like that ~ Yhimmie
User avatar
Dozen
TheSportsHole.com
 
Posts: 2343
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Willoughby, Ohio
Favorite Player: my son
Least Favorite Player: venomous/bipolar

Unread postby pup » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:30 pm

Spork the Nets, right in the anus.
Home Run Leaders as RHB 5/7/13

Mark Reynolds (10)
User avatar
pup
Closet Shapiro Fan
 
Posts: 12020
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:15 pm
Location: Eastlake, Ohio
Favorite Player: Vince Shubrownicek
Least Favorite Player: Any other coach

Unread postby swerb » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:50 pm

This has almost been a surreal start to the playoffs. The fan enthusiasm has really been subdued.

Buff put it best in an email to me.

"The Wizards without Arenas and Butler are the Grizzlies."

Bottom line, this has been a bye for the Cavs. They've controlled from start to finish in all 3 games.

The fanatics like the guys in here have been living and dying with the team through the 1st 3 games. Joe Fan has yet to become emotionally invested. And its not like the Cavs have made a history of going to the playoffs. This is just the second time in a decade.

Raptors will win game 5 and game 6 is a classic. Heres hoping the Raptors win that game 6 classic, giving the Cavs a little more rest.

Most likely its gonna be the Nets though. Thats where the fun really starts.
"It's like dating a woman who hates you so much she will never break up with you, even if you burn down the house every single autumn." ~ Chuck Klosterman on Browns fans relationship with the Browns

http://www.twitter.com/theclevelandfan
User avatar
swerb
JoBu's bee-yotch
 
Posts: 17918
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 5:04 pm
Location: Twinsburg, OH
Favorite Player: Mango Hab
Least Favorite Player: Bob LaMonte

Unread postby swerb » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:44 pm

8 wins in a row. Hopefully 5-6 days rest. Big Freaking Z. Talk about a role reversal from last years playoffs. I gotta give the big man credit, I didn't think he had it in him.

And he should be able to feast on a similarly weak Nets front line in the next round as well.

Alright, it's Cavalier time.
"It's like dating a woman who hates you so much she will never break up with you, even if you burn down the house every single autumn." ~ Chuck Klosterman on Browns fans relationship with the Browns

http://www.twitter.com/theclevelandfan
User avatar
swerb
JoBu's bee-yotch
 
Posts: 17918
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 5:04 pm
Location: Twinsburg, OH
Favorite Player: Mango Hab
Least Favorite Player: Bob LaMonte

Unread postby BruceK » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:45 pm

Had 'em all the way.
User avatar
BruceK
BJKResearch.com
 
Posts: 1023
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:45 pm
Location: Lakewood OH
Favorite Player: Reggie Dunlop
Least Favorite Player: Ogie Oglethorpe

Unread postby Dozen » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:49 pm

Swerb wrote:8 wins in a row. Hopefully 5-6 days rest. Big Freaking Z. Talk about a role reversal from last years playoffs. I gotta give the big man credit, I didn't think he had it in him.

And he should be able to feast on a similarly weak Nets front line in the next round as well.

Alright, it's Cavalier time.


Wow, Z was incredible....... different guys steppin up every night. I know it was the depleted wizards team, but a sweep is a sweep! :mrgreen:
http://www.thesportshole.com

http://www.youtube.com/TheSportsHole


I have never seen so many kok heads all lumped together like that ~ Yhimmie
User avatar
Dozen
TheSportsHole.com
 
Posts: 2343
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Willoughby, Ohio
Favorite Player: my son
Least Favorite Player: venomous/bipolar

Unread postby consigliere » Mon Apr 30, 2007 10:33 pm

Talk and attachment to this team should now begin in the 2nd round. Let's face it, the Cavaliers have been playing glorified regular season games the last four games against Washington.

I know they have won 8 in a row.....but it was against cupcakes. Sort of concerns me for Game 1 when they likely play NJ. That Game 1, if you ask me, may be a game the Cavaliers may not be ready for since they have not really been tested by a good team in like 3 weeks.
Indians Prospect Insider: http://www.indiansprospectinsider.com/
Image
User avatar
consigliere
 
Posts: 10822
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:22 am
Location: Painesville Twp, OH
Favorite Player: Jeff Stevens
Least Favorite Player: Carl Willis

Unread postby FUDU » Tue May 01, 2007 12:58 am

I dunno why, but the Nets scare the living hell out of me

B/C they have 2.85 superstars in their starting 5 that's why.

I must give the Cavaliers their due credit for the sweep but in the end it is meaningless other than the fact this first series was just a series to keep our guys fresh.

Let's hope Toronto can push that series to 6 games at least.
Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect.
"I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

2011 TCF Stratomatic Champ
User avatar
FUDU
 
Posts: 13356
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:02 am
Favorite Player: Me
Least Favorite Player: You

Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue May 01, 2007 11:15 am

Jersey is definitely not a cupcake and they are entirely capable of defeating the Cavs. The point of attack has to be the interior because NJ doesn't have much there with Krstic gone. They've got some old farts and younger guys, but the Cavs have more experience with Gooden and Z in the paint.

Jefferson and Carter are the two big scoring threats with Kidd providing a boatload of assists. We have to try and limit the production of one of those guys. Their bench isn't overly deep, so we may have an advantage there.
Mr. MacPhisto
Troll
 
Posts: 3925
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:39 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Favorite Player: LeBron James
Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby pup » Tue May 01, 2007 11:19 am

Anyone think Z was the Cavalier taking it easy throughout the regular season, even more than LeBron? Could his lack of minutes, role in the offense, etc... just a way to keep the big man fresh?

If we can get this Z for another month or so, this team is even that much more of a threat.
Home Run Leaders as RHB 5/7/13

Mark Reynolds (10)
User avatar
pup
Closet Shapiro Fan
 
Posts: 12020
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:15 pm
Location: Eastlake, Ohio
Favorite Player: Vince Shubrownicek
Least Favorite Player: Any other coach

Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue May 01, 2007 12:06 pm

Pup wrote:Anyone think Z was the Cavalier taking it easy throughout the regular season, even more than LeBron? Could his lack of minutes, role in the offense, etc... just a way to keep the big man fresh?

If we can get this Z for another month or so, this team is even that much more of a threat.


That may be a part of it. Truth is, the NBA regular season does mean something, but you really need to bring your A-game in the playoffs.

Against Jersey, Z could be a major factor on the offensive side. They have 7 footers to guard him, but I still think he can put up plenty of points in the paint. I'm on the same pafe with Gooden - I think he could also be essential if we do face the Nets next.

One of the plusses on this team is that we have quite a few guys who can and have stepped up in the past. Any one of our five starters can have a big game. Sasha is least likely, but he's still able to post some amazing performances when he's on. The Cavs have also been making far more use of LeBron as decoy, with him posting up or driving and then dishing. Sasha has hit some wide open Js, some for three, because of LeBron drawing defenders.
Mr. MacPhisto
Troll
 
Posts: 3925
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:39 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Favorite Player: LeBron James
Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby FUDU » Tue May 01, 2007 12:12 pm

Not to rip Z, b/c he did play well, but many of his points in this series were while he was not being guarded at all. He didn't score much with true post ups in the paint. Plenty of easy buckets from nice feeds from a double teamed ball handler.

I am sure NJ will notice that in film.
Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect.
"I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

2011 TCF Stratomatic Champ
User avatar
FUDU
 
Posts: 13356
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:02 am
Favorite Player: Me
Least Favorite Player: You

Unread postby Dozen » Tue May 01, 2007 1:26 pm

FUDU wrote:Not to rip Z, b/c he did play well, but many of his points in this series were while he was not being guarded at all. He didn't score much with true post ups in the paint. Plenty of easy buckets from nice feeds from a double teamed ball handler.

I am sure NJ will notice that in film.


Not to come off sounding like a dick here, but isnt that smart basketball???? draw a double and kick it out? Im just happy they were going down and hope it continues.
http://www.thesportshole.com

http://www.youtube.com/TheSportsHole


I have never seen so many kok heads all lumped together like that ~ Yhimmie
User avatar
Dozen
TheSportsHole.com
 
Posts: 2343
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Willoughby, Ohio
Favorite Player: my son
Least Favorite Player: venomous/bipolar

Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue May 01, 2007 1:51 pm

FUDU wrote:Not to rip Z, b/c he did play well, but many of his points in this series were while he was not being guarded at all. He didn't score much with true post ups in the paint. Plenty of easy buckets from nice feeds from a double teamed ball handler.

I am sure NJ will notice that in film.


So what if they notice? Are they going to stop double teaming LeBron or only send one guy to stop a driving player like Hughes?

When your starting lineup is Z, Gooden, LBJ, Sasha, and Hughes, you have offensive talent of some kind at every position. The Nets will not resort to man-2-man because they'll get killed. They will have to leave men open. They're not going to have one guy on James, that's a guarantee.

The Nets aren't bad defensively in the paint, but if someone attempts to drive the lane then they'll either have to give him the lane, pull of their man in the paint and attempt to close the lane, or bring someone in from the perimeter to do it. Anyway you look at it, there's a problem. Either the lane will be relatively unprotected or someone wil be left unguarded.

This is the Cavs' greatest strength. Both Hughes and LeBron can drive the lane. Z and Gooden can draw people in the post. LeBron can post-up and draw almost the whole defensive interior to himself. There's enough talent that dishing the ball off can mean points. Each time you do it you leave the opponent with a tough decision.

LeBron is posting up but I want to keep Pavlovic, Gooden, Hughes, and Z covered. That means I need to cover him one-on-one. Not gonna work very well.

The problem with Z for much of the year was that he was being misused. The Cavs were not using their offensive talent to create defensive problems. They weren't playing organized. They were playing a jump shot oriented game.

It appears that they've corrected that for the post season. Even the good defensive teams will have trouble not leavng someone open. You leave Pavlovic open beyond the arc and you're toast. You put one man on Larry or LeBron and you risk a penetrating drive - and an opening in the post where Z or Gooden can usually drain shots. You concentrate more than one guy on Gooden or Z in the post and you open up holes elsewhere - and both Gooden and Z are more than capable of scoring in man-2-man situations in the post.

We've finally seen Z used properly. He's excellent as a finisher when others have drawn away the defenders and Z makes them pay for it. There's not much New Jersey or others can do if the Cavs can execute properly and move defenders off some of the other players.
Mr. MacPhisto
Troll
 
Posts: 3925
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:39 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Favorite Player: LeBron James
Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby FUDU » Tue May 01, 2007 2:08 pm

My point was Z's success these past 4 games just may well have been due to circumstance more than anything.

The circumstance that multiple opponents ran at the ball handler b/c they were out of position and Z just "happened" to be open as opposed to him having to work to get open and work to get the ball in the hoop.

Looking back at the Wiz series Z didn't earn a lot of hard fought points. I agree that he stacks up well against what the Nets bring to the table but if they don't double team out of necessity or panic Z will find himself working much harder for his points.

It is easy to finish when you're are free in space, it is not so easy when you have bodies around.

I fully expect to see Z being watched more closely and his FG% dropping in RD 2.

Add to the fact LeBron will have to use energy on both ends of the court by covering and being covered by both VC and RJ at times. Unless LBJ is on fire the Nets may not need to double team him as often which means Z will not benefit as he did in the first RD.
Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect.
"I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

2011 TCF Stratomatic Champ
User avatar
FUDU
 
Posts: 13356
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:02 am
Favorite Player: Me
Least Favorite Player: You

Unread postby Steve Buffum » Tue May 01, 2007 2:16 pm

FUDU wrote:Looking back at the Wiz series Z didn't earn a lot of hard fought points. I agree that he stacks up well against what the Nets bring to the table but if they don't double team out of necessity or panic Z will find himself working much harder for his points.

It is easy to finish when you're are free in space, it is not so easy when you have bodies around.

I fully expect to see Z being watched more closely and his FG% dropping in RD 2.

Isn't Jason Collins considered a premier defensive center? He may be a total zero offensively (I believe DeSagana Diop trumps him), but defensively, he's supposed to be terrific, isn't he? Have I got the wrong guy?

I would guess that Nets guards would let Hughes drive right into Jason Collins and chuckle warmly at the prospect. I could be wrong.

Now, Mikki Moore is another story, but that seems like a different problem: I don't see how Ilgauskas covers Moore effectively. Ilgauskas' defense seems more theoretical than practical ("He's very large, he must be hard to post up or get around").
User avatar
Steve Buffum
Prose Flayer
 
Posts: 5463
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2006 12:32 am
Location: Austin TX
Favorite Player: Withheld
Least Favorite Player: David Huff

Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue May 01, 2007 2:44 pm

Steve Buffum wrote:Isn't Jason Collins considered a premier defensive center? He may be a total zero offensively (I believe DeSagana Diop trumps him), but defensively, he's supposed to be terrific, isn't he? Have I got the wrong guy?


I wouldn't call him a premier defensive center. He's the best defender the Nets have, but most of his defensive "prowess" is due to him clogging the paint. He's not an effective rebounder, shot blocker, or scorer. His one great asset is taking charges, though we have one of those guys too (Varejao).

I would guess that Nets guards would let Hughes drive right into Jason Collins and chuckle warmly at the prospect. I could be wrong.


Problem there is that Collins isn't a quick mover. If Hughes, LeBron, etc don't drive straight out him, instead rolling around him, then he's not much good.

For the record, Ilgauskas actually is rated better defensively than Collins, allowing fewer scores per possession.

Now, Mikki Moore is another story, but that seems like a different problem: I don't see how Ilgauskas covers Moore effectively. Ilgauskas' defense seems more theoretical than practical ("He's very large, he must be hard to post up or get around").


Ilgauskas' defense is practical, depending on who he's up against. Z is most effective against post-up big men who have little or no mid-range shot. From a purely statistical standpoint, Z's PER is superior to Moore's. Z's Defensive Rating also looks good against Moore's stats. Moore has been more of a "points in the paint" guy this year and Z is better at dealing with that. Ilgauskas' greatest liability is adapting to those driving towards the basket. His defensive weakness is solved when the perimeter defense effectively shuts down lanes to the basket.
Mr. MacPhisto
Troll
 
Posts: 3925
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:39 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Favorite Player: LeBron James
Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue May 01, 2007 2:51 pm

I can't speak for FUDU, however, another way to put it is drawing barometers for Z or any other Cavs based on the past series in which they beat a mediocre team sans their besy two players, probably isn't going to get you much info.

The Cavs played well. Took care of their business. From this point forward is where we'll see how far they've come.
User avatar
leadpipe
The Reverend
 
Posts: 6575
Joined: Fri Jan 19, 2007 1:58 am

Unread postby Wolfy » Tue May 01, 2007 4:59 pm

I agree with the Pipe. This is a new series and nothing like the last. Cavs have played to there opponent all year long and in the playoffs so far...every game against the Wiz was close for 3 and a half quarters so take from it what you will but I think this will be fun to watch and very nerve-racking to say the least. Anytime you face a team with Kidd, R. J., V. C., and it seems that Moore always kills us so yes I am nervous. We got LBJ and he needs to show me some more than just a 1st round cake walk...Now We Go! Time to pay for that castle King James!
User avatar
Wolfy
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 3:57 pm

Unread postby consigliere » Tue May 01, 2007 5:01 pm

Lead Pipe wrote:I can't speak for FUDU, however, another way to put it is drawing barometers for Z or any other Cavs based on the past series in which they beat a mediocre team sans their besy two players, probably isn't going to get you much info.

The Cavs played well. Took care of their business. From this point forward is where we'll see how far they've come.


Rack that. Look, we took care of business against Washington. Let's leave it like that. I take NOTHING from that series....whether it be Gooden and Z performing well or whatever. Playoffs start now.

By the way, anyone have an idea when game 1 of the Cavs vs. Nets/Raptors series strarts?
Indians Prospect Insider: http://www.indiansprospectinsider.com/
Image
User avatar
consigliere
 
Posts: 10822
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:22 am
Location: Painesville Twp, OH
Favorite Player: Jeff Stevens
Least Favorite Player: Carl Willis

Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue May 01, 2007 5:51 pm

Consigliere wrote:By the way, anyone have an idea when game 1 of the Cavs vs. Nets/Raptors series strarts?


Possibly as early as this Monday, though the scheduling depends on when everyone finishes the first round. Last year the second round started on May 7 and May 8. I think those dates will remain the same as any potential Game 7s in the first round are scheduled for the fifth or sixth.

My guess is that they'll try for a Monday night start for the Cavs, but if Toronto does the unlikely and wins the next two it'll move the game to Tuesday.
Mr. MacPhisto
Troll
 
Posts: 3925
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:39 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Favorite Player: LeBron James
Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby Wolfy » Tue May 01, 2007 6:00 pm

If Jersey wins tonight the series would start saturday. As per the N-H.
User avatar
Wolfy
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 3:57 pm


Return to Cleveland Cavaliers & The NBA

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron

Who is online

In total there are 2 users online :: 0 registered, 0 hidden and 2 guests (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 181 on Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:50 pm

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests