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Call the Picks

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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Wed May 18, 2011 8:16 pm

The position thing doesn't bother me and I like D-Will II.

My issue is that gambling isn't worth it, Kemba is dog shit and Knight is hopefully Jamal Crawford.

No thank you.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Wed May 18, 2011 8:21 pm

Know I hate tweeners even more in the NBA then NFL. However, point taken. In a weak draft like this that 2 slot ceiling probably should be looked at as sparkplug off the bench, ala, a combo guard on the front line.

For the love of good not at #1 which is what these brain dead morons have to do by passing on Irving for the Williams/Knight/Walker combo.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby peeker643 » Wed May 18, 2011 8:29 pm

Orenthal wrote:^There is no hope with that... After you hit them with a mountain of rational thought their response is, "but did you see Williams in that Duke game?" or "Walker just got dat swag, that killer insinct." or "I'm a fucking retard that licks windows and has water in my skull, but I call radio shows dur dur."

WHY THE FUCK THEY CAN'T UNDERSTAND WILLIAMS HAS NO POSITION.


And took games and parts of games off. I said earlier it scared me and I was liking the dude before he went off on Duke.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby daddywags » Wed May 18, 2011 8:32 pm

They aren't stupid enough to pass on Irving unless his foot injury won't heal until he's 35 years old (which might be par for the TCE course). IMO folks suggesting this just don't know what they are talking about.

That said, Jan Vesely? Really? We want a 6'10" Euro SF who's already 21 years old and can't hit half his free throws? I know he runs the floor well and is supposedly an athletic freak, but 4 rebounds in 25 mpg? That doesn't make any sense to me, either.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Wed May 18, 2011 8:37 pm

FWIW: according to Broussard the front office loves Irving but Gilbert loves Williams. Said that just before he mentioned the Vesley thing that Russillo has also heard.

Vesley's upside is AK47ish, FWIW.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Wed May 18, 2011 11:39 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:FWIW: according to Broussard the front office loves Irving but Gilbert loves Williams. Said that just before he mentioned the Vesley thing that Russillo has also heard.

Vesley's upside is AK47ish, FWIW.


Which from this draft, considering whats on the board at the time, eh. Ya'll know I'm a Kanter fanboy.

Not surprised to hear that from Broussard. I'll wait for a second source before I freak out.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 10:49 am

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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby peeker643 » Thu May 19, 2011 10:54 am

If you draft a Euro this June they have to be staying overseas this coming season given the lockout, right? They can stay and play there while this shit here gets settled?

I mean, is that a certainty for any and all of them under contract or whose Euro contracts expire this season?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby motherscratcher » Thu May 19, 2011 11:04 am

Orenthal wrote:http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/05/18/consensus.mock.draft/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1


Wait, is Inside Hoops saying that the Cavs are going to pick Irving and Knight? That's ridiculous, right?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 11:06 am

That I could not understand, cause while the mock on rye could end up skewed like that, the individual drafts shouldn't be that retarded.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 11:11 am

peeker643 wrote:If you draft a Euro this June they have to be staying overseas this coming season given the lockout, right? They can stay and play there while this shit here gets settled?

I mean, is that a certainty for any and all of them under contract or whose Euro contracts expire this season?


There are a couple guys with contract issues, not the usual high first round names, that would be perfect canidates for stashing with our second round picks. Just doesn't seem feasible to have all 4 players come onto the roster, given there are still possible some young guys on the team you want to evaluate.

That's that flexibility they are always talking about.

Guy like this...
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Boj ... ovic-1104/
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby JJN » Thu May 19, 2011 3:40 pm

Orenthal wrote:There are a couple guys with contract issues, not the usual high first round names, that would be perfect canidates for stashing with our second round picks. Just doesn't seem feasible to have all 4 players come onto the roster, given there are still possible some young guys on the team you want to evaluate.

That's that flexibility they are always talking about.

Guy like this...
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Boj ... ovic-1104/


Word is that Bog@#*%vic just signed a big Euro contract. That might be a little prohibitive to drafting him if we want him this year, but if the buyout terms are decent he might be worth stashing for another two years if he drops low enough (which he might given the new contract).

At this point in time, I'm going to be pretty happy with any of the bigs that can be projected to the #4 pick (with the exception of Vesley -he reminds me too much of Timmy from South Park). With Kyrie running the offense, I think DWill, Kanter, Vala, or even Bismack should be much better than we were thinking before we got Kyrie. If you can pick-n-roll (or pop), and grab boards, that's all we really need for you to do.

And while I'm warming up to Kanter, I'm still worried given that no one will have seen him play any organized ball in the last two years. That said, I'm just going to try and put my trust in the FO, but reserve the right to continue to be an armchair scout.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 4:39 pm

^The stash method is our best use of 2nd rounders. Weak draft, many picks, guys we currently on roster that probably need another season before the verdict is clear...
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 6:27 pm

HANKKKKK

Quick lil video of Irving at the combine. He won't do anything physical blah blah.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf ... draft.html

Volume sucks on that clip, but here is another nugget in print. Mother fucker thinks James has been filling a "Big Brother" role. Pass...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2011 ... id=6566218

;-) ;) :wink:
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby OldDawg » Thu May 19, 2011 6:44 pm

motherscratcher wrote:
Orenthal wrote:http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/05/18/consensus.mock.draft/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1


Wait, is Inside Hoops saying that the Cavs are going to pick Irving and Knight? That's ridiculous, right?


Right. As I read it, those are the consensus or average draft orders when looking at 12 different mock drafts. Knight averages out at 4, even though possibly very few have him going there. That's my guess.

EDIT: No, I see where you are talking about. Maybe that mock was done prior to the lottery. Now here is there current draft order:

http://www.insidehoops.com/nba-mock-draft.shtml
1) Cleveland Cavaliers: Kyrie Irving (PG, Duke) - Every rebuilding team needs a real floor general. Probably the best prospect in the 2011 Draft.

2) Minnesota Timberwolves: Derrick Williams (F, Arizona) - A scorer and rebounder who will probably be a small forward who plays occasional power forward in the NBA. Also might be worthy of being selected first overall.

3) Utah Jazz (from NJ): Brandon Knight (PG, Kentucky) - Pretty good guard but NBA potential is uncertain.

4) Cleveland Cavaliers (from LAC): Jonas Valanciunas (PF, Lithuania) - A raw project who is still in development.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby OldDawg » Thu May 19, 2011 7:05 pm

I haven't seen too much of D. Williams. The clips I have seen does remind me a little of the Beasley comparison someone made. DW does appear to be a little more athletic and stronger.

You guys that say he doesn't have a position. You must mean he is between a 4 and a 3. You don't think he is quick enough to play the 3? Strong enough to play the 4?

The draft gurus don't seem to be concerned. Do you think it is that big of a problem for him to transition to the NBA?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby StewieG » Thu May 19, 2011 7:12 pm

Williams will be able to score, no problem. Defensively he'll have issues. And yes, I think he's too slow for a 3, too small for a 4.

Maybe as a 6th man he could thrive, backing up both the 3 and 4 and providing scoring against the opponent's 2nd team. Kind of like Lamar Odom the last couple years with the Lakers. I think he'd thrive doing that kind of thing, but I question how effective he can be defensively as a long-term starter. Maybe he'll prove me wrong.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Thu May 19, 2011 7:26 pm

Williams spent all day telling everyone that would listen that he is a SF, not a PF.

Kanter looked good, more athletic than most expected.

OJ went to an airport restroom and waited for three shoe taps.

Feh to the rest.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby peeker643 » Thu May 19, 2011 8:22 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:Williams spent all day telling everyone that would listen that he is a SF, not a PF.

Kanter looked good, more athletic than most expected.

OJ went to an airport restroom and waited for three shoe taps.

Feh to the rest.


OJ does that every Thursday. Tells me zero.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Thu May 19, 2011 8:24 pm

I've seen nothing (lmao) that shows Williams has the handles to be a 3. Lamar Odom can almost run the point at near 7 feet. Williams can shoot better, but, the handles and lateral quickness.

That said I pray he goes 2, cause I think that drops Kanter to 4. The Larry Craig rumors e0 picked up??? No comment.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Thu May 19, 2011 8:29 pm

WIlliams ego is pretty insane. Quotes today range from him being the biggest star in the draft to him being a great LBJ replacement.

I like swag as much as the next guy, so I'm not gonna judge, but when you have that much swag you better nail your GM interviews.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Thu May 19, 2011 9:01 pm

At this point, Irving can show up at the combine wearing wine 'n gold.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Thu May 19, 2011 9:05 pm

DraftExpress Jonathan Givony
Same. Nothing's changed. 18-20 at most. RT @mhaubs: Any update on Biyombo age situation? How old do you think he is, based on current info?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Triple-S » Thu May 19, 2011 9:08 pm

Williams is tempting at 4. No way in hell he drops that far though.

as said before though, the arrogance kind of turns me off, but if he can back it up, the combo of him and Kyrie would be pretty cool.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby StewieG » Fri May 20, 2011 10:09 am

Some measurables, via Chad Ford

-Kemba Walker 5' 11.5" in socks. 6' 1" in shoes. 6' 3.5" wing
-Brandon Knight 6' 1.5" socks and 6' 3.25" in shoes. 6' 6.75" wing
-Morehead States Kenneth Faried measured just 6' 6" in socks and 6' 7.5" in shoes. However he has a 7' wingspan and a 9' standing reach.
-Kawhi Leonard had a huge 7' 3" wingspan and the biggest hands of anyone at the camp. But just 6' 7" in shoes.
-Providence's Marshon Brooks had the biggest wingspan among guards with a crazy 7' 1" wingspan. He's longer than bothMorris twins.
-Turkey's Enes Kanter measured out well. 6' 9.75" in socks and 6' 11.25" in shoes with a good 7' 1.5" wing and a 9' 1.5" standing reach
-Derrick Williams was 6' 7.25" in socks and 6' 8.75" in shoes. He had a 7' 1.25" wingspan and a 9' 0" standing reach.
-Got measurements from the draft combine. Kyrie Irving was 6' 1.75" in socks and 6' 3.5" in shoes with a 6' 4" wingspan. But 10.3 body fat
Irving's also not participating in any of the agility or S&C drills
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Fri May 20, 2011 10:19 am

Bismack isn't there, right?

I saw some awesome quote from him today about not being scared of anyone in the NBA but I can't find any evidence as to if he is there or not.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby StewieG » Fri May 20, 2011 10:23 am

I haven't seen any mention of him, aside from his age that you posted. You'd think he'd at least be mentioned if he were there.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Fri May 20, 2011 10:56 am

I'm an idiot. I don't think any Euros are still there, pretty sure they are still playing.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby fundamentals » Fri May 20, 2011 11:17 am

e0y2e3 wrote:WIlliams ego is pretty insane. Quotes today range from him being the biggest star in the draft to him being a great LBJ replacement.

I like swag as much as the next guy, so I'm not gonna judge, but when you have that much swag you better nail your GM interviews.


Here is Mr. Williams at his finest:

"I think I'm the No. 1 pick because I have more star quality I would think," the small forward said. "I'm just a bigger person. Just trying to fill in for a big star like LeBron like they're missing. That missing piece. I think that's me."



Go ahead, tell us a little about yourself. :lmfao:
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby OldDawg » Fri May 20, 2011 11:38 am

Looking more closely at the "consensus" draft mock that lists 12 mock drafts (that some of you had referenced earlier at http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/0 ... ef:nbahpt1), it seems there is pretty strong consensus that the Cavs will take Kanter at 4 if he is available.

When looking at all 12 mock drafts:
5 mocks have us taking Kanter.
Of the 7 others, 5 of those mocks have Kanter not being available to us at 4 (four say he goes at #3, one at #2)
Only 2 of the 12 mocks have him sliding past us at 4 (one at #8, one at #10 - noting that the InsideHoops mock has been updated since then)

In other words, only 2 of 12 mocks have us passing up the chance to take Kanter if he is there. Both of the mocks have us passing on Kanter have us taking Valanciunas instead.

The mocks that have Kanter being gone before we draft at 4: two had us taking Valanciunas, one each had us taking Vesely, Leonard, or Burks(huh? - a guy most have going at 10!)
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby StewieG » Fri May 20, 2011 2:23 pm

I've got no problem taking Kanter at 4. I don't think he'll be there though. Hope I'm wrong.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Sun May 22, 2011 3:48 pm

Best GM EVER!

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/player?rd= ... ign=WKNRAM

Why do these retards think anyone in the Org is going to say, "Yup Irving. We aren't even looking in another direction."

Like they are going to break a story. Cowherd is such a tool.

Only other item of note is how aggressive they sound in terms of using our flexibility. The TPE buying of other 1st round picks, the 2 seconds, packaging together assets...
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun May 22, 2011 4:43 pm

I'm not listening to a link to Cowherd.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby rebelwithoutaclue » Sun May 22, 2011 7:10 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:I'm not listening to a link to Cowherd.



Never ever.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Kingpin74 » Sun May 22, 2011 7:45 pm

Irving's a no-brainer but I'd be willing to pay a decent amount to move up to 2 for Williams. It would be awesome if he fell to 4 but I doubt it given how much Minnesota wants to trade. What would the price be to go from 4 to 2?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun May 22, 2011 8:49 pm

A vet that can play leader and contribute at a high level for Minny.

AKA nothing the Cavs have.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby daddywags » Sun May 22, 2011 8:55 pm

Kingpin74 wrote:Irving's a no-brainer but I'd be willing to pay a decent amount to move up to 2 for Williams. It would be awesome if he fell to 4 but I doubt it given how much Minnesota wants to trade. What would the price be to go from 4 to 2?


Who knows? Their GM says he wants a veteran type player because they are already young enough. Nobody on our team fits that bill, but maybe there is a way to use our TPE to move a veteran player Minny likes to them while moving 2 to us and 4 to the team giving up the player. Not sure even if that's doable, though.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun May 22, 2011 9:11 pm

There is no reason to waste assets to move up to #2.

Stay at four and get more picks. More, more, more, more, more, more.

TMLP and Grant have been giving the indication that this is the plan and that plan would go a long way toward making me happy.

D-WIll has his warts, just like Kanter and Biyombo and everyone else. Wasting assets for him would be silly. Especially when you need help at literally every position on the floor.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun May 22, 2011 9:15 pm

Vala contract/mock draft clarification from Draft Express (he wrote the piece for Yahoo!)

While this crop of prospects leaves a lot to be desired in terms of star power, seeing how the pecking order of international prospects unfolds might be the most interesting storyline of the draft.

There are five international players - all 6-9 or taller - who are expected to be selected in the lottery a. How they rank in terms of NBA potential is one huge source of debate amongst talent evaluators, but how much is known about their situations off the court will ultimately decide where they're selected.

While only one of them, Enes Kanter, was actually in Chicago, the rest were constantly being discussed.

The main topic: Jonas Valanciunas of Lithuania. He is considered by most teams to be the most intriguing of the bunch. At 6-11, with a reported 7-6 wingspan and a Joakim Noah(notes)-type motor, he's the type of prospect NBA teams have a difficult time getting their hands on outside of the draft. He has repeatedly indicated his desire to move to the NBA and only the NBA, which separates him from the Ricky Rubios and Fran Vazquezes of the world.

Seeing solid playing time for a BC Lietuvos Rytas team that made the top 16 of the Euroleague, and leading the competition in rebounding per minute, he's been seen by everyone. For him, it's his buyout, or lack thereof, that has teams worried.

Rytas has taken a major step forward in resolving the buyout issue in recent days by hiring a European lawyer with significant experience in NBA buyout negotiations. According to sources with knowledge of the situation, Rytas will attempt to structure the buyout on a sliding scale depending on where he gets picked, and are willing to be flexible with Valanciunas on when he can leave the team in case of an NBA lockout, even giving him the opportunity to stay with the team until he signs his rookie contract.

If his buyout situation will be resolved in a timely fashion, look for Valanciunas to be drafted somewhere between Nos. 3 and 8 overall. He's ahead of Enes Kanter on both Cleveland and Toronto's boards according to reports and has huge fans in Detroit's front office as well.

Valanciunas has three more years on his contract after this current season, with no buyout option. His American agent Leon Rose of CAA has been negotiating with the team for the better part of the year Most of the dispute revolves around when the buyout will be paid. The team, which is in serious financial trouble, wants the money now, not when he joins the NBA. It's asking for a percentage of Valanciunas' rookie contract. An agreement could have already been reached some time ago but the team has sent mixed messages.

Most expect a deal to be struck no more than a week before the draft. Valanciunas falling in the draft will only hurt Rytas' cause as not only will it lose significant respect from fans and constituents in basketball-crazy Lithuania, but it'll also hurt its chances of landing the next great young local prospect with NBA aspirations. Furthermore, being drafted lower results in a smaller contract.


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... cn-8514315

EOD: the independent workouts Kanter, Vala and Bismack have for teams is going to go a LONG way in determining how their draft order shakes out.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Sun May 22, 2011 11:04 pm

Why does Cowherd have a career?
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun May 22, 2011 11:05 pm

He pisses people off so they listen.

Plus I really enjoy the peeps I follow that Tweet stupid things he says everyday. Great comedy when sitting at work and reading his absurdities every few hours.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Sun May 22, 2011 11:10 pm

Get it while you can I suppose, that has a short shelf life. Sad thing is thats the most nothing I have ever heard Grant say...
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon May 23, 2011 12:33 pm

DX reporting what has been rumored for awhile. Cavs offered #4 and TE for Gay. Memphis rejected.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Mon May 23, 2011 12:41 pm

^They trying to fix us into a poor man's Atlanta Hawks in one season??? There will be next years draft. More flexibility as we move on...

The one thing I like about Rudy Gay is he was from UConn. Good pedigree for wing players.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon May 23, 2011 12:47 pm

No. Stop being stupid.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Orenthal » Mon May 23, 2011 12:57 pm

The Hawks comment was meant just to say we are going to be mediocre, not a player to player comparison. Unless, and this is your plan, they trade Jamo, Andy, and Baron.

Cavaliers open the season with additions of Irving and Gay to a team that stays somewhat healthy and the same pieces where do you think they end up? I know the end of last season with Baron they were competent, yet sub 500. Add in Jamo, Andy, and Gay? You think earlier season success and Gilbert allow the firesale.

If Memphis agrees to #4 and the TPE I would do it, but also would pray they don't think that makes us good enough to start trying to plug and play not rebuild.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Mon May 23, 2011 12:59 pm

For a rebuild the trade is 100% the right move.

If the owner is a dumb enough fuck to not consider it a young piece and keep collecting other young pieces with old talent then the team is owned by a dumb fuck and hopeless regardless.

That's it, EOD. Either they get what rebuilding is and can add assets or they don't. It is 100% the kind of move you make.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby JJN » Mon May 23, 2011 2:45 pm

Rudy Gay is probably a better player than anyone coming out in this draft. Its easy to forget because MEM went on the playoff run without him, but he was stupid good this season. 47%/40%/80% - 20pts/6reb/3ast/1.7st/1 block. And he isn't yet 25.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby ajunior148 » Mon May 23, 2011 3:31 pm

JJN wrote:Rudy Gay is probably a better player than anyone coming out in this draft. Its easy to forget because MEM went on the playoff run without him, but he was stupid good this season. 47%/40%/80% - 20pts/6reb/3ast/1.7st/1 block. And he isn't yet 25.


I actually agree with OJ on this as far as his Atl comment. It would be incredibly short sighted to not consider what it would cost us draft pick wise as well salary cap space. He has 4 years at about ~$17 mill per left on his deal after this season. Not exactly cheap.

If we did this we'd be better much sooner, but is it worth it? Gay hasn't gotten better in like 3 seasons, I don't think he would now. Plus he is not a good defender.

Add in the fact that our draft pick would most likely go from being top 5 next season to somewhere 8-15, and I'll pass.

We took some short cuts with the roster when we had LBJ and it cost us big time. If these rumors are true then I am worried that Gilbert did not learn his lesson. We aren't in a position to benefit much from a trade like this, even though Gay is a better player than we'll probably get at 4.
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Re: Call the Picks

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Mon May 23, 2011 3:43 pm

Lee likes it, ajunior hates it. Well, that was easy. Sign me up for Rudy Gay.
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