Moderators: peeker643, swerb, pup, papacass
by Spin » Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:28 pm
by waborat » Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:48 pm
Spin wrote:Could they defend Rondo or the other "modern" point guards? It seems there's a new breed of PG taking over the game. You have a hard time defending them, and if you put someone besides your PG on them or double them, they are deadly passers to wherever you left the weak matchup.Not being smart, just askin'.
by CP » Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:16 pm
CP wrote:Assuming no additional trades, just handicapping the 6 teams that LBJ is going to meet with:CHICAGOPG RoseSG ?SF LeBron (via UFA)PF Bosh (via UFA)(assuming he'll take the lower salary; if not, sub in Boozer or Amare here)C NoahBench: Taj Gibson, Luol DengHave to renounce all potential own FAs to clear the cap room. Will have to sign guys at veteran minimum to fill out roster. No MLE since they are under the cap. Notably gone are Brad Miller, Kirk Hinrich, Flip Murray from playoff squad.CLEVELAND CAVALIERSPG Mo WilliamsSG Anthony ParkerSF LeBron JamesPF JJ HicksonC Shaquille O'NealBENCH: Antawn Jamison, Anderson Varejao, Daniel Gibson, Jamario Moon, Leon Powe, Sebastian Telfair, Danny GreenMLE available. Rights to Sasha Kaun available. (Assumption made that O'Neal returns if LeBron does.)
by Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Jun 27, 2010 7:21 pm
by CP » Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:04 pm
by dmiles » Mon Jun 28, 2010 2:07 am
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:08 am
dmiles wrote:We of course have the popular perception that you need two hall-of-famers playing key roles to win a title. Again it doesn't always hold up but typically there are two top 50 type guys on the roster.I am not convinced a team with a bench that freakin' weak can win titles.
by e0y2e3 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 12:21 pm
by e0y2e3 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 12:37 pm
by Larvell Blanks » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:09 pm
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:17 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:CP, you really need to stop smoking the homer weed.Taj Gibson is a fine third big in this league and has only upside.Deng is a perfectly fine starting two in this league as a complimentary player to LBJ.The Bulls roster is a couple of three point specialists short of undeniably awesome, but a starting five of Bosh, LBJ, Noah, Rose, Deng laughs at any starting five the Cavs have ever put together (including your atrocious Boozer/Z/LBJ analogy). BTW: these bull crap bench arguments are the same arguments everyone was preaching when the 07 Celtics were put together and about this years Lake Show (who 7-12 are just not good at all).If you think our depth matters you need to put down the bong. We have no center, no starting SG, a 33 year old starting PF and combo guard who shrinks from the spotlight starting at the 1, etc. Our roster is a gawd damned mess when compared to the elite competition.This is simple, if LBJ wants to stay loyal and home he stays, if he wants to win he goes to Chicago if he wants Bright Lights he goes to NYC. Also, Bosh is not this soft pussy you are acting like he is, he struggled in Toronto because Colangelo put together the single worst starting five (defensively) I've ever seen in the NBA. Dewey would have given up a lot of points in the paint on that team and Noah is the perfect hustle/bang center combo to put w/ Bosh.Pau Gasol is the best PF in the NBA right now and next Noah Bosh would challenge him.(remember all of the "Pau is a soft pussy bullshit just a couple of years ago")
by e0y2e3 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:36 pm
by Orenthal » Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:48 pm
by daddywags » Mon Jun 28, 2010 5:04 pm
by Madre Hill, Superstar » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:02 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:LBJ, Rose, Bosh, Noah and Deng w/ clowns is WAY better basketball wise then the regular season superstars we currently have, period.
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:18 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:...Deng a better athlete than the corpse of Anthony Parker, who also is possibly a 3 at this point in his career.Moon is a three at this point but we trotted him out there at the 2, etc....And are you really going to trump Brown, Walton, and Farmar as good? Wow. Brown was just grabbed for the vet min, Farmar hasn't really developed in ages, etc....Two vets decide to play for the min and they are fine.And again, that entire core is 25 and under. Homer Glasses.LBJ, Rose, Bosh, Noah and Deng w/ clowns is WAY better basketball wise then the regular season superstars we currently have, period.
by e0y2e3 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:41 pm
by Orenthal » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:51 pm
by e0y2e3 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:53 pm
Orenthal wrote:I was thinking the same things Wags, but like you said until 7/1, we don't have all the facts.Is Derek Rose the same player when he doesn't have the ball in his hands 80% of the time? I would have said Noah would be better no doubt with James on board, but Bosh takes any touches he would have had on offense, and Rose was already a good drive and kick distributor. This is very much unlike the Cavaliers where James was the only real distributor. Noah was able to score on the Cavaliers during the playoffs easy enough.Lots of questions, not even close to a sure thing.
by waborat » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:21 pm
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:29 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:CP, let me type this slowly for you:LBJ let's you play three types at the 2, Parker, Moon and the pursuit of Ariza and Artest all went down because of this.
Deng's problem is D at the 2 against quicker SGs and that can easily be covered w/ LBJ.
But then again, if I said it it must be true, just like you comparing Andy and Taj Gibson when you should be comparing our starting center at the moment (Andy) to Noah and Taj to JJ Hickson.
Again, keep on saying things like "Taj sucks because he is 6'9" though.
Watch the games, Rose is special, Noah is a beast, Bosh can be Pau, etc.
Shannon Brown started getting time last year after being dumped three times and was paid poop. He got run before Farmar last year because Farmar sucks. Farmar and Brown both improved this year for title #2 but both are dime a dozen scrap heap players (unless you care about Brown's vertical).
If they get two guys to show up PJ Brown style they are in great shape, I openly admitted this and the Lake Show could give them some problems, but they already are one of the two best starting lineups in the league if LBJ and Bosh show up, period and have a solid third big to come off the bench. Only need two more decent players to have a bench in the playoffs.
Hell, just look at this years Celtics, Tony Allen finally developed after being HORRID for two years and was pretty much their only back-up wing player.
And, chris, what does Rose wanting paid in 2013 matter? Seriously? Reinsdorph already said he'd go over the luxury tax this week and in case if you missed it two of the more important players in the finals (Sheed and Ron Ron) were MLE pickups. Guys like JJ Reddick, Josh Childress et al, will probably also go for the MLE this year. Two MLE additions is pretty huge and do we need to go down the list of late draft picks providing good minutes off the bench?
I get what your points are here, but you are pretending like just about every contender out there wasn't built from the Top down and didn't have serious bench concerns at one point or another. The Cavs used the depth excuse to cover up for a lack of legit star power, the real contenders are all MAD top heavy though (and more than one player top heavy).
by peeker643 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:31 pm
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:35 pm
waborat wrote:Can anyone make a case?Mav Carter might?Interesting article by Wojo:http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... ower062810
by FUDU » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:39 pm
by CP » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:43 pm
@STEIN_LINE_HQ Most creative FA story I've heard today? Rockets apparently planning to send three-truck caravan ferrying fans to their free-agent meetings about 5 hours ago
As we've been writing all season, Bosh is Rockets' No. 1 sign-and-trade target. If Bosh grants HOU sitdown, he'll be greeted by adoring fans about 5 hours ago
by peeker643 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:54 pm
by waborat » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:57 pm
peeker643 wrote:It's been said multiple times but if LeBron wants to keep his family friends within reach, not be bothered by an invasive media and can't bear the thought of breaking ties with this area then he will stay.
by peeker643 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:02 pm
waborat wrote:peeker643 wrote:It's been said multiple times but if LeBron wants to keep his family friends within reach, not be bothered by an invasive media and can't bear the thought of breaking ties with this area then he will stay. No doubt...Hell, I've been saying the same things for the past 2 years that it could easily come down to family, friends and the big mansion...Just found it interesting on how much power Team L might end up losing with WWW's agendas...Thought Wojo finally spun it in a lil differnet direction for a change, is all
by waborat » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:54 pm
peeker643 wrote:waborat wrote:peeker643 wrote:It's been said multiple times but if LeBron wants to keep his family friends within reach, not be bothered by an invasive media and can't bear the thought of breaking ties with this area then he will stay. No doubt...Hell, I've been saying the same things for the past 2 years that it could easily come down to family, friends and the big mansion...Just found it interesting on how much power Team L might end up losing with WWW's agendas...Thought Wojo finally spun it in a lil differnet direction for a change, is allI hear ya. I read 'em all too. Mostly because I want to see how people will spin what they say today after the decision is made though. I just think the decision process, when you peel back all the bullshit, isn't that much different than the choices many people make when determining where they want to practice their profession. A lot more zeros and incidentals and benes, but for the vast majority family, kids/comfort/security plays a huge role.* Security and comfort, in this case, have nothing to do with money. It's lifestyle, it's going out in public to the barbershop, going shopping, taking the kids out, etc.
by peeker643 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:01 pm
waborat wrote:Yep, no more sitting at Cracker Barrel eatin grits & fried apples...Does NY even have Cracker Barrels?
by jb » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:03 pm
by aoxo1 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:13 pm
by jb » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:15 pm
by jb » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:17 pm
aoxo1 wrote:jb, you mean there wasn't a question of who the Lakers' FAs would be playing with... except for that long flirtation with the Clippers. Right?
by jb » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:20 pm
by waborat » Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:40 am
jb wrote:I completely subscribe to that POV.
by jb » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:32 am
waborat wrote:jb wrote:I completely subscribe to that POV. It's good to see the GOTLPD finally released ya Welcome back
by e0y2e3 » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:19 am
by CP » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:51 am
e0y2e3 wrote:If you are banking on Shaq returning and that making our roster, well, that kinda speaks for itself CP.Sure Andy is better as a third big at this point, so is Shaq and so is JJ. We have one starting front court player. 1.
by diminishingskills » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:53 am
jb wrote:Does that absolve DF from any resposnibility related to outcomes? I part company Johnny. I hjave to see Pup's point that at the end of the day, DF called the shots and while most were reasoned and well intended within a tough set of cirsumstances, the real result is that he created a strange brew that never mixed right when Ball Don't Lie (TM). I do know good players and better fits moved during DF's tenure, and he missed out. I can't ignore that entirely.
Wish he'd stay, but if he chooses his right under the CBA - this is America - my accountability list is pretty short, and pretty balanced. Most on LeBron, and the rest on DF shots not hitting, as DS says. The dif is I just can't give the "oh well, no guaraentees in sports" free pass. That's why they count up W's and L's: accountability. Correct me if I misrepresent, John.
In the end, however, the person most respnsible for Bron leaving is....... Bron. Clearly, he doesn't see himself as having skin in this game when it comes down to this being a bianary decision. Not up to me to take a leadership position to put the team around me. Up to me to take care of Bron while others' try to do it for me. Kobe reupped and reupped and reupped. Never a question of stability of whom the Lakers' FA's (inclu Phil) would be playing with. But Mr Diva Burlesque Dancer helped piss in the Cheerios more than anyone.
Side note - if the cavs were so hell bent on all resources for a 2010 run, explain the Congan Elgin Baylor. D'Juan Blair was a decent contributor all season and we could have used bigs on D. Very comparable presence to JJ in his 2nd year, even iof they are very different players.
by e0y2e3 » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:50 am
by CP » Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:16 pm
by Orenthal » Tue Jun 29, 2010 5:23 pm
by aoxo1 » Tue Jun 29, 2010 5:44 pm
by e0y2e3 » Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:02 pm
by waborat » Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:14 pm
e0y2e3 wrote:Sasha Mother Fucking Kaun Motherfucker:
by jb » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:05 pm
by jb » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:08 pm
by Madre Hill, Superstar » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:15 pm
jb wrote:Side note - if the cavs were so hell bent on all resources for a 2010 run, explain the Congan Elgin Baylor. D'Juan Blair was a decent contributor all season and we could have used bigs on D. Very comparable presence to JJ in his 2nd year, even iof they are very different players.http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dejuan_bl ... stats.html
by FUDU » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:35 pm
jb wrote:To Pups point....I got me a choice of playing with D Wade, Chris "soft" Bosh, Pat Riley coming back to the becnh, and South Beach with unimaginable sums of money...vs.The 2 guard who laid my Momma (allegedly) , JJ Hix, a rookie HC, and NEO with iunimaginable sums of miney.Dunno guys. I'm the biggest homer here without 3 letters in my user id and I might not be able to pass that up.
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