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Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby hugerobot » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:35 am

padding my record etc. etc.

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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Ea$t $ide » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:11 am

just once when the knicks come to town i wish one of our local guys would have enough balls to ask one of their players this question: "do you guys think as a team that sometimes you suck so bad at basketball that lebron probably doesn't want to join you losers?"


cmon...freddy mac...grow a pair!!!
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby papacass » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:41 am

Ea$t $ide wrote:just once when the knicks come to town i wish one of our local guys would have enough balls to ask one of their players this question: "do you guys think as a team that sometimes you suck so bad at basketball that lebron probably doesn't want to join you losers?"


cmon...freddy mac...grow a pair!!!


Most of those guys aren't going to be Knicks in a year or two, so they don't care. In the eyes of Donnie Walsh, that whole roster (save for David Lee, Wilson Chandler and maybe Chris Duhon) is a series of walking, talking contracts that will expire at some point in the future.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:04 pm

Papa Cass wrote:
Ea$t $ide wrote:just once when the knicks come to town i wish one of our local guys would have enough balls to ask one of their players this question: "do you guys think as a team that sometimes you suck so bad at basketball that lebron probably doesn't want to join you losers?"


cmon...freddy mac...grow a pair!!!


Most of those guys aren't going to be Knicks in a year or two, so they don't care. In the eyes of Donnie Walsh, that whole roster (save for David Lee, Wilson Chandler and maybe Chris Duhon) is a series of walking, talking contracts that will expire at some point in the future.


but what sort of supporting cast does that leave there for lebron then??? lebron going to new york would be dumber than orlando just letting hedo turkoglu walk in free agency and then trading for vince carter.

lebron is no dummy.

he knows that his buddy warren buffett is able to be a global icon from little ol' omaha nebraska and doesn't need the "big-city-bright-lights" of wall street to still make gazillions of dollars more than anybody else except bill gates. lebron knows that the spotlight comes to see him right here in little ol' cleveland where he is already a global icon now anyway.

he doesn't need new york. new york needs him.

at this point, lebron's main motivation basketball-wise is to win a title. going to new york is not going to put him any closer to achieve that goal and will in fact set him back probably several years before he may eventually win one in new york, if ever. he knows his best chance at winning, not just "a" title, but multiple titles, is right here in little ol' cleveland ohio.

he saw the spurs (of which the cavs are very much modeled after) win 4 titles in little ol' san antonio texas while their own superstar tim duncan continued to play on short-term contracts and still continually re-signed with the spurs every 3 years or so in which he was actually able to make more money in the long run on all the multiple short term contracts he signed than what he would have on any single long term max contract, making the team more accountable for always striving to go out and get, develop and keep the best players possible to maintain a sustained run of excellence for the team.

the one thing lost in all this is the fact that lebron still has a 1-year player option on his contract, if he elects to excercise it. what would be extremely prudent on his part would be to go ahead and exercise that option just to see what the other teams all do to make their teams better in the 2010 off-season. he could then defer his decision to next year when those teams that are real contenders would be much better known from the pretenders then. and even then, i still think that the cavs will be in just as good of a position, if not better than any other teams in bidding for lebron's services because they have his "bird rights" and so would be able to offer him more money and more years on a contract than anyone else could.

but let's be honest, nobody knows what lebron is going to do then except lebron, so why even worry about it??? let's just enjoy the ride now for as long as it lasts and it looks like it's going to be a fun ride this year as the cavs are looking every bit the part of a team that has championship moxie. we can only hope. go cavs!!!

:cavs1: going for 11 in a row tonite, baby!!!
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby AK-ROWDY » Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:25 pm

Didn't know where to put it so i figured this was as good as a place.

Through 51 games last year the cavs were 40-11...

p.s. thats our record now...so much for starting 0-2
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby papacass » Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:41 pm

davemanddd wrote:
Papa Cass wrote:Most of those guys aren't going to be Knicks in a year or two, so they don't care. In the eyes of Donnie Walsh, that whole roster (save for David Lee, Wilson Chandler and maybe Chris Duhon) is a series of walking, talking contracts that will expire at some point in the future.


but what sort of supporting cast does that leave there for lebron then??? lebron going to new york would be dumber than orlando just letting hedo turkoglu walk in free agency and then trading for vince carter.


It leaves no supporting cast, other than Lee, who is shooting by far the most FG attempts per game in his career (15.0) because he's the cornerstone of their offense this year. That would obviously change with LBJ in town, and Lee would revert back to his true role-player self.

The Knicks' grand plan to lure LBJ with the promise of playing alongside D-Wade or Bosh was weak to begin with, but it was completely derailed last summer when the NBA announced the salary cap was going to shrink. Now, really the only selling point the Knicks have for LBJ is "You could rule New York!"

Right. LBJ is going to rule New York on a 48-34 basketball team that gets eliminated in the first and second round each year. I'm sure Madison Avenue would trip over itself to tear down all those Derek Jeter billboards and replace them with King James, who would be dubbed "Mr. February" by the New York Post in much the same way Dave Winfield was "Mr. May."

Other than trying to get LBJ hyped on MSG and playing in Manhattan, I don't really know what else the Knicks can tell him that would make him want to take a competitive step back and suit up for the Knicks. But hey, LBJ is having a lot of fun planting the seeds of possibility with the New York media, so I guess he's enjoying the waiting game.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 3:20 pm

Papa Cass wrote:
davemanddd wrote:
Papa Cass wrote:Most of those guys aren't going to be Knicks in a year or two, so they don't care. In the eyes of Donnie Walsh, that whole roster (save for David Lee, Wilson Chandler and maybe Chris Duhon) is a series of walking, talking contracts that will expire at some point in the future.


but what sort of supporting cast does that leave there for lebron then??? lebron going to new york would be dumber than orlando just letting hedo turkoglu walk in free agency and then trading for vince carter.


It leaves no supporting cast, other than Lee, who is shooting by far the most FG attempts per game in his career (15.0) because he's the cornerstone of their offense this year. That would obviously change with LBJ in town, and Lee would revert back to his true role-player self.

The Knicks' grand plan to lure LBJ with the promise of playing alongside D-Wade or Bosh was weak to begin with, but it was completely derailed last summer when the NBA announced the salary cap was going to shrink. Now, really the only selling point the Knicks have for LBJ is "You could rule New York!"

Right. LBJ is going to rule New York on a 48-34 basketball team that gets eliminated in the first and second round each year. I'm sure Madison Avenue would trip over itself to tear down all those Derek Jeter billboards and replace them with King James, who would be dubbed "Mr. February" by the New York Post in much the same way Dave Winfield was "Mr. May."

Other than trying to get LBJ hyped on MSG and playing in Manhattan, I don't really know what else the Knicks can tell him that would make him want to take a competitive step back and suit up for the Knicks. But hey, LBJ is having a lot of fun planting the seeds of possibility with the New York media, so I guess he's enjoying the waiting game.


which is exactly why i think lebron won't go to new york, papa. he wants to win a title so bad so that he can be thought of in the same vein as title winners kobe bryant, magic johnson, larry bird and michael jordan instead of the best players to never win a title like charles barkley, patrick ewing, reggie miller and allan iverson.

him going to new york will be just like you described, a middle of the road playoff team with no supporting cast. he will become like kevin garnett in minnesota, tracy mcgrady whereever he's been and carmelo anthony in denver, pre-billups.

hopefully everything i've read in "shooting stars" and seen in "more than a game" will hold true and lebron does remain loyal to his roots as he always has, well then we will have nothing to worry about. we can only hope. go cavs!!!

:cavs1:
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby papacass » Sat Feb 06, 2010 3:56 pm

davemanddd wrote:which is exactly why i think lebron won't go to new york, papa. he wants to win a title so bad so that he can be thought of in the same vein as title winners kobe bryant, magic johnson, larry bird and michael jordan instead of the best players to never win a title like charles barkley, patrick ewing, reggie miller and allan iverson.

him going to new york will be just like you described, a middle of the road playoff team with no supporting cast. he will become like kevin garnett in minnesota, tracy mcgrady whereever he's been and carmelo anthony in denver, pre-billups.

hopefully everything i've read in "shooting stars" and seen in "more than a game" will hold true and lebron does remain loyal to his roots as he always has, well then we will have nothing to worry about. we can only hope. go cavs!!!

:cavs1:


You could make the case that the Nets could still be attractive for LBJ, even with their horrible play this year. They could add a possible star player in the draft this summer, they still have talent, they have a well-endowed incoming owner, the persuasive power of Jay-Z, and sooner or later, the Brooklyn arena project will get finalized. Their case to LBJ still has holes, but they have ammo.

The Knicks' chances, barring some crazy turn of events, are toast. The Knicks need to do what the Cavs and Nuggets did seven years ago: Trade off anyone who is helping you win games and bottom out. They need to competely wash the organization clean of Zeke's fingerprints, and hope that a future superstar is waiting when they pick first overall.

LBJ will probably still give the Knicks a look-see, only because he wants to go to New York and have everyone in town fawn over him for a couple of days. But if you're looking at teams that could potentially lure LBJ away, the Nets and Heat are 1 and 1A. I don't think anyone else is seriously on the radar.

And I do think there is about a 95 percent chance LBJ is staying, because he can make the most money up front with the Cavs, he's winning here, the Cavs are spending gobs of cash to make sure he wins, and he has one thing here that he can't guarantee anywhere else he goes: control within the organization.

LBJ says "jump," and everyone in the Cavs organization says "How high?" That might irritate some outside observers (Adrian Wojo) who think it's pathetic, sycophantic behavior. But the Cavs are treating LBJ like a partner, and if he finds himself in a different situation with different egos, that might not be the case.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 5:12 pm

Papa Cass wrote:
davemanddd wrote:which is exactly why i think lebron won't go to new york, papa. he wants to win a title so bad so that he can be thought of in the same vein as title winners kobe bryant, magic johnson, larry bird and michael jordan instead of the best players to never win a title like charles barkley, patrick ewing, reggie miller and allan iverson.

him going to new york will be just like you described, a middle of the road playoff team with no supporting cast. he will become like kevin garnett in minnesota, tracy mcgrady whereever he's been and carmelo anthony in denver, pre-billups.

hopefully everything i've read in "shooting stars" and seen in "more than a game" will hold true and lebron does remain loyal to his roots as he always has, well then we will have nothing to worry about. we can only hope. go cavs!!!

:cavs1:


You could make the case that the Nets could still be attractive for LBJ, even with their horrible play this year. They could add a possible star player in the draft this summer, they still have talent, they have a well-endowed incoming owner, the persuasive power of Jay-Z, and sooner or later, the Brooklyn arena project will get finalized. Their case to LBJ still has holes, but they have ammo.

The Knicks' chances, barring some crazy turn of events, are toast. The Knicks need to do what the Cavs and Nuggets did seven years ago: Trade off anyone who is helping you win games and bottom out. They need to competely wash the organization clean of Zeke's fingerprints, and hope that a future superstar is waiting when they pick first overall.

LBJ will probably still give the Knicks a look-see, only because he wants to go to New York and have everyone in town fawn over him for a couple of days. But if you're looking at teams that could potentially lure LBJ away, the Nets and Heat are 1 and 1A. I don't think anyone else is seriously on the radar.

And I do think there is about a 95 percent chance LBJ is staying, because he can make the most money up front with the Cavs, he's winning here, the Cavs are spending gobs of cash to make sure he wins, and he has one thing here that he can't guarantee anywhere else he goes: control within the organization.

LBJ says "jump," and everyone in the Cavs organization says "How high?" That might irritate some outside observers (Adrian Wojo) who think it's pathetic, sycophantic behavior. But the Cavs are treating LBJ like a partner, and if he finds himself in a different situation with different egos, that might not be the case.


amen!!! (y)
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sat Feb 06, 2010 5:50 pm

After Thursday, I'm wondering if the Heat are fading to option 2. D-Wade reminded me of an early Lebron carrying the franchise on his back.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby papacass » Sat Feb 06, 2010 6:37 pm

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:After Thursday, I'm wondering if the Heat are fading to option 2. D-Wade reminded me of an early Lebron carrying the franchise on his back.


Windy wrote something last week or the week before about the differences between how the Cavs are handling LBJ's free agency and how the Heat are handling Wade's free agency.

Basically, the Cavs are spending to win now, banking that if they keep LeBron happy and winning year to year, that's the recipe for making him stay. It's a model that requires Dan Gilbert to find new revenue streams to keep the spend-now, win-now plan financed. Some of the moves Gilbert is allowing don't make a ton of business sense from a money standpoint, unless you consider that the best business move of all is to keep LeBron.

The Heat are taking a much more fiscally conservative approach. Ownership (the guy who owns Carnival Cruise Lines) is laying off Heat employees and slashing the budget, citing the economy. Pat Riley came right out and said "We're not going to commit to building around Dwyane Wade until he commits to us long-term." Riley will be banking heavily this summer on using a large amount of cap space and Miami's standing as a prime NBA free agent destination to lure a superstar running mate for Wade.

The Cavs are gambling with their short- and medium-term flexibility. They really could find themselves between a rock and a hard place until 2011 or '12 if LBJ leaves. The Heat, however, are gambling with D-Wade's satisfaction with the organization. They're risking a team like the Bulls swooping in and snapping up a disenchanted Wade before Miami's grand offseason plan can unfold (and I think, in terms of being realistic, they're eyeing Bosh more than LBJ).

In a nutshell, the Heat have a lot invested in the summer of 2010 and trying to make big changes. The Cavs, especially if Ferry were to land someone like Jamo in the next two weeks, would theoretically be set. They could possibly re-sign Shaq for one or two years at a reduced price, maybe re-sign Z for a year or two on the relative cheap. And with the organization stable and a two-year history of top-tier success (and hopefully an NBA title), they could basically tell LBJ "You know what you have here. And I don't think you're going to find the grass much greener over the fence."
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:08 pm

Hugely rackably accurate Cass.

Well done.

Every asshat here should have to read that post before even contemplating 2010.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby AK-ROWDY » Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:45 pm

Boobie with a nice assist!
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:49 pm

who says j.j. can't play??? why do you think so many of these other teams are demanding that he be included in any trades??? might i remind you that he is in essence just a college junior at just 21 years of age with still much room to grow??? he has learned to play off lebron very well and that is why he is shooting nearly 55% from the field. it's because he knows if he rolls to the hoop when lbj drives, there is a very good chance that he is going to get a pass for a very high percentage shot just like he did right there. wham with two hands!!!
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Cease » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:06 pm

Filthy.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby AK-ROWDY » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:09 pm

WE.ARE.NOT.WORTHY.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:10 pm

davemanddd wrote:who says j.j. can't play??? why do you think so many of these other teams are demanding that he be included in any trades??? might i remind you that he is in essence just a college junior at just 21 years of age with still much room to grow??? he has learned to play off lebron very well and that is why he is shooting nearly 55% from the field. it's because he knows if he rolls to the hoop when lbj drives, there is a very good chance that he is going to get a pass for a very high percentage shot just like he did right there. wham with two hands!!!


I can honestly say that I am not commenting on JJ for the rest of the season.

When I say he sucks he shows.

When I say he is showing he sucks.

Dude's just flippen me the bird and living in his water bong induced haze.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:12 pm

we all are witnesses indeed!!! :king:
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby AK-ROWDY » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:12 pm

going for 82 tonight?
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:13 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:
davemanddd wrote:who says j.j. can't play??? why do you think so many of these other teams are demanding that he be included in any trades??? might i remind you that he is in essence just a college junior at just 21 years of age with still much room to grow??? he has learned to play off lebron very well and that is why he is shooting nearly 55% from the field. it's because he knows if he rolls to the hoop when lbj drives, there is a very good chance that he is going to get a pass for a very high percentage shot just like he did right there. wham with two hands!!!


I can honestly say that I am not commenting on JJ for the rest of the season.

When I say he sucks he shows.

When I say he is showing he sucks.

Dude's just flippen me the bird and living in his water bong induced haze.


well then just keep saying he sucks and let him prove you wrong. a little reverse psychology never hurt anyone.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Cease » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:13 pm

Anyone else want to see LeBron go for more than 81 tonight?

got to let him off the chain if he's this hot. Let it rip.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Ziner » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:14 pm

e0y2e3 wrote:
davemanddd wrote:who says j.j. can't play??? why do you think so many of these other teams are demanding that he be included in any trades??? might i remind you that he is in essence just a college junior at just 21 years of age with still much room to grow??? he has learned to play off lebron very well and that is why he is shooting nearly 55% from the field. it's because he knows if he rolls to the hoop when lbj drives, there is a very good chance that he is going to get a pass for a very high percentage shot just like he did right there. wham with two hands!!!


I can honestly say that I am not commenting on JJ for the rest of the season.

When I say he sucks he shows.

When I say he is showing he sucks.

Dude's just flippen me the bird and living in his water bong induced haze.


Why? just pull a Pup and make Hickson your huckleberry so he keeps showing.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:15 pm

AK-ROWDY wrote:going for 82 tonight?


well, he never has scored 50+ at the q. no time like the present.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Ziner » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:17 pm

Watching online, Austin Carr is an unbelievably bad announcer. Rambling fool.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:18 pm

gee, 20 point lead in the 2nd quarter already. now do you think maybe we might have a cedric the entertainer sighting???
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:19 pm

Ziner wrote:Watching online, Austin Carr is an unbelievably bad announcer. Rambling fool.


typical uncle austin. i just had to laugh when he said something about lebron "eating his cheerios" tonite. i think he meant wheaties.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby StewieG » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:36 pm

Jesus.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby just another fool » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:43 pm

davemanddd wrote:
Ziner wrote:Watching online, Austin Carr is an unbelievably bad announcer. Rambling fool.


typical uncle austin. i just had to laugh when he said something about lebron "eating his cheerios" tonite. i think he meant wheaties.


i'm pretty sure he said "feeling his cheerios" AGAIN. does AC even have a clue what he means when he says that? cause i'm pretty sure nobody else does.

and it's definitely scary how often lebron has these hot nights and how this still isn't the best we're gonna see from him.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:03 pm

just another fool wrote:
davemanddd wrote:
Ziner wrote:Watching online, Austin Carr is an unbelievably bad announcer. Rambling fool.


typical uncle austin. i just had to laugh when he said something about lebron "eating his cheerios" tonite. i think he meant wheaties.


i'm pretty sure he said "feeling his cheerios" AGAIN. does AC even have a clue what he means when he says that? cause i'm pretty sure nobody else does.

and it's definitely scary how often lebron has these hot nights and how this still isn't the best we're gonna see from him.


you are correct sir. if lebron ever figures out the style of play that karl malone used to employ, he could average 40 points a game. i still say he is going to average a triple-double for a season at some point in his career too.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Hoover » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:13 pm

Way to go LBJ to stifle their little comeback!
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Orenthal » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:13 pm

Anytime something amazing happens for the Cavaliers/LeBron I get douche chills due to McLeod and Carr.

Read that asshats...
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:20 pm

Orenthal wrote:Anytime something amazing happens for the Cavaliers/LeBron I get douche chills due to McLeod and Carr.

Read that asshats...


what you mean you don't like it when uncle austin says the l-train throws the hammer down from deep in the q. meanwhile, fredo says that rubber rim job was too easy as hot-wad took it right down euclid.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Hoover » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:21 pm

Whoever's "covering" Nate should be charged with loitering with ugliness malaforethought.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:34 pm

horrible call on the flop by jeffries. lebron should be going to the line for an "and-one". instead the farking zebras called him for the offensive foul??? like charles barkley would say, "turrible".
Last edited by davemanddd on Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:34 pm

Just what you need to counter the 7 Seconds Offense: The Lebron and Four Guys Waiting For A Bus Offense. ::doh::
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Orenthal » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:34 pm

Perfect example of why watching one guy do it all, or better yet, why when one guy takes over the game the team play is lackadaisical. The offense has no flow, and guys are uninterested in playing defense.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:36 pm

You can only do so much against D'Antoni's offense.

That said, not going inside far more often against Hill and Harrington is outright criminal.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Cease » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:37 pm

Give Austin some credit, "there's no excuse for this" is dead nuts analysis.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Orenthal » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:38 pm

Now he feels like he is the only one who can do anything. His shooting % is startng to normalize, yet he is still in love with it missing the past few allowing quick run-outs.

Should be running an inside out offense at this point. Slow their run. Instead we would rather initiate an offense 5 feet behind the 3 point line...
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Cease » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:41 pm

Might be time to rethink the entire "Cavs team offense" thread. LeISO is in the house.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:42 pm

Ah, now there's the Cavs defense we all know and love.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby JoJo White » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:04 pm

Windy's new column suggests the owners are going to play hardball with the players and may put the Cavs in a situation where they're damned if they do and damed if they don't re: Lebron (ie, re-signing or not re-signing).

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf ... _hard.html

On Friday, CBSSports.com reported the details of a memo the owners sent to the players this week outlining their initial proposal.

Currently, the NBA has a "soft" salary cap that can be exceeded under certain "exceptions." Along with a luxury tax that penalizes teams that far overshoot the salary cap, the system has worked for more than a decade.

The owners' demands have a wave of potential consequences, the foremost being an increased likelihood of a lockout following the 2010-11 season.

The players are already facing two years of salary cuts because the salary cap, which is determined by the league revenues each year, is going to decrease in back-to-back years for the first time in the 26-year history of the system. So the threat of a hard cap is a change the players will dig their heels in to fight.

The implications on the Cavaliers could be significant, and not in a good way. If a hard-cap system happened in Major League Baseball, it would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Indians. But it may take away one of the Cavs' biggest weapons.

Forget for a minute that the warnings on the max contracts could impact what LeBron James does this summer. The Cavs are a mid-market NBA team but one that is feasting on the current system because they are generating record-setting revenue and have an owner willing to spend it.

James is the biggest reason the Cavs have the best record in the NBA over the last two years. But the other is how General Manager Danny Ferry has been able to leverage his owner's deep pockets to acquire star players like Mo Williams and Shaquille O'Neal in money-centered trades.

Even Daniel Gibson's presence on the team has roots to this kind of deal. The Cavs got Gibson because back in 2006 they were willing to make a trade that saved the Philadelphia 76ers money and it led to them getting Gibson.

A hard cap levels the entire playing field and, in fact, could penalize a team that has a player like James. Teams who have players making huge money -- James will likely be one of the league's highest-paid players for the next decade (right now he's just the 19th-highest paid, believe it or not) -- may not have the options to surround that player with as much talent.

In the short run, the threat of these measures virtually guarantees that James and his fellow big-name free agents like Chris Bosh and Dwyane Wade will opt out of their contracts this summer. It also may change what they're looking for when they do sign somewhere. There was a belief that they may all want to again sign three-year deals, as they did back in the summer of 2006 together, to increase flexibility.

With the danger of new, less favorable max contract rules, they may instead look to sign for longer terms to stay grandfathered into the current system. O'Neal and Kevin Garnett did this before the lockout in 1998, for example, and it saved them tens of millions when the term "max contract" was created after that lockout.

Also, they will probably all seek provisions that would guarantee their salary be paid if there is a lockout. The owners already have a guarantee to get their money from multi-billion dollar TV contracts if a lockout takes place.

No matter what, though, the NBA is headed for some turbulent times.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:25 pm

much closer than it needed to be, but i will certainly take the win. a win is a win is a win is a win, right??? besides, i much prefer an ugly win over a "good" loss any day of the week. 11 in a row!!! as frank the tank would say, "were streaking".

lebron obviously ran out of gas there in the 2nd half after having a 23-point first quarter and 35-point first half, but he only scored 3 in the 3rd period and 12 in the entire 2nd half. shades of dwyane wade in the previous 2 cavs-v-heat games.

the cavs were very lucky to survive that furious knicks rally that saw them come back from 24 points down to cut it down to as few as just 3 points late in the 4th quarter before lebron finally hit a couple of free throws and a couple of jumpers to close out the scoring. as a previous poster said, uncle austin was dead-on when he said there was no excuse for this after the knicks had cut the score down to 107-104 cavs with a little over 3 minutes to go.

hopefully this will serve as a little bit of a wake-up call for the cavs that they can't take a team lightly or let up on them just because they got a big lead on them. we will see whether or not they learned their lesson when the new jersey nets, just the worst team in the nba, come to town on tuesday.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:57 am

I'll leave the better analysis to the Lead Man. Regardless of just how and why they're going strong on their opening bid, however, everyone and their grandmama knows there's no way the next labor pact will end with a hard cap. No way the only way you'll have two max contracts and the rest of the roster filled with minimum wage fodder. Nah guh nuh hap pen.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby JoJo White » Sun Feb 07, 2010 3:30 pm

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:I'll leave the better analysis to the Lead Man. Regardless of just how and why they're going strong on their opening bid, however, everyone and their grandmama knows there's no way the next labor pact will end with a hard cap. No way the only way you'll have two max contracts and the rest of the roster filled with minimum wage fodder. Nah guh nuh hap pen.


http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4894018

The proposal, a source familiar with talks said, includes rollbacks that could reduce maximum guaranteed salaries, both for veterans such as Kobe Bryant and LeBron James, as well as up-and-comers like Kevin Durant and Derrick Rose, to almost a third of what they would have been eligible for under the current agreement.

Perhaps the biggest shocker: The owners' proposal includes a provision that would require any pre-existing deals to be revised to conform to the new deal's limits.

The total value for a veteran maximum deal would be well under $60 million and for players currently on rookie salary-scale deals well under $50 million, the source familiar with the proposal said. Fully guaranteed maximum deals also could be a thing of the past, with the proposal allowing for less than half of any contract to be guaranteed.

The mid-level exception and other devices that allow teams over the salary cap to sign free agents also would be abolished, several sources said, effectively creating a hard cap.


Stern buttfucked the union in 98 and he will do so again. The players are not going to go without a paycheck for long. They will cave.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sun Feb 07, 2010 3:43 pm

Everyone is stealing Woj's column on this:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=a ... &type=lgns
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby JoJo White » Sun Feb 07, 2010 3:55 pm

You can absolutely bet that Stern and the owners are going to play the "economy is bad" card and the need to scale back to the hilt in the next negotiation. Shit, it's already happened out in LA, where Phil Jax is going to be "asked" to take a paycut:

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-hei ... 5528.story

It turned out so well, owner Jerry Buss is wondering whether he can do it without paying Phil $12 million. Lakers sources agree on one thing: Jackson will be asked to take a pay cut.

Coming off a title after banking more than $40 million in profit last season, Buss is on an austerity kick.

With no raise in ticket prices, this season's revenues will be flat, a word Lakers officials use as if it means Great Depression.

"People are cutting costs all around the league and coaches are obviously going to take a cut too so they may not even want to hire me," Jackson said. "They may want to save some money."

Asked if he would take a pay cut, Jackson said, "Would you?"
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby rebelwithoutaclue » Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:39 am

e0y2e3 wrote:Everyone is stealing Woj's column on this:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=a ... &type=lgns



And, as I'm sure you know, Woj stole it from every Bill Simmons NBA column for the last 2 years. Simmons has been reveling in this oncoming union-crushing since it looked like the Hornets were about to fold. He would marry David Stern if he had the chance.
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Re: Knicks vs. Cavs

Unread postby Madre Hill, Superstar » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:40 pm

JoJo White wrote:Stern buttfucked the union in 98 and he will do so again. The players are not going to go without a paycheck for long. They will cave.


Or go where the money is.

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