The Pittsburgh Pistons?

[papacass]

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10035/1033328-53.stm

The speculation is starting to build momentum that the Pistons could leave Michigan within the next five years. The destination could be Pittsburgh, where construction is reaching completion on a brand new arena for the Penguins.

The bottom line is this: Detroit might no longer have enough economic clout to support four major league pro sports teams. The Pistons' ownership future has been murky since the death of Bill Davidson, and his family is looking into unloading both the team and the Palace of Auburn Hills.

The most likely scenario still has the Pistons sold to local ownership that will keep the team in Michigan. But it's far from a sure thing.

The Pittsurgh scenario works from the standpoint of having a new arena, but I really question whether NBA basketball can flourish there alongside three other teams. Their metro area is roughly the same size as Cleveland's, and while Pittsburgh doesn't have nearly the economic problems of Cleveland, and certainly not Detroit, it's not like they're paving the streets with gold there, either. What Pittsburgh does have is some rather large business headquarters, so more opportunities for corporate sponsorship and selling luxury boxes.

Can I add a little Cleveland paranoia into this? If LBJ leaves this summer, thereby turning the Cavs into a money pit, and if it appears that the situation with the Pistons is deteriorating, I wonder if Dan Gilbert would feel the strong urge to offload the Cavs for whatever he can get, race back home and rescue the Pistons, blood being thicker and whatnot. Obviously if LBJ stays and continues to make Gilbert loads of money, he's not selling the Cavs for anything. But if LeBron left, the Pistons might afford Gilbert his out. Hey, Chinese investors, how would you like your own NBA team?

Obviously, it's not anything that's really rooted in sound logic, because if the corporate dollars aren't there in Detroit, they're not there. Gilbert's ownership of the Pistons wouldn't change the fact that the Big Three don't have any endorsement dollars to throw around. It's going to be hard to make money on a team when no one in the region is spending. But it's just something in the back of my paranoid Cleveland mind.

[hermanfontenot]

I don't think there's any way Pittsburgh can support four teams. They don't even support three. The Pirates don't draw for squat (and weren't a great draw even in the Bonds-Bonilla-Van Slyke era) and the Pens were on the verge of moving to Kansas City before being saved by the drafting of Sidney Crosby (that franchise has also gone bankrupt at least once in its history.)

Next city to get an NBA team is going to be Seattle IMO, and that team will be either the Hornets or the Grizzlies.

[Hi Oktane]

I didn't even know you owned a Bill Davidson jersey, PC.

[Ziner]

Very few cities are able to support 4 pro franchises. I dont think Detroit is in that group anymore, but I also dont think Pittsburgh could do it. KC seems more logical, while not a huge city they wouldnt have a NHL team to compete with. Just seems like a ton of winter dates to sell out in a city like Pittsburgh. I've always thought VA Beach/Norfolk could use a pro team of some sorts. They have the population and dont really have a big college there. Maybe Erie Warrior can give more insight, but I cant imagine there being much of a sports scene there besides minor league baseball.

[papacass]

I didn't even know you owned a Bill Davidson jersey, PC.

Hey now. My jersey curse only causes injuries. I have yet to kill anyone.

[Cease]

Fueling your unfounded Gilbert move of the Cavs to Detroit scenario... In 10 years, the city of Detroit might make Gilbert the type of offer that they wouldn't make the current ownership to keep the team in Detroit right now (see Cleveland v. Modell circa 1996).

Doomsday scenario? Yes. If the bottom falls out in Cleveland, he might see a sweetheart deal from Detroit as a safe harbor for his franchise. The cherry on top for Gilbert would be the gambling dollars coming from his Cleveland casino to subsidize his basketball team.

Re: Pittsburgh- The other three major franchises would not be happy about a fourth coming in and milking a share of entertainment dollars. Not that they could stop it. I don't see the market supporting 4 majors.

[papacass]

Fueling your unfounded Gilbert move of the Cavs to Detroit scenario... In 10 years, the city of Detroit might make Gilbert the type of offer that they wouldn't make the current ownership to keep the team in Detroit right now (see Cleveland v. Modell circa 1996).

Doomsday scenario? Yes. If the bottom falls out in Cleveland, he might see a sweetheart deal from Detroit as a safe harbor for his franchise. The cherry on top for Gilbert would be the gambling dollars coming from his Cleveland casino to subsidize his basketball team.

Re: Pittsburgh- The other three major franchises would not be happy about a fourth coming in and milking a share of entertainment dollars. Not that they could stop it. I don't see the market supporting 4 majors.

I was actually more concerned about Gilbert dumping a post-LBJ Cavs franchise and buying the Pistons to prevent them from moving. Kind of like you could be making zillions of dollars and enjoying great success in a new city, but when your family is in trouble, you drop everything and go home.

Not the greatest analogy, but it kind of parallels.

[Anglefan]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

[papacass]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Gilbert is from Detroit. I think it's reasonable to at least bring up the possibility of him wanting to buy the Pistons at some point, particularly if it means saving them from moving. But I don't think anyone around here seriously thinks it's going to happen, and in the probable scenario that LeBron stays a Cav past this summer, there is no way it's going to happen.

But it's just something to throw out there.

[Anglefan]

But it's just something to throw out there.

That was kind of my point. What's the psychology behind wanting to throw that out there?

[e0y2e3]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Gilbert is from Detroit. I think it's reasonable to at least bring up the possibility of him wanting to buy the Pistons at some point, particularly if it means saving them from moving. But I don't think anyone around here seriously thinks it's going to happen, and in the probable scenario that LeBron stays a Cav past this summer, there is no way it's going to happen.

But it's just something to throw out there.

Didn't Gilbert try to buy the Pistons or one of the other D-shithole franchises before buying the Cavs?

And PS: the guy Dante Stallworth hit w/ his car would like to have a few words w/ you regarding your Jersey Curse.

[Orenthal]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Gilbert is from Detroit. I think it's reasonable to at least bring up the possibility of him wanting to buy the Pistons at some point, particularly if it means saving them from moving. But I don't think anyone around here seriously thinks it's going to happen, and in the probable scenario that LeBron stays a Cav past this summer, there is no way it's going to happen.

But it's just something to throw out there.

Didn't Gilbert try to buy the Pistons or one of the other D-shithole franchises before buying the Cavs?

And PS: the guy Dante Stallworth hit w/ his car would like to have a few words w/ you regarding your Jersey Curse.

He tried to buy the Brewers.

[DrPoove]

I don't think there's any way Pittsburgh can support four teams. They don't even support three. The Pirates don't draw for squat (and weren't a great draw even in the Bonds-Bonilla-Van Slyke era) and the Pens were on the verge of moving to Kansas City before being saved by the drafting of Sidney Crosby (that franchise has also gone bankrupt at least once in its history.)

Next city to get an NBA team is going to be Seattle IMO, and that team will be either the Hornets or the Grizzlies.

Having lived in Pittspuke I concur.

The Pirates have the best stadium in MLB and don't draw dick. They have gone bankrupt TWICE. They almost lost the Pens TWICE while I lived there and they would be in KC if not for a THIRD salvo from Mario Lemieux... after they almost disowned him after he said he would have to move the team if they didn't get a new arena because he was hemorrhaging money out his French Canadian ying yang. Don't let Univ. of Pitt b-ball fool you, it is the farthest from a b-ball town I have seen. Philly is the b-ball hub of that pitiful Commonwealth.

[e0y2e3]

I don't think there's any way Pittsburgh can support four teams. They don't even support three. The Pirates don't draw for squat (and weren't a great draw even in the Bonds-Bonilla-Van Slyke era) and the Pens were on the verge of moving to Kansas City before being saved by the drafting of Sidney Crosby (that franchise has also gone bankrupt at least once in its history.)

Next city to get an NBA team is going to be Seattle IMO, and that team will be either the Hornets or the Grizzlies.

Having lived in Pittspuke I concur.

The Pirates have the best stadium in MLB and don't draw dick. They have gone bankrupt TWICE. They almost lost the Pens TWICE while I lived there and they would be in KC if not for a THIRD salvo from Mario Lemieux... after they almost disowned him after he said he would have to move the team if they didn't get a new arena because he was hemorrhaging money out his French Canadian ying yang. Don't let Univ. of Pitt b-ball fool you, it is the farthest from a b-ball town I have seen. Philly is the b-ball hub of that pitiful Commonwealth.

To be fair Philly is only a college hoops town.

They suck as far as NBA fan-bases go. Always been your standard so so bangwagoners.

[jb]

LOL.

Those yinzers are too stupid to understand a sport like NBA hoops.

Itd also be by far the tiniest 4 team marketr in the world. The MSA is smaller than Cleveland by a decent amount.

[mrburns]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

[motherscratcher]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

[motherscratcher]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

[Ziner]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

[aoxo1]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

It's so acute when you try to talk all smart.

[Ziner]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

It's so acute when you try to talk all smart.

Just dont want him to look obtuse

[jb]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

It's so acute when you try to talk all smart.

Just dont want him to look obtuse

Please stop.

These puns in this thread are alrerady too protracted.

[motherscratcher]

I actually did consider that. But, isosceles is a much funnier word, don't you think?

I figured it didn't make much of a difference.

[aoxo1]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

It's so acute when you try to talk all smart.

Just dont want him to look obtuse

Please stop.

These puns in this thread are alrerady too protracted.

You've got that right.

[Ziner]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Hey Anglefan, what's your favorite angle? isosceles?


Thank you thank you. I'll be here all week.

(Sorry, I pretty much drank through the whole Cavs game.)

While funny (assuming he spelled it wrong) isosceles is a type of triangle not a paticular angle...

It's so acute when you try to talk all smart.

Just dont want him to look obtuse

Please stop.

These puns in this thread are alrerady too protracted.

You've got that right.

That is quite complimentary

[mrburns]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

Key Arena is still there, right? I think you could make that work for another season or two if the city voted to build a new arena or throw down some money for a big renovation.

[Ziner]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

Key Arena is still there, right? I think you could make that work for another season or two if the city voted to build a new arena or throw down some money for a big renovation.

So you are just saying it would be supplementary?

[hermanfontenot]

LOL.

Those yinzers are too stupid to understand a sport like NBA hoops.

How long would it take anyone to pick up on the intricacies of "the superstar call" and "the crooked official?"

[aoxo1]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

Key Arena is still there, right? I think you could make that work for another season or two if the city voted to build a new arena or throw down some money for a big renovation.

So you are just saying it would be supplemental?

He's just setting the record straight, even if it's a little orthogonal to the point. Your first reflex shouldn't be to accuse him of going off on a tangent.

OK, I think that's enough.

[Ziner]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

Key Arena is still there, right? I think you could make that work for another season or two if the city voted to build a new arena or throw down some money for a big renovation.

So you are just saying it would be supplemental?

He's just setting the record straight, even if it's a little orthogonal to the point. Your first reflex shouldn't be to accuse him of going off on a tangent.

OK, I think that's enough.

I understand the corresponding story, it just seems people may be bisected on supporting the new arena


Now Im done

[British_Pharaoh]

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10035/1033328-53.stm

The speculation is starting to build momentum that the Pistons could leave Michigan within the next five years. The destination could be Pittsburgh, where construction is reaching completion on a brand new arena for the Penguins.

The bottom line is this: Detroit might no longer have enough economic clout to support four major league pro sports teams. The Pistons' ownership future has been murky since the death of Bill Davidson, and his family is looking into unloading both the team and the Palace of Auburn Hills.

The most likely scenario still has the Pistons sold to local ownership that will keep the team in Michigan. But it's far from a sure thing.

The Pittsurgh scenario works from the standpoint of having a new arena, but I really question whether NBA basketball can flourish there alongside three other teams. Their metro area is roughly the same size as Cleveland's, and while Pittsburgh doesn't have nearly the economic problems of Cleveland, and certainly not Detroit, it's not like they're paving the streets with gold there, either. What Pittsburgh does have is some rather large business headquarters, so more opportunities for corporate sponsorship and selling luxury boxes.

Can I add a little Cleveland paranoia into this? If LBJ leaves this summer, thereby turning the Cavs into a money pit, and if it appears that the situation with the Pistons is deteriorating, I wonder if Dan Gilbert would feel the strong urge to offload the Cavs for whatever he can get, race back home and rescue the Pistons, blood being thicker and whatnot. Obviously if LBJ stays and continues to make Gilbert loads of money, he's not selling the Cavs for anything. But if LeBron left, the Pistons might afford Gilbert his out. Hey, Chinese investors, how would you like your own NBA team?

Obviously, it's not anything that's really rooted in sound logic, because if the corporate dollars aren't there in Detroit, they're not there. Gilbert's ownership of the Pistons wouldn't change the fact that the Big Three don't have any endorsement dollars to throw around. It's going to be hard to make money on a team when no one in the region is spending. But it's just something in the back of my paranoid Cleveland mind.

I prefer beating those wankers in Detroit than I do Pittsburgh though

[papacass]

Typical Cleveland. Is there any other city where fans like discussing this? Lets find outlandish ways to allow ourselves to bask in worst case scenarios. It's pathetic, honestly.

Gilbert is from Detroit. I think it's reasonable to at least bring up the possibility of him wanting to buy the Pistons at some point, particularly if it means saving them from moving. But I don't think anyone around here seriously thinks it's going to happen, and in the probable scenario that LeBron stays a Cav past this summer, there is no way it's going to happen.

But it's just something to throw out there.

Didn't Gilbert try to buy the Pistons or one of the other D-shithole franchises before buying the Cavs?

And PS: the guy Dante Stallworth hit w/ his car would like to have a few words w/ you regarding your Jersey Curse.

He did try to buy the Brewers. I also believe he made a play for the Suns before Robert Sarver bought the team. Let us all laugh at the Phoenix Suns.

My jersey curse accounts for the approximately nine plays from scrimmage that Stallworth took part in during the '08 season. It causes injuries. What my jersey curse doesn't account for is having a few too many, getting in your car and running up a crosswalk at daybreak. Donte's natural dumbfuckdedness killed that pedestrian long before my jersey curse could do anything.

[papacass]

But it's just something to throw out there.

That was kind of my point. What's the psychology behind wanting to throw that out there?

Because it's a scenario and it's worth examining.

[Cerebral_DownTime]

But it's just something to throw out there.

That was kind of my point. What's the psychology behind wanting to throw that out there?

Because it's a scenario and it's worth examining.

Don't bother Cass, he's just a curmudgeon who pisses and moans when Cleveland fans are pessimistic (which you weren't). It's obvious to anyone with a brain that the story was posted for purposes of board discussion.

[exiledbuckeye]

Regardless of who it is, the next city to get a transplanted team needs to be Seattle. Stern has to realize it was a huge injustice to let them leave, and he won't want his legacy permanently stained by the move.

would he move a team there without an arena? Isn't that the rationale behind them leaving in the first place?

Key Arena is still there, right? I think you could make that work for another season or two if the city voted to build a new arena or throw down some money for a big renovation.

Here's why the whole "the arena isn't good enough" reason for moving the Sonics (which was obviously a sham) is bullshit: the city paid for a massive renovation of the arena in 1995. It's in a great location (Seattle Center), it's modern, plenty of luxury suites, etc. Public transportation is fantastic. Tons to see and do down there, a great gameday experience. The new owners allegedly wanted to build an arena in Renton, which is probably a half hour drive from downtown Seattle on a good day with zero traffic - which never happens. Basically they wanted to build the old Coliseum, we see how well that worked out for Cleveland.

The reason the team left is because Howard Schultz (Starbucks CEO) sold the team to a group of Oklahoma City guys who "didn't want to move the team." Bullshit.

[davemanddd]

they should change their name to the pisces then and literally become "the fish that saved pittsburgh".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOuI0rXrOmA

[rk]

If LBJ leaves do we really care if the Cavs follow? Honestly it's not like it's gonna ever be this cool to watch the Cavs again and Cleveland wasn't exactly a NBA city before. With the ticket prices where they are, the inevitable collapse of the Cavs roster without a guy like LBJ on it and with only overpaid role players working moderately hard, and the eventual strike that the NBA will have to endure to get money under control I gotta imagine it would be met with not much more than a yawn.

But we'll see.

[aoxo1]

If LBJ leaves do we really care if the Cavs follow? Honestly it's not like it's gonna ever be this cool to watch the Cavs again and Cleveland wasn't exactly a NBA city before. With the ticket prices where they are, the inevitable collapse of the Cavs roster without a guy like LBJ on it and with only overpaid role players working moderately hard, and the eventual strike that the NBA will have to endure to get money under control I gotta imagine it would be met with not much more than a yawn.

But we'll see.

I don't know, do you like basketball or not?

[rk]

I don't know, do you like basketball or not?

Not enough to spend $100+ a game to watch a superstar-less team in the NBA with no chance at winning anything. But NCAA ball is fun and the NBA is pretty sweet to watch on TV for free.

If Lebron leaves no other superstar is going to be attracted to Cleveland which means the Cavs need to luck out in the draft which will take several seasons of tremendous sucking during which it is unlikely that we continue having an owner willing to shell out money on a losing franchise.

I don't even think people will pay if the Cavs somehow manage to become a mid-level playoff team like the Suns or the Hawks after being spoiled by Lebron.

If he leaves I really think it'll be the beginning of the end for the Cavs unless the NBA changes dramatically in the next CBA revision. Just too difficult to make money in the league without a superstar.

[aoxo1]

I don't know, do you like basketball or not?

Not enough to spend $100+ a game to watch a superstar-less team in the NBA with no chance at winning anything. But NCAA ball is fun and the NBA is pretty sweet to watch on TV for free.

If Lebron leaves no other superstar is going to be attracted to Cleveland which means the Cavs need to luck out in the draft which will take several seasons of tremendous sucking during which it is unlikely that we continue having an owner willing to shell out money on a losing franchise.

I don't even think people will pay if the Cavs somehow manage to become a mid-level playoff team like the Suns or the Hawks after being spoiled by Lebron.

If he leaves I really think it'll be the beginning of the end for the Cavs unless the NBA changes dramatically in the next CBA revision. Just too difficult to make money in the league without a superstar.

This is how it is for every team. You do realize that it is nearly unprecedented for superstars to switch teams (not including trades)? Over the last twenty years, it's pretty much... Shaq. Some guys switched and became superstars (Nash, McGrady) but that's not the same thing.

And I wouldn't expect Gilbert to continue shelling out money at the rate he is now. If LeBron leaves, I fully expect and hope that he slashes spending so that we can get that superstar in the draft. And teams don't need to draft #1 to get that guy, they just need to not be a Paxson. A few years of top 10 picks can set a team up for contending.

The Cavs managed to survive the years between Price and LeBron, and that was with completely inept management. It will obviously be a huge hit if LeBron leaves, but it's not the apocalypse unless Gilbert really, really wants to leave Cleveland.

[googleeph2]

If the Detroit franchise moves to Pittsburgh, I'd assume they'd adopt the colors of the Pirates, Steelers and Penguins.

In honor of that, they could change their name to the
Pittsburgh "Black 'n Piss"Tons.

Or the Blackened Pisstons. I can't photoshop, but the logo could be a black silhouette of a piston.

Or, in keeping with the trend not to make team nicknames plural,
they could just drop the '-tons' from the name, 'Pistons'.

[NoWearMan]

hello

[Spin]

If LBJ leaves do we really care if the Cavs follow?

No. Any NHL teams looking to relocate? I' much rather have the NHL than a LeBron-less NBA team. I've watched about zero non-Cav non-Zip basketball games the past half dozen years...

So, how many games did you attend between the Price-Daugherty-Nance era and the LBJ era?

I saw one. Took the whole family, some kind of promotion. Watched that miserable wreck lose to the Knicks by 50 points. Great times those were...

Hmmmmm, the Cleveland Coyotes playing at Cleveland Browns Stadium on January 1st.

The Cavs managed to survive the years between Price and LeBron

Actually they were big money losers, apparently headed for OKC or another new market before the ping pong balls "bounced our way". Let's not forget...

[jb]

But it's just something to throw out there.

That was kind of my point. What's the psychology behind wanting to throw that out there?

Because it's a scenario and it's worth examining.

Don't bother Cass, he's just a curmudgeon who pisses and moans when Cleveland fans are pessimistic (which you weren't). It's obvious to anyone with a brain that the story was posted for purposes of board discussion.

Deeep, from the Q!

Next time Cap'n Lou fan adds something, anything to any discussion will be the first.

Put it on ignore, Erik.

[jb]

If LBJ leaves do we really care if the Cavs follow?

No. Any NHL teams looking to relocate? I' much rather have the NHL than a LeBron-less NBA team. I've watched about zero non-Cav non-Zip basketball games the past half dozen years...

So, how many games did you attend between the Price-Daugherty-Nance era and the LBJ era?

I saw one. Took the whole family, some kind of promotion. Watched that miserable wreck lose to the Knicks by 50 points. Great times those were...

Hmmmmm, the Cleveland Coyotes playing at Cleveland Browns Stadium on January 1st.

The Cavs managed to survive the years between Price and LeBron

Actually they were big money losers, apparently headed for OKC or another new market before the ping pong balls "bounced our way". Let's not forget...

NHL = watching grabage cans rust.

[peeker643]

LOL.

Those yinzers are too stupid to understand a sport like NBA hoops.

How long would it take anyone to pick up on the intricacies of "the superstar call" and "the crooked official?"

Go back to the Miami (in Miami) gamethread and tell me the people here understand the 'intracacies'.

[Spin]

NHL = watching grabage cans rust.

50+ loss Cavs teams (between each playoff era) = watching your ex getting boned by the guy she dropped you for