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LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby e0y2e3 » Sat Jan 23, 2010 11:54 pm

OD did you really miss ALL the sarcasm there? Phone posting, out, so no game thoughts, fwiw.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby davemanddd » Sat Jan 23, 2010 11:55 pm

ugh, what an emotionally draining game, but i will certainly take the hard fought win. talk about survival of the fittest.

i swear, okc is going to be a force to be reckoned with in the nba for many years to come. they ain't no sister of the poor anymore. in fact, there are a lot of up-and-coming teams who you used to be able to pencil in default wins for that you just can't do that with anymore including okc, charlotte, memphis, sac-to, etc. the cavs have already lost 3 games to such teams this year and almost lost again tonite.

had the cavs lost tonite, it would have been mainly due to their extremely poor foul shooting and once again a bugaboo that has plagued them quite a bit ever since they went out on their west coast road trip and that is way too many (17) turnovers. of course it didn't help matters any that their top 2 point guards were out with injuries, but that's beside the point. if i never see anthony parker trying to run the point again, it will be a good thing.

nice to see new guy cedric "the entertainer" jackson from csu get some run there though. maybe we might see more of him in miami on monday??? all i know is that the cavs need some serious help in the backcourt now in the wake of the injuries to mo & d-west and that was certainly evident tonite.

thankfully, they were able to pull it out there in the end though thanx to the magnificence that is lebron james and an extremely timely 3 by the boobster. when boobie hit that 3 to put them up 2 with 8 seconds left, i think i jumped so high my head hit the ceiling. then, when lebron blocked durant's shot and made the free throws that sealed the deal, i pretty much just collapsed in my recliner from the relief.

my gawd, i am just spent right now.

i think i may have yelled and screamed at my tv more tonite just during the 4th quarter than what i did all thursday night against the lake show. i think i will just go to bed now and crash. later.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby peeker643 » Sat Jan 23, 2010 11:59 pm

OldDawg wrote:I had the game on the radio in the car for only the 4th quarter, then got home to watch the last 5 mins. I know Shaq was having possibly his best game of the year, but how many FTs does a guy have to miss in a row before you way the pros and cons of his worth late in the game?

I know that everyone else was missing FTs too, but Shaq shooting a FT is the same as a TO. Maybe MB is trying to show Shaq that he confidence in him in this situation, but Shaq is what he is. He has constantly proven to be a liability in end game situations on the FT line. A vote of confidence isn't gonna all of a sudden change this.

Isn't Shaq's job to get the team in the bonus, and then Z comes in to take advantage of it and shoot those FTs?

Again, didn't see or hear most of the game. Am I missing something??

And was LBJs block of Durant absolutely sick. LBJ is a freak of nature, who finds new ways to amaze us every night.


Z was just useless all night. He and Andy combined for two points. And, with Gibson having as many assists as you did in 35 more minutes of play, LBJ initiated the offense all night. When he needed help it was Shaq on the block. He powered his way to 22 points on 8-10 from the floor and to about 64 misses from the line. But w/o Mo and West I think that's how they're going to have to go to get to 100 each night.

Believe me, I wondered the same thing while watching it. But tonight it was necessary and it was also highlighted by everyone else shooting like Shaq from the stripe.

Just my $0.02
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby OldDawg » Sun Jan 24, 2010 12:27 am

e0y2e3 wrote:OD did you really miss ALL the sarcasm there? Phone posting, out, so no game thoughts, fwiw.

Actually, I did, i was being facetious as well.
Last edited by OldDawg on Sun Jan 24, 2010 12:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby neoleo » Sun Jan 24, 2010 12:28 am

Peeker643 wrote:
OldDawg wrote:I had the game on the radio in the car for only the 4th quarter, then got home to watch the last 5 mins. I know Shaq was having possibly his best game of the year, but how many FTs does a guy have to miss in a row before you way the pros and cons of his worth late in the game?

I know that everyone else was missing FTs too, but Shaq shooting a FT is the same as a TO. Maybe MB is trying to show Shaq that he confidence in him in this situation, but Shaq is what he is. He has constantly proven to be a liability in end game situations on the FT line. A vote of confidence isn't gonna all of a sudden change this.

Isn't Shaq's job to get the team in the bonus, and then Z comes in to take advantage of it and shoot those FTs?

Again, didn't see or hear most of the game. Am I missing something??

And was LBJs block of Durant absolutely sick. LBJ is a freak of nature, who finds new ways to amaze us every night.


Z was just useless all night. He and Andy combined for two points. And, with Gibson having as many assists as you did in 35 more minutes of play, LBJ initiated the offense all night. When he needed help it was Shaq on the block. He powered his way to 22 points on 8-10 from the floor and to about 64 misses from the line. But w/o Mo and West I think that's how they're going to have to go to get to 100 each night.

Believe me, I wondered the same thing while watching it. But tonight it was necessary and it was also highlighted by everyone else shooting like Shaq from the stripe.

Just my $0.02


Agree with Peek. We had no other options. Z was invisible and Andy was quiet, partly due to Hickson playing relatively well and getting extended minutes. I'd rather have Shaq over Hickson and Anderson isn't exactly a sure thing from the stripe either (which he showed with the two late misses).
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby neoleo » Sun Jan 24, 2010 12:37 am

davemanddd wrote:nice to see new guy cedric "the entertainer" jackson from csu get some run there though. maybe we might see more of him in miami on monday??? all i know is that the cavs need some serious help in the backcourt now in the wake of the injuries to mo & d-west and that was certainly evident tonite.


The more Boobie plays the point, I think the more obvious it will be that he needs to be off the ball. My question is this, with Moon possibly coming back next game in Miami and with Green playing well today, who gets the minutes in the back court?

Is it possible that Jawad goes back to the end of the bench and gives all his minutes back to Moon? Does Moon go back to his old role and Jawad gets his minutes reduced down into Green's role from tonight? Or does MB see the need to get Jackson some playing time as the backup PG? If so, where in the world do those minutes come from?

If MB plays it by committee like he did tonight, I think you see Jackson as the odd man out and Moon/Jawad/Green (in that order) split the minutes behind Boobie/AP/LeBron. Problem is, until Delonte comes back, I don't think MB can get away with this lineup because not one member of the "committee" is a point guard at all (as Boobie showed tonight).

As much as I liked seeing Green out there, him, Jawad and Moon become redundant in my opinion. And until Delonte gets back, I really think we need a ball handling point guard ala Jackson.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby Ea$t $ide » Sun Jan 24, 2010 9:03 am

I have to agree with everyone saying OKC is up and coming. Man they are a good team. They're a C and some better role players away from being a top team...


Nenad Krstic needs to shave his dome....the 45 year old bald guy look is not so cool...
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby papacass » Sun Jan 24, 2010 11:23 am

NEOLeo wrote:As much as I liked seeing Green out there, him, Jawad and Moon become redundant in my opinion. And until Delonte gets back, I really think we need a ball handling point guard ala Jackson.


As great as it is from a Clevelander's standpoint to have Ced Jackson on the team, I don't think you can just throw him to the wolves in his first week in the NBA. Not when the Cavs are under pressure to win every game. Jackson might be able to help some, but MB isn't going to have him running the offense for any extended period of time.

(Well, maybe you actually can throw him to the "Wolves." Wednesday's game is probably the best chance to get a newcomer like Jackson some real minutes.)

Green and Jawad are a bit redundant. But Moon is a different player. Jamario is a defender and exceptional athlete. He brings far more to the table than Green or Jawad, who are primarily shooters. Jamario won't be fighting for minutes with anyone on the back of the bench.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby neoleo » Sun Jan 24, 2010 1:30 pm

Papa Cass wrote:
NEOLeo wrote:As much as I liked seeing Green out there, him, Jawad and Moon become redundant in my opinion. And until Delonte gets back, I really think we need a ball handling point guard ala Jackson.


As great as it is from a Clevelander's standpoint to have Ced Jackson on the team, I don't think you can just throw him to the wolves in his first week in the NBA. Not when the Cavs are under pressure to win every game. Jackson might be able to help some, but MB isn't going to have him running the offense for any extended period of time.

(Well, maybe you actually can throw him to the "Wolves." Wednesday's game is probably the best chance to get a newcomer like Jackson some real minutes.)

Green and Jawad are a bit redundant. But Moon is a different player. Jamario is a defender and exceptional athlete. He brings far more to the table than Green or Jawad, who are primarily shooters. Jamario won't be fighting for minutes with anyone on the back of the bench.


I've admitted to being completely biased on this one, but I do understand that you can't just throw a D League player into the rotation when you're fighting for the number 1 seed.

That being said, I can see Jackson, even in the early stages of learning the system and just days removed from the D League, being a better option for 2-3 minute stretches than AP. Especially when you have any combination of Boobie, AP, Moon, Jawad and Green out there together.

Outside of playing LeBron 42+ minutes every night (which can't be good in the long run either), I just don't see how that group can be productive. Which again, when you're fighting for the one seed is not good. I guess it's pick your poison at this point.

And I agree on Moon. When he's healthy he'll get all of his minutes back. I'm just not sure he'll come back ready to take all of those minutes right away. And that still begs the question, when he's 100% does Jawad go back to being glued to the end of the bench?
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby papacass » Sun Jan 24, 2010 2:11 pm

NEOLeo wrote:I've admitted to being completely biased on this one, but I do understand that you can't just throw a D League player into the rotation when you're fighting for the number 1 seed.

That being said, I can see Jackson, even in the early stages of learning the system and just days removed from the D League, being a better option for 2-3 minute stretches than AP. Especially when you have any combination of Boobie, AP, Moon, Jawad and Green out there together.

Outside of playing LeBron 42+ minutes every night (which can't be good in the long run either), I just don't see how that group can be productive. Which again, when you're fighting for the one seed is not good. I guess it's pick your poison at this point.

And I agree on Moon. When he's healthy he'll get all of his minutes back. I'm just not sure he'll come back ready to take all of those minutes right away. And that still begs the question, when he's 100% does Jawad go back to being glued to the end of the bench?


Delonte probably isn't going to miss a lot of time. Maybe 3-5 games. So if you have to play LBJ a bit more in the meantime, it's not that big of a deal.

My guess is that Jackson, when he's in there, won't be handling the ball a lot, if at all. He'll need to prove his worth with D and hustle plays before he gets to decide where the ball goes. That's fair. Start out as a placeholder and improve your value from there based on what you show.

The PF situation with the Cavs is very fluid right now. J.J. and Jawad are interchangeable, Powe could be back within a month and the trade deadline is a little over three weeks away. At this point, there isn't any real way to tell how it's all going to shake out. But I think Jawad is going to continue to get decent minutes in the short term. MB seems to be impressed with what he's seen out of him.
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Re: LBJ - KD/Westbrook - Some kid from CSU/Cavs - OKC

Unread postby Gradysmanldy » Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:13 pm

Further training for Mike Brown in the next few weeks on how to flexibly work with a lineup based on matchups and how the guys are playing. He has been so formulaic over the last 2 years it's kind of nice to see his hand forced into actually playing the guys that work best in a given situation.

That said, sucks that the #1 seed is in the balance while he works in guys like Green, Powe, Hot Wad, and a potential trade acquisition.

I'd really like to see Green play a few more minutes when Delonte is either off-balance mentally or out with injury. I've really liked what i've seen from him in limited minutes. Think he could be a very Courtney Lee type player for us.
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