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Cleveland Cavaliers & The NBA

Will the Cavaliers make a trade?

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Will the Cavaliers make a trade?

Yes, they'll make a significant move
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30%
Yes, but it will be a minor deal
3
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No
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Total votes : 10

Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:32 am

http://blogs.ohio.com/cavaliers_blog/

Ferry in dash to get Bibby

Didn't go it to Toronto tonight, my first missed game of the season. But this was no off day, I was working the phones hard. I talked to several organizations and it has become clear the Cavs are going all out as to land Mike Bibby.

In my past dealings with Danny Ferry, I found him to be very calculating and cautious. He didn't want to make a trade unless he was pretty sure he was going to win it. That is the Spurs way. With the Eastern Conference faltering this season and with all sorts of signs that the Kings really just want to rid themselves of Bibby, it seems Ferry has changed his tune. He's willing to make a risky move if he thinks it will make the Cavs contenders. And apparently, he's got Dan Gilbert's backing.

Getting Bibby might slam the Cavs into the luxury tax this season and deep into the tax next year. But there's no doubt the green light has been given. As I've written on numerous occasions, the Kings want Gooden and cap relief. From the people I talked to today, they also want a point guard too. Ferry has been working on it as hard as he can, but so far hasn't been able to get the Kings to bite.

I think the ball is really in Sac's court, they are making this trade to start to rebuild and rid themselves of Bibby and his contract. It will come to them to bend probably.

One thing that is very important here is that Bibby can opt out of his deal in the offseason. Though he might not because he's making big dollars. A huge factor is that Bibby's agent is David Falk, the guy who landed Ferry a 10-year deal back in the day. Trust that Ferry and Falk have talked about it a lot and obviously have a lot of trust built with each other and I'm sure the sides have an understanding about what Bibby's intentions are.

Even if this doesn't get done, remember two things: 1. Ferry worked hard to make a major deal. 2. This might very well get done next summer.
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Unread postby BadBecks » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:36 am

Yup, ESPN and SI.com are reporting Danny Ferry is going all out. I guess Sacramento wants more expiring contracts. I even heard a crazy rumor that it could be a four team deal. I'm for it. In this conference, this trade can really push them ahead. Esp w/ "Wild Thing" playing phoenominal as a starter right now...he'll step right in for Gooden.
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Unread postby swerb » Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:38 am

Lead Pipe wrote:C'mon Swerb. The Suns could play 81 games in 81 nights and they still ain't losing a series to the Cavs. If Lebron is the best player in that Series the Suns have 2 thru 9. Not to be a downer here but here's my reality check.

1. They are not going to make a trade of any signifigance. They've rendered themselves useless in the trade market.

2. The East is incredibally week and the Cavs still aren't going to the finals. They are part of the reason the Eastern conference is weak. Number two conference seeds aren't generally mediocre teams, which the Cavs are.

You're right, even given what I just mentioned, I couldn't see any scenario where the Cavs could beat the Suns 4 outta 7.

I disagree with you though on a couple things. I do think the Cavs will end up with Bibby by 3 PM today. And if so, they'll make it to the East Finals with a good shot to get to the NBA Finals.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am

Phoenix will not make the NBA Finals, and they are the only Western team that the Cavs have no shot against. Dallas or San Anotnio will take care of them. Book it.

JB - I see where you are at with this, but I could not disagree more. I have been haring about the future of Cleveland teams for way too long. I am ready for the present to come and bite me square on my left cheek.

I'm also of he belief that Gooden is tremendously underrated by Cavs fans. Sure, 11 / 8 isn't the be all, end all line. And yes, dude has mental lapses like he's an Irish Setter. But he's active, he's a legit big man, and he's a decent 3rd offensive option. You deal him and give his minutes to SSB and you'll miss the skill set on O, you'll miss Gooden's boards and D not at all, but you'll feel it off the bench. Donyell Marshall is a specilaist. You don't want the old dude getting serious minutes and you don't want him doing much more than hoisting some treys.


Donyell Marshall will be reborn in the playoffs. He is the one Cavalier that I think people forget paces himself. Come playoff time, he will hit the blocks and the board like a beast.

I also think the trade that is going down is different than what you have listed. The Cavs will be giving up multiple players and only getting Bibby in return so far, so there would have to be something else in the works for an extra big.

just have to reiterate. If they take on Marcus Banks' contract I defy anyone to come on here and tell me the Cavs aren't the dumbest organization in the game. My God, has anyone seen that contract? HOOOOOORRRRIIIBBBBBLLLLEEE!!!


So that means the Suns are currently the dumbest team in sports? :lol:

And yes, if our big move at the deadline is Marcus Banks, then Danny Ferry should be drawn and quartered on Public Square.
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:27 pm

Im starting to think the Cavs will not make a trade :-( :sad: :(
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:34 pm

Ferry was on WTAM this morning....said he would be surprised if something gets done. Although, of course he isn't going to show his cards.....so probably some BS there. But, I did get the notion he was telling the truth. I hope not.
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:43 pm

Trade talk: the final hoursBy Marc Stein
ESPN.com

The latest dose of trade chatter dribbling in to Stein Line HQ as of 2 a.m. ET on Thursday morning, just over 12 hours away from NBA's Thursday 3 p.m. ET trade deadline:
The marquee player most likely to move entering the final hours of trade season is the same guy who held that designation in this cyberspace Tuesday night: Sacramento's Mike Bibby.

Yet there were no indications in the wee hours of Thursday morning that a Bibby-to-Cleveland deal was close, either.

The Cavs remain seriously interested in putting Bibby between LeBron James and Larry Hughes and, according to NBA front-office sources, have been scouring the NBA map to find a third team to help facilitate a deal. Minnesota, Toronto and Phoenix are among the teams that Cleveland has reached out to in hopes of furnishing Sacramento with more cap-friendly contracts it can offer on its own.

However ...

A three-team scenario in which Cavs power forward Drew Gooden and Minnesota's Mike James would land in Sacramento no longer appears to be an option. It appears that Cleveland and Sacramento will keep trying to strike a deal before the trade buzzer.

Sources said Sacramento's offer of Bibby to the Dallas Mavericks for young speedster Devin Harris and Austin Croshere's expiring contract was quickly rejected by the Mavs, who won't consider moving anyone in their main rotation. Dallas believes Harris could be the top defensive point guard in the West, if he's not there already.
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Unread postby swerb » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:03 pm

From a chat on ESPN.com with Chad Ford ...

Eric (Phoenix, AZ): What are the odds that Marcus Banks gets traded and are their any PGs out there that the Suns could bring in to back-up Nash?

Chad Ford: (12:26 PM ET ) They are trying to move Banks who's been a MAJOR bust in Phoenix (don't get me started on this ... I'm still stunned they passed on Rajon Rondo to get this guy ... that's almost worse than the contract). I think they are less worried about point guard at this point than the front court. They've been showing a lot of interest in Drew Gooden lately and the Cavs might be willing to do a deal for Banks, Kurt Thomas and a couple of first round picks (Phoenix has three this year, including the Cavs pick). Not sure if Gooden is a great fit in Phoenix ... but they seem to like him.


Dayton, Ohio: Chad, are the Cavs going to get the Bibby deal done???

Chad Ford: (12:09 PM ET ) I just don't think they have the assets unless they can find a taker for either Larry Hughes or Zydrunas Ilgauskas. The Cavs don't have many assets or expiring contracts. For the Cavs to pull off a deal with the Kings, they'd have to include like five players to get one. Look for the Cavs to perhaps make a smaller deal for a point guard using Drew Gooden as the bait.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:20 pm

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/baske ... and_b.html

The latest on Mike Bibby: The deal with Cleveland was hitting a snag this morning, said a person involved in the situation. The reason? Bruised egos over the leaking of the proposal that would've freed Bibby from Sacramento. That's only one of the many reasons why it's so hard to get trades done at the deadline. A few years ago, Miami's Pat Riley pulled the plug on a trade for Jamal Mashburn because he was so miffed that his secret discussions got out.

It still appears that Bibby will be dealt, and his destination probably still will be Cleveland. If the Cavs can't get Bibby, they've discussed a Damon Jones-for-Marcus Banks deal with Phoenix, as ESPN.com's Chris Sheridan reported here http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/ ... id=2774443
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:49 pm

This is killing me, Id do that trade with Phx yesterday. Having two #1's + Nebles exp contract could be nice
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:08 pm

Warm Up Bibby – He’s Still In Play: Mike Bibby may be the only big name moved in the next few hours – Miami, Cleveland and LA all made a play on Bibby in the past 48 hours. Cleveland wants him the most and has the least to offer, Miami wants him for minor parts, and LA was ready to give Sacramento enough young parts to make it workable to fans. The Kings are fielding the calls and hoping for a multi-team deal, and it seems at this point that’s the only way Cleveland get Bibby is with a third team involved, and that third team might be Denver. There were rumblings a month or so ago that Brad Miller could be on the move, so things may get interesting down the stretch for the Kings, who are ready to start over.
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:20 pm

ESPN Radio is reporting that the Cavs are now bidding against themselves for Bibby. If it happens, it probably won't be the huge four-team deal or something of that sort, but whether or not the Kings simply want to get out from that contract.
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Unread postby swerb » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:21 pm

You really get the impression that the Kings are dead set on moving Bibby, and are just taking it right down to the 3 PM deadline before moving him to the highest bidder.

Think about it, Bibby has voiced his displeasure about playing in Sacramento, and can opt out of his deal at seasons end.

I'm saying Bibby gets moved in the next 40 minutes to whoever has the best offer at 3 PM.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:25 pm

SOmeone from the CS board just said ESPN is reporting the Bibby to Cleveland talks are dead. I don't see anything on ESPN indicating so, though.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:35 pm

LOL, the Scout.com forums are down because they are upgrading the board software. I bet there are a lot of not-so-happy campers on the Cavs site right about now!
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Unread postby leadpipe » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:50 pm

Pup, you are telling me the Cavs can beat the Mavs or San Antone. Christ.

And, The Suns are not the dumbest team in sports because of the Banks contract. If 3/4 of the players they signed for 15 years straight were inked to horrible contracts, like the Cavs, then they would approach their stature.
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Unread postby papacass » Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:57 pm

Yahoo Sports is reporting that the Bibby deal is dead. But I haven't heard or seen anyone else report that as of yet.

Remember, even if 3 p.m. comes and goes with no announcement, it sometimes takes hours for these deals to finally be announced. 3 p.m. is simply when all the paperwork has to be filed.

I think it was early evening last year before we found out about the Flip Murray trade.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:03 pm

Whelp, the deadline has passed. Hopefully Ferry got something done. I'll be very disappointed otherwise.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:03 pm

Pipes, I beleive we are 2-0 against the Spurs this year.

I don't think we are any worse than Miami was last year, if we get a PG. Dallas was a ton better than Miami last year, but didn't win the series.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:11 pm

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... &type=lgns

After exhausting the possibility of the involvement of a third team, the Cleveland Cavaliers look like they will be unable to present a package that would land Sacramento Kings point guard Mike Bibby.

Kings general manager Geoff Petrie was unwilling to trade Bibby to Cleveland in a deal that featured forward Drew Gooden.

Cavaliers general manager Danny Ferry was determined to show LeBron James that the Cavs are committed to making a move in the Eastern Conference. That's why Ferry was so relentless in his pursuit of Bibby on Wednesday.
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Unread postby papacass » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:35 pm

Sacramento Bee's website is also reporting that Bibby is staying put, and the Cavs have moved on to "other, non-Bibby related business."

Brian Windhorst said earlier today on his blog that, even if the don't make a deal today, it could very well be that a Bibby deal gets made over the summer. The Cavs want him and the Kings want to move him, but over the summer, there will be more time to tinker with the rosters and maybe get another team involved.

By the by, where did Andre Miller's name go in all of this? He's hardly even a blip on the rumor mill radar screen.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:45 pm

Per Triv, he says he has been told the Cavs made no trades.
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Unread postby papacass » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:55 pm

Then they probably didn't make any moves, since Trivisonno is spoon-fed stuff directly from the front offices of all three sports teams in town.

The perks of working for the station that has "all the balls"...
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:59 pm

Very disappointing.
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:03 pm

ESPN News said there was a major deal at the NBA office. But I have found nothing to verify this.
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Unread postby swerb » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:03 pm

Well, we're going to war with what we got.

This is a better team with Sasha and Gibson getting minutes, Snow down to 15-20 min a night, and Damon's ass stapled to the bench.

Now ... the next move, officially replace Z with Varejao in the starting lineup.

This isn't a championship team. But who is definitively better in the East?

Detroit probably. No one else.

We're likely gonna be looking at the #2 seed, and one of these teams in the first round ...

Orlando
Miami (in trouble with Wade down again)
Indiana

Then Washington, then Detroit.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:13 pm

Thing is, the opportunity is there with the East so bad right now. Who knows how much longer the East will continue to be like this.

And, what happened to Wade last night night should be a reminder that you can't we can't look to next year with this team. What happened to Wade last night could happen to Lebron next year.

Damn.

Oh well....they'll be a #2-#5 seed when it all plays out. And then we'll see what happens in the playoffs.....
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Unread postby papacass » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:35 pm

See, I'm not all that disappointed.

I think, honestly, that standing pat is a good move if they couldn't land Bibby. And the fate of that deal was largely out of the Cavs hands.

If they stand pat, they keep intact the second-best frontcourt in the East behind Detroit. If you watched last night's game, Gooden and Varejao really put them in a position to win the game down the stretch with their rebounding.

They do need a point guard, but if you want to have a prayer against the Pistons in the playoffs, you need to be able to match their size and physicality up front.

I would have loved to have Bibby, but even if the deal was made, I'd still have some reservations if it cost them Gooden.

Maybe the summer is a better time to revisit this deal, especially since Bibby can opt out of his contract after the season.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:39 pm

Pup, Maybe I'm watching the wrong team As good as the Heat last year? Half of the old Shaq and Haslem provide 100% better inside presence than the Cavs have (if they have any) The Heat were excelent defensively in the playoffs defending both half court and transition. They made their free throws (even with Shaq bringing them down.) They are much better coached. I don't get it.
And yes, the Cavs have beaten the Spurs twice. A veteran championship team that when it's on the line would beat The Cavs so handily it's not funny. Who's going to hang with Parker. Who's the inside presence on Duncan. Ginobli and Bowen running The King ragged and D-ing up on him. This is a horrible match-up, but typical in the sense that Lebron would be the best player on the floor and the next 6 best players are from the other team.

This is not a good team. They didn't make a trade this year and they will be on impact trade hiatus for the next two. They have conducted themselves from a management standpoint like they always have. Lebron will win his championship somewhere else.

Lastly, understand that I am a Cavs fan. I could give a shit about any other NBA team. It is just sickening how pathetic the franchise has been for so long. After Lebron leaves there will become a real danger that the franchise will eventually leave as well.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:41 pm

It's there for the taking this year, though. Getting a top PG would have bumped us to Piston level or even above them. Even without Gooden.

I hope their recent play of late did not give the team (and fans) a false sense of security. From everything being reported, Ferry went all out to get Bibby which is all I can ask. Just disappointing we couldn't get him now, as with him we are a legit NBA FInals contender....without that PG we are just in the same mix with 3-4 other teams below the Pistons.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 22, 2007 6:12 pm

Andy, Gooden, Z and Marshall are a better presence than Shaq and Haslem. If you don'tt hink so, you are just being bitter about the Cavs.

The Shaq from last year's playoffs is not the dominant Shaq of yesteryear. The only thing that team did better than this Cavs team is shoot free throws (and coach).

The Cavs have not exactly been bad defensively this year. If they make the same improvement this year going into the playoffs they did last year, they will be fine on D. Marshall will play much better and tougher once we get to the playoffs.

Who's going to hang with Parker.


Gibson. He won't shut him down, but he will be better than anything else we could ahve thrown at him in the past.



Who's the inside presence on Duncan.


Like I said, the Cavs have 4 solid big men, plus hack-a-Duncan Scott Pollard to rotate through the series. Andy will annoy the piss out of him, Z can handle some minutes on him, Yell can man up.

I am not saying the Cavs are in the top 5 teams in the NBA (though they are very close to that). What I am saying is the East is pathetic. If you can find your way through it, in a 7 game series anything can happen. Do I like to count on the anything can happen angle? No. But it is better than anything else I have to cheer for right now, so I will roll with it.

Think St. Louis Cardinals. They were probably about the 7th best team in baseball and the 2nd best team in the National League. They found a way to win the NLCS and then anything did happen and they are World Champions. I think that is exactly where the Cavs fall in the NBA and Eastern Conference. Would I rather they won 65 games and strolled through the playoffs, of course, but that ain't happening and I ain't giving back a championship because they weren't the best team through 82 games.
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Unread postby jb » Thu Feb 22, 2007 9:38 pm

Papa Cass wrote:See, I'm not all that disappointed.

I think, honestly, that standing pat is a good move if they couldn't land Bibby. And the fate of that deal was largely out of the Cavs hands.

If they stand pat, they keep intact the second-best frontcourt in the East behind Detroit. If you watched last night's game, Gooden and Varejao really put them in a position to win the game down the stretch with their rebounding.

They do need a point guard, but if you want to have a prayer against the Pistons in the playoffs, you need to be able to match their size and physicality up front.

I would have loved to have Bibby, but even if the deal was made, I'd still have some reservations if it cost them Gooden.

Maybe the summer is a better time to revisit this deal, especially since Bibby can opt out of his contract after the season.


Dude, that's exactly what I'm talkin' about.

You can't win the east with a weak front line. Not even w/ Marshall being our Bill Cartwright and only really showing up in the playoffs.
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 22, 2007 11:07 pm

Hey Pipes, forget everything I said. These guys suck donkey balls!
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 22, 2007 11:29 pm

JB wrote:Dude, that's exactly what I'm talkin' about.

You can't win the east with a weak front line. Not even w/ Marshall being our Bill Cartwright and only really showing up in the playoffs.


Let's be real here.

Didn't Z and Gooden practically disappear in last year's playoffs? Some great front-line.

Actually, I am down with keeping Gooden and sending Z packing. Gooden at PF and Varejao at C would make for a great rebounding tandem.....and Varejao is Rodman. Great defense, rebounding....it is all we need from our center.

It is amazing when you think about it how much we blew that 2005 offseason. Z is irrelevant now, and should be replaced in the starting lineup by Varejao. Hughes is irrelevant, and should be replaced by Sasha (or a Sasha/Boobie combo). Damon Jones is irrelevant, as Gibson provides what we thought we'd get from him. Only Marshall has any value, and he is heading downhill.

This off-season, the Cavaliers need to look to trade Z. Unfortunately, it will be almost impossible, and they will have to trade Drew.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Fri Feb 23, 2007 12:15 am

They do not have a good front court. Andy seems like a nice player, than you have a bunch of average guys. Papa says they are the second best front court in the East. Ummm, I think you might be leaving out a few teams that have one guy and whomever the hell he wants to play beside him that are better than the Cavs. The Raptors for example. Bosh and (fill in the blank) are going to produce more than a Cavs Front line. Drew Gooden is not a good player. If he was he would have played in the playoffs last year when games were being won and lost. Hell, Z was already out of the playoff picture and he still coulldn't get meaningful minutes. Pollard is ineffective, isn't playing many games and is too worried about the hair. You could cut him and grab a guy off the street and you wouldn't be losing much.

The last two nights....Cavs fans shouyld pay attention to. This is what they are. They are pretty close to the Raptors, pretty close to the Bulls, they aren't much better than any of these Eas teams, and they are worse then some. Incidentally, in 2 years when the Cavs are still cap strapped and an 85 year old Donyell Marshall is hoisting 3's and al eleven million dollar Z walks up the floor to receive a pass from a 14 million dollar Larry Hughes, The Raptors will have a much better team. Bargani in two years will be much better than anyone the Cavs put on the floor save Lebron. This is the huge problem...they have little future.
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Unread postby Dozen » Fri Feb 23, 2007 12:23 am

1st off AV will never be a starter of any value in the NBA. He can give you some spot starts and a 6th man role but never a starter. Talk about disappearing, where was AV tonight? I was a "witness" to see Wallace and PJ fricken Brown dominate the paint. Christ, Brown actually went to Pollard and Dwayne Jones for help. Oh, and this just in...........Larry Hughes is worthless going to his left. Has anyone ever really noticed this? Dude cant go to the hole nor pull up when he goes to his left. Wouldnt it be logical for the coach to maybe notice this and switch him to the other side? Don't good coaches try to blend their philosiphy with the players strengths? I'll tell ya what, if the cavs could have gotten Banks and 2 #1's for Gooden..........they should have done so. And yes I do realize Banks contract is awful, but with 2 #1's and Nebles exp. contract they could have started to pull themselves out of this HUGE hole they are in. This could very well be a re-occuring theme for the next few years and LBJ will have every reason to head to Brooklyn.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:44 am

They still owe Newble for next year.
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Unread postby papacass » Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:55 am

Lead Pipe:

They do have a good frontcourt. They are 32-23 for a reason, and it sure as heck ain't their backcourt.

If anybody is going to use last night's loss as proof to show just how bad the frontcourt is, I think that's false reasoning. As usual, when the Cavs struggle, it's not a talent issue. They fell asleep at the switch on offense in the second quarter, fell behind by double figures and then started bricking free throws.

They missed Z last night. Yes, it is possible for this team to miss everyone's favorite white stiff. The Bulls do not have much size up front, and Z could have made life a lot tougher on Ben Wallace trying to grab the six zillion rebounds he got last night.

Z and Sasha gave them pretty huge holes to fill. But as usual, when they lose a game like last night, it comes down to energy and execution. Not talent.
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Unread postby pup » Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:50 am

The last two nights....Cavs fans shouyld pay attention to. This is what they are. They are pretty close to the Raptors, pretty close to the Bulls


So they are in the mix as the second best team in the East, correct? Isn't that all anyone is saying? If they can snag the 2 seed, then they will be looking at a very beatable team in round 1, with HC advantage, then the Raptors, with HC advantage.

The Pistons could have to go Nets, then Bulls just to make it to the Conference Finals. We could very easliy have HC throughout the EC.

Pistons
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Raptors
Wizards
Bulls
Indiana
Orlando
Nets

Our road to the Finals could be Pacers/Raptors. The Wiz/Bulls winner then gets to rough up Detroit, before the finals.
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:54 am

Way to early to talk seeding since everyone is so bunched up. Bottom line, we need that #2 seed. But, this team could realistically finish anywhere from #2 to #6 in the seedings.
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Unread postby Dozen » Fri Feb 23, 2007 11:16 am

Lead Pipe wrote:They still owe Newble for next year.


Pipes, Im well aware of this, going into the JUNE draft, they could have had 2 #1's and Newbles exp deal. This would be after this season.The day the season ends for the Cavs, Nebles contract will start to look atractive.
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Unread postby pup » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:02 pm

The Cavs want him and the Kings want to move him, but over the summer, there will be more time to tinker with the rosters and maybe get another team involved.


Haven't we all known for months that the Cavs needed a Bibby? Why did it take until the week of the deadline, where time became an issue?
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Unread postby consigliere » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:07 pm

Pup wrote:Haven't we all known for months that the Cavs needed a Bibby? Why did it take until the week of the deadline, where time became an issue?


Rack Pup!
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Unread postby Dozen » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:07 pm

Pup wrote:
The Cavs want him and the Kings want to move him, but over the summer, there will be more time to tinker with the rosters and maybe get another team involved.


Haven't we all known for months that the Cavs needed a Bibby? Why did it take until the week of the deadline, where time became an issue?


Takes 2 Pup, Sac hasnt even considered trading him til this year and why wouldnt they take that to the deadline? The Cavs dont have anything to offer anyways. Something like this could take place in the offseason. Teams will know after the draft and FA how things are shaping up for them. Bottom line, they need 1-2 more teams to get something done.
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Unread postby pup » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:16 pm

Takes 2 Pup, Sac hasnt even considered trading him til this year and why wouldnt they take that to the deadline? The Cavs dont have anything to offer anyways. Something like this could take place in the offseason. Teams will know after the draft and FA how things are shaping up for them. Bottom line, they need 1-2 more teams to get something done.


Sac wanted to move Bibby. The Cavs didn't have the right pieces, so they had to get other teams involoved. I understand that. What I am asking is, why didn't they have the forsight to see this coming and get started on the talks earlier, with the other teams. If Sac does not want to move Bibby, then why would the talks heat up again this summer?

A savy GM would have began the talks of bringing in a third and fourth team weeks, if not months, ago. It looks like Ferry waited until Wednesday.
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Unread postby Dozen » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:25 pm

Well I see what you are saying but, It was reported that they had a deal fall through 2 weeks ago. This is turning into what may be the worst FO in the 3 franchises in Cleveland. You have guys who under perform and have ridiculous contracts. You have guys who you dont even know if they are valuable to us or anyone else. Can anyone honestly say how good Sahsa is? How good Gibson or S.Brown can be? We cannot expect another GM to be sold on something we dont even know yet. You have an owner who hired the coach and a GM who lobbied to get Snow benched. All of this while the LBJ to Brooklyn timeclock ticks. I hate to say this, but this seriously could be one of the slowest, most painful deaths of any sports franchise.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:49 pm

Papa Cass wrote:Lead Pipe:

They do have a good frontcourt. They are 32-23 for a reason, and it sure as heck ain't their backcourt.

If anybody is going to use last night's loss as proof to show just how bad the frontcourt is, I think that's false reasoning. As usual, when the Cavs struggle, it's not a talent issue. They fell asleep at the switch on offense in the second quarter, fell behind by double figures and then started bricking free throws.

They missed Z last night. Yes, it is possible for this team to miss everyone's favorite white stiff. The Bulls do not have much size up front, and Z could have made life a lot tougher on Ben Wallace trying to grab the six zillion rebounds he got last night.

They are 32-23 because the East is horrible and they have one of the top five players in the league.

And, assuming Z would make a difference last night would be like assuming he was going to help in last years playoffs.

Gooden follows up a 4 point outburst against Toronto with a 13 minute performance...... Go ahead and assume he'll play well in the playoffs as well. Lead will pretty much expect him to do what he did last year, which was, well, I can't really remember him even playing.

Z and Sasha gave them pretty huge holes to fill. But as usual, when they lose a game like last night, it comes down to energy and execution. Not talent.
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Unread postby papacass » Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:52 pm

Lead Pipe:

No, actually, their record against the West is better than their record against the East. You can double-check that, but if it's not better, it's pretty close. As of the All-Star break, the Cavs had the best Eastern Conference record against West teams. Meanwhile, they've lost games to the Hawks, Kincks and Bobcats.

Can't chalk their record up to being in a horrible conference.

And isn't LeBron's regression one of the hot-button topics in the NBA? How many times in the past few months has he carried this team to a win? Against the Lakers right before the break, and ... ??

Can't chalk it up to LeBron.

No one is saying the players in the Cavs frontcourt in of themselves are world beaters, but as a unit, they've done a good job of picking up the slack for each other. That's what I mean. I'm not talking about each player individually. I'm talking about the sum of the parts.

This team would be totally lost without their offensive rebounding.

Like I said, they're nine games over .500 for a reason, and it's not their backcourt, and it's not their coaching. It sure as heck isn't their point guard play. LeBron isn't carrying the team on a nightly basis. It's not really the schedule. So what is left?

The frontcourt. Like it or not.
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Unread postby pup » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:24 pm

CLEVELAND: Z-infinity-minus
That's the lowest grade we can give a team, right? The Cavs haven't made a good move in two years and it's legitimately inconceivable that Danny Ferry watched the first 50 games of this Cavs season, then decided, "You know what? We're good." Part of me doesn't blame the Global Icon for putting a 39-cent stamp on the season.



That is Simmons grade of the Cavs deadline work.
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Unread postby Dozen » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:43 pm

That's about right. a lil blunt, but dead on. Another thing I noticed last night, not sure if it was seen on TV but at halftime, LeBron seemed to be going off to Mike Brown til Snow came out and got in between them. And LBJ,Hughes and Brown were at least 5 min behind everyone else coming out of halftime. Then LeBron just walked over to the scorers table and bit his nails instead of warming up with the rest of the team. I havnt been to enough games to know if this is typical or he was just pouting, or maybe just dont give a shit.
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