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Showcasing Sasha

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Showcasing Sasha

Unread postby swerb » Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:34 pm

Man, Sasha has looked unbelievable tonight. Just another reminder that this kid does have talent, and is still very young. 24 points, and he's done it in several different ways. From three, on passionate drives to the tin, a couple nice dunks, from the charity stripe ... he's had the game of his life.

Sasha is one of those players, when hes playing well offensively, he gives much better effort at the defensive end, where hes prone to mental lapses. If Sasha could ever get his head right at the defensive end, he could really thrive for one of the west coast teams that plays an up tempo style.

A team, say like ... the Golden State Warriors.

Alot of intriguing guys on Golden State. Love Matt Barnes game. Biedrins is an emerging star. Monta Ellis would be the perfect fit to fill the PG gap. Plus, they now have Jasikevicius (Z's best man in his wedding), who the Cavs had a serious hard on for before he spurned them to sign with the Pacers.
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Unread postby Dozen » Wed Jan 31, 2007 9:24 am

His recent performances have been very good. But the organization will deem him untradable and then Brown will award him with 10 DNPCD's in the 2nd half. I am totally convinced when LBJ is on the floor, that Brown has none clue about rotations. It seem as though when LBJ is out that Brown gets these guys to actually move without the ball. I just dont get it. The move last friday against Philly with 3 guards on the floor was stunning to me. He actually mades adjustments. Why can he not do this when LBJ is in?
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Unread postby leadpipe » Wed Jan 31, 2007 4:32 pm

"A professional player will move without the ball when he knows he is going to get it."
-Hubie Brown

This, in a nutshell, is why the Cavs don't move without the ball. Snow is nothing special passing the ball and as mentioned before he creates a 4 on 5 situation with a clogged lane (which means clogged passing lans as well). Gibson, while maybe not being the ideal true point opens up the floor, gives players room to move, and some hope they will get the ball in a good situation. There is a big differnce in your outlook when you get passes 24 feet from the hoop from Snow with 5 seconds left on the shot clock and nowhere do penetrate than when you get a ball moving toward the goal or at a preffered spot on the floor. Finally a good move by the Cavs, however, they still put the Cav touch on it by doing it at least a month later than they should have.
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Unread postby Dozen » Wed Jan 31, 2007 5:06 pm

This has been mentioned on both Scout.com and RealCavsfans.com as well. Apparently someone on Scout mentioned this and then his validity was seconded by another poster. Anyway here it is:

Cavs Trade
Gooden
Hughes
Gibson

Kings Trade
Bibby
Artest
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Unread postby consigliere » Wed Jan 31, 2007 5:33 pm

WTAM reported the rumor, but talked to a Cavs official who commented that the trade was "hysterical."

Would have been nice....
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Unread postby Dozen » Wed Jan 31, 2007 5:34 pm

I thought the WTAM rumor was for KG?
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Unread postby consigliere » Wed Jan 31, 2007 6:26 pm

Ah shit, my bad. I saw the reported trade and thought you were mentioning the KG rumor all over WTAM the last 2 hours. My bad. :mrgreen:

Now, as for Gooden, Hughes and Gibson for Artest and Bibby? I'd seriously consider that. Artest is an ass, but he brings a toughness this team lacks and his defense is a ton better than Hughes......hell, he is just a better player than Hughes and would fit into Brown's system much better. So, to me, Artest > Hughes. The only question mark is when his next meltdown would be.

To me, Gooden is replaceable (Varejao). Getting Bibby for Gooden and Gibson works for me. Bibby is a heck of a shooter, and is a top PG.

I think this deal would help the Cavaliers a lot......anyone see if there is any more validity to this?
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Unread postby Dozen » Wed Jan 31, 2007 6:37 pm

I know it was reported on wknr today but it is still a "rumor". Someone also reported on scout that NBA Sirus radio is reporting the KG deal by Friday (I hardly believe this)

On the other trade, I would do it in a minute. It would give us a true shut down defender and a true pg we both have been wanting.
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Unread postby consigliere » Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:11 pm

Yeah, the Sirius rumor is Z, Hughes, Snow and Newble for Garnett, Davis and Jaric.
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Unread postby Guest » Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:23 pm

Bibby is one of my all time favorite players and would love him in a Cavs uni
Artest's toughness would be a welcome addition
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Unread postby consigliere » Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:33 pm

FightDr wrote:Bibby is one of my all time favorite players and would love him in a Cavs uni
Artest's toughness would be a welcome addition


Back when he was at Arizona, I loathed Bibby and Simon. Couldn't stand those two. But, I've grown to appreciate Bibby. Guy can shoot, and is probably one of the top 5 PGs in the league if you ask me.

And even though you are taking a huge Gamble with bringing The Artest Show to the Q......I am all for it. Why the hell not. You bring him back into the Central Division, and he'll be up to dominate again. He may be a bit pyschotic, but he brings everything to this team we need (a take no shit not gonna back down and I'll beat your ass attitude).
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Unread postby British_Pharaoh » Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:38 pm

Bibby is one of my all time favorite players and would love him in a Cavs uni
Artest's toughness would be a welcome addition


Back when he was at Arizona, I loathed Bibby and Simon. Couldn't stand those two. But, I've grown to appreciate Bibby. Guy can shoot, and is probably one of the top 5 PGs in the league if you ask me.

And even though you are taking a huge Gamble with bringing The Artest Show to the Q......I am all for it. Why the hell not. You bring him back into the Central Division, and he'll be up to dominate again. He may be a bit pyschotic, but he brings everything to this team we need (a take no shit not gonna back down and I'll beat your ass attitude).


bottom line is both players would give us something we havent got
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Unread postby Guest » Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:59 pm

Both have gone deep into the playoffs and performed there also
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 01, 2007 9:02 am

This is the perfect trade for the Cavs, but from what Ive been reading this morning.............its not happening. :-( :sad: :(
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:11 am

This is the perfect trade for the Cavs, but from what Ive been reading this morning.............its not happening


Really? I thought either of these had to have at least a 2% chance of happening. Then I looked at a map this AM, and we are still in Cleveland Ohio, where trades like these do not happen.
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:13 am

Just saw from a respected poster on another board that Sac-town radio is reporting the Cavs are up to a potential big trade. Supposedly, the station that talked about it is the main sportstalk station in the area and that the guy mentioning it supposedly has an "in" with the Kings FO. The Sac-town radio report didn't say what teams or what players......

This doesn't substantiate this rumor at all yet, but things are starting to line up that a potential big trade may be looming.

Even if nothing happens, big trade rumors involving your team are always exciting to ponder about for a few days. :-) :smile: :)
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:16 am

Agree T, What is the other site? I really feel like not doing any work today and could use another site to read. :mrgreen:
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Unread postby pup » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:25 am

Don't waste your time Dozen....
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Unread postby Dozen » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:30 am

Its better than actually working 8) :cool: 8-) :lol:
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Unread postby consigliere » Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:37 am

The Cavaliers Scout.com site.
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Unread postby swerb » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:57 am

In two weeks, this kid has gone from someone I wanted showcased for a trade, to someone who looks irreplacable right now. Someone who has given this team the shot in the arm it desperately needed.

Classic quote from LBJ after the game last night ...

"I feel like a prophet. I've been harping on Sasha for three years now. People were looking at me like I was crazy and I've always said that if Sasha gets an opportunity that he's going to be very good. We go against each other every day in practice and I know what type of player he is, and he's showing it."

Sasha's game is kinda like an LBJ Lite. And he's playing DEFENSE. This as always been the rub with Sasha. He did a helluva job on Kobe in the 4th, checking him almost the entire quarter.
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Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Mon Feb 12, 2007 2:42 pm

I don't know how much we need to make a trade when I look at the roster and what I know each player is capable of. There's still some questions at PG with a rookie and Eric Snow there but Hughes has taken some of the weight off that position and Snow has not been bad on the short range jumpers.

With this team running more and FINALLY showcasing the offensive talent, I'm not sure I want to spend any of that talent to plug holes. Maybe in the offseason, though I'm loathe to trade Sasha right now.
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Unread postby consigliere » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:01 pm

Sasha (and Gibson) make Hughes irrelevant.

Right now, if I am Ferry, I am dealing Hughes in a deal to get a PG. I'd be completely happy with Hughes going and getting our starting PG, and then going with a Sasha/Gibson combo at the 2.
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Unread postby swerb » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:16 pm

It is at least worth pointing out that we've seen these flashes before from Sasha, only to see them go away.

Granted, it appears as if he is here to stay this time. But I don't know if I'm ready to deal Larry Hughes yet off of four good games from Sasha. Plus, his salary probably gives Larry less value in a deal than a Sasha, Gooden, maybe even Gibson.
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Unread postby Guest » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:28 pm

Can't deal Hughes until Sasha has proven this isn't a fluke.

If he does, then that's fantastic, because Hughes is a valuable commodity that would command a good return. Maybe he just needs to play on a team where he's not so overshadowed/irrelevant.
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Unread postby Dozen » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:34 pm

Can't deal Hughes until Sasha has proven this isn't a fluke.

If he does, then that's fantastic, because Hughes is a valuable commodity that would command a good return. Maybe he just needs to play on a team where he's not so overshadowed/irrelevant.


Only a week til the trade deadline so no time to see if Sasha is a fluke. And thats Mr. Browns fault.

Hughes has really no value with his contract/injury history/recent play.
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Unread postby Birdman » Mon Feb 12, 2007 4:05 pm

Hughes is horrible so the only teams that will take him are ones that are run by terrible GM's. Philly may be a possibility since they have a player we want (Miller) and King is ignorant.

Maybe they we can find someone who hasn't seen Larry play for the last year and a half and still thinks he can put up numbers like he did in his contract year for the Wizards.
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Unread postby furls » Mon Feb 12, 2007 4:18 pm

Hughes, much like Ilgauskas and Jones, is untradeable because of his contract. It is long and expensive and he is not worth it.
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Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Mon Feb 12, 2007 4:48 pm

Hughes, much like Ilgauskas and Jones, is untradeable because of his contract. It is long and expensive and he is not worth it.


Z and Jones are not untradeable. Jones especially has a contract that is actually attractive to a team that wants an outside threat.

Z's deal is actually below market for big men. There are several teams that want help in the post and Z would give it to them. Even Hughes is worth more than you think. He's not worth as much to us, but there are teams that need someone to play defense and drive the ball because they don't have it. Contracts in the NBA are really only untradable when they jump over $15M and Hughes' deal goes down in price over the next two years, making him more tradeable.
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Unread postby Birdman » Mon Feb 12, 2007 5:26 pm

but there are teams that need someone to play defense and drive the ball because they don't have it

Hughes does neither of these things. He shoots all jumpers and constantly gets beat off the dribble. He does get some steals but this is do to the fact that he takes risk and that put him out of position more often than not.
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Unread postby Dozen » Mon Feb 12, 2007 5:44 pm

Seriously, The amount his contract goes down is comparable to gas going from $2.11 to $2.05 for you and me.

Hughes' deal goes down in price over the next two years, making him more tradeable.



Z's deal is actually below market for big men


Really? For ones who play 15-17 min a game?

Jones especially has a contract that is actually attractive to a team that wants an outside threat.


This would be good news if he was one.
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Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Mon Feb 12, 2007 6:16 pm

Seriously, The amount his contract goes down is comparable to gas going from $2.11 to $2.05 for you and me.


Not quite. Hughes' contract has a 10% dip next year with about $1.4 million dropping off the cap number. That's closer to gas going from $2.11 to $1.90. That $0.21 will save you $2.10 on a 10 gallon fill up and it's still pennies compared to the savings when you're talking in the millions.

Hughes is worth something. He's not used in Cleveland much as someone to drive the hoop. I've gotten to talk with some personnel guys with the Magic who like him, think his contract is inflated but manageable in the modern NBA, and believe the Cavs aren't using him correctly. The decrease in cap hit coupled with a likely increase in the actual cap don't make his contract "attractive" per se, but he's not a complete albatross.




Really? For ones who play 15-17 min a game?


Funny that he's averaging 27.5 minutes per game. He's also not the only post guy.

Big men are worth more in the NBA and Z is still fairly highly regarded. Cavs fans don't regard him as highly as they should. That said, I have no interest in trading Z. He's a strong contributor and we don't have any heir apparent at center.


This would be good news if he was one.


39% from three point range is considered good in the NBA. That is what he's shooting this year. He's also shown some effort on the defensive end and shown the ability to drive. He's making under $4 million a year - less than the average player salary in the NBA.

You might not see it because you're a Cavs fan and hometown fans often see their own players differently than outsiders. All of the above guys are worth more than you think.
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Unread postby Dozen » Mon Feb 12, 2007 6:25 pm

Then I hope you are right. Z may be avg 27 min/game but not so much lately. Hughes has been a victim of having Snow beside him for most of his time here. You may be able to convince someone that it's "the system" which I truly dont honestly know anymore. I have hopes every game Hughes will bust out but then he goes out like yesterday and gives ya 3pts. He's still settling for horrific looks and has been more average on defense as well. Damon Jones isnt getting any minutes right now, and if you look at his career he has had maybe 3 solid seasons. Maybe he's tradable............... maybe not.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:48 pm

Teams in the league are done with Damon Jones and his schtik. The last sucker was, as usual, the Cavs. Just like they are the last sucker with most first round picks, coaches Lucas an Silas, as well as a host of other things. If Damon Jones has some value to teams as an outside shooter, why the hell wouldn't we keep him. We need someone to hit open shots, there are a ton of opportunities courtesy of LBJ drives and kicks. He just isn't a good player.

Z's contract is ridiculous, and the NBA will pay for GOOD big men. If they don't have one they can run the offense thru they go the route of Wallace, Howard etc. The Cavs front office has given Z a players option for over 11 million in 2010. How slow do you think he'll be then. He was a zero in the playoffs last year because it is very easy for teams to take him out of games. This year will be no different. Detroit and Chicago for example are two teams Z will not be a factor against because there lineups will take him right out of the game. That was a HORRIBLE signing that will cripple them for 4 more years. The Cavs.
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Unread postby furls » Mon Feb 12, 2007 9:00 pm

Damon Jones has value... that is laughable. The only minutes he should get are the last 30 seconds of every quarter, but only if we have the ball and are vying for the last shot. If he is supposed to play any defense at all then leave him out. Is it worth putting the leagues 29th best 3 point shooter on the floor with the defense he plays? And he only costs 4million a year? What a deal.

Zadrunas? Are you kidding me? The guy might be 7'3" but he is so weak on the inside that he may as well be 6'8". If he were a couple of inches shorter, say only 6'11 he would not even be remotely serviceable. Watching him lumber up and down the floor is horrific and his rebounding numbers are jaded by his own missed tip ins. I have been a Z hater since before it was cool, because as a guy that spent a lot of time playing underneath, I know what he is.

Larry Hughes may or may not be a good player, but he is clearly not a good player for the Cavs, for whatever reason. I like that he seems to hustle and play hard, but he just is not effective on this team. He may have some value in the market, but I am not sure that teams are willing to gamble on a long term 12mil/per year contract on a guy that might have value. The only guy that would do something like that, Isiah, has cap problems so he couldn't take hughes off our hands unless he was willing to part with one of his selfish, ballhogging 2's.
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Unread postby swerb » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:10 pm

Well, I think we'll get the answer to our debate on this one. At least on Damon Jones.

If Ferry can move him for anything, I think he will. He's clearly the odd man out in the wake of the emergence of Gibson and Sasha.

Given the facts that other shooters have emerged and Damon can't dribble penetrate or defend, I think the odds are pretty high that Damon gets moved to a playoff team desperate for outside shooting. A quick look at the NBA.com sortable stats shows that Utah and Denver are the two worst 3 point shooting teams in the NBA.

In addition, and despite his good behavior riding the pine in the playoffs last year, Damon is not likely to take well to the extended bench time he's likely to see if he does stay in CTown.
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Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:12 am

Well, I think we'll get the answer to our debate on this one. At least on Damon Jones.

If Ferry can move him for anything, I think he will. He's clearly the odd man out in the wake of the emergence of Gibson and Sasha.

Given the facts that other shooters have emerged and Damon can't dribble penetrate or defend, I think the odds are pretty high that Damon gets moved to a playoff team desperate for outside shooting. A quick look at the NBA.com sortable stats shows that Utah and Denver are the two worst 3 point shooting teams in the NBA.

In addition, and despite his good behavior riding the pine in the playoffs last year, Damon is not likely to take well to the extended bench time he's likely to see if he does stay in CTown.


Precisely Swerb. If someone is desperate for three point shooting they may take the contract.

Same goes for Z. The Bulls would like to have him right now regardless of the contract.
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Least Favorite Player: A.J. Pierzynski

Unread postby leadpipe » Tue Feb 13, 2007 3:56 pm

Mr. Mac. I find myself agreeing with much of what you say, but I'm lost here. Why would the Cavs not keep him. Aren't they desperate for outside shooting?
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