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D. Anderson don't get to excited.

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D. Anderson don't get to excited.

Unread postby ramllov » Mon May 28, 2007 7:46 pm

I remember reading all the write ups regarding the quarterback practices this week.

D. Anderson is nothing to get excited about. He had a better result than his competition. It means nothing.

He was the biggest and strongest QB. These are advantages to this type of competition, when the QB is standing still and not getting rushed.
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Unread postby mistero » Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:51 am

Ram, not to be arguementitive but DA did very well standing still and being rushed. He torched Pittsburgh against the blitz. He knows where to go with the ball and how to stay in the pocket and still execute the called play. If you are looking for a QB that will bail out and the smallest break down you're looking for number 9.
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Unread postby jfiling » Wed Jun 06, 2007 6:50 pm

I stand by what I said earlier: the O-Line should determine which QB starts the season. If the O-Line is improved, I think that DA is the better pocket passer and gives the Browns a better chance to win early. If the O-Line is as porous as previous years, Frye's scrambling works better, especially considering DA will just get injured around week 2 taking so many sacks.

If my analysis is correct, I'm hoping for DA, because that's the line we need to protect Quinn once he finally is NFL-ready.
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Unread postby barleydawg » Fri Jun 15, 2007 12:42 pm

I think that there are a couple of ways to look at this, but I'll note some thoughts:
- Quinn could not be named starter now even if he was ready (which he's not) because he isn't signed. No way would anyone be dumb enough to give Tom Condon that kind of negotiating leverage. But keeping an open competition does get him more reps now than if he was already listed as a back-up. I'll note that Chud has thrown the whole playbook in right away instead of gradually doing so. That will be a plus if Quinn holds out. At least he'll have the whole offense to chew on instead of some small percentage. And. of course, if he thinks he has a legitimate shot at being the starter this year he might be incented to get to camp on time - or close to on time.
- Frye would need to progress from where he was at the beginning of last year to take the starting job. Since he regressed last year he's got a lot of ground to make up to do that. That regression makes me think that the coaches would shy away from him as starter unless he really stepped up and took the job. I don't think it will happen, but he deserves his shot.
- Anderson would be my bet as starter on opening day. He isn't optimal, but I expect that he'll limit his mistakes more than Frye and that makes him our best bet to hold down the fort until Quinn is ready to go (mid-season perhaps?).

Ultimately I think the QB that the coaches can count on to make the least mistakes gets the job. Of course, how they do in that respect will play a big part in Quinn's getting his first start. As for the "open competition", that is just a good way to have Frye and Anderson compete and give Quinn reps. I'd be stunned if he (Quinn) was our opening day starter.
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No QB has looked good

Unread postby ramllov » Sat Jun 16, 2007 10:52 am

I read all the stuff. It is the same. Nobody looked any good. They are saying Anderson today and during the first week of training camp you will read Frye or Quinn. The next week it will be the other one.

Big guy with a big arm, no pass rush and no equipment. It is the same story prior to mini camp as after. There is no defensive test.

The offense looked terrible. New scheme. They ran laps they did so good the last day of camp.

If Charlie Frye had a leg up, it probably is gone. He is back with the other two. May the best man win.

If the guy is Anderson, that would be great.

Anderson was involved with starting three games. He lost 27-7. 12 yards rushing in 8 plays and four of them when Anderson ran the ball. Anderson and the Browns were no factor in this game. Nice passing statistics, but, he was not effective.

Baltimore 27-17, 68 yards rushing, 16 plays. The other team ran for 142 yards and 355 total yards. Were the Browns ever in this game? Doubtful.

Tampa Bay 22-7, four interceptions, 123 yards. The touchdown was not an offensive play if I remember correctly.

Based on these three games, I would not risk the 2007 season. It is nice that he passed for so many yards on Pittsburgh and Baltimore. I wonder if they were in a prevent defense. Pittsburgh controlled the ball for 38+ yards, they may as well put their second and third string defense on the field for all the damage Anderson did.

Again, Anderson has a chance, just like Frye and Quinn. He better show his stuff in July and early August. There was nothing impressive with the results of 2006, except when he camp off the bench. It was like a Holcomb siting.
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Unread postby jb » Sat Jun 16, 2007 11:35 am

Ram, I am being argumentative.

Dunno what yer aganda is against DA, but yer typin' boolshit. So I'm calling you on your pure boolshit. Cause its boolshit.

The press reports from mini camp say DA's playing the best in mini camp outta any QB we got - by far.

The NFL Network Mini Camp hour long program that aired last night says he's playing the best in mini camp outta any QB we got and raved about his skills.

He outplayed Frye last yaer when given an equal opprtunity.

Yet you show up here and diss the guy for no reason at all.

We don't have Dan Marino in his prime on the roster. That's for damn sure. But if DA is playing the best, he should play, and he's playing the best by any objective measure. It should be the same for QB's as it is for linebackers. Let's see what he's got before you decide for everyone with certainty that he's trash.

We all got eyes and brains.
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Unread postby leadpipe » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:13 pm

Exactly JB. Anyone with eyes could see Anderson played better than Frye. The TEAM played better. As far as comparing it to Couch and Holcomb, it's not that most people who wanted Holcomb over Couch thougth he was bound for Canton, it's they thought he gave the team a better chance. Even call it the lesser of two evils if you like. The same applies here.

By the way Holcomb isn't a really good player. But he was, is and always will be better than Tim Couch.
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Unread postby jb » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:18 pm

Lead Pipe wrote:Exactly JB. Anyone with eyes could see Anderson played better than Frye. The TEAM played better.



http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/sports/17373233.htm


While Charlie Frye seems to be trying too hard and Brady Quinn has struggled, Anderson has done what he does: Stand tall in the pocket and get rid of the ball. His 20-some-yard touchdown Wednesday was the best pass thrown in practices open to the media.



BTW - I don't do Couch / Holcomb anymore. I value my sanity. 8) :cool: 8-)

All I know for sure is Charlie ain't got it, Dorsey never had it, and Quinn doesn't yet get it. That leaves DA.
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Unread postby consigliere » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:23 pm

Please, please do not cut DA. That guy HAS to stick on our QB roster with Quinn.

If I had my druthers, I'd have DA as the #2 and Quinn the #3....and a vet #1.

I'm sorry, but I just don't like the prospects of a four-headed QB of Frye, DA, Dorsey, and Quinn, of which three make this team. Blah.

The QB is gonna hold this team back next year. If we had a vet signal caller, like say a Trent Green, I'd like our chances to be a surprise team this year and be competitive. I think having DA or Frye as the starter seriously hinders that competitiveness.

I'll go a step further in an almost JB-esque fashion....we have a solid vet QB and I believe this team could make some playoff noise the last few weeks of the season and possibly sneak in.

Just sayin.
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Unread postby furls » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:48 pm

The QB is gonna hold this team back next year.


Lots of things are going to hold the Browns back this year, QB is just one of them. Adding Trent Green, or someone of similar ilk, just adds a QB contraversy in one year and two wins right now. It also takes away the very real prospect that the Browns (if the offensive line is decent) would use Quinn toward the end of the season.

In terms of developing a competitive team for 2008, it would not be terribly beneficial. 2008 should be the real goal, this team still has too many holes for 2007.

Now, I do agree with the idea that the Browns need a veteran QB to come in and mentor, but they do not need a guy that has any long term career asperations, an adept career clipboard holder that comes in and knows his sole job is to mentor quinn (and hope for a follow on coaching position) would be optimal.
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Unread postby Seadawg » Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:33 pm

Wow...........A Browns board that posters are arguing over the QB , and training camp has not even began . The way the arguments have gone on this board is very similar to the others . Myself , I just plan on waiting until I am at camp and decide for myself when I can actually see them side by side . Of coarse I am not a professional judge of talent , but feel I can tell who is lost and who is not .

But for the sake of all this argument I do feel it should be Charlie's to lose . My problem with Charlie is that I don't think he has the mental attributes to absorb a new offense in a very short time . He has BQ and DA looking over his shoulder , and the pressure of a new system along with competition will be to much for him .

So I hope there are two or three miracles that happen and it goes this way . Quinn gets in camp on time , Thomas nails the LT job , and RAC gets over his anti rookie attitude , and Baxter pulls off the comback of cosmic proportions and they all become starters and stars .

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Unread postby jb » Sun Jun 17, 2007 10:16 am

Pluto:

http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/sports/columnists/terry_pluto/17381717.htm

ANDERSON ON TOP

Judging by drills, quarterback has legitimate chance to become starter

By Terry Pluto


If the Browns had to open the season today, the quarterback probably would be Derek Anderson. That's the word from some with the Browns, but it's written in pencil, and keep in mind that Anderson is being judged on drills where they wear shorts and helmets and the quarterback is not being sacked. He has the strongest arm of the three candidates, and it will look the best in this type of minicamp setting.

That said, the Browns also believe Anderson showed some promise in the four games he played last season. He completed 63 percent of his passes, five for touchdowns, with eight interceptions. His stats were skewed a bit because he was terrible in his final start, completing 10-of-27 with four interceptions and a QB rating of 12.1 against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. He also suffered a separated shoulder in that game.

New offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski has a new offense, and all three quarterbacks have been struggling to grasp the different motions and formations. This takes away some of the advantage that incumbent Charlie Frye would have. Brady Quinn is a rookie, so it's no surprise he has been overwhelmed. All three have been at some point.

Frye's best moments have been in the two-minute drills when he has been on the move around the pocket. His advantage is having played against the Cincinnati Bengals, Baltimore Ravens, Pittsburgh Steelers and Oakland Raiders, the first four opponents on this year's schedule. He knows their defenses, and with 18 pro starts, he has more experience than anyone else.

Listening to General Manager Phil Savage, it's obvious the quarterback spot is wide open, and Anderson definitely has a legitimate chance to become the starter. It's between Frye and Anderson, and it might not be decided until the middle of the exhibition season.

Fearing a holdout

As for Quinn, here's what the Browns aren't saying: They fear a holdout. The Notre Dame star was the 22nd pick. Savage and the Browns said several times that they ranked him among the top five players in the draft. No doubt, agent Tom Condon will mention that to the Browns in contract talks. The Browns will say, ``Look, we had him ranked high, but he was drafted 22. That's not our fault.''

In terms of wanting to get on the field this season, the last thing Quinn needs is a holdout. Adjusting to the pros is hard enough. Chudzinski's system is more complicated than some other pro sets. Not having been in the NFL has Quinn already behind Anderson and Frye, and missing practices certainly wouldn't help him close the gap.

Maybe there will be no holdout, but that will be only if the Browns decide to immediately pay Quinn far more than the projected pay for a 22nd pick. There is pressure on all NFL teams not to do that because it escalates rookie salaries for many other picks in the same area of the draft.

All this is why the NFL needs a rookie salary cap much like the one in the NBA, where players are slotted based on where they are picked. That leaves more money for veterans rather than kids who have never played a pro game. It also eliminates rookie holdouts.

Somehow, the Browns have to find someone who can put a motor on the offense. In the past four years, they've barely averaged 17 points per game. In 2005-06, it was fewer than 15 points.

TALKIN' MORE BROWNS ...

• The Browns were thrilled with the early look at Jamal Lewis, who has taken part in more drills than anticipated. He had surgery to remove bone spurs from an ankle, and he feels better than at any time last season, he has said.

• Lewis is only 27. He has a lot of miles on his legs and has been knocked around, but he rushed for 1,122 yards last season with that painful bone spur. He has lost about 10 pounds to 248, and might drop a few more before training camp to help his speed. As Savage said, ``I've got a very good feeling about Jamal. He is hungry and has something to prove. He wants people to see that he has a lot left, and he's very happy here.''

• Savage also is upbeat about Jerome Harrison, who had a good preseason in 2006 but played little once games began. He is slated to be a sometimes third-down back. Harrison is listed at 5-9, 199 pounds, but he's up to 210 -- and it's mostly muscle. He gained 1,900 yards at Washington State in 2005, so the Browns do think he's durable.

Rookie Eric Wright has drawn raves for his work at cornerback. He has been picking up the defense quickly, and he is a gifted athlete. The Browns don't want to say it so early, but he does have the inside track on starting. The key is keeping veteran Leigh Bodden healthy at the other cornerback spot. The Browns think that with Bodden and Wright at the corners, and with safeties Sean Jones and Brodney Pool, their defensive backfield should be solid. They also are pleased with backups Daven Holley and Ken Wright. Fifth-rounder Brandon McDonald from Memphis also has drawn some attention at cornerback.

• D'Qwell Jackson started last year as a rookie, and the linebacker has shown signs he might be even better this season in terms of understanding the defense. The Browns need Jackson and Andra Davis -- both inside linebackers -- to do a better job against the run.
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Unread postby swerb » Sun Jun 17, 2007 10:38 am

• Rookie Eric Wright has drawn raves for his work at cornerback. He has been picking up the defense quickly, and he is a gifted athlete. The Browns don't want to say it so early, but he does have the inside track on starting. The key is keeping veteran Leigh Bodden healthy at the other cornerback spot. The Browns think that with Bodden and Wright at the corners, and with safeties Sean Jones and Brodney Pool, their defensive backfield should be solid. They also are pleased with backups Daven Holley and Ken Wright. Fifth-rounder Brandon McDonald from Memphis also has drawn some attention at cornerback.

Great news on Eric Wright. I loved this pick, and think this kid and Bodden could bring back some memories of the days of Dixon and Minnifield. Thank you Pac Man Jones. Hes the reason this kid is still there at a spot we can trade back up to in the 2nd.

Holly, I liked him last year. I thought he played very well in spots and showed some promise. I see him filling the nickel role and Kenny Wright competing with McDonald, Minter, and whoever the 3rd safety is for the dime role.

McDonald is a kid I'll be keeping a close eye on. Remember, we could have had Trent Green with that 5th round pick we used to select him.
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Nice Discussion

Unread postby ramllov » Fri Jun 22, 2007 10:16 am

Lets see, hidden agenda, ---- NO.

What I know and what I believe. I will give you an opinion on what I think about Derek Anderson. He has not proven anything to me. I was not overly impressed on the work he did last season. He could become a very good quarterback and I hope he is. However he did not show me anything.

He had one great relief appearance. Holcomb had a few very good relief appearances. We saw what he could do when he was a starter and the opposing defense prepared for him. He went to a Buffalo and he did not do anything sensational. I believe he was part of a trade that put him in Philadephia. He probably will be traded or cut in the next two to three months. He is the fourth QB and unless someone get hurt, he is gone.

I went through the four games he played in last year. No one contradicted the results. After Kansas City he was not a factor in getting close to winning any of those games. He started three and that was good. He had some real live experience against some teams he will face this year if he starts. Pittsburgh and Baltimore. Tampa Bay knew what was coming and they prepared for him. Tampa Bay was a terrible team last year and they ate him up.

The Browns have better players this year and Derek Anderson will have more coaching and preparation, so he might be successful. However, we have seen nothing yet.

I have read all the favorable reports on Derek Anderson, but those were in comparison to what. They were not comparing them to any successful starting QB in the NFL. If he was compared to that, I might get excited.

He was compared to Charlie Frye, who is recognized as not a practice type player. Charlie Frye does better when the lights go on. However, considering last year, he did not look good either. There can be a number of excuses. A few sportswriters wrote about how Bernie Kosar explained the situation last year and how Charlie Frye did not do that bad, considering the circumstances.

I don't buy that.

I see an open situation for three QBs, which starts on July 27th. I hope Brady Quinn is signed and in camp. He needs all the time, practice and coaching he can get. He probably will be starting after the bye week. Unless, Derek Anderson or Charlie Frye play like Drew Brees did for San Diego, which kept their young QB, Rivers on the bench. I doubt that will happen, however, anything is possible. Since the luck has run bad for a number of years, who is to say that it can not change for the good.

When you read all the articles in the past 30 to 45 days saying how Derek Anderson is showing the best. Have they said he can read defenses? Have they said he was mobile and can avoid the pass rush? Have they said that he has a quick release and gets rid of the ball quick enough not to get sacked? Have they said he is accurate on his long throws?

I don't remember reading any positive answers to those questions. If there are, please link them on this thread, I missed them.

Now, I know he is a big guy, who has a big arm and they say he looks good in camp. They also said prior to any part of any 2007 camp, that Derek Anderson was a big guy and had a big arm and these conditions favored him to look best of all the quarterbacks when camp started. Well, they were right, so what does it mean for Derek Anderson's progressed. It was expected, because there was no pass rush, no pressure on the QB and little contact with the defensive backs on the receivers.

I don't remember reading any commentary where Derek Anderson consistently drove the field with the Browns offense and scored repeatedly against the Browns defense in practice.

So, what I am saying is don't get excited. He has done nothing that was not expected prior to camp. It is nice that he did what he did. Charlie Frye and Brady Quinn did what was expected of them. Charlie Frye is not a practice type QB. Brady Quinn is a rookie QB.

The true evaluation for these QBs will be in late July and early August. They probably will pick a starting QB after the second preseason game.

If it is Derek Anderson, I will be as happy as everyone else, because he will have won the competition and the coaching staff believes he has the highest chance of all three or four QBs to win against Pittsburgh on September 9th.

My agenda is, Cleveland Browns please pick the best QB candidate who will beat Pittsburgh on September 9th.
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Unread postby General » Fri Jun 22, 2007 10:32 am

I agree with many of the points brought up. CF and DA are not going to guide us to the Super Bowl. Will Brady Quinn? That remains to be seen. But I do strongly believe that the QB decision should also take into account the state of the new O-Line. The contribution of this factor is IMHMFO about 40% of the decision.
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Unread postby Mr. MacPhisto » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:39 pm

At this point I would have thought Anderson would be in the lead. I believe he can probably still read through the progressions faster than the other QBs on the roster. He probably still has a quicker release. His accuracy is an issue and always has been, but those problems can be minimized if it's taken into account when creating a game plan.

I'd like to see Quinn start if he can win the job, but if Anderson is the best guy then he needs to start.

Whoever plays QB should have an easier go of it. The OL look much improved. A healthy Jamal Lewis would provide us with a good running game, especially if the OL can block for him. That takes the pressure off the QB to do everything.

Since the Browns came back, everything has been on the shoulders of the QB on offense. The OL hasn't provided much help. The receivers have dropped passes they should have caught. The RBs have stunk outside of Droughns' solid year - a year that would have been better with a good OL.

The good OL and good running game will also make the defense better, giving them more rest. That'll also play in the favor of the QB, whoever he is.

It's amazing how much easier the job is for the QB when he's surrounded by competent teammates and a good GM. If Chud can find a way to get this offense going then we suddenly have a competent coach as well.

I don't think DA will be a failure. I think he can be a long term great backup QB and a decent starter until Quinn is groomed. I think Frye is done and part of me would rather have the cerebral Dorsey as the third stringer. His brain helps out on the bench.
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