Weeden, Every Throw

[mistero]

Color coded, green for "good" play. Red for "bad " play. I'm more optomistic. I see more of a mixed bag. Pretty much what you'd expect from a rookie in his first start with a rookie supporting cast. I just don't get the angst by media and message boards.

4 good plays and one bad play. Not bad for the first quarter.


1st QT:
10:39 To Mo Mass 24 yards,perfect slant. Hit in stride.
9:25 Mo Mass deep,Had defender by 2 steps, badly overthrown
9:19 Slant to Benjamin ,defender on his back, no call, incomplete
3:53 Play action left, Alex Smith with one defender on backside,Good throw,defender makes open field tackle, lots of open realestate, -1 yards
3:12 Fumble,arm coming forward. Joe Thomas burned on the edge
2:56 Drag route to Watson in front of first down marker,can't break the tackle. 3 yard gain on 3rd and 4.-------------------------------------------------- -----

[mistero]

9 good plays and 5 bad plays. Still 13 good to 6 bad plays in the first half. Not the disaster you fellas want to make it.


2nd QT
14:22 Threads the needle on slant to Benjamin 12 yards,hit in stride
12:25 Screen to T Rich ,dropped
12:20 Bullet to Little, well placed, dropped/deflected. Defender did not contact Little until after deflection.INT
11:00 Screen -T Rich can't get out of scrum to recieve the pass, ball thrown into ground
7:22 Very Overthrown pass to Little, Marecic wide open on backside.Weeden never looks to his left.
6:35 Poorly placed deep ball to Benjamin,thrown on inside shoulder. Intercepted
4:47 Mo Mass crossing route, 4 yards, can't make defender miss
3:34 Short pass to Jackson, 6 yards for 1st down
3:04 Pocket breaks down,thrown away on purpose,good decision, not panic
2:55 Slant to Gordon. defender makes contact,no call, Gordon drops,ball well placed
2:52 Mo Mass wide open 20 yards down field.Weeden pressured and ball way over thrown
1:00 Drop by Marecic on arrow route, would of been first down
:14 Deep ball to Bejamin,other thrown. Benjamin sitting in void of the zone,3 defenders near, would of been tough fit.
:09 Easy pass to Gordon against prevent, 20 yards
:01 Brain dead scramble on last play of half instead of hail mary

[mistero]

5 good to 4 bad plays. Starting to let the pressure effect his play.


3rd QT:
14:16 Nice slant to Gordon,hit in stride ,12 yards
13:42 Strip sack,ball coming forward,should be incomplete like the first questionable fumble
12:16 Dangerous pass to Mo Mass,behind and late in traffic,nearly picked
10:52 Weird play, suspect Little blew his route again. Little and Benjamin both running go routes on right sideline.Underthrown and on wrong shoulder again, INT
6:40 Slant to Mo Mass, hit in stride. 13 yards
6:07 sacked, Schwartz smoked
5:48 Stares down Gordon badly on slant,bad throw, Incomplete
5:05 Cross Route to Mo Mass , dropped, defender had mo mass jersey in his hand,still should of caught,well placed
3:20 Under duress,poor throw,high of Little,short of Smith, crowded route, not sure who target was.
3:15 Pressure- nearly sacked,throw away, Schwartz beat
1:53 Screen to T Rich, 5 yards, OK throw, not much blocking , 5 yards
:21 Overthrown to Alex Smith in endzone,defender holding as Smith makes his break, Makes Weeden's throw seem worse than it was. Penality called

[mistero]

4 bad to 2 good plays. Can't finish the deal, but not so unusual for a rookie. I just don't see the melt down.


15:00 pass bobbled by Watson,caught ,well covered ,6 yards
14:22 Ball forced to well covered Cameron, Contact made by defender,uncalled.Little in the picture seems like unsure of his route again,Incomplete
7:49 Swing pass to Jackson,14 yards ,good touch
6:41 Stares down Little,Overthrown, well covered,never looked at another WR
6:37 Short pass to Jackson ,hit and ball was dropped.Check down with out any real pressure,didn't look down field
1:12 NO pressure until late, stares down Mo Mass, over throws crossing route, INT, WR open on left sideline,never looked that way

[Govbarney]

Did you get this from the broadcast feed, or did you get the coaches tape from NFL.com?

[mistero]

Yeah, I got the NFL.com replay package. I watched the opener 4 times now. Thinking about charting Richardson's carries too. His game was way worse than Weeden's. Then again the holes were just not very big. Run blocking was absysmal. Richardson was so tentative, whcih is the flip side of being patient. He was waiting and waiting for a hole to develop. Lack of preeason, I guess. He's not going to get Alambama holes in the NFL.

[Govbarney]

Yeah, I got the NFL.com replay package. I watched the opener 4 times now. Thinking about charting Richardson's carries too. His game was way worse than Weeden's. Then again the holes were just not very big. Run blocking was absysmal. Richardson was so tentative, whcih is the flip side of being patient. He was waiting and waiting for a hole to develop. Lack of preeason, I guess. He's not going to get Alambama holes in the NFL.

Richardson needs time to learn the speed of the game. That's one thing he missed by being out pre-season. That being said the play calling was pretty unimaginative. I would be interested in the number of draws, and counters called. I only watched the game once , but I only remember the one draw play in which Richardson had his most successful run of the game and decapitated Colman, after that I do not recall another Draw.

[pod2dawg]

And was a screen pass ever called/attempted?

Alot of red ink there late Misty, but it is what it is ..another perfect storm scenario in Cleveland. Poor preparation, non-mobile rookie QB in new system used to shotgun, rook RB coming off surgery, no guards, rook RT, highly suspect receiving corps, poor play calling.....
Eagles best pass rush in league , 9 deep on DL, as talented a roster as there is in NFL.



Eagles -9. The world had the Eagles. Vegas had the Browns. That's why those casinos are so nice and shiny.

The "O" was horrific from Pat - Chilly-execution-Weeds.

The reffs & the D get some kind of medal for keeping us in that game.

The Bengals will be a much better gauge.

Who is playing corner this week ? ...........ouch!

[peeker643]

Should be a green line for the security personnel who threw Weeden the rope and the life preserver that led him out from under the stars and stripes.

THAT was a clutch throw under pressure.

[mattvan1]

I really appreciate the effort. Thanks.

[FUDU]

I really appreciate the effort. Thanks.

You talking to peeker or mistero?

[LarsHancock]

14 bad plays against 20 good plays is by no means even close to acceptable, especially considering how bad the bads were. This isn't baseball where hitting .400 is exceptional - a QB will need to produce 90% good plays to move an offense consistently.

And the bads... they were so bad. Throwing to the wrong shoulder is bad in the NFL. Bausermaning the ball into the stands on wide open receivers is.... ugh. If 14 were wrong shoulder/bad read, yeah, but that's not what they were. It's like saying your girlfriend had 14 diseases last year - okay if they were all variants of the flu and common cold, but Weeden had herpes, cancer, syphilis, AIDS, mad cow disease, and swine flu on his chart.

Not blaming Weeden as much as Shurmur - he wasn't prepared, and that's on the coaching. No way the kid is that bad. But he essentially hasn't played a football game for 9 months and is expected to win an NFL game. Giving Shurmur a QB to develop is like giving a monkey a hammer to make an atomic bomb. And I say that with full mystified knowledge that Bradford played well under the guy as a rookie.

It needs to get much much better.

[pup]

Just not sure if you can evaluate with "good play/bad play".

The "good plays" from above are really elementary NFL throws.
The "bad plays" are mostly egregious. Some were down right atrocious throws. You call the two deep balls to Benjamin slight underthrows to the wrong shoulder. In fact, they were bad balls following horrible decisions.

Good plays:
Slant to Mo Mass
Slant to Benjamin
-1 yard pass to a TE
Checking down with no pressure to a TE for 3 yards on 3rd and 4 (i know, Watson can break a tackle, but he had time to let him clear the area a bit and let Watson get more separation or another yard down before the throw)
Slant to Benjamin
Screen to T-Rich, dropped. (Little DA juice on that throw)
Bullet to Little (slant) dropped
Crossing route!
Dump off to Jackson on 1st down with little pressure, but got 6 yards. Good play, agreed.
Throw away and good decision. Agreed
Slant to Gordon
Arrow to Owen the stiff
Slant to Gordon
Slant to Mass
Cross to Mass
Screen
Overthrow, but the penalty makes it good? not so sure about that.
6 yard completion to TE
Nice swing pass to Jackson

So I see a lot of things in the middle of the field and a couple of dump offs. I would hope a guy with that arm can throw the slant in his sleep. But that cannot be the only thing. Anything to the sidelines or deep down the field was, um, Coltish.

[General]

No disrespect intended but this thread strikes me as bit insane.

[Govbarney]

This is troubling to say the least:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/ ... erformance

Its an Insiders article that compares QBRs of other QBs in there debut with Weeds.
It gives examples of QBs all over the NFL.

Here is a snippet:

"....On the other hand, just 18 percent of quarterbacks who came within two points of Tannehill's QBR on Sunday went on to produce a season QBR above 50. Yes, some QBs have generated occasional single-digit QBRs on the way to fine careers, including Matt Schaub and Matthew Stafford. But these are depths usually plumbed by journeymen, injury replacements and, most alarming for Miami, guys who teams wanted to bank on but who turned out to be disasters, like Jimmy Clausen and JaMarcus Russell.

And at the bottom of the charts, the news is even worse. Weeden had a QBR of just 1.2, and among the 25 QBs who have ever had a QBR lower than 2 in single games since 2008, just one (Jake Delhomme in 2008) ended the season with a QBR above 50. Many of the others are guys you might not even recall starting an NFL game, like Ken Dorsey and Josh Johnson, or probably remember for the wrong reasons, like Luke McCown and Curtis Painter....."

[leadpipe]

Well, you could study this list, and as Pup has pointed out, understand that the "good" plays any professional QB ought to make - minus the 6 zillion bad ones.

But I maintain a better way to analyze what an abomination of that position Sunday was, was to simply prop your eyes halfway open.

[municipalmutt]

This is a lot like studying an autopsy from a victim that was stabbed 53 times. You can't point to one wound that killed the guy, but he's damn sure dead.

[mistero]

The dagger that killed him was the drop and
Int by Little but go ahead and keep nailing the
Rookie QB to the cross.

[leadpipe]

The dagger that killed him was the drop and
Int by Little but go ahead and keep nailing the
Rookie QB to the cross.

No no no......

Don't treat everyone as if they are irrational idiots passing judgement on one game.

Anyone with a clue understands it takes time for a rookie at that position, furthermore, as I've mentioned before, this is especially the case for anyone coming out of a conference that has ONE pass defense in the top 60 NCAA teams.

This is all quite different than looking at one game and making an anaysis. In a vaccuum, that quarterback play was downright awful.

And the list above doesn't do anything to dispell that analysis.

My God Man, the reason there are numerous articles from national media members claiming the performance to be a joke, is well, cause that performance was a joke.

If you saw some "potential" in that performance, good for you. I didn't - doesn't mean I don't know how the game works.

[municipalmutt]

Nailing him to the cross? He played shitty in his debut. Real shitty. No cherry picking stats is going to change that. He deserves criticism. Let's see what he does next week. I don't want him to fail and I don't know where you are getting this from.

[mistero]

Do you think Couch makes any of those slants?

Do you think Quinn makes any of those big time pro passer throws?

How was Weeden any worse than their debuts?

Listen I wanted RG3. Wanted to trade every pick from 2012 and 13. Whatever it took.

Next , I wanted Tannehill becuase I loved his expereince in the WCO and upside.

I never wanted Weedeen but he has won me over so far with his training camp. pre-season, and some...some of the throws he made in week one that show he belongs in the big leagues.

Seriously?? Does Quinn complete a single pass in that game?

[peeker643]

I blame Hiko for this.

He wanted Weeden to have the same asinine aplogists as Colt had.

Now we have one.

Not only are we now celebrating a marginally better QB than Cuddles but we're having to try and justify the guy being better than two other shitbirds.

And btw, Couch was a better player.

Carry on.

[Orenthal]

It just doesn't matter one game in...

[peeker643]

It just doesn't matter one game in...

Nope. Unfortunately that's correct. We'll have a season to watch it play out and be just as true then as it was in April.

God, I hope he does have a couple big games. Get the "Andy Marte Homered!!" and "LaPorta Hit Something Hard Opposite Field!!!" crowd something to get excited about.

This must happen. When he does he play a really shitty defense without the pre-game pageantry including a ginormous flag?

[Orenthal]

I like seeing the plays charted out as much as the next guy... But really, it was pretty easy to tell Weeden had no clue and Richardson did zip. The Eagles are supposed to have a good defense so feh. IMO, those guys MAY still have potential, sample size and all, but FOR THE LOVE OF GOD WHY DO THE BROWNS PUT PEOPLE IN POSITION TO FAIL.

I am so fucking sick of "systems" and the "process" that has no flexibility to adapt to individual or group strengths. I swear to God every run looked outta a bunch formation and our Shotgun QB always under center. Eh, end rant. Last week was more of the usual tripe, and almost every ounce of homerism is gone. Fuck'em.

[mistero]

Yeah ....because Richardson played so well. And the Joe Thomas and his mates played so well. The whole offense is guilty but pile on a rookie QB. Weeden was not the main problem. Your expectations of his play is whacked....carry on with your circle jerk lynch mob.

[Orenthal]

Um, ya, good luck with the fan victim complex. Guy blew last week end of story. No more qualifiers.

[mattvan1]

Yeah ....because Richardson played so well. And the Joe Thomas and his mates played so well. The whole offense is guilty but pile on a rookie QB. Weeden was not the main problem. Your expectations of his play is whacked....carry on with your circle jerk lynch mob.

Actually, the correct term, as coined by a prominent poster and site contributor, is "circle jerk of despair" which is not to be confused with "black hole of suck"

But circle jerk lynch mob is pretty tits as well

[municipalmutt]

Yeah ....because Richardson played so well. And the Joe Thomas and his mates played so well. The whole offense is guilty but pile on a rookie QB. Weeden was not the main problem. Your expectations of his play is whacked....carry on with your circle jerk lynch mob.

The o-line, WRs, and RB have been improved astronomically from last year yet none of these areas were valid excuses for McCoy sucking last year. Why are they valid this year?

Bottom line is that with under two minutes left and only needing a field goal to win, Ginger Leaf threw the game away.

[mattvan1]

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/09/grading_brandon_weeden_breakin.html

•The Browns and Weeden ended up trying to dink and dunk the Eagles into submission. And they took it to an extreme.
Stat: Weeden's 12 completions resulted from balls thrown a combined 30 yards from line of scrimmage.

•As an extension of previous point, Weeden's big arm was a non-factor. Whether by design or necessity, he did not power the ball downfield. When he did, he and his team regretted it.
Stat: He went 0-of-8 with three picks on throws that were in the air 10+ yards from line of scrimmage.

[pup]

Yeah ....because Richardson played so well. And the Joe Thomas and his mates played so well. The whole offense is guilty but pile on a rookie QB. Weeden was not the main problem. Your expectations of his play is whacked....carry on with your circle jerk lynch mob.

Is someone going to start a Richardson, Every Run thread? Because we can probably kill that one too.

Nobody (well, maybe Peeker) is cutting Weeden today.

But fer fricks sake...that was about as poorly as you can play that position at this level and live to tell about it.

So Weeden can do some things that an entire lineage of shitty Browns QB's could not. Great, let me know when there are signs he can do some things the winning QB's in this league can do. Then get Prosecutor to extrapolate those 4 throws into an entire career of throws and we can move forward with the greatest single signal caller in the history of the civilized United States of America!

I knew I should have gone to bed without checking out this forum.

[peeker643]

Tremendous.

Because we had a guy here for a year and a half that couldn't throw a simple slant like every capable QB in the world can, we celebrate a guy who has an arm and can throw a basic slant like 90% of the QBs in the history of the game have.

And of those 90% who could actually throw the basic slant about 10% of those guys were actually decent.

10% of those 10% were elite, if that.

BUT CELEBRATE THE SLANT!!!!!!

Let's just delight in the fact that there's at least no way in holy hell the guy can be worse than he was Sunday.

Which I'm sure will be celebrated Monday if he hits double digits in QBR and throws fewer than 4 INTs. Progress!!!! He wasn't historically bad, just shitty. But not nearly as shitty as Spergeon Wynn!!!!

[pup]

I am concerned. For some reason it sticks out in my head that the Bengals have a propensity for achieving the rare 5 INT game. Has anyone ever thrown 9 in 2 games?

[peeker643]

I am concerned. For some reason it sticks out in my head that the Bengals have a propensity for achieving the rare 5 INT game. Has anyone ever thrown 9 in 2 games?

Saw it happen at Upson Elementary School in Fall of 1984. 5 on Saturday and then 5 again the very next day!!

The line didn't block much though plus the defense was cheating on the pace of the 1-Mississippi, 2-Mississippi's. And the backs were useless. Receivers were 'meh'.

Really wasn't my fault. And I was forced to throw on 4th down because there was no punting. Defense knew what was coming.

[Bigfist]

I am concerned. For some reason it sticks out in my head that the Bengals have a propensity for achieving the rare 5 INT game. Has anyone ever thrown 9 in 2 games?

Seems to me that was the average for Mike Phipps.

[rbm0183]

It sure would be nice if Weeds could go out there on Sunday and just play well, so that depressingly desperate fans don't have to sink to the point of analyzing every throw from another uniquely hideous performance just to try and dig up something to prop him up. Why does he have to wear DA's number? It just makes it that much more painful to watch someone throw the ball at top velocity to receivers in the flat, throw mindless picks, and overthrow open receivers when they bring back the memories of the last #3 - who made a career out of doing all of those things.

And Trent needs to step up too. I made a vow to myself not to draft any freaking Browns in my fantasy league but then broke it when Trent fell to the 4th round. I regretted it immediately, and last week sure didn't help. Can we just have something to feel positive about?! Please?!

[municipalmutt]

Somebody know Mistero? Need to check up on him. If he was beaming over that shitfest last week by the rook qb, he had to have had an aneurism over this week's performance. Kid looked like an NFL QB today.

[leadpipe]

Somebody know Mistero? Need to check up on him. If he was beaming over that shitfest last week by the rook qb, he had to have had an aneurism over this week's performance. Kid looked like an NFL QB today.

He's on the line with Canton trying to get the five year wait waived.

[mistero]

Anybody seen the lynch mob? I thought they went this way???

[Orenthal]

Good to see everyone here justified who said he had a stank shit game LAST week.

[Brandon Weeden]

Well I'll be dipped in shit and rolled in bread crumbs.

Yeee-aahh!!! Told ya' you boys were nuttier than a port-o-potty at a peanut festival. 'Specially that pup fella. Boys about as sharp as a cue ball.

I was hotter than a freshly f#cked fox in a forest fire today baby! OKC style!

Time to go celebrate this one with a couple PBR tall boys fellas!

[TouchEmAllTime]

Well I'll be dipped in shit and rolled in bread crumbs.

Yeee-aahh!!! Told ya' you boys were nuttier than a port-o-potty at a peanut festival. 'Specially that pup fella. Boys about as sharp as a cue ball.

I was hotter than a freshly f#cked fox in a forest fire today baby! OKC style!

Time to go celebrate this one with a couple PBR tall boys fellas!

Watch Lizard Lick Towing much?

[peeker643]

He wasn't horrible. I think this will be the platform today.

That two yard throw to Richardson that went for 30 was outstanding. I also liked the Colt-like 4 yard throw on 3rd and 9 and the moron that called and executed the under-a-minute 4 yard slant to the Bengals 7 yard line w/no timeouts and the clock ticking.

The throw to Little for the TD was beautiful, he did more right than wrong and he wasn't trapped under a ceremonial parachutist before the game.

[Rat_Tail]

Weeden is top 10 in passing yards. That's something right?

[Hikohadon]

Get the INT's down and maybe there's something there.

[peeker643]

Still near the very bottom in YPA (yards per attempt). Clearly not the sole proprietor of the dink and dunk philosophy which seems more every day like a staple of the coaching staff and not any given QB.

[mattvan1]

Still near the very bottom in YPA (yards per attempt). Clearly not the sole proprietor of the dink and dunk philosophy which seems more every day like a staple of the coaching staff and not any given QB.

It's like when we were kids playing sandlot football. Run the 5 yard out long enough until the magical "out and up" is a reality.

I figure by December or so most of the CBs in the league will be jumping the 5 yard out, (if they aren't already) so in fact Shur is simply setting up his secret weapon play for late in the year when he really needs it.

[OldDawg]

Weeden is top 10 in passing yards. That's something right?

And the bottom 5 in completion percentage and bottom 2 for QB rating (for QBs with more than 2 games).
I am cautiously optimistic about him, though. He's got a bit of a cannon for an arm... can throw the long ball moreso than anyone we've had in some time. And I think he's got some toughness... I never felt McCoy had any toughness.

[pod2dawg]

Still near the very bottom in YPA (yards per attempt). Clearly not the sole proprietor of the dink and dunk philosophy which seems more every day like a staple of the coaching staff and not any given QB.

It's like when we were kids playing sandlot football. Run the 5 yard out long enough until the magical "out and up" is a reality.

I figure by December or so most of the CBs in the league will be jumping the 5 yard out, (if they aren't already) so in fact Shur is simply setting up his secret weapon play for late in the year when he really needs it.

Would it not shock us, and the other teams in the league if perhaps we "cleared out" with those slants and sent Ogbann or Richardson on a "wheel-route" to that side ( isolated on LB) instead of the perpetual 6 yard arrow?.............

[motherscratcher]

Still near the very bottom in YPA (yards per attempt). Clearly not the sole proprietor of the dink and dunk philosophy which seems more every day like a staple of the coaching staff and not any given QB.

See, I don't think they are dunking and dunking. I think Weeden is playing the "you go long" game with Greg Little. I'll bet e laughs his ass of in that huddle.