Thank Christ thats over.

[bookelly]

After literally spending 9 damn months obsessing over the draft we can all take a breath and realize this team still sucks. It's better...but we're still looking straight into the eye of 4-6 wins next year. Why?

-Shurmer can't coach.

-Rookie QB

-Questions on the O-line, Receiving corps, secondary depth and run D.


So let me be the first to ask; who do we take with the 3rd pick in the 2013 Draft?


/

[Triple-S]

-Questions on the O-line

meh.

we got better there.

finally got that needed right tackle, and we drafted two guys who can hopefully add to the depth of this team, and hopefully push luvao and pinkston for playing time.

The o-line maybe young, but at least we're not talking about 1999 level of ineptitude.

I think things will get better. We won't win a lot of games, but I think it's just because they're still not there YET. 2013 though? if all goes according to plan, could be where we finally make an impact.

[Hikohadon]

OL should be fine.

Rookie QB should be better than Colt ever was or ever will be.

Enormous lift at RB.

Nice depth at DT.

Still weak at LB and WR.

Not worth it to me to predict wins or losses. Somewhere between 4 and 7 is most probable, but that could go up or down by 2 wins/losses if fate gets involved.

There's no reason to believe that they're any worse than last year's Bengals (except at WR). If they're able to pick up an elite WR in next year's draft, they might be scary. But, yeah, they're probably still one draft away.

[jb]

This is the best draft since Phipps netted us Clay and we used out own on Ozzie.

Desperate crying needs were addressed by the best prospects resources could allow AND for those of you sleeping Heckert OBVIOUSLY has prototypes and is filling an organizational plan. Sure, you hear the myopic bitching and wailing about alleged value by the McDooshes and helmet heads of the world. pay no mind. The Browns are doing what th Browns want to do.

We netted in one draft, prospects (they all won't hit; duh so STFU ) who have potential to:

provide an identity to a moribund franchise on an all pro level on the weakest side of the ball

a QB prospect in the physical ability mold of a John Flacco with a hellistrong arm with touch an maturity

A ORT with decade long quality starting potential at a good level

A deep threat prospect faster than 95% of DB's on the slowest team in the NFL

A rotational run stuffer whose coach gushed about his character and commitment and production on the radio; forget the negative hatchet job report on line

A thumper prospect at Mike who should help shitty ST's immediately

A guard prospect to push the kids there who are inconsistent

Another WCO FB who can push a struggling Marecic

Seriosuly; they used every pick to the max for their needs and their systems. Sign a GD UFA next sea on or two and do this often enough and things WILL turn.

I can't wait to see Weedon, TR and the Schwartz play. Can Not wait!

[jb]

After literally spending 9 damn months obsessing over the draft we can all take a breath and realize this team still sucks. It's better...but we're still looking straight into the eye of 4-6 wins next year. Why?

-Shurmer can't coach.

-Rookie QB

-Questions on the O-line, Receiving corps, secondary depth and run D.


So let me be the first to ask; who do we take with the 3rd pick in the 2013 Draft?


/

Boo, your take is checkers, not chess.

The beauty of the top 5 slotting next season gets you the elite pass rusher or WR, and rounds out the d backfield.

In 2013 we start to party for 5 - 8 years.

[pup]

I gotta say.

I don't remember the feel of a Browns draft getting better the later it went.

Heckert earned some stripes. Just looking at where some of these guys were ranked coming in compared to the place they got them is a nice bit of work.

I guess Mike checked out to hang with Weeden and left the man to do his job.

[jb]

I gotta say.

I don't remember the feel of a Browns draft getting better the later it went.

Heckert earned some stripes. Just looking at where some of these guys were ranked coming in compared to the place they got them is a nice bit of work.

I guess Mike checked out to hang with Weeden and left the man to do his job.

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

[Cerebral_DownTime]

What kind of party?

[jb]

What kind of party?

[Cerebral_DownTime]

F-U-C-K.

[bookelly]

After literally spending 9 damn months obsessing over the draft we can all take a breath and realize this team still sucks. It's better...but we're still looking straight into the eye of 4-6 wins next year. Why?

-Shurmer can't coach.

-Rookie QB

-Questions on the O-line, Receiving corps, secondary depth and run D.


So let me be the first to ask; who do we take with the 3rd pick in the 2013 Draft?


/

Boo, your take is checkers, not chess.

The beauty of the top 5 slotting next season gets you the elite pass rusher or WR, and rounds out the d backfield.

In 2013 we start to party for 5 - 8 years.

Oh mine is the Chess one. And I like this draft too, and your comments (+1), but everyone is ignoring the 800 Lb. Gorilla in the room. Shurmer. What we saw last year was way more 'master of panic' than 'master of chess.'

[OldDawg]

I gotta say.

I don't remember the feel of a Browns draft getting better the later it went.

Heckert earned some stripes. Just looking at where some of these guys were ranked coming in compared to the place they got them is a nice bit of work.

I guess Mike checked out to hang with Weeden and left the man to do his job.

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

Trade down / Hughes combo instead of WR. That was inexcusably poor.

[Hikohadon]

I gotta say.

I don't remember the feel of a Browns draft getting better the later it went.

Heckert earned some stripes. Just looking at where some of these guys were ranked coming in compared to the place they got them is a nice bit of work.

I guess Mike checked out to hang with Weeden and left the man to do his job.

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

Trade down / Hughes combo instead of WR. That was inexcusably poor.

Was there some awesome WR prospect - better than the guy we got in the 4th - there for us in the 3rd round that I didn't know about?

You might say Reuben Randle, but that is a 4.55 forty guy that never interested me in any of the LSU games I watched and fell to the end of the 3rd for the same reason Colt did.

I wish they got a great WR too. But there were only a few sure-fire guys at that position in the draft. You don't draft a mediocre WR in the 3rd just b/c you need a WR.

[Hikohadon]

After literally spending 9 damn months obsessing over the draft we can all take a breath and realize this team still sucks. It's better...but we're still looking straight into the eye of 4-6 wins next year. Why?

-Shurmer can't coach.

-Rookie QB

-Questions on the O-line, Receiving corps, secondary depth and run D.


So let me be the first to ask; who do we take with the 3rd pick in the 2013 Draft?


/

Boo, your take is checkers, not chess.

The beauty of the top 5 slotting next season gets you the elite pass rusher or WR, and rounds out the d backfield.

In 2013 we start to party for 5 - 8 years.

Oh mine is the Chess one. And I like this draft too, and your comments (+1), but everyone is ignoring the 800 Lb. Gorilla in the room. Shurmer. What we saw last year was way more 'master of panic' than 'master of chess.'

This may very well be true. But teams don't draft coaches, and we knew all along we're stuck with this guy for another year.

At the absolute minimum, you've drafted some players that the next coach can make use of.

[Cerebral_DownTime]

Oh awesome! The next coach! Go Browns!

[Hikohadon]

Does Ron Swanson know you have his gun?

[Cerebral_DownTime]

No. I took this gun from Swan Ronson.

[Cerebral_DownTime]

So who is going to be the next coach?

Will Holmgren hire him?

Do you think Weeden will be able to change systems?

What will our record be when new coach comes in?

How long will that coach last?

[Hikohadon]

So who is going to be the next coach?

Will Holmgren hire him?

Do you think Weeden will be able to change systems?

What will our record be when new coach comes in?

How long will that coach last?

How the fuck should anyone know?

Hope not. I think Holmgren was honest that Shurmur was the last coach he hires. Next one gets hired by Heckert (assuming he's still around).

Weeden has all the physical skills to play in any system. Whether he has the mental goods to play in any system is TBD.

Bad.

How the fuck should anyone know?

[Cerebral_DownTime]

Absolutely fascinating.

[bookelly]

Absolutely fascinating.

We're gonna need more bullets.

[Triple-S]

I don't really see what Shurmer's vision for this team is.

Granted..I could be wrong, but he really does seem clueless out there.

have their been teams before that have stumbled into the playoffs with a coach that had no business coaching a team before, and was just going solely on talent?

The Jim Caldwell Colts, Norv Turner Chargers, Wade Phillips Cowboys..are the ones that keep coming to mind. But I don't think they were near Shurmer's level of cluelessness. And even then..they had HOF caliber Head Coaches kind of lay the ground work so they can take over the reigns for those gigs.

[motherscratcher]

1994 Browns

[bookelly]

1994 Browns

well played.

/

[OldDawg]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/Czar ... eam-042812

DIVISION DRAFT GRADES

Cleveland Browns
No one knows where quarterback Colt McCoy stands with management, but the offense definitely will be better with Alabama running back Trent Richardson. Jim Brown may not be a huge Richardson fan, but the guy did average 5.8 yards a carry and can be an effective receiver. The shocker was Oklahoma State quarterback Brandon Weeden, who will turn 29 in October. Yes, Weeden is mature, but can you really sit such an old player behind McCoy? Obviously, the Browns are embarking on a quarterback competition or have definitely decided that McCoy is not the guy. It wasn't that long ago the Browns used the 22nd overall pick in the first round on a quarterback. Remember Brady Quinn? ... They did help the defense with a couple of late-round picks in Nevada linebacker James-Michael Johnson and Boise State defensive linemen Billy Winn. Both of these players can make the roster. ... The Browns could have used another playmaker, but did land a quality offensive tackle in Cal's Mitchell Schwartz. ... They reached in the fourth round on Cincinnati defensive tackle John Hughes. Grade: C

Baltimore Ravens
There is no doubt Baltimore general manager Ozzie Newsome and his PR-conscious sidekick Eric DeCosta know how to draft. Their first three selections, none in the first round, reflected quality. Alabama linebacker Courtney Upshaw had tremendous value, but he's not a replacement for Ray Lewis. Upshaw, who is excited about joining this defense, will be given a chance to replace Jarret Johnson, who jumped to the Chargers. ... Iowa State guard Kelechi Osemele and Delaware guard Gino Gradkowski prove that Newsome wants to fix his offensive line. ... Temple running back Bernard Pierce has the slashing style of Ray Rice, but he needs to work on his receiving skills. Grade: B

Cincinnati Bengals
Based on mock drafts, their first three picks were projected in the first round, including Devon Still, Penn State's gap-quick defensive tackle who was the Big Ten's Defensive Player of the Year in 2011. They also took the two players they designated two weeks ago: Cornerback Dre Kirkpatrick and rugged guard Kevin Zeitler from Wisconsin. Kirkpatrick was rated third at his position and Zeitler should start immediately. ... Then the Bengals satisfied Rutgers receiver Mohamed Sanu, who was crank-called on Thursday by a fan who said the Bengals had drafted him in the first round. Instead, Sanu went 83rd overall. He was a three-year starter and figures to be a slot receiver. ... Clemson defensive tackle Brandon Thompson had second-round talent and was taken 93rd overall. ... Later, they took two solid players in Cal receiver Marvin Jones and 6-foot-4, 225-pound free safety George Iloka, a favorite of Deion Sanders. Iloka has the quickness to be put in man coverage. Grade: A

Pittsburgh Steelers
They got two first-round talents in Stanford's David DeCastro, simply the best guard in the draft, and Ohio State offensive tackle Mike Adams, who was considered the second-riskiest player behind Janoris Jenkins. Adams tested positive for marijuana at the Scouting Combine, then lied to the Steelers about it. But to his credit, Adams sought out the Steelers and apologized and got back in their good graces. He may even defer his signing bonus. If he stays clean, though, the Steelers have rebuilt their porous offensive line, which got Ben Roethlisberger sacked 40 times last season and also ruined his ankle. DeCastro could end up being better than Alan Faneca. ... With 35-year-old Casey Hampton, Washington nose tackle Alameda Ta'amu, all 350 pounds of him, made perfect sense in the fourth round. Ta'amu had an awesome Senior Bowl. ... Florida running back Chris Rainey has awesome speed and reminds new offensive coordinator Todd Haley of Dexter McCluster, his former all-purpose running back in Kansas City. Grade: A+

[OldDawg]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-o ... mart-draft
Winners and losers:

Winners
Cincinnati Bengals -- Cincy's run of success is, frankly, shocking. They killed the 2011 draft with A.J. Green and Andy Dalton, then they turned Carson Palmer into a second first-round pick this year. Their first six picks in this draft -- Dre Kirkpatrick, Kevin Zeitler, Devon Still, Mohamed Sanu, Brandon Thompson and Orson Charles -- are all arguably first- or second-round value guys. Mike Brown's en fuego and it's no longer looking like anything resembling a fluke, which means the Bengals will challenge in the AFC North again next year.

Pittsburgh Steelers -- Kevin Colbert's crew had one of the most impressive first few rounds of anyone, picking up David DeCastro and Mike Adams in the first two rounds, which could go a long way towards revamping the Steelers offensive line. (If it was even vamped in the first place.) Then they beefed up their defensive depth by grabbing Sean Spence (though he's surprisingly undersized given the Steelers history) and Alameda Ta'amu. I'll just assume that seventh-round wideout Toney Clemons will eventually become a star like the rest of the late-drafted Steelers wideouts.

Losers
Cleveland Browns -- Not a fan of the Brandon Weeden pick in the first round, especially when the wide receiver class was so deep in this draft. That pick was what Cleveland got in exchange for wideout Julio Jones when they swapped with Atlanta in the 2011 NFL Draft. Would you rather have the trio of Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson and Julio Jones or the combo of Weeden, Richardson and Greg Little? I can't find any reasonable explanation for why you would choose the second group. (Although I'm sure Browns fans will figure out a way to justify it in the comments.) The move to protect themselves from having Richardson yanked away was good I think, but they also could have called the Vikings bluff and taken Justin Blackmon if someone else tried to hop them, and gotten some bodies later in the draft. He's a great pick but the rest of their draft is best summed up by the last name of their final pick.

[noles1]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/18881992/2012-nfl-draft-winners-and-losers-colts-stay-on-offensive-with-smart-draft
Winners and losers:

Winners
Cincinnati Bengals -- Cincy's run of success is, frankly, shocking. They killed the 2011 draft with A.J. Green and Andy Dalton, then they turned Carson Palmer into a second first-round pick this year. Their first six picks in this draft -- Dre Kirkpatrick, Kevin Zeitler, Devon Still, Mohamed Sanu, Brandon Thompson and Orson Charles -- are all arguably first- or second-round value guys. Mike Brown's en fuego and it's no longer looking like anything resembling a fluke, which means the Bengals will challenge in the AFC North again next year.

Pittsburgh Steelers -- Kevin Colbert's crew had one of the most impressive first few rounds of anyone, picking up David DeCastro and Mike Adams in the first two rounds, which could go a long way towards revamping the Steelers offensive line. (If it was even vamped in the first place.) Then they beefed up their defensive depth by grabbing Sean Spence (though he's surprisingly undersized given the Steelers history) and Alameda Ta'amu. I'll just assume that seventh-round wideout Toney Clemons will eventually become a star like the rest of the late-drafted Steelers wideouts.

Losers
Cleveland Browns -- Not a fan of the Brandon Weeden pick in the first round, especially when the wide receiver class was so deep in this draft. That pick was what Cleveland got in exchange for wideout Julio Jones when they swapped with Atlanta in the 2011 NFL Draft. Would you rather have the trio of Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson and Julio Jones or the combo of Weeden, Richardson and Greg Little? I can't find any reasonable explanation for why you would choose the second group. (Although I'm sure Browns fans will figure out a way to justify it in the comments.) The move to protect themselves from having Richardson yanked away was good I think, but they also could have called the Vikings bluff and taken Justin Blackmon if someone else tried to hop them, and gotten some bodies later in the draft. He's a great pick but the rest of their draft is best summed up by the last name of their final pick.

Except we would have had to give up our 4th to get Richardson, instead of Atlanta's. Throw in that it completely discounts Phil Taylor in the comparison. Pretty lazy take by the writer.

[Hikohadon]

Would you rather have the trio of Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson and Julio Jones or the combo of Weeden, Richardson and Greg Little?

Weeden, Richardson, and Little. Oh, I'm sorry, let's make that Weeden, Richardson, Little, Taylor, and Marecic.

I swear these national guys don't watch any Browns games.

[bac5665]

Would you rather have the trio of Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson and Julio Jones or the combo of Weeden, Richardson and Greg Little?

Weeden, Richardson, and Little. Oh, I'm sorry, let's make that Weeden, Richardson, Little, Taylor, and Marecic.

I swear these national guys don't watch any Browns games.

Is there any one who takes McCoy Richardson and Jones over Weeden Richardson and Little?

Because damn, I can't imagine such a person.

[motherscratcher]

Would you rather have the trio of Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson and Julio Jones or the combo of Weeden, Richardson and Greg Little?

Weeden, Richardson, and Little. Oh, I'm sorry, let's make that Weeden, Richardson, Little, Taylor, and Marecic.

I swear these national guys don't watch any Browns games.

Is there any one who takes McCoy Richardson and Jones over Weeden Richardson and Little?

Because damn, I can't imagine such a person.

This, even without adding Phil Taylor into the discussion.

Yet, that author acted like it was an obvious conclusion that the Jones combo is better. Strange. Does he really think that Jones is so far better than Little that you can justify Colt McCoy as the QB going forward?

Just a bad conclusion to reach IMO.

[Fire Marshall Bill]

I bash the WR's as much as anyone but, I like Little in spite of his drops and I really really do want to see him hurt somebody wearing Piss&Yellow

The thing is, if he catches half of those he challenges Green and Jones for best WR of the class

He had at least 3-4 he could have taken the distance and added 200 yds to his total

Hopefully Benji means the end of enduring Slow Mass

I like the Weeden pick...without a doubt he brings some maturity to the locker room and in that regard I see him becoming a leader in short time

Same with T-Rex... I like he has a couple kids and won't be hanging out at the scipt clubs till 4 am

I'm OK with The Schwartz, too.....its the Hughes pick that has me

...but maybe this frees up TJ to hammer peeps, which would be a good thing

[Hikohadon]

I think it was Prisco that had the review, and from some of the other stuff he wrote, I don't think he watches Browns games at all. A lot of the national guys don't find them worth their time, so they assume things based on pedigree.

I remember on one of the shows the day before the draft someone referring to Colt as a "young, up-and-coming QB" and thinking "you didn't watched one down of Browns football in 2011".

Hard to blame 'em, I guess. Doubt I'd be watching much Browns football if I wasn't a fan.

[CAVSTRIBEBROWNSin07!]

Prisco is on my short list of worst sports writers. Has been for years.

[motherscratcher]

I think it was Prisco that had the review, and from some of the other stuff he wrote, I don't think he watches Browns games at all. A lot of the national guys don't find them worth their time, so they assume things based on pedigree.

I remember on one of the shows the day before the draft someone referring to Colt as a "young, up-and-coming QB" and thinking "you didn't watched one down of Browns football in 2011".

Hard to blame 'em, I guess. Doubt I'd be watching much Browns football if I wasn't a fan.

I guarantee you'd be watching them if covering the NFL was your fucking job.

[pup]

I gotta say.

I don't remember the feel of a Browns draft getting better the later it went.

Heckert earned some stripes. Just looking at where some of these guys were ranked coming in compared to the place they got them is a nice bit of work.

I guess Mike checked out to hang with Weeden and left the man to do his job.

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

The time they took a player at 4 they have no plans/ability to use to his fullest and followed it up by passing on the chance to build the part of the team that would allow you to use his abilities to his fullest. All while paying a price to get that player at #3 instead of #4 that should have shown he would be available at #4.

[OldDawg]

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

The time they took a player at 4 they have no plans/ability to use to his fullest and followed it up by passing on the chance to build the part of the team that would allow you to use his abilities to his fullest. All while paying a price to get that player at #3 instead of #4 that should have shown he would be available at #4.

I had to read that a couple times to figure it out... but I think I got it.

[rk]

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

It sucked all the way through the third round, IMHO. That's not to say that the end result wasn't good, they made serious efforts at filling three of the four biggest needs on offense, and I'm happy they did. But the way they went about it still makes me feel like they were a little bit desperate. More with the Weeden pick than the Richardson pick (people who don't believe the Bucs were trying to trade up are on crack and picks over 100 have little real value). So I think that even though this draft may have helped redefine the Browns in a great way - it could have been even better.

But they sat back and picked great after than. Felt they really crushed 3rd day. Got role players that should make big impact.

Love all the kudos that the Steelers are getting for drafting an OG who dropped and a OT who smoked up before the combine but promises he'll never do it again and still underperformed during college. Sure. Great pick. :lol

Also the love for the Bengals. It's like no one remembers that every year they get great draft grades because Mike doesn't spend money on scouts and just buys Ourlads and ESPN Insider™. So he gets guys draftniks like but who never pan out. No way Dre' makes it to 2013 w/o an arrest.

[peeker643]

This is the best draft since Phipps netted us Clay and we used out own on Ozzie.

Library.

[peeker643]

Yo Pup, "got better" ?

Let me know when it sucked, eh?

It sucked all the way through the third round, IMHO. That's not to say that the end result wasn't good, they made serious efforts at filling three of the four biggest needs on offense, and I'm happy they did. But the way they went about it still makes me feel like they were a little bit desperate. More with the Weeden pick than the Richardson pick (people who don't believe the Bucs were trying to trade up are on crack and picks over 100 have little real value). So I think that even though this draft may have helped redefine the Browns in a great way - it could have been even better.

But they sat back and picked great after than. Felt they really crushed 3rd day. Got role players that should make big impact.

Love all the kudos that the Steelers are getting for drafting an OG who dropped and a OT who smoked up before the combine but promises he'll never do it again and still underperformed during college. Sure. Great pick. :lol

Also the love for the Bengals. It's like no one remembers that every year they get great draft grades because Mike doesn't spend money on scouts and just buys Ourlads and ESPN Insider™. So he gets guys draftniks like but who never pan out. No way Dre' makes it to 2013 w/o an arrest.

Just so I understand this: picks over #100 have 'little real value' but the Browns really 'crushed' day 3? They got role players that should make a big impact with the picks that have little real value?

Just asking. Because if they crushed it and picked up a lot of impact guys there then giving away 4,5 and 7 to move up a spot when they didn't have to is even dumber than it was when they did it OR it'll be excellent to have a couple special team and backup linebackers 4 years from now when Weeden is eating the early bird special at La Boca Vista and Richardson is on the down side of his career.

[rk]

Just so I understand this: picks over #100 have 'little real value' but the Browns really 'crushed' day 3? They got role players that should make a big impact with the picks that have little real value?

Yes. I see the winks so I assume you're just being cute but there is limited gain from picks over 100. I did not mean impact players - I meant as a whole it will impact the team. The guys they did pick look to be solid role players from big schools with solid resumes. Not a lot of unknowns. The only guy who I don't feel can contribute is the h-back. But that's because I don't feel like anyone who doesn't have a sure position at the start of the draft is a good pick. I'm looking at you, Owen Marecic.

From an overall draft standpoint making the most you can with picks over 100 has very little impact on your team compared to the guys you pick the first two days. Maybe one or two are still with the team in 3 years. If you strike gold one of the 5 guys will start in the next three years.

It kills me when draftnicks, including the Maynock/Kipers of the world, pencil in guys in the third round as sure-fire replacements for teams that lost starters this offseason. Yet alone 4th-7th picks. Most of those guys are only marginally better than UDFAs and draft boards of the NFL teams diverge enough after 100th pick that there is very little risk of a team targeting the same player as your team by then. At any point in the last 3 rounds.