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Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

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Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:45 pm

Some clips from Heckerts presser

"“It’s probably unlikely, but we have talked to teams about moving up.”

What about trading down.

”I think it’s more of a risk vs. reward for what we can get for that pick,” he said. “It depends on what you’re getting back. If you get three players, it might be worth doing.”

And is Heckert concerned that a team will take someone they really want ahead of them.

“No, if we end up staying where we are at we’re going to get a good football player,” he said. “We have six guys we’d be happy with if we stay there.”

The general consensus is the Browns need to take a wide receiver or a defensive lineman in the first round.

Heckert defended his receivers.

“Internally, we feel better about some positions than the fans or media might, but we’re not looking at it as we have to get a certain position,” he said. “We like those guys. Robo (Brian Robiskie) and Mohamed (Massaquoi) are good players.

“Last year, they didn’t get a ton of opportunities, but I think the West Coast offense will get them a better opportunity. They’re both big and catch the football. Everybody wants the top players and we heard it every day in Philadelphia that our receivers weren’t good enough and we went to five NFC Championships. We do like our receivers.”

The Browns have been linked to A.J. Green or Julio Jones as their choice at six by many draft experts. Heckert, obviously, wouldn’t say who the Browns had ranked higher.

“It’s up to each individual club,” he said. “They are both good receivers. Some teams might like some things better than the other guy. At that position, it’s kind of hard. But they are very similar players. Either one is fine.”

The Browns are very thin on the defensive line and many experts feel they desperately need a pass rusher.

“I don’t know if it’s a sore spot, but we know we have to get to the quarterback,” Heckert said. “We knew last year we needed to get pass rushers.”

Concerning the defensive line, Heckert was asked about most of the candidates that are considered to be available to the Browns, other than Marcel Dareus, who is expected to be taken with the second pick.

On Robert Quinn, he said his missing last season doesn’t cause the Browns to shy away from him.

“I don’t think it’s a risk, but you would’ve like to see him play last year,” Heckert said. “We look at two years of tape anyway.”

Heckert said the Browns have checked out Da’Quan Bowers’ knee and the doctors have signed off on him.

“Our doctors have looked at him 100 times and are satisfied that he is healthy.”

Nick Fairley was listed early as the top defensive lineman, but might be available to the Browns.

“He’s a one year wonder from a sacks standpoint, but not as a defensive lineman,” Heckert said.

Why does it seem that everyone is ranking Quinn higher than Fairley.

“I wouldn’t say everyone’s perception is (Quinn)over (Fairley),” he said. “There are a zillion things. You watch the tape and make your decision.”

And then there’s cornerback Patrick Peterson, who many think is the best player in the draft. Would the Browns consider taking another cornerback with their first pick.

“He’s a very rare football player,” Heckert said. “He has the size and speed. Patrick is a very good football player.”

Heckert said you can never have enough cornerbacks.

“If you don’t have three (corners), they’ll find you,” he said. “The more cover guys you have the better you are. You can’t have enough of them, just like pass rushers or offensive lineman.”

And then there’s always the quarterback issue.

Heckert didn’t rule out taking a quarterback in the first round.

“I wouldn’t assume that,” he said. “I wouldn’t say there is no chance. But we like Colt McCoy. In Philadelphia, we had Donavan McNabb and don’t know what the perception was but thought Kevin Kolb was a very good football player when we drafted him.

“If we thought there was a legitimate Hall of Fame quarterback, we’d consider it.”

Heckert was asked if either Cam Newton or Blaine Gabbert were available at the Browns six, if it would help the Browns cause in terms of trade possibilities.

“We don’t really do mock drafts, but I have no idea.”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Right , I'm sure you don't Tom :)

SoulDawg


"""
Last edited by SoulDawg74 on Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby motherscratcher » Fri Apr 22, 2011 2:54 pm

So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.

Like he said, there is going to be a good player at #6 no matter what happens so I don't see how I could possibly come away unsatisfied. I guess I'd like a WR less than Peterson, DL, or Cam...but I doubt I'd get melty because Green and Jones both look like great players.

I think my only chance to melt would be with a trade if I though they gave up too much to move up, or didn't get enough to move down.

The only player I could see them moving up for is Cam.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:02 pm

motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.

Like he said, there is going to be a good player at #6 no matter what happens so I don't see how I could possibly come away unsatisfied. I guess I'd like a WR less than Peterson, DL, or Cam...but I doubt I'd get melty because Green and Jones both look like great players.

I think my only chance to melt would be with a trade if I though they gave up too much to move up, or didn't get enough to move down.

The only player I could see them moving up for is Cam.


SD:

What if Homie pulled a Butchum and chose Locker.

Myself , I'd move down to the ten spot in a minute if Washington wanted the six and were willing to give up both their
#2's to get Gabbert.

I could see Shanny going nuts and picking Locker Mallet or even Kap such is the need to get a QB since he devalued McNabb, a QB buys him time for a team who needs everything.


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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby motherscratcher » Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:26 pm

If he picked Locker I'd put my likelihood of complete melt at around 96.37%, and the likelihood of self inflicted head trauma at an even 100%.

I Think if Washington wants to give up 2 second rounders to move up, I'd have to take that. I guess we go with Jones there, assuming he's available.

Then in the 2nd we are looking at something like DL, DL, RT. I could definitely live with that.

Edit: Maybe even looking at Prince at #10.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:39 pm

motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.


He certainly does a week before the draft.

The most important thing Heckert has said this week is the answer to this one question:

Q - What is the top weight at defensive ends you project in the 4 - 3?

A - 250 pounds top at end.

http://cle.scout.com/2/1066282.html

This tells me we will NOT be looking at a Dick Jaraun vanilla defense but a much more aggressive 4 man line with small ends, maybe even Tampa 2 style. That means we'll need lots. And we'll need quality.


http://walterfootball.com/draft2011DE.php
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:40 pm

SoulDawg74 wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.

Like he said, there is going to be a good player at #6 no matter what happens so I don't see how I could possibly come away unsatisfied. I guess I'd like a WR less than Peterson, DL, or Cam...but I doubt I'd get melty because Green and Jones both look like great players.

I think my only chance to melt would be with a trade if I though they gave up too much to move up, or didn't get enough to move down.

The only player I could see them moving up for is Cam.


SD:

What if Homie pulled a Butchum and chose Locker.




What if you stopped smokin on Good Friday?
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:09 pm

jb wrote:
SoulDawg74 wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.

Like he said, there is going to be a good player at #6 no matter what happens so I don't see how I could possibly come away unsatisfied. I guess I'd like a WR less than Peterson, DL, or Cam...but I doubt I'd get melty because Green and Jones both look like great players.

I think my only chance to melt would be with a trade if I though they gave up too much to move up, or didn't get enough to move down.

The only player I could see them moving up for is Cam.


SD:

What if Homie pulled a Butchum and chose Locker.




What if you stopped smokin on Good Friday?


SD:

I could but it wouldn't make the question any less valid .

Locker played at Washington where Homie was stationed before becoming Don Corleone..

If the dummy had come out in 2010 instead of returning and getting nit picked to death , he would have been the second QB off the board and in all probability a Cleveland Brown.

Holmgren was on staff when Walsh reclaimed a project beaten and battered in the NFL, playing for poor teams , who had fallen into bad habits and poor decision making .

No less than steve Young whose talent set mimics Locker to a tee save the right hand left hand difference.

Of course if your so limited in your maginot thinking , you can't even explore all possibilities , even the simplest of plausible occurrences might stump you like Euclidean Geometry .

So just put your head down on the desk and let the adults talk if it becomes too much for ya .

o k

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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby hiko » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:26 pm

I would be well on my way from a solid to a liquid if they took Gabbert.

Taking Locker/Mallett would require a complete reboot of my brain. Probably a new mother board too.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:33 pm

Of course if your so limited in your maginot thinking


Fuckin A come up with a new metaphor already. Same ole same ole since 1999. And had they built that shit to the north sea it'd a been a real bitty.

Looking for a unicorn cage at the zoo ain't thinkin' outside the box. It's fuuckin' dumb.

The Browns ain't takin' a QB, but have another hit. If they do, no reason to go melty. If that's what they want, that's what they want. You seem to have this strange attitude that identifying reality equals some love of Colt. I don't fuckin' care about Colt. New boss, old boss, whatever these guys think and want.

BTW - Jimi was from Seattle. Ergo, Mike may trade the first draft pick for the royalty rights to "Hey Joe", too. Or a tiest with Courtney Love. But that'd be overpaying.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby hiko » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:58 pm

jb wrote:
Of course if your so limited in your maginot thinking


Fuckin A come up with a new metaphor already. Same ole same ole since 1999. And had they built that shit to the north sea it'd a been a real bitty.

Looking for a unicorn cage at the zoo ain't thinkin' outside the box. It's fuuckin' dumb.

The Browns ain't takin' a QB, but have another hit. If they do, no reason to go melty. If that's what they want, that's what they want. You seem to have this strange attitude that identifying reality equals some love of Colt. I don't fuckin' care about Colt. New boss, old boss, whatever these guys think and want.

BTW - Jimi was from Seattle. Ergo, Mike may trade the first draft pick for the royalty rights to "Hey Joe", too. Or a tiest with Courtney Love. But that'd be overpaying.


$1.98 would be overpaying, especially with the resultant Clap.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby Cerebral_DownTime » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:40 pm

I would laugh my ass off if they draft Locker.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:42 pm

jb wrote:
Of course if your so limited in your maginot thinking


Fuckin A come up with a new metaphor already. Same ole same ole since 1999. And had they built that shit to the north sea it'd a been a real bitty.

Looking for a unicorn cage at the zoo ain't thinkin' outside the box. It's fuuckin' dumb.

The Browns ain't takin' a QB, but have another hit. If they do, no reason to go melty. If that's what they want, that's what they want. You seem to have this strange attitude that identifying reality equals some love of Colt. I don't fuckin' care about Colt. New boss, old boss, whatever these guys think and want.

BTW - Jimi was from Seattle. Ergo, Mike may trade the first draft pick for the royalty rights to "Hey Joe", too. Or a tiest with Courtney Love. But that'd be overpaying.


SD:

Jeeze but do you have a bad case of hero worship .

Its the only reason why your having such a hard time going into pre -melt over something that hasn't even happened

"Yet ",

I confess that the pain it seems to be causing you is giving me a great perverse pleasure in your discomfort .

my bad .

I'll try not to enjoy myself so much {snicker }


:lmfao: :lmfao:



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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:44 pm

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I would laugh my ass off if they draft Locker.


SD:

Would that be to hide the tears , or the pain or both .


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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:17 pm

hiko wrote:I would be well on my way from a solid to a liquid if they took Gabbert.

Taking Locker/Mallett would require a complete reboot of my brain. Probably a new mother board too.


SD:

I would hope like hell they deal Gabbert preferably to Minny or Washington where we would still be in the fat part of the draft with a high second minimum if not more.

Un fortunately none of these guys is creating that trade buzz which includes Newton.

Hmmmm............................


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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:37 pm

motherscratcher wrote:If he picked Locker I'd put my likelihood of complete melt at around 96.37%, and the likelihood of self inflicted head trauma at an even 100%.

I Think if Washington wants to give up 2 second rounders to move up, I'd have to take that. I guess we go with Jones there, assuming he's available.

Then in the 2nd we are looking at something like DL, DL, RT. I could definitely live with that.

Edit: Maybe even looking at Prince at #10.



SD:

This mock draft the fresh prince doesn't make the top 10 , but we do have the chance to deal Gabbert before we select , so I'm not buying Shanny passing.

Note how locker is not that far away from our pick at 6 .

http://www.profootballweekly.c...1-mock-draft-60 <---- Full first round, at link...

1. Carolina Panthers Darin Gantt, Rock Hill (S.C.) Herald
Cam Newton | QB | Auburn [Jr.]
Panthers GM Marty Hurney has had a change of heart in recent years, and the former patron of Jake Delhomme knows that if he wants a long-term answer at quarterback, he might have to bite the bullet. Newton's far from a sure thing, but with a new staff, a great running game and a very good offensive line in front of him, there's actually some insulation for a player with potentially dynamic skills.
2. Denver Broncos Lee Rasizer, Broncos RapidReports
Marcell Dareus | DT | Alabama [Jr.]
The Broncos have huge defensive needs and get their pick of the lot after Carolina's selection of a QB. Dareus fills the biggest hole, which is in the middle of Denver's front four. The Broncos released two defensive tackles, and two more are free agents. Dareus would be the team's first defensive tackle selected in the first round since Trevor Pryce in 1997.
3. Buffalo Bills Chuck Pollock, Olean (NY) Times Herald
Von Miller | OLB | Texas A&M
The Bills still have a desperate need for a pass rusher. Miller can play either an OLB or DE spot and some think he's the best player in the draft.
4. Cincinnati Bengals Joe Reedy, Cincinnati Enquirer
A.J. Green | WR | Georgia [Jr.]
Chad Ochocinco, Jerome Simpson and Andre Caldwell are entering the final year of their contracts and Ochocinco's chances of being back this year are pretty slim. The Bengals have thrown away money the past couple seasons trying to find a No. 2 receiver but they need to start addressing their long-term No. 1.
5. Arizona Cardinals Kent Somers, Arizona Republic
Patrick Peterson | CB | LSU [Jr.]
The Cardinals need someone to contribute immediately and aren't sold on Missouri QB Blaine Gabbert.
6. Cleveland Browns Tony Grossi, Cleveland Plain-Dealer
Julio Jones | WR | Alabama [Jr.]
Jones would help give Colt McCoy a No. 1 receiver/TD-maker and help in the young QB's development. Plus, he carries less risk than the others available.
7. San Francisco 49ers Kevin Lynch, San Francisco Chronicle
Blaine Gabbert | QB | Missouri [Jr.]
The Niners are really looking for a quarterback, which is their No. 1 need, and Gabbert might be the most accurate QB in the draft.
8. Tennessee Titans Jim Wyatt, The Tennessean
Jake Locker | QB | Washington
The Titans can't afford to wait on their next franchise quarterback. So they grab Locker before someone else beats them to the punch.
9. Dallas Cowboys Mickey Spagnola, DallasCowboys.com
Nick Fairley | DL | Auburn [Jr.]
Not sure the Cowboys would expect Fairley to be available at this pick, but would welcome the potential defensive end in their 3-4 alignment falling into their laps, especially since without the availability of veteran free agency before the draft that certainly is one of their need positions, with three of their top four defensive ends scheduled to be unrestricted free agents.
10. Washington Redskins John Keim, Washington Examiner
Robert Quinn | DE | North Carolina [Jr.]
The Redskins wanted a pass rusher opposite Brian Orakpo; they found one in the raw but very athletic Quinn.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby Fire Marshall Bill » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:40 am

There is a calmness that accompanies not giving a rats ass
Hope is a moment now long past
The Shadow of Death is the one I cast
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby mattvan1 » Sat Apr 23, 2011 9:54 am

jb wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.


He certainly does a week before the draft.

The most important thing Heckert has said this week is the answer to this one question:

Q - What is the top weight at defensive ends you project in the 4 - 3?

A - 250 pounds top at end.

http://cle.scout.com/2/1066282.html

This tells me we will NOT be looking at a Dick Jaraun vanilla defense but a much more aggressive 4 man line with small ends, maybe even Tampa 2 style. That means we'll need lots. And we'll need quality.


http://walterfootball.com/draft2011DE.php


Nice find. But what does it mean? Pressure off the edge, I would guess and trying to generate a pass rush with just the 4 down. But not sure how this means Jauron's D will be anything but a standard 4-3 cover 2. Also not sure where/how the Tampa 2 differs a whole lot than what we think Jauron will run (or at least ran in the past) other than MLB responsibilities against the pass (staing the obvious but we don't have that guy on the roster) and a 3 technique DT as opposed to the 2 gap responsibilities that jta (whatever happened to him, btw?) described awhile back.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby General » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:53 am

Fire Marshall Bill wrote:There is a calmness that accompanies not giving a rats ass


Amen. I will chuckle and enjoy another Browns season of using football(if there is a season) as background noise to Sunday Funday on Pensacola beach. :dingle:
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby gameface » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:40 pm

I would melt if we traded down to the bottom of the first round for two thirds and a fourth, and then drafted an offensive guard.

It is my fervent hope that unlike many previous drafts, our war room is no longer an annex of the West Side Insane Asylum and Front Office Clown Academy.

I believe in one thing Heckert said, they have six players on their board that they would be happy to draft. If a scouting department can't identify six guys out of the entire college football universe that will be NFL impact players, then they need to hand in clipboards. We're staying put at 6, and we're getting someone who should be good.

I'm still going to sacrifice a chicken or something, just to be safe.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:42 pm

gameface wrote:I would melt if we traded down to the bottom of the first round for two thirds and a fourth, and then drafted an offensive guard.

It is my fervent hope that unlike many previous drafts, our war room is no longer an annex of the West Side Insane Asylum and Front Office Clown Academy.

I believe in one thing Heckert said, they have six players on their board that they would be happy to draft. If a scouting department can't identify six guys out of the entire college football universe that will be NFL impact players, then they need to hand in clipboards. We're staying put at 6, and we're getting someone who should be good.

I'm still going to sacrifice a chicken or something, just to be safe.


SD:

I'll spring for a second chicken if we got a shot of ridding ourselves of all the bad Ju Ju.



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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby comish » Sun Apr 24, 2011 9:17 am

There isn't much they could do here to put me into physical change mode.

LAST DRAFT there were some epic melts over some of their moves (particularly the selection of a certain DB from Oregon) and in retro we would all have to agree, the Heckgert combo did pretty well. B+ A- range? (A productive Hardesty pushes this into A territory IMO)

So, even though it is a limited body of work to go on....in the Walrus I trust, but I reserve the right to get over-emotional in the spur of the moment :partyers:
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby mistero » Mon Apr 25, 2011 6:30 am

250Lbs DE's. Do we possibly have a few of those guys in Roth, Gocong, and Bernard? No saying, just asking.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby hiko » Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:45 am

mistero wrote:250Lbs DE's. Do we possibly have a few of those guys in Roth, Gocong, and Bernard? No saying, just asking.

Only one of those guys (Benard) is under contract. And just because they're 250 lbs and can play DE doesn't mean they're any good.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:32 am

gameface wrote:I would melt if we traded down to the bottom of the first round for two thirds and a fourth, and then drafted an offensive guard.

It is my fervent hope that unlike many previous drafts, our war room is no longer an annex of the West Side Insane Asylum and Front Office Clown Academy.

I believe in one thing Heckert said, they have six players on their board that they would be happy to draft. If a scouting department can't identify six guys out of the entire college football universe that will be NFL impact players, then they need to hand in clipboards. We're staying put at 6, and we're getting someone who should be good.

I'm still going to sacrifice a chicken or something, just to be safe.



When the org first started talking off season, the first words out of Holmgren's mouth were "we have to find a home run hitter". After all the BS and subtrefuge, it usually comes back to that in the end; what they originally said.

I have a feeling in the end they will come back to that. To me, that screams Jones, Green, or Quinn if he considers big plays on D home runs.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:34 am

mistero wrote:250Lbs DE's. Do we possibly have a few of those guys in Roth, Gocong, and Bernard? No saying, just asking.



Pretty sure they have Gocong at MLB in pencil. I think Heckert gave up on the DE experiment in Philly.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby jb » Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:52 am

mattvan1 wrote:
jb wrote:
motherscratcher wrote:So basically, Tom Heckert likes everyone at every position.


He certainly does a week before the draft.

The most important thing Heckert has said this week is the answer to this one question:

Q - What is the top weight at defensive ends you project in the 4 - 3?

A - 250 pounds top at end.

http://cle.scout.com/2/1066282.html

This tells me we will NOT be looking at a Dick Jaraun vanilla defense but a much more aggressive 4 man line with small ends, maybe even Tampa 2 style. That means we'll need lots. And we'll need quality.


http://walterfootball.com/draft2011DE.php


Nice find. But what does it mean? Pressure off the edge, I would guess and trying to generate a pass rush with just the 4 down. But not sure how this means Jauron's D will be anything but a standard 4-3 cover 2. Also not sure where/how the Tampa 2 differs a whole lot than what we think Jauron will run (or at least ran in the past) other than MLB responsibilities against the pass (staing the obvious but we don't have that guy on the roster) and a 3 technique DT as opposed to the 2 gap responsibilities that jta (whatever happened to him, btw?) described awhile back.



matt, should we split this into a non-retarded thread?

Anyway, what this mens to me is that the D will not be a passive vanilla defense. That would mean you have 275 - 280 do-it-all DE's who can play both run and pass. If 250 is upper end, that means you are not playing run D at DE. Those guys don't have enough sand in the pants. You are going to take guys who get upfield in a hurry. It also means that you will need some big, fat, ginormous DT's in the middle. Think Williamses in Minny. I could see Fairly also fitting into this arrangement as he's a big boy despite catlike quickness.

So on draft day, don't be hollerin' for no Claybourne or Hayward in round 2. Just don't . They won't be going there as those guys are too big for DE, soo light for DT in this sceme. Rather, keep an eye on Quinn at 1 and prospects like the Arizona kids later on days two and three.

It also suggests that Jaraun is nothing but a caretaker to extablish a foundation. Rhodes will be consulting on sceme and technique and the next DC is yet to arrive.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby gotribe31 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:41 am

SoulDawg74 wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I would laugh my ass off if they draft Locker.


SD:

Would that be to hide the tears , or the pain or both .


SoulDawg


I'd much rather have Locker than Cam Newton.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:31 pm

jb wrote: matt, should we split this into a non-retarded thread?

Anyway, what this mens to me is that the D will not be a passive vanilla defense. That would mean you have 275 - 280 do-it-all DE's who can play both run and pass. If 250 is upper end, that means you are not playing run D at DE. Those guys don't have enough sand in the pants. You are going to take guys who get upfield in a hurry. It also means that you will need some big, fat, ginormous DT's in the middle. Think Williamses in Minny. I could see Fairly also fitting into this arrangement as he's a big boy despite catlike quickness.

So on draft day, don't be hollerin' for no Claybourne or Hayward in round 2. Just don't . They won't be going there as those guys are too big for DE, soo light for DT in this sceme. Rather, keep an eye on Quinn at 1 and prospects like the Arizona kids later on days two and three.

It also suggests that Jaraun is nothing but a caretaker to extablish a foundation. Rhodes will be consulting on sceme and technique and the next DC is yet to arrive.


Ah, ok - I see your point and agree with the premise of the Freeny/Peppers type of DE. If Heckert isn't just blowing smoke. I guess I read 'vanilla' and am thinking having a speed guy off theedge isn't that wild and crazy - still vanilla to me but perhaps a lot less so than what we expected (feared) out of Jauron.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby JacksonDysonJackson » Mon Apr 25, 2011 6:06 pm

A lot of muck in here, but I'm assuming the thread's title was its main point.

Two guys that I'm warming on, that have not been slotted to the Browns in many mocks:

- Aldon Smith
- Nick Fairly
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:02 pm

gotribe31 wrote:
SoulDawg74 wrote:
Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I would laugh my ass off if they draft Locker.


SD:

Would that be to hide the tears , or the pain or both .


SoulDawg


I'd much rather have Locker than Cam Newton.



SD:

Locker is an enigma , he's a fifth year senior that should have been the star of this draft .

Comes out of a pro set , has prototypical size and speed and an arm which is borderline elite .

However he needs somebody t flush the mushroom residue out of his playing field , that 5 inches of space between his ears which beats him to death , preventing him from making plays and good game time decisions .

aka coming back in the first place ala Matt Lineart when he could have been the first or second QB taken in 2010 draft.

Now he's projected anywhere from the 7th pick to the second round , because teams look into his eyes and see infinity.

As improbable as it seems , he has legit value if they trade down .




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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby Fire Marshall Bill » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:37 pm

Just out of curiosity Re: Locker

Is there any other team worse than Washington with a player rated as a 1st rd pick?

Is there no accounting for the absolute suckatude of his surrounding cast or comaprison to same of his previous season?

Yes or no sansa SD hyperbolic drivel.....
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby peeker643 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:43 pm

Fire Marshall Bill wrote:Just out of curiosity Re: Locker

Is there any other team worse than Washington with a player rated as a 1st rd pick?

Is there no accounting for the absolute suckatude of his surrounding cast or comaprison to same of his previous season?

Yes or no sansa SD hyperbolic drivel.....



Plays a part for sure. Guy got killed this season and the cumulative effect of the hits and hurts didn't help him at all.

Say this: he wanted to go back in part to get his degree and because of a sense of obligation. He did. He paid a lot of money for that degree if you weigh his salary this coming year to what it would have been last year.

All those QBs have huge questions attached. But I would not be at all surprised if Locker ultimately turns out to be the best of the class.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby Fire Marshall Bill » Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:25 pm

That's what I've said before...

5 yrs from now Locker will be the best of this yrs group and that makes just as much sense as any other opinion here

Forgetwhat 'you' think you know...

Ya'll don't know sheet... (mooning)

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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby danwismar » Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:50 pm

RE: Locker...

Not sure I can recall a player on whom the "conventional wisdom" has ranged so crazily up and down over a one year period....from somewhere near the top overall pick a year ago...only to crash and burn into the 2nd or 3rd round somewhere along the way....and now back up near, if not in, the Top 10 again.

I love the athleticism...but I haven't seen enough to know if the passing accuracy will be there. Glad it's not my job on the line picking the guy.
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Re: If the Browns go unpredictable will you go melty

Unread postby mattvan1 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:10 pm

jb wrote:
matt, should we split this into a non-retarded thred?


Yes. Do it. You're a mod, use your powers for good; not evil.
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Re: Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:46 am

SoulDawg74 wrote:Some clips from Heckerts presser

"“It’s probably unlikely, but we have talked to teams about moving up.”

What about trading down.

”I think it’s more of a risk vs. reward for what we can get for that pick,” he said. “It depends on what you’re getting back. If you get three players, it might be worth doing.”

And is Heckert concerned that a team will take someone they really want ahead of them.

“No, if we end up staying where we are at we’re going to get a good football player,” he said. “We have six guys we’d be happy with if we stay there.”

The general consensus is the Browns need to take a wide receiver or a defensive lineman in the first round.

Heckert defended his receivers.

“Internally, we feel better about some positions than the fans or media might, but we’re not looking at it as we have to get a certain position,” he said. “We like those guys. Robo (Brian Robiskie) and Mohamed (Massaquoi) are good players.

“Last year, they didn’t get a ton of opportunities, but I think the West Coast offense will get them a better opportunity. They’re both big and catch the football. Everybody wants the top players and we heard it every day in Philadelphia that our receivers weren’t good enough and we went to five NFC Championships. We do like our receivers.”

The Browns have been linked to A.J. Green or Julio Jones as their choice at six by many draft experts. Heckert, obviously, wouldn’t say who the Browns had ranked higher.

“It’s up to each individual club,” he said. “They are both good receivers. Some teams might like some things better than the other guy. At that position, it’s kind of hard. But they are very similar players. Either one is fine.”

The Browns are very thin on the defensive line and many experts feel they desperately need a pass rusher.

“I don’t know if it’s a sore spot, but we know we have to get to the quarterback,” Heckert said. “We knew last year we needed to get pass rushers.”

Concerning the defensive line, Heckert was asked about most of the candidates that are considered to be available to the Browns, other than Marcel Dareus, who is expected to be taken with the second pick.

On Robert Quinn, he said his missing last season doesn’t cause the Browns to shy away from him.

“I don’t think it’s a risk, but you would’ve like to see him play last year,” Heckert said. “We look at two years of tape anyway.”

Heckert said the Browns have checked out Da’Quan Bowers’ knee and the doctors have signed off on him.

“Our doctors have looked at him 100 times and are satisfied that he is healthy.”

Nick Fairley was listed early as the top defensive lineman, but might be available to the Browns.

“He’s a one year wonder from a sacks standpoint, but not as a defensive lineman,” Heckert said.

Why does it seem that everyone is ranking Quinn higher than Fairley.

“I wouldn’t say everyone’s perception is (Quinn)over (Fairley),” he said. “There are a zillion things. You watch the tape and make your decision.”

And then there’s cornerback Patrick Peterson, who many think is the best player in the draft. Would the Browns consider taking another cornerback with their first pick.

“He’s a very rare football player,” Heckert said. “He has the size and speed. Patrick is a very good football player.”

Heckert said you can never have enough cornerbacks.

“If you don’t have three (corners), they’ll find you,” he said. “The more cover guys you have the better you are. You can’t have enough of them, just like pass rushers or offensive lineman.”

And then there’s always the quarterback issue.

Heckert didn’t rule out taking a quarterback in the first round.

“I wouldn’t assume that,” he said. “I wouldn’t say there is no chance. But we like Colt McCoy. In Philadelphia, we had Donavan McNabb and don’t know what the perception was but thought Kevin Kolb was a very good football player when we drafted him.

“If we thought there was a legitimate Hall of Fame quarterback, we’d consider it.”

Heckert was asked if either Cam Newton or Blaine Gabbert were available at the Browns six, if it would help the Browns cause in terms of trade possibilities.

“We don’t really do mock drafts, but I have no idea.”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Right , I'm sure you don't Tom :)

SoulDawg


"""


SD:

Don't play Texas holdem with heckert , baaad idea .

Nobody and i mean nobody saw doctor Phil as our #1 pick let alone an extra second this morning and an extra number one in the bank vault for next year , ....should we need go hunting the LUCK.

Three keys start of second round , Kaepernick in play , Little at wideout aka Julio redux and the best MLB in Wilson to fill a big sore spot in our D .

Wilson Wilson wilson Wilson Little Wilson wilson Little Kap :)


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Re: Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby JacksonDysonJackson » Fri Apr 29, 2011 9:20 am

I was concerned about dropping so far at first, but by anyone's estimation, we got a nice haul of picks in the deal. The trade (and not taking JJ) tells me that Heckert values this talent crop of receivers and we'll pluck a guy they like later.

I like Phil Taylor...actually had him as a potential target for us in the 2nd. For those upset that we traded up to get him, get real, reports are all over that Philly and others were targeting him.

Bottom line for me: Tom got a guy he wanted, ala the trades for Ward and Hardesty last year. Different story if they traded down and settled on a guy that fell.
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Re: Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby SoulDawg74 » Fri Apr 29, 2011 11:56 am

JacksonDysonJackson wrote:I was concerned about dropping so far at first, but by anyone's estimation, we got a nice haul of picks in the deal. The trade (and not taking JJ) tells me that Heckert values this talent crop of receivers and we'll pluck a guy they like later.

I like Phil Taylor...actually had him as a potential target for us in the 2nd. For those upset that we traded up to get him, get real, reports are all over that Philly and others were targeting him.

Bottom line for me: Tom got a guy he wanted, ala the trades for Ward and Hardesty last year. Different story if they traded down and settled on a guy that fell.


SD:

Agree they went hunting with a big stick , two picks this year including a second which equates to another potential starter , and a big PHAT #1 next year , to go with moving a building in alongside Tuba .

The extra 4th next is candy and wasn't even needed to make that a
good deal , and it will make a nice extra trading chip .

Taylor , i have to read up on , have zero first hand on his play .

butt damn is that a big man.


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Re: Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby jb » Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:09 pm

JacksonDysonJackson wrote:I was concerned about dropping so far at first, but by anyone's estimation, we got a nice haul of picks in the deal. The trade (and not taking JJ) tells me that Heckert values this talent crop of receivers and we'll pluck a guy they like later.



I don't know. Seems no one is listening to Heckert. All he's said about the WR's has been extremely consistent. Says he likes the young talent we already have and talks up how they'll be in a more WR friendly system now. Holmgren says same. But we don't seem to want to listen. I think there is a shot that they really think Daboll was a dork and want to see the kids with coachiung, including Mitchell, before they spend much more coin on WR.

Now an athlete with speed like a Jurnigan? Different issue.
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Re: Anybody feel the urge to melt after the trade

Unread postby pup » Fri Apr 29, 2011 1:13 pm

Front seven and o-line is how you build a foundation. Most have been preaching it for years from May-March...but so many forget it come April.

Sexy picks are Hulk Hogan's leg drop. Wide receivers can be found everywhere. Running backs can be found everywhere.

Last year's draft fell in a way they thought the pretty boys were proper value and the uglies weren't, so they pounced. This year, they are laying the concrete.
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